ThomMcK Share Posted March 10, 2011 Surely Nokia won't wait until 2012. I would be very surprised if they didn't have a handset, using Mango, out in time for Christmas Link to post Share on other sites
BajiRav Share Posted March 10, 2011 Regardless of the NoDo date MS should come clean as to why exactly it's taken this long when it shouldn't have. They surely ****ed this big time :/ As expected it's either Samsung or AT&T that is blocking the update and I won't be surprised if they blocked bigger updates to push sales. After this, I am not sure if I will trust Microsoft's reasoning - "they can block one update but not for long because it will be rolled in the next update" , well - what stops them from blocking the "next update" and then the "next next update"? I wasn't looking forward to copy/paste update as such but so far have been frustrated by the sheer stupidity of the whole process. :crazy: Link to post Share on other sites
Omen1393 Share Posted March 10, 2011 They surely ****ed this big time :/ As expected it's either Samsung or AT&T that is blocking the update and I won't be surprised if they blocked bigger updates to push sales. After this, I am not sure if I will trust Microsoft's reasoning - "they can block one update but not for long because it will be rolled in the next update" , well - what stops them from blocking the "next update" and then the "next next update"? I wasn't looking forward to copy/paste update as such but so far have been frustrated by the sheer stupidity of the whole process. :crazy: But the carriers are only allowed to block one update, they can't block NoDo because they've already released one update. Link to post Share on other sites
George P Global Moderator Share Posted March 10, 2011 Holding off an on update like Mango (7.5) which will probably ship on a new batch of phones later this year I can understand, but since we haven't seen any new WP7 devices yet on the current networks (and the phones Sprint and Verizon are getting are just respins) then blocking an update for sales doesn't make as much sense right now. Link to post Share on other sites
guru Share Posted March 10, 2011 MS needs to try and work on some solid dates and press OEMs and Carriers more so this works out like it should and not how NoDo has turned out. Besides can't MS update the native apps without needing to flash the whole firmware? Why not just release IE9 for example on it's own as an app update? this. or handover the ROMs to XDA and call it a day Link to post Share on other sites
Owen W Author Veteran Share Posted March 10, 2011 Where has all this Compass talk come from? Microsoft has never stated that this would be made available with NoDo. They never stated it, doesn't mean it isn't there. Link to post Share on other sites
+LogicalApex MVC Share Posted March 10, 2011 It isn't the delay of this update that is the problem insomuch as it is the lack of openness from Microsoft regarding its time frame. Every competing platform uses the update cycle ferociously in their competitive jockey for power and Microsoft is sitting on the sidelines like a lost school child. It is very important that they are as transparent as possible with the update process and time frame so that customers can feel confident. For the established OSes like Android and iPhone it doesn't matter as much, they are established, but it matters a LOT for Windows Phone. The majority of the current crop of customers are us highly technical early adopter types. They need to win us over hard and keep us excited enough to constantly spread the word about the platform. The majority, which are non-technical, buy what they see us using and what we encourage them to buy. Microsoft is loosing us due to the lack of transparency in the update process. This update has been delayed THREE times and there is no official word as to why. This is insane! Is it because a carrier is blocking it? Is it an OEM? Is it Microsoft themselves? Why is it being blocked/delayed? Why can one carrier or OEM slow it down for everyone? Will Sprint not put the HTC Arrive on sale on the 20th due to the delay? Etc... So far they just aren't getting it and they better hurry up and start getting it if they want to win this war. Link to post Share on other sites
Owen W Author Veteran Share Posted March 10, 2011 It isn't the delay of this update that is the problem insomuch as it is the lack of openness from Microsoft regarding its time frame. Every competing platform uses the update cycle ferociously in their competitive jockey for power and Microsoft is sitting on the sidelines like a lost school child. It is very important that they are as transparent as possible with the update process and time frame so that customers can feel confident. For the established OSes like Android and iPhone it doesn't matter as much, they are established, but it matters a LOT for Windows Phone. The majority of the current crop of customers are us highly technical early adopter types. They need to win us over hard and keep us excited enough to constantly spread the word about the platform. The majority, which are non-technical, buy what they see us using and what we encourage them to buy. Microsoft is loosing us due to the lack of transparency in the update process. This update has been delayed THREE times and there is no official word as to why. This is insane! Is it because a carrier is blocking it? Is it an OEM? Is it Microsoft themselves? Why is it being blocked/delayed? Why can one carrier or OEM slow it down for everyone? Will Sprint not put the HTC Arrive on sale on the 20th due to the delay? Etc... So far they just aren't getting it and they better hurry up and start getting it if they want to win this war. Does this answer your questions enough? Link to post Share on other sites
+LogicalApex MVC Share Posted March 11, 2011 Does this answer your questions enough? Sadly no. It only made me angry. It really said nothing... It was a lot of words without really communicating anything at all... I mean what phones need the Feb. update? Why havent't all got them? What is the NoDo delay? Is it carrier or pure MS? When it hits in "late march" what carriers will it hit and when? How can we really be sure this won't delay Mango? Honestly what did he communicate with us? Well I guess he did show that MS still needs to learn the meaning of transparency. Link to post Share on other sites
downhillrider Share Posted March 11, 2011 their official answer was pretty lame. still no solid date, seemed like they were blaming sites/blogs for spreading misinformation. they wanted to say hey we messed this thing up but without saying it. Link to post Share on other sites
George P Global Moderator Share Posted March 11, 2011 It's too early in WP7 life and it's marketshare it still small so MS can't come out and flat out blame a OEM or a carrier for a delay, hell it didn't even want to blame Yahoo for it's IMAP data leak. They're going to play it safe like this till they can get enough sales going to where it doesn't matter as much. Like if this delay was due to Samsung, the Focus is the top selling WP7 device in the US i'd say, you think it'd be wise this early in if MS stepped on Samsungs toes? I'm all for openness and so on but I also understand that you can't just come out and flat out blame your partners when you need them so much. Link to post Share on other sites
Cereal Bawks Share Posted March 12, 2011 They never stated it, doesn't mean it isn't there. They also never stated that WP7 is going to make you breakfast every morning, but doesn't mean it won't. Link to post Share on other sites
George P Global Moderator Share Posted March 12, 2011 They also never stated that WP7 is going to make you breakfast every morning, but doesn't mean it won't. You mean yours doesn't for you? :blink: Link to post Share on other sites
guru Share Posted March 12, 2011 It isn't the delay of this update that is the problem insomuch as it is the lack of openness from Microsoft regarding its time frame. Every competing platform uses the update cycle ferociously in their competitive jockey for power and Microsoft is sitting on the sidelines like a lost school child. It is very important that they are as transparent as possible with the update process and time frame so that customers can feel confident. For the established OSes like Android and iPhone it doesn't matter as much, they are established, but it matters a LOT for Windows Phone. The majority of the current crop of customers are us highly technical early adopter types. They need to win us over hard and keep us excited enough to constantly spread the word about the platform. The majority, which are non-technical, buy what they see us using and what we encourage them to buy. Microsoft is loosing us due to the lack of transparency in the update process. This update has been delayed THREE times and there is no official word as to why. This is insane! Is it because a carrier is blocking it? Is it an OEM? Is it Microsoft themselves? Why is it being blocked/delayed? Why can one carrier or OEM slow it down for everyone? Will Sprint not put the HTC Arrive on sale on the 20th due to the delay? Etc... So far they just aren't getting it and they better hurry up and start getting it if they want to win this war. this. Link to post Share on other sites
George P Global Moderator Share Posted March 12, 2011 I take the realistic view in that MS can't go around tossing blame left and right while WP7 still has a small share. It's early on and MS needs it's partners so it's not going to try and step on any toes. A year from now who knows though? Link to post Share on other sites
BajiRav Share Posted March 12, 2011 I take the realistic view in that MS can't go around tossing blame left and right while WP7 still has a small share. It's early on and MS needs it's partners so it's not going to try and step on any toes. A year from now who knows though? Personally I wanted them to come forward with the news about delay or releases before everyone started screaming for lack of communication from MS. They could've been much more proactive and announced before hand that "yes, we will be delayed" instead of keeping us guessing for days/weeks. Link to post Share on other sites
scumdogmillionaire Share Posted March 15, 2011 Ok, I have my first gripe that I hope they address in one of thse updates. I got my Samsung Focus today (awesome by the way) but they've removed my Outlook sync (which I knew was coming, so it wasn't a surprise) so I've spent the last 3 days moving stuff to hotmail, contacts, calendar, etc.. and merging duplicates from facebook integration and all that. Perfect. Now, I have a birthday calendar and US holidays calendar in my hotmail. Pretty cool. Everything is organized very nice. I like it. Well, those don't sync with WP7!!! So now I have no birthdays or holidays in my phone. Gaaaaaaah!!!! Very obnoxious. If they're going to insist sycing with hotmail, and insist that that's where birthdays go, those "subscribed" calendars need to sync. Period. Not pleased with this part. Link to post Share on other sites
Calum Veteran Share Posted March 15, 2011 Holding off an on update like Mango (7.5) which will probably ship on a new batch of phones later this year I can understand, but since we haven't seen any new WP7 devices yet on the current networks (and the phones Sprint and Verizon are getting are just respins) then blocking an update for sales doesn't make as much sense right now. To be honest, I can't understand Microsoft letting carriers block an update like Mango. I can certainly understand why they would from a sales point of view, but I can't understand why they would from a decency point of view. Aren't iOS and Android always updated for users if they'd like it to be, even for a small price sometimes? I thought I read that Microsoft confirmed us users would all get .5 and full version updates, and that's one of the reasons I opted to go for a Windows Phone 7 before the operating system had matured more. Does anyone know if any carriers are definitely allowed to block the 7.5 update? If that is the case, I won't be happy. Link to post Share on other sites
George P Global Moderator Share Posted March 15, 2011 To be honest, I can't understand Microsoft letting carriers block an update like Mango. I can certainly understand why they would from a sales point of view, but I can't understand why they would from a decency point of view. Aren't iOS and Android always updated for users if they'd like it to be, even for a small price sometimes? I thought I read that Microsoft confirmed us users would all get .5 and full version updates, and that's one of the reasons I opted to go for a Windows Phone 7 before the operating system had matured more. Does anyone know if any carriers are definitely allowed to block the 7.5 update? If that is the case, I won't be happy. It's still not clear yet what this first delay has been with NoDo, people say it's the carriers blocking it or it could be some slowness on the part of the OEMs or Carriers have to do extra testing. The thing is that unlike with the iPhone, MS does it's OS updates then the OEMs have to do any hardware firmware and app updates to go with it and then we also have the carriers who have to do their own app updates and testing. With the iPhone it's just Apple, no OEM in the middle and no Carrier extras to mess with, so they can just push it out faster after it's ready. That's how it looks to me anyways. They said that the next update(s) after NoDo haven't been delayed which makes me think we didn't get it quicker cuz of either the OEMs or Carriers taking too long to fix their side of things and test. I really think though that MS will push way harder for Mango to be on time and before the key holiday sales period for 2011. A bit 7.5 release like that would be perfect for a 1 year b-day gift IMO. Link to post Share on other sites
+LogicalApex MVC Share Posted March 16, 2011 It's still not clear yet what this first delay has been with NoDo, people say it's the carriers blocking it or it could be some slowness on the part of the OEMs or Carriers have to do extra testing. The thing is that unlike with the iPhone, MS does it's OS updates then the OEMs have to do any hardware firmware and app updates to go with it and then we also have the carriers who have to do their own app updates and testing. With the iPhone it's just Apple, no OEM in the middle and no Carrier extras to mess with, so they can just push it out faster after it's ready. That's how it looks to me anyways. They said that the next update(s) after NoDo haven't been delayed which makes me think we didn't get it quicker cuz of either the OEMs or Carriers taking too long to fix their side of things and test. I really think though that MS will push way harder for Mango to be on time and before the key holiday sales period for 2011. A bit 7.5 release like that would be perfect for a 1 year b-day gift IMO. Apple has the carriers in the middle to deal with to... Unless they somehow have a get out of jail free card, but I find that hard to believe. Link to post Share on other sites
Owen W Author Veteran Share Posted March 16, 2011 To be honest, I can't understand Microsoft letting carriers block an update like Mango. I can certainly understand why they would from a sales point of view, but I can't understand why they would from a decency point of view. Aren't iOS and Android always updated for users if they'd like it to be, even for a small price sometimes? I thought I read that Microsoft confirmed us users would all get .5 and full version updates, and that's one of the reasons I opted to go for a Windows Phone 7 before the operating system had matured more. Does anyone know if any carriers are definitely allowed to block the 7.5 update? If that is the case, I won't be happy. There is the problem. The problem is that Microsoft hasn't told anyone what's actually going on here. 99% of carriers have given the OK, it's been OEM's themselves messing this up. Link to post Share on other sites
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