PS3 Hacker Who Needed Legal Funds Gets Over $28,000 in Donations

[AbandonedTrolley]

Honestly, I wasn't trolling for donations, I feel kinda bad about posting that. Just irked me a bit. Thank you all.

I don't see why you need to apologise, you're right in that people seem to value a material possession more than another childs life. Something there isn't quite right.

[00000000000000000000000000]

Well, you have to remember, the majority of the world is pretty stupid. The internet has a way of giving all these people a way to gather, and when a bunch of stupid people gather up, well, it gets really bad. "A fool and his money are easily parted."

And as you said as well, these people apparently have some messed up logical way of thinking, if they think the ps3 is a viable system to get linux on and to run their 20 year old NES roms...

It is a sad sight that people will give this kid money, who most likely want do anything for them, yet wont help those who actually need the help.

Maybe I should make a blog and see if people will pay for me to go back to college.... hell, at least it is a better endeavor than what most are already donating to...

Soniq, wish I could help man, I'll see if I can next pay day. Your cause is much more honorable and worthy of donation.

Not to sound like a troll or anything but over 6k posts seems less sane than a kid giving away a day's pay for something he really believes in. I think everyone likes to spend money on stupid things most of us wouldn't agree on but what do you expect when we live in a society flooded with negative corporate influence? I want to see graf win this not because of the final product that he may or may not present, but because he has the knowledge and the guts to fight for his, and systematically, our rights.

[Choto Cheeta]

Coool.. it seems "Internet community" wants to make a story out from SONY... ha ha ha.. Hopefully geohot would get an honest judge as i doubt donation wouldn't be enough to counter sony's "price" towards the decision..

[kopsarchidis]

A cool way to splash a large amount of money; pay layers against sony, yet loose the fight :)))

[DukeEsquire]

Not to sound like a troll or anything but over 6k posts seems less sane than a kid giving away a day's pay for something he really believes in. I think everyone likes to spend money on stupid things most of us wouldn't agree on but what do you expect when we live in a society flooded with negative corporate influence? I want to see graf win this not because of the final product that he may or may not present, but because he has the knowledge and the guts to fight for his, and systematically, our rights.

Does anyone else think that the word "rights" has been thrown around so much that it has become meaningless?

When I think of legal and human "rights" I think the right to free speech, right to vote, right to practice religion...etc.

When we start applying it--as the Europeans like to do--to things like the right to an unlocked phone or, in this case, the right to hack a PS3, it becomes meaningless.

Rights are things that we can't--or would be very hard to--live without.

Hacking a PS3 is a "want", not a "right".

[iamawesomewicked]

What is this sick obsession with Linux on the PS3?

It couldn't have been any good compared to what you can put on a common PC... I mean.. you don't even need to Partition anymore with Wubi installer.

[Growled Member]

I think it's more "this is my device that I bought with my own money and I should be able to do whatever the hell I want to do with it."

[DukeEsquire]

I think it's more "this is my device that I bought with my own money and I should be able to do whatever the hell I want to do with it."

Do whatever you want with the DEVICE.

Install Linux.

Smash it.

Paint it.

Do whatever you want with or to it.

[shakey]

I think it's more "this is my device that I bought with my own money and I should be able to do whatever the hell I want to do with it."

You may do whatever you want with it, but when that whatever affects another person in anyway , shape , or form, you have entered into society, where rules and laws apply. When these hacks enabled pirated games to be played, that's when it affected Sony, and many others. They now enter the ball field.... play ball. lol.

You can mod your car all you want, but once your horn becomes too loud, exhaust too loud, or anything else that will affect others around you, you can be fined and ticketed for it. I know, car analogies and whatnot, blah, but the point still remains. Free to do what you want with yourself and belongings until it affects another.

Sadly, too many have a very limited view of the world, and can not put thought past themselves. They feel that they deserve to do whatever they want, and couldn't care less who is harmed in anyway. That, or they just can not put thought into a company actually being harmed by such, since the "whole" of a company seems so big, and they might think they are so small that it couldn't make a difference.

Either way, when you enable a method that can enables others to bypass laws, rules, or security, you are affecting someone, and that someone has the right to take action.

[DukeEsquire]

You may do whatever you want with it, but when that whatever affects another person in anyway , shape , or form, you have entered into society, where rules and laws apply. When these hacks enabled pirated games to be played, that's when it affected Sony, and many others. They now enter the ball field.... play ball. lol.

You can mod your car all you want, but once your horn becomes too loud, exhaust too loud, or anything else that will affect others around you, you can be fined and ticketed for it. I know, car analogies and whatnot, blah, but the point still remains. Free to do what you want with yourself and belongings until it affects another.

Sadly, too many have a very limited view of the world, and can not put thought past themselves. They feel that they deserve to do whatever they want, and couldn't care less who is harmed in anyway. That, or they just can not put thought into a company actually being harmed by such, since the "whole" of a company seems so big, and they might think they are so small that it couldn't make a difference.

Either way, when you enable a method that can enables others to bypass laws, rules, or security, you are affecting someone, and that someone has the right to take action.

+1

Just to add, whenever you update your firmware or sign up for PSN, you explicitly agree NOT to modify the software.

If you wanted to modify the firmware, then DON'T AGREE THAT YOU WOULDN'T.

Seems like an obvious point, but sadly, too many people in society don't walk the walk when it comes to contracts and agreements.

Consumers wouldn't like it if Sony decided to break the contract and start bricking PS3s remotely. Sony would appreciate if you didn't break the contract by modifying the software.

[articuno1au]

Which I'm sure he had time to cancel as well.

Re OP: This dude gets mad cash to help him get off from breaking the law and "fight the man", and we've gotten less than 1/10 of that and my kid is dying.

Nice.

I really feel for your kid, but you should be thoroughly ashamed of yourself for this post. THOROUGHLY ASHAMED.

Good luck with your child. I hope things work out for the best.

When people start sending this kind of money I have to think, for Linux on a PS3, really? A 3 figure sum could go very nicely to building your own HTPC, far more powerful and customizable than a PS3. However you'd rather give your money to someone who isn't guaranteeing you anything, you have no contract with, and you don't even know?

It's just hard for me to understand, but that's the way my brain ticks.

People want to donate to the Japan fund, a dog charity, charity for kids, I get it, but for someone who is hacking devices and will inevitably step on the toes of the products manufacturer? I cannot feel it's ever my problem to get them out of that ****.

Yeah.. unless you are like my university. The university bought 200 PS3s for use as a super computing cluster during holidays, and for the gaming students to use for their studies.

Sony swore black and blue they would not remove linux support. The university built their cluster, only to have Sony backflip. This was a costly error, it put the university back $60,000 dollars even considering the bulk purchase discount.

The issue is that Sony released a product, and as a selling point they included "Can run linux OS". They then rescinded this feature. THAT IS ILLEGAL.

I have no qualms with hackers working on this for Linux.

The PS3 is a tool, like a gun. In the hands of a trained law official, it can be a tool used to save lives, in the hands of a ****ed off red-neck, it can be a way of destroying lives. Do not condemn the tool, condemn the users.

People are free to decide. They should also not be lied to by a multi-billion dollar company.

I don't see why you need to apologise, you're right in that people seem to value a material possession more than another childs life. Something there isn't quite right.

WOW, JUST WOW.

I wasn't even aware of this guy's child. This seems to be true of nearly EVERY SINGLE USER on this forum. Don't get me wrong, I feel for the guy, but insinuating we are all bad people because we gave money to a cause of our choice instead of a cause of YOUR choice is just truly **** weak.

You may do whatever you want with it, but when that whatever affects another person in anyway , shape , or form, you have entered into society, where rules and laws apply. When these hacks enabled pirated games to be played, that's when it affected Sony, and many others. They now enter the ball field.... play ball. lol.

You can mod your car all you want, but once your horn becomes too loud, exhaust too loud, or anything else that will affect others around you, you can be fined and ticketed for it. I know, car analogies and whatnot, blah, but the point still remains. Free to do what you want with yourself and belongings until it affects another.

Sadly, too many have a very limited view of the world, and can not put thought past themselves. They feel that they deserve to do whatever they want, and couldn't care less who is harmed in anyway. That, or they just can not put thought into a company actually being harmed by such, since the "whole" of a company seems so big, and they might think they are so small that it couldn't make a difference.

Either way, when you enable a method that can enables others to bypass laws, rules, or security, you are affecting someone, and that someone has the right to take action.

You are indeed right, but what about the people who mod their cars for race tracks? Should they have their cars impounded while it sits on a trailer not doing illegally noisy things on the road?

As above, it's a tool. Punish the people who use the tool in a certain way, not the people using it for legal/acceptable things.

Seriously, did you all forget that people were told straight out by a multi-billion dollar company that this feature would never be removed?

+1

Just to add, whenever you update your firmware or sign up for PSN, you explicitly agree NOT to modify the software.

If you wanted to modify the firmware, then DON'T AGREE THAT YOU WOULDN'T.

Seems like an obvious point, but sadly, too many people in society don't walk the walk when it comes to contracts and agreements.

Consumers wouldn't like it if Sony decided to break the contract and start bricking PS3s remotely. Sony would appreciate if you didn't break the contract by modifying the software.

When you purchased that device, you entered into the purchase with the knowledge that the product was fit for a purpose.

Sony revoked functionality which made it no longer so. Claiming that by using other methods to re-enable this functionality makes you inherently bad is extremely hypocritical.

What about the users right to use the product for what it was bought, and for what it was sold as?

Stop making blanket statements. Not everyone modding their consoles is doing it for "bad" reasons.

[dknm]

There's nothing hard to understand .

It's a shortsighted collective statement against SONY.

That these people can't grasp the entire picture, that of the company being an entity of it's own and having plenty strings to pull, patents and laws to defend it (Yes it did deliberately remove features, but there was some fine print that allowed them to in the first place.You signed up for an account, it's similar to signing a contract - folk agreed to its terms) and being able to undertake many actions that will in the end hurt the legitimate user, is another story.

I'll let the prosecution be the judge, but some people root for the hacker's statement and that's fine.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

That's your Universities problem, PS3s are not sold as supercomputers, they're sold as games consoles.

Anyway, if the Universities main focus was having a supercomputer I'm sure it doesn't hurt to take away the ability for students to play some games in the summer and stay on pre-3.15 firmware :rolleyes:

If you're going to confirm your University updated all 200 PS3s, then your University is a rather stupid place and put themselves back into the red. What University would prioritize students playing games over a supercomputer?

The PS3 is a tool, like a gun. In the hands of a trained law official, it can be a tool used to save lives, in the hands of a ****ed off red-neck, it can be a way of destroying lives. Do not condemn the tool, condemn the users.

And that is quite possibly the most retarded thing I've read throughout this legal battle.

You want to really have a chance of saving lives? Run Folding@Home through Playstation Life.

[Jan Veteran]

So a innocent child's life isn't worth as much as a PS3 Hacker's wants?

Do you even know how bad this guy feels?

[articuno1au]

There's nothing hard to understand .

It's a shortsighted collective statement against SONY.

That these people can't grasp the entire picture, that of the company being an entity of it's own and having plenty strings to pull, patents and laws to defend it (Yes it did deliberately remove features, but there was some fine print that allowed them to in the first place.You signed up for an account, it's similar to signing a contract - folk agreed to its terms) and is able to undertake many actions that will in the end hurt the legitimate user, is another story.

I'll let the prosecution be the judge, but some people root for the hacker's statement and that's fine.

Speak for your country. A lot of countries don't take the point of view.

In Australia, EULAs are not legally binding. Furthermore, they were sold as platforms capable of running linux. This is no longer possible.

The super computing was the use of linux install. The purpose of the purchase was to run linux. It no longer does that.

Also, does it not **** you off to be straight up lied to by a MASSIVE corporation the likes of Sony?

Lastly: Consoles in Australia are MUCH more expensive then in the US/EU. Games here run $100->$120, Consoles are just as bad.

That's your Universities problem, PS3s are not sold as supercomputers, they're sold as games consoles.

Anyway, if the Universities main focus was having a supercomputer I'm sure it doesn't hurt to take away the abilitiy for students to play some games in the summer and stay on pre-3.15 firmware :rolleyes:

If you're going to confirm your University updated all 200 PS3s, then your University is a rather stupid place and put themselves back into the red.

Yeah, except you know how good academics are at thinking about those things before the students run the updates -_-

Derp @ them >.<

Sidenote: This university lost half the nodes of a beau wolf supercomputing cluster.

So a innocent child's life isn't worth as much as a PS3 Hacker's wants?

Do you even know how bad this guy feels?

Clearly didn't read the post.

I never said that, all I said was that you asserting that was wrong. I agree the childs life is most important, but it's not your "right" to decide that.

Please read it then reply. Seriously.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Yeah, except you know how good academics are at thinking about those things before the students run the updates -_-

Derp @ them >.<

I would like to think if a University somehow managed to research that PS3s could be used in a cluster, then went and bought 200 of them, they'd know their stuff.

It's still very careless and irresponsible to build something as important and expensive as a 200 piece hardware cluster then let students do whatever they want with it. Students could uninstall Linux, format hard drives, break the PS3, and the list goes on. However you're telling me your University didn't care and just let the students game on their "supercomputer"?

Prior to updating every PS3 as well the EULA and change list is shown, so every student if they do what they're suppose to do would clearly see OtherOS being listed as being removed.

[carmatic]

yeah they wont give their money to the people who make the games they play but they'll give it to what is a total stranger LOL.

but they HAVE already 'gave their money' to the people who make games... well, certainly most of them would have bought a few games for their PS3's , unless you are supposing that they are so hardcore piracy that none of their games are paid for....

[DukeEsquire]

<snip>

When you purchased that device, you entered into the purchase with the knowledge that the product was fit for a purpose.

Sony revoked functionality which made it no longer so. Claiming that by using other methods to re-enable this functionality makes you inherently bad is extremely hypocritical.

What about the users right to use the product for what it was bought, and for what it was sold as?

Stop making blanket statements. Not everyone modding their consoles is doing it for "bad" reasons.

Who said "bad" reasons? Not me.

Sony has never said they would never remove Linux support. In fact, they say, and YOU AGREE, that they are permitted to add and remove features in the future.

If you got screwed by Sony, go sue them. The reason your University didn't sue is because Sony didn't do anything illegal. The facts speak for themselves.

Or is "Two wrongs make a right" valid law in Australia? :laugh:

[articuno1au]

Yeah, those of us working with the high performance computing teams do >.>

The people in game design aren't ACTUALLY in IT D:

Dual use computing is pretty standard. I am currently Admin'ing a blade we use for research off term, and then mount multiple linux VM's on for the Network Admin classes. Universities don't have endless supplies of money, being able to cover 2 areas of their budget with a single purchase is very important :)

Lastly, the students probably weren't even aware that the PS3s were taken out of the rooms for other uses.

Universities are run by idiots. The people like you and I who do the actual work never get a look in on such decisions, but we kinda have to live with them. :\

[splur]

Yeah.. unless you are like my university. The university bought 200 PS3s for use as a super computing cluster during holidays, and for the gaming students to use for their studies.

Who the hell in your department requested that? Better question, who approved it?!

That's like me requesting 50 flat screen LED TVs for "instrument monitoring displays", my department would laugh at me. I'm sorry, if your research requires supercomputing then either buy a supercomputer or use your "modded hardware" for supercomputing only. If you kept your PS3s on old firmware, the Other OS option would've stayed and for supercomputing, I highly doubt you need access to PSN or online multiplayer gaming. It's your own fault that you decided to use your PS3 for both supercomputing and gaming at the same time, because I don't even understand why else you'd update a firmware where it was on news about how Sony removed the option of Linux.

[articuno1au]

Who said "bad" reasons? Not me.

Sony has never said they would never remove Linux support. In fact, they say, and YOU AGREE, that they are permitted to add and remove features in the future.

If you got screwed by Sony, go sue them. The reason your University didn't sue is because Sony didn't do anything illegal. The facts speak for themselves.

Or is "Two wrongs make a right" valid law in Australia? :laugh:

Please see:

The PlayStation 3 does not have Linux pre-installed. However, Sony included an option in the XMB menu to install other operating systems such as Linux.[7] Sony stated, "It was fully intended that you, a PS3 owner, could play games, watch movies, view photos, listen to music, and run a full-featured Linux operating system that transforms your PS3 into a home computer."[8]

Soon after the PlayStation 3 launched, Sony released "Other OS" in a PlayStation 3 System Software firmware up-date that allowed booting into Linux from the hard drive or from a Live CD that the distributor's kernel would boot.

Sony removed support for the "Other OS" install option in the PS3 Slim, announced in August 2009.[9] In March 2010 Sony announced that the "Other OS" capability of the original PS3 models would be removed due to security concerns in PS3 Firmware 3.21 on April 1 2010.[10

Regarding their commitment to maintaining Linux support on the console, you will have to give me some time to find it, but just to quickly make my point.

Just quickly: Where exactly do I agree to that? In the EULA? You mean that non-binding document that has no legal standing in Australia?

The university didn't sue Sony because it's a state funded university that isn't able to enter into legal proceedings of this nature on their own. There are undoubtedly other reasons, but on the off chance that there aren't, that reason flies.

Your ignorance knows no bounds. What I am saying is that modifying a tool for a legal use is NOT a wrong.. You would have clearly seen this had you bothered to read my previous posts. I am saying that using Linux on the PS3 does not negatively impact on other users, thus there is no reason to remove access based on the aforementioned arguments.

I would appreciate you bothering to read what I write before rebutting (I used the term out of habit, not accuracy) with floundering idiocies suggestive of an IQ sub 60.

Kindly have the respect to treat my posts in the same way I am treating yours, as a valid opinion worthy of a rebuttal, not as some idiosyncratic diatribe of stupidity.

Who the hell in your department requested that? Better question, who approved it?!

That's like me requesting 50 flat screen LED TVs for "instrument monitoring displays", my department would laugh at me. I'm sorry, if your research requires supercomputing then either buy a supercomputer or use your "modded hardware" for supercomputing only. If you kept your PS3s on old firmware, the Other OS option would've stayed and for supercomputing, I highly doubt you need access to PSN or online multiplayer gaming. It's your own fault that you decided to use your PS3 for both supercomputing and gaming at the same time, because I don't even understand why else you'd update a firmware where it was on news about how Sony removed the option of Linux.

Certain games force firmware updates. Thus the updates.

There is also something to be said for studying online gaming in a gaming degree..

I agree, they would have been far better off (and completely broke) had they bought a dedicated computing cluster, but given their budget and their available options, this path was a good choice.

The system is/was scalable, could be broken down to smaller clusters and made mobile with very little effort. This is of particular important when considering re-allocations of class rooms et all.

They took a perfectly valid decision that bit them on the ass due to dishonesty by Sony.

JUST FOR THE SAKE OF INTEREST: http://www.geek.com/articles/games/air-force-supercomputer-in-jeopardy-due-to-sony-ps3-update-20100513/

This further lead to a filing:

On April 27, 2010 a class action lawsuit was filed in California. The lawsuit claimed that the removal of the OtherOS feature was "unfair and deceptive" and a "breach of good faith".[14] Most of the filing relates to violation of various consumer protection laws relating to the removal. Several other lawsuits were also filed and are somewhat similar in nature but are filed by other individuals.[15]

Source (As above): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OtherOS

Will look for the statement of commitment now :)

[windows95isg8]

There is a lot better causes out there then some ****ing geek hacking his PS3, any of you here that donated to him should think about spending your cash more wisely in the future! If you have lots of free cash and want to donated some look into a just cause not some teenager with a PS3 problem. There is a lot of dying children in the world and kids loosing there parents to nasty illnesses and you really think a kid on his PS3 is what you should be funding?

[articuno1au]

/headdesk.

What, YOU BOUGHT AN ASTON MARTIN!!? ARE YOU A COMPLETE MORON! ROLLS ROYCE ARE WAY BETTER!?

Thank you for that beautifully opinionated statement. I shall again put to you that your opinion is YOURS. People can make their own (and clearly did) on what constitutes a worth while cause.

Just because you think there are better ways to spend your money, does not mean everyone should bend to your will..

Personally I'd have spent the money on an SSD drive, but that's just me >.>

EDIT::

Regarding my previous posts: http://www.tomshardware.com/news/ps3-playstation-3-linux-john-carmack,10035.html <- A decision made to save costs to the ultimate detriment of the users, maintain the security of their hardware again to the detriment of their users..

More reading: http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Sony-PS3-lawsuit-Firefox-4-and-Google-banishes-H264/

http://www.salon.com/technology/dan_gillmor/2011/01/19/sony_sues_researchers/index.html

Sony love to bitch and moan about their customers doing illegal things.. Anyone remember that Rootkit thing?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal

Ultimately, your opinion is your own (I know right, totally not what I have been saying this entire time..).. That is why I don't buy Sony equipment any more. Sometimes this sucks as I might see a Vaio laptop I really want, but I have never regretted my stance on this (for more then the 20 seconds after I see the pretty back lit keyboard :p)

I just think that Sony's actions are reprehensible, and I think this should be DEBATED, not opinionated by the (usually) intelligent members of this forum :\

[windows95isg8]

/headdesk.

What, YOU BOUGHT AN ASTON MARTIN!!? ARE YOU A COMPLETE MORON! ROLLS ROYCE ARE WAY BETTER!?

Thank you for that beautifully opinionated statement. I shall again put to you that your opinion is YOURS. People can make their own (and clearly did) on what constitutes a worth while cause.

Just because you think there are better ways to spend your money, does not mean everyone should bend to your will..

Personally I'd have spent the money on an SSD drive, but that's just me >.>

EDIT::

Regarding my previous posts: http://www.tomshardware.com/news/ps3-playstation-3-linux-john-carmack,10035.html <- A decision made to save costs to the ultimate detriment of the users, maintain the security of their hardware again to the detriment of their users..

More reading: http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Sony-PS3-lawsuit-Firefox-4-and-Google-banishes-H264/

You don't get my point... if you have children or have them one day and one gets ill or yourself... would you be happy with a doctor going ohh sorry we could not raise the cash for your care, but hay a lot of dump people gave lots of cash to a upset teen with a PS3 YAY! Now maybe it makes sense.. if not don't worry yourself.

[DukeEsquire]

@ articuno1au

I don't know anything about Australian law. I'm talking about US law. I know about that outstanding OtherOS litigation. It has not made much traction and if you read the motions by both sides, it's pretty clear what the resolution will be.

In the US, the EULA explicitly states that features may be added or removed in the future. That is binding.

Edit:

http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/california/candce/3:2010cv01811/226894/168/

From Sony's motion:

Stripped to its essence, Plaintiffs? eighty-four-page, 341-paragraph FAC fails to allege the one thing repeatedly demanded by this Court ? an explicit promise by SCEA to Plaintiffs that the

?Other OS? feature of the PlayStation?3 game console (?PS3?) would be available unconditionally and in perpetuity. Absent such a promise, Plaintiffs? claims ? no matter how prolix ? remain legally and factually deficient.

In other words, the Court asked the Plaintiff to produce something that shows Sony would not remove OtherOS. The Plaintiff was not able to.