ComScore: Microsoft's mobile phone market share slipping

Nokia may have launched the Lumia 710 in the US in January, but the biggest smartphone launch yet for Microsoft's Windows Phone OS apparently didn't help the company's market share against Apple, Google and Research in Motion. A new report from ComScore today states that Microsoft's share of the smartphone market went down from 5. 4 percent in October 2011 to just 4.4 percent in January 2012 in the US.

Google's Android OS continues to dominate the smartphone market with 48.6 percent in January, up from 46.3 percent in October 2011. Apple's iOS commanded 29.5 percent of the market in January, compared to 28.1 percent in October. RIM's Blackberry OS saw its market share dip from 17.2 percent in October to 15.2 percent in January.

ComScore also said that January was an important month for the smartphone industry in the US. For the first time, over 100 million US mobile phone customers now use smartphones. Overall, 234 million US citizens age 13 and above use some kind of mobile phone device. Samsung is the number one smartphone manufacturer in the US with 25.4 percent of the market in January. LG was second with 19.7 percent, followed by Motorola with 13.2 percent, Apple with 12.8 percent, and Research in Motion with 6.6 percent.

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Karma. For abandoning the good things from Windows Mobile along with the bad things. Hope the same doesn't happen to desktop Windows. (It's too big to happen of course). Microsoft will be successful in the Phone market when they develop a product that does everything that Windows Mobile+iPhone+Android do, not ship half-baked half-developed OSes to rush to get it shipped and when they get UX right.

xpclient said,
Karma. For abandoning the good things from Windows Mobile along with the bad things. Hope the same doesn't happen to desktop Windows. (It's too big to happen of course). Microsoft will be successful in the Phone market when they develop a product that does everything that Windows Mobile+iPhone+Android do, not ship half-baked half-developed OSes to rush to get it shipped and when they get UX right.

Exactly!

In the last month, we've lost our last 3 BlackBerry users to other devices. One to Android, and two to Windows. I have since shut down the BB services.

AlternSti said,
just bought a lumia 800 and it's truely good. Don't worry about stat... only time will tell

This is typical of the comments about the WP7 phones 'truely good' is not a rave review.

derekaw, I can say the same when it's a troll or an iManiac but I'm not commenting

I have all 3 : Playbook 64gb, iTouch, Lumia and I can comment properly... can you do the same?

derekaw said,

This is typical of the comments about the WP7 phones 'truely good' is not a rave review.

AlternSti said,
derekaw, I can say the same when it's a troll or an iManiac but I'm not commenting

All I suggest is that you think about what I said. I think that WP7 has a problem when the people with the phones are saying things like the phone is 'truly good'. Truly good is not good enough if WinPhone7 is to really do very well. There is no passion in a statement like that and that is a problem. I see comments like this all over the internet. Its almost like the people using the WP7 devices know they are not that good but are hopeful they will get better.

How about you start looking at the positive comments people make about the WP7 phones and you will see what I mean.

If you sometime dislike comments like that than don't bother with no? I'll never stop giving my feeling based on misperception

derekaw said,

All I suggest is that you think about what I said. I think that WP7 has a problem when the people with the phones are saying things like the phone is 'truly good'. Truly good is not good enough if WinPhone7 is to really do very well. There is no passion in a statement like that and that is a problem. I see comments like this all over the internet. Its almost like the people using the WP7 devices know they are not that good but are hopeful they will get better.

How about you start looking at the positive comments people make about the WP7 phones and you will see what I mean.

These are very low numbers and they show that there is little public interest in the platform. MS are doing all they can to promote the platform except give the phones away in breakfast cereal packs.

UndergroundWire is right about previous fanboy claims made here and we are still waiting.

As for lumping WinMo with WP7 what are CommScore meant to do when MS kicked off the new O/S with an incremental version number from the old O/S?

But I thought that Nokia was the savior? At least that's what the Microsoft fanboys on this site tell me. I know what will shut these fanboys once and for all though. Release individual figures for Windows Mobile and Windows Phone. That way we can see how much of decline it is every quarter.

Edit: My mistake they said that about 2011 and Apollo.

I have only ever seen 1 windows phone in the wild and when I asked the person about it they said that they hated it and regretted the purchase.

This is bad news considering how much Microsoft has been pushing WP7. It would be nice to see a break down of WP7/Win Mo though so we can see if WP7 has gained any.

In the US, Windows Phone is not going to go anywhere. No advertising, carriers blinded by the iphone and anti Microsoft bias, and stupid sales reps. Whereas in Europe Nokia is leading the way and at least growing WP marketshare. Just forget WP in the US, eventually MS's share will be zero. Guaranteed.

And for the record, I am a card-carrying WP7 fan using a Dell Venue Pro since December 2010. However I am realistic when it comes to WP's performance in the US, it just wont happen.

efjay said,
In the US, Windows Phone is not going to go anywhere. No advertising, carriers blinded by the iphone and anti Microsoft bias, and stupid sales reps. Whereas in Europe Nokia is leading the way and at least growing WP marketshare. Just forget WP in the US, eventually MS's share will be zero. Guaranteed.

And for the record, I am a card-carrying WP7 fan using a Dell Venue Pro since December 2010. However I am realistic when it comes to WP's performance in the US, it just wont happen.

It will, it's just going to take time. Keep in mind that Nokia only just recently came into the picture here and most other OEM's are waiting for Apollo... Unlike the rest of the world that has much better OEM support. Plus, Verizon is being all persnikity about it and probably won't give the platform a real chance until it officially supports LTE (Which I'm assuming won't be until Apollo)... It WILL gain marketshare in the US, but it will take some time.

[quote=efjay said,]In the US, Windows Phone is not going to go anywhere. No advertising, carriers blinded by the iphone and anti Microsoft bias, and stupid sales reps. Whereas in Europe Nokia is leading the way and at least growing WP marketshare. Just forget WP in the US, eventually MS's share will be zero. Guaranteed.


It isn't as great as you imagine goto Vodaphone UK website and try and spot the windows phone amongst all the iphone, blackberries and androids

http://www.vodafone.co.uk/personal/mobile-phones/index.htm

Orange is better, but its still 1 phone in 100 on offer

http://shop.orange.co.uk/mobile-phones/pay-monthly

in the U.S, huh? there's your problem. Lumia was launched in my country way before in the U.S. It also helps that we don't have retarded carriers here (no carrier locked phones or carrier exclusive phones by law).

FalseAgent said,
in the U.S, huh? there's your problem. Lumia was launched in my country way before in the U.S. It also helps that we don't have retarded carriers here (no carrier locked phones or carrier exclusive phones by law).

That sounds wonderful. I wish it were like that here. I really do.

M_Lyons10 said,

That sounds wonderful. I wish it were like that here. I really do.

But who would pay election campaigns for........... "People representatives" here?..............

Lots of WP7 lovers point to Windows Phone 6.5's presence in these figures so it disorts them, but has anyone seem a Windows Mobile handset of the shelves any time in the past year? Their haven't been many if any in the UK stores I've seen.

This is America. People over here don't really upgrade their phones as often as people do worldwide. They're on 2 year cycles and 2 years ago there were still WinMo devices on sale like the AT&T tilt 2 (touch pro 2) and the HD2, Imagio etc

The other problem with America is it usually takes forever for a new phone to get here (unless the carrier signs an exclusivity deal). The rest of the world is happily using UMTS 2100 but in America T-Mo uses 900/1700, AT&T uses 850/1900, Sprint uses CDMA and WiMax and Verizon uses CDMA and LTE Every carrier has a different band / technology that's only different from each other but from the rest of the world. So the phone you buy on AT&T, won't get 3g on t-mobile and won't work at all on Verizon / Sprint. So you're essentially locked into your carriers choice of phones. It's not like, say, Hong Kong where I can walk into an electronic store pick up a phone and use it on any of the 7 networks available.

Also due to the different bands OEMs have to make specialized models for the US market, and then since carriers have such a massive say here they get different designs and names too (even though their technically the same phone).

Edited by -Razorfold, Mar 8 2012, 8:41pm :

thealexweb said,
Lots of WP7 lovers point to Windows Phone 6.5's presence in these figures so it disorts them, but has anyone seem a Windows Mobile handset of the shelves any time in the past year? Their haven't been many if any in the UK stores I've seen.

the simple fact is they never promoted these devices and never will.

Razorfolds said,
This is America. People over here don't really upgrade their phones as often as people do worldwide. They're on 2 year cycles and 2 years ago there were still WinMo devices on sale like the AT&T tilt 2 (touch pro 2) and the HD2, Imagio etc

The other problem with America is it usually takes forever for a new phone to get here (unless the carrier signs an exclusivity deal). The rest of the world is happily using UMTS 2100 but in America T-Mo uses 900/1700, AT&T uses 850/1900, Sprint uses CDMA and WiMax, Verizon uses CDMA and LTE etc. Every carrier has a different band / technology that's only different from each other but from the rest of the world.

Hence OEMs have to make specialized models for the US market, and then since carriers have such a massive say here they get different designs and names too (even though their technically the same phone).

I suppose, someone should flag up when the final WinMo handset ceases to be sold and then x years from there this excuse can't be used.

thealexweb said,

I suppose, someone should flag up when the final WinMo handset ceases to be sold and then x years from there this excuse can't be used.


I don't think they're any being sold actively anymore, but I know the HD2 was on sale until a few months ago. But remember what I said about CDMA? More than half the people in the US are on either US cellular, Verizon, Sprint and Metro PCS (which I think piggy backs on Sprint's network). And all those networks are CDMA which hasn't gotten a new WP7 device since the Arrive / Trophy.

And its not surprising as to why, CDMA is pretty much a dead technology. Over 90% of the world uses GSM.

Razorfolds said,
This is America. People over here don't really upgrade their phones as often as people do worldwide. They're on 2 year cycles and 2 years ago there were still WinMo devices on sale like the AT&T tilt 2 (touch pro 2) and the HD2, Imagio etc

The other problem with America is it usually takes forever for a new phone to get here (unless the carrier signs an exclusivity deal). The rest of the world is happily using UMTS 2100 but in America T-Mo uses 900/1700, AT&T uses 850/1900, Sprint uses CDMA and WiMax and Verizon uses CDMA and LTE Every carrier has a different band / technology that's only different from each other but from the rest of the world. So the phone you buy on AT&T, won't get 3g on t-mobile and won't work at all on Verizon / Sprint. So you're essentially locked into your carriers choice of phones. It's not like, say, Hong Kong where I can walk into an electronic store pick up a phone and use it on any of the 7 networks available.

Also due to the different bands OEMs have to make specialized models for the US market, and then since carriers have such a massive say here they get different designs and names too (even though their technically the same phone).

Good post. It really is ridiculous here. I wish it were handled similarly to the rest of the world... lol

thealexweb said,

I suppose, someone should flag up when the final WinMo handset ceases to be sold and then x years from there this excuse can't be used.

Lets not forget, the large majority of Windows Mobiles sold tended to be for business use, and business' don't like to upgrade very often (too much expense), and technically this is a marketshare statistic, not a sales statistic.

thealexweb said,
Lots of WP7 lovers point to Windows Phone 6.5's presence in these figures so it disorts them, but has anyone seem a Windows Mobile handset of the shelves any time in the past year? Their haven't been many if any in the UK stores I've seen.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/1...re-after-q2-ios-was-static/

in 2011:
Windows mobile 6 marketshare: 3%
WP7 marketshare : 2%

obviously some professionnals still buy WM6 devices for in house applications.

Razorfolds said,
This is America. People over here don't really upgrade their phones as often as people do worldwide. They're on 2 year cycles and 2 years ago there were still WinMo devices on sale like the AT&T tilt 2 (touch pro 2) and the HD2, Imagio etc

The other problem with America is it usually takes forever for a new phone to get here (unless the carrier signs an exclusivity deal). The rest of the world is happily using UMTS 2100 but in America T-Mo uses 900/1700, AT&T uses 850/1900, Sprint uses CDMA and WiMax and Verizon uses CDMA and LTE Every carrier has a different band / technology that's only different from each other but from the rest of the world. So the phone you buy on AT&T, won't get 3g on t-mobile and won't work at all on Verizon / Sprint. So you're essentially locked into your carriers choice of phones. It's not like, say, Hong Kong where I can walk into an electronic store pick up a phone and use it on any of the 7 networks available.

Also due to the different bands OEMs have to make specialized models for the US market, and then since carriers have such a massive say here they get different designs and names too (even though their technically the same phone).

Some carriers have 3 year contracts too you know. But by your "logic", do you really think everyone signed up just before Windows Phone was released? Better yet, please explain why Android and iPhone are out selling Windows Phone? I mean by your "logic", wouldn't the effects be experienced with Android and iOS devices too?

Lastly, the first mainstream Android device was released in September 2008. It took it a year and a half to be a device that was selling really good. What is Windows Phone problem?

Please explain?

Some carriers have 3 year contracts too you know. But by your "logic", do you really think everyone signed up just before Windows Phone was released? Better yet, please explain why Android and iPhone are out selling Windows Phone? I mean by your "logic", wouldn't the effects be experienced with Android and iOS devices too?

I already explained that quite easily, but since you don't seem to understand English let me break it down for you.

Android is available on AT&T, Verizon, US Cellular, Metro PCS and T-Mobile. WP7 is available on AT&T and T-Mobile (and Verizon / Sprint if you count an ancient phone that they don't even advertise or really sell anymore). So more than half the US cellular network doesn't really have a windows phone that anyone would consider buying (ie a lumia or the focus or the titan). AT&T is pretty much the only carrier that has more than one WP7 device on sale (and the only one to have the most popular devices too).

Not to mention the lumia 800, which like I said is the best selling WP7 device, still isn't being sold in the US.

Lastly, the first mainstream Android device was released in September 2008. It took it a year and a half to be a device that was selling really good. What is Windows Phone problem?

Lets go back to 2008 and see what the competition was shall we? Oh it was just the iPhone and some old WinMo devices. Now lets fast forward to 2012 and see what the competition is oh there's the iPhone, about 8 million android handsets, and like 3 WP7 devices (the Titan, Focus, and lumia 710).

T-Mobile has pointed out that the lumia 710 is their 3rd best selling phone, and if you go abroad the lumia 800 is the best selling phone in a ton of markets.

Ugh can't edit.

And then there's people like me who can't really switch carriers for whatever reason. I'm an international student so getting anything on contract is a pain since I don't have a SSN. Now I would love to use AT&T even though I think they're a giant pile of **** just because I really like the Lumia 900 (or even the Titan 1/2), but two years ago I went to them and asked them if I buy the phone at full price and get a monthly plan for it (just so I can get unlimited data, text etc) and they said sure if I could put down a $1000 deposit. Are you kidding me? I'm paying $500 for a phone, so pretty much negating any cost benefit a contract may have, and you still expect me to put down another $1000 on top of that?

Verizon, Sprint and the rest are useless to me since where I'm from (Hong Kong) CDMA is virtually non-existent and I'm not interested in any of the world phones they sell. So that just leaves me with T-Mobile. Any other part of the world this wouldn't be an issue, I could be on any carrier and have any phone I want since they generally use the same bands and the same technology. In America, well it is an issue.

And what sucks even more is even though I have a lumia 800 (EU version) that unbranded and unlocked, it won't get 3g speeds since it doesn't support T-Mo's bands. So I'm stuck with my HD7 for now.

Razorfolds said,
...

Funny, what you broke down for me WAS NEVER MENTIONED! Most of what you explained in your first intangible rant is how carriers work in the U.S. NOWHERE does it explain why Verizon and Sprint dropped Windows Phone (I did only quote your first post). Perhaps you still need to learn English. You did say you are not from here so don't take it as an insult.

Second, On your response to me, you are arguing the fact that if it doesn't make it here in the U.S. then it has no shot of ever winning? Is that what you are trying to say? Well perhaps they should advertise in the U.S.? There is a bright idea.

Third, why is it I can buy a GSM Galaxy Nexus from (EU version) and it works with all GSM 3G bands here in the U.S. Perhaps Nokia doesn't know how to design a good world phone then. Samsung gets it when they design a EU GSM phone.

Fourth, they say the Lumia is the third best selling phone on TMobile and it's selling well overseas, why are the numbers slipping? If they numbers are slipping because Windows Mobile is not being sold anymore, then why aren't former Windows Mobile customers switching to Windows Phone. You see the number wouldn't being going backwards if people who had Windows Mobile bought Windows Phone. It would just plateau if that were the case.

In 2008, the competition was iPhone, BlackBerry and Symbian. Granted Symbian is pretty much an obsolete mobile OS here in the U.S., but it was the number 1 selling in Europe where the iPhone was number 2. Here in the U.S. BlackBerry was number 1 and iPhone was number 2. Not sure where Windows Mobile stood at the point. So Android came out at a time competing against an old established giant and a young, hip and trendy little giant. It still managed to come out on top. Fast forward to 2012, BlackBerry is hardly a competitor (it is more like what Windows Mobile used to be in its later days). So Windows Phone has to face two competitors. Same situation that Android had to face. So I don't see what the difference is. Android started out with one horrible carrier (T-Mobile) for a little more than a year. For about 4 months, Android had 1 phone. By 8 months, they had 6 phones total released. Sure Windows Phone had more than that released?

Lastly, most people in the U.S. just stick to one carrier. They are not you. Your boring story is not a case and point story to tell that explains anything from this article. I'm sorry that you have a difficult time getting a contract phone but that is what T-Mobile and prepaid carriers are there for. It is mostly used by immigrants and people that have bad credit (just my observation). But a responsible and respectable company CAN NOT put you on contract when you do not have a social security number. You can abuse the service one month and decide not to pay. SORRY, THAT'S HOW IT WORKS HERE IN THE U.S.

Funny, what you broke down for me WAS NEVER MENTIONED! Most of what you explained in your first intangible rant is how carriers work in the U.S. NOWHERE does it explain why Verizon and Sprint dropped Windows Phone (I did only quote your first post). Perhaps you still need to learn English. You did say you are not from here so don't take it as an insult.

Then maybe you should read all the replies before posting huh?

Second, On your response to me, you are arguing the fact that if it doesn't make it here in the U.S. then it has no shot of ever winning? Is that what you are trying to say? Well perhaps they should advertise in the U.S.? There is a bright idea.

Surprising how I never said that.

Third, why is it I can buy a GSM Galaxy Nexus from (EU version) and it works with all GSM 3G bands here in the U.S. Perhaps Nokia doesn't know how to design a good world phone then. Samsung gets it when they design a EU GSM phone.

It does? Network: HSPA/WCDMA Europe/Asia: 900/2100 MHz
That won't get 3G in the US, sorry. AT&T uses 850/1900 (both up and downstream) and T-mobile uses BOTH 900 / 1700 (one is upstream the other is downstream)

That's directly from Expansys. Yes Pentaband HSPA+ chips do exist, but they shouldn't have to. If the rest of the world can happily use 2100 so can America, but nope America likes to be different.

Not to mention the vast majority of phones don't have a pentaband chip. Which is why you GENERALLY can't buy a phone on AT&T and then use it on T-Mobile for example (or the other way around).

Fourth, they say the Lumia is the third best selling phone on TMobile and it's selling well overseas, why are the numbers slipping? If they numbers are slipping because Windows Mobile is not being sold anymore, then why aren't former Windows Mobile customers switching to Windows Phone. You see the number wouldn't being going backwards if people who had Windows Mobile bought Windows Phone. It would just plateau if that were the case.

Because these are US numbers not worldwide

In 2008, the competition was iPhone, BlackBerry and Symbian. Granted Symbian is pretty much an obsolete mobile OS here in the U.S., but it was the number 1 selling in Europe where the iPhone was number 2. Here in the U.S. BlackBerry was number 1 and iPhone was number 2.

I didn't know Blackberry had a smartphone out in 2008 Symbian doesn't exist here in the US and WinMo was generally used by businesses and pretty much on a massive decline after the iPhone came out. So yes the only competition was guess what the iPhone. Which if you remember correctly only had been out for under a year and costed close to $500 or something ridiculous ON contract AND only existed on AT&T. The iPhone now exists on Verizon, Sprint, and AT&T. Android exists on all those carriers too and T-Mobile. The competition now is WAY WAY more than it was 3 years ago.

Lastly, most people in the U.S. just stick to one carrier. They are not you. Your boring story is not a case and point story to tell that explains anything from this article.

So didn't I say most people in the US stick to one carrier for whatever reason? Oh yes I did. And when the majority of those people are on carriers that don't really sell WP7 (ie every carrier but T-Mobile who has 1 device and AT&T who has 3) guess what happens?

But a responsible and respectable company CAN NOT put you on contract when you do not have a social security number. You can abuse the service one month and decide not to pay. SORRY, THAT'S HOW IT WORKS HERE IN THE U.S.
Yeah amazing how I have two credit cards, one with Chase and one with Bank Of America (both unsecured and both have a $1000 credit limit) all without a social security number.

And I know people can abuse the service, but a monthly bill is what? 90usd max? Please explain why I need to put down a $1000 deposit for an absolutely unlimited plan (so no overage fees) when they will cancel my plan if I don't pay a bill for one month. 1 or 2 month deposit? Yeah that's acceptable, but sorry a thousand dollar deposit which is pretty much like 10 months + of service isn't.

And I was with AT&T before that, on their monthly prepaid plans for 2 years and never had a late payment so it's not like I'm some brand new person they've never heard of.

Edited by -Razorfold, Mar 9 2012, 2:39am :

Razorfolds said,

Surprising how I never said that.

Hence Why I asked if that is what you are trying to say. After all you did mention U.S. specifically on why the numbers for WP suck. So what were you trying to say then? Note I am now asking the question a SECOND TIME! P.S. This funny symbol in quotes "?" means it was a question. I don't know if you learned that yet.

Razorfolds said,

It does? Network: HSPA/WCDMA Europe/Asia: 900/2100 MHz
That won't get 3G in the US, sorry. AT&T uses 850/1900 (both up and downstream) and T-mobile uses BOTH 900 / 1700 (one is upstream the other is downstream)

Yes it REALLY DOES. HSDPA 850 / 900 / 1700 / 1900 / 2100 from GSM Arena: http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_galaxy_nexus-4219.php Funny, I would think a flagship phone would have such things. I guess Nokia is not considering it anymore since they are with Windows Phone.

Razorfolds said,

Because these are US numbers not worldwide

Oh so were back to it has to succeed first in the U.S. before the numbers ever budge world wide? Why mention it sells well oversees when the numbers are still pathetic? You like to tell pointless stories, my mistake.

Razorfolds said,

I didn't know Blackberry had a smartphone out in 2008 Symbian doesn't exist here in the US and WinMo was generally used by businesses and pretty much on a massive decline after the iPhone came out. So yes the only competition was guess what the iPhone. Which if you remember correctly only had been out for under a year and costed close to $500 or something ridiculous ON contract AND only existed on AT&T. The iPhone now exists on Verizon, Sprint, and AT&T. Android exists on all those carriers too and T-Mobile. The competition now is WAY WAY more than it was 3 years ago.

Wait, what? BlackBerry is not a smartphone? What the hell are you trying to say? I know your English is not good but try not to joke around because I honestly think you are being serious here. So I never actually said that WinMo was a competitor only BlackBerry and iPhone in the U.S. and Symbian and iPhone in Europe. Using my fingers, I count two big competitors for each region. I wish I can show you the two fingers I used to count. One on each hand too.

Razorfolds said,

Yeah amazing how I have two credit cards, one with Chase and one with Bank Of America (both unsecured and both have a $1000 credit limit) all without a social security number.

Now you know why this country is in the condition in. But goodie for you. But seriously, Verizon and AT&T is not a bank. Maybe it is different in Hong Kong for you. So a $1000 is not much for a bank to lend you. But thanks for sharing I guess.

Razorfolds said,

And I know people can abuse the service, but a monthly bill is what? 90usd max? Please explain why I need to put down a $1000 deposit for an absolutely unlimited plan (so no overage fees) when they will cancel my plan if I don't pay a bill for one month. 1 or 2 month deposit? Yeah that's acceptable, but sorry a thousand dollar deposit which is pretty much like 10 months + of service isn't.

And I was with AT&T before that, on their monthly prepaid plans for 2 years and never had a late payment so it's not like I'm some brand new person they've never heard of.

Well, you can rack quite a bit on text messages, data, phone calls. Not sure if AT&T has in-app billing tied to the carrier account with the iPhone and Android phones. Also, when you go on contract, technically you are buying a subsidized phone. That can equal to a good chunk of money. So let me ask you, can I sign-up for AT&T, buy the iPhone 4S, rack up a huge bill and not pay it? Can I get away with it for two months? How much does that equal now. Wait, one more thing. Can I sell the phone after the two months? Who losses in all this? Surely if that is the way it works in Hong Kong or Europe, let me sign up and cash in.

Again, I'm sorry but that is how the system works. Like I said before, that boring story doesn't have any relevance to this topic. But if it made you feel good to Bit**, then goodie for you.

Hence Why I asked if that is what you are trying to say. After all you did mention U.S. specifically on why the numbers for WP suck. So what were you trying to say then? Note I am now asking the question a SECOND TIME! P.S. This funny symbol in quotes "?" means it was a question. I don't know if you learned that yet.

And yet for the third time now.
WP7 ONLY EXISTS ON AT&T and 1 PHONE ON T-MOBILE. Nokia / HTC / Samsung haven't really bothered making a CDMA version and Verizon seems to hate Microsoft since they declined the 900 claiming it doesn't have LTE (when it does).

When most of the country is on networks that don't sell WP7, no **** WP7 isn't going to sell as well as Android / iOS (which do exist on those networks).

Yes it REALLY DOES. HSDPA 850 / 900 / 1700 / 1900 / 2100 from GSM Arena: http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_galaxy_nexus-4219.php Funny, I would think a flagship phone would have such things. I guess Nokia is not considering it anymore since they are with Windows Phone.

http://www.expansys.com/google...xy-nexus-16gb-black-224319/
GSM arena tends to list all the available frequencies.

And like I said, most phones do not have pentaband chips because they're too expensive and apart from the US, pointless.

Oh so were back to it has to succeed first in the U.S. before the numbers ever budge world wide? Why mention it sells well oversees when the numbers are still pathetic? You like to tell pointless stories, my mistake.

Wow your English is more pathetic than your common sense. I said WP7 is doing well worldwide, and that has absolutely nothing to do with America, and if you don't believe me go look up the info yourself. The lumia 800 is outselling a ton of phones in pretty much every market its sold in. It goes on sale in the US (finally) later in March but only on AT&T (goes back to my first point about AT&T being the only real carrier with WP7).

Wait, what? BlackBerry is not a smartphone? What the hell are you trying to say? I know your English is not good but try not to joke around because I honestly think you are being serious here.

You consider blackberry on the same level as Android, iOS and WP7? Really? Remember I'm talking about blackberry in 2008, not 2012. There's a massive difference.

In 2008 blackberries looked like this: http://www.blogcdn.com/www.eng...ackberry-9000-itw-11-sm.jpg

Blackberry app world didn't even exist until later in 2009.

Now you know why this country is in the condition in. But goodie for you. But seriously, Verizon and AT&T is not a bank. Maybe it is different in Hong Kong for you. So a $1000 is not much for a bank to lend you. But thanks for sharing I guess.

It is for me when my monthly expenses (rent aside, which is paid in cash) come to about $600. I don't need a higher limit because I will never come close to using it.

Well, you can rack quite a bit on text messages, data, phone calls. Not sure if AT&T has in-app billing tied to the carrier account with the iPhone and Android phones. Also, when you go on contract, technically you are buying a subsidized phone.

Did you miss the part where I said unlimited data, text and calls? Did you also miss the part where I said I wanted to buy the phone outright ie no subsidizing? They wanted to put down a $1000 deposit EVEN WITH buying the phone outright for $500 or w/e. So all in all even if I did miss a months payment, all AT&T will lose is $90. Not $1000.

Guess your English isn't as good as you think it is.

Edited by -Razorfold, Mar 9 2012, 3:37am :

Razorfolds said,

...

This conversation is going NOWHERE with you. In no particular order.

I was talking about 2008 for BlackBerry. So let me dumb it down for you (again) A giant is a giant no matter how you slice it. Is BlackBerry in the same league? No but you just answered your own question here. Android came out with something that was different than the iPhone and offered somethings different. It also offered more than BlackBerry in some cases. Fast forward to day. What does Windows Phone offer that iPhone and Android doesn't? Don't you think at this point Microsoft can't just have something similar but they need a device that will revolutionize the smartphone.

Second, a friend of mine has the GSM Galaxy Nexus and it works fine on T-Mobiles 3G. http://articles.businessinside...dwich-sale-today-newegg-com Any Android site will tell you that too. So again, Nokia couldn't do that? I see you get your knowledge form inferior sites. That explains a lot. Stop debating me with the Nexus. Unlike you, I know what I am talking about. It was meant as a point, Android's flagship phone is World Wide just like the iPhone. Why can't Nokia do that? They are clearly the flag ship manufacturer.

Third, If the phone is doing well world-wide, WHY ARE THE WORLD_WIDE NUMBERS ALSO SLIPPING? Again I find myself repeating the same question over and over and over.

Fourth, There is no IF's AND's or BUT's about it. YOU HAVE TO GO THROUGH A CREDIT CHECK. Let's go by your weak scenario. You buy the phone out right, you have unlimited, blah blah blah. But what happens when you upgrade? They do not run a credit check on you because you are in the system. Hence why, regardless, you have to go through that process first. If you don't want to put money down, then go with a prepaid or an inferior carrier. Yes Prepaid doesn't offer good phones because quite frankly, they don't have to. AT&T doesn't make much money from selling you a phone outright for a prepaid plan. Again, this story is NOT WORTH MENTIONING.

It's quite laughable that you are putting that boring story up there. Go back to where you came from if you don't like it. Or get your citizenship and SSN. I don't know what else to tell you kiddo. If you don't get it by now, you never will. So I will not respond to this boring story anymore. BIT*H all you want, it won't change a thing.

In the end of all this stupid little rant, Verizon and Sprint doesn't want Windows Phone because the majority of their customers don't want it. I don't see some big campaign petitioning them to bring Windows Phone. Lastly, it doesn't matter what you are reading. Windows Phone just doesn't sell well in the U.S. or World-Wide. I just let the numbers do the talking for me on this one.

Edited by UndergroundWire, Mar 9 2012, 3:05am :

I was talking about 2008 for BlackBerry. So let me dumb it down for you (again) A giant is a giant no matter how you slice it. Is BlackBerry in the same league? No but you just answered your own question here. Android came out with something that was different than the iPhone and offered somethings different. It also offered more than BlackBerry in some cases. Fast forward to day. What does Windows Phone offer that iPhone and Android doesn't? Don't you think at this point Microsoft can't just have something similar but they need a device that will revolutionize the smartphone.

Ok fine lets consider that blackberry is a smartphone just to appease you. When android came out its competition was:

Verizon - Blackberry
AT&T - Blackberry and iPhone
T-Mobile - Nothing
Sprint - Nothing

Now Android, blackberry and iPhone are on all those networks above (apart from T-Mobile). Still going to argue the competition is the same as it was in 2008? And sorry to burst your bubble but the first android phone was an outright failure, much worse than the failure you consider WP7. The only thing it did differently to the iPhone at the time was allow you to install your own apps and cost about $400 less on contract.

And before you point out that I'm a giant Apple / Microsoft fan let me just list my past few devices for you: iPhone 3g, AT&T Captivate (the samsung galaxy), HTC evo 4G (which I found out was just a giant waste of money since Sprint is terrible), HTC HD2, and now HD7.

Second, a friend of mine has the GSM Galaxy Nexus and it works fine on T-Mobiles 3G. Any Android site will tell you that. So again, Nokia couldn't do that?

They could have but they didn't. Either way the lumia series of devices is coming out in America on AT&T in just over a week. Better late than never.

HTC, as far as I know, don't have any pentaband HSPA chips either for your information.

Third, If the phone is doing well world-wide, WHY ARE THE WORLD_WIDE NUMBERS ALSO SLIPPING? Again I find myself repeating the same question over and over and over.

They are? Where?

AT&T doesn't make much money from selling you a phone outright for a prepaid plan.

I wasn't talking about that but ok.

It's quite laughable that you are putting that boring story up there.

The only reason I put that to story was because I said most people in the US stick to one carrier for whatever reason. The reason I stick to T-Mobile was as I described. Not that hard to understand.

In the end of all this stupid little rant, Verizon and Sprint doesn't want Windows Phone because the majority of their customers don't want it. I don't see some big campaign petitioning them to bring Windows Phone.

Actually there are people on Verizon and Sprint that do want it. But don't let facts get in your way.

Lastly, it doesn't matter what you are reading. Windows Phone just doesn't sell well in the U.S. or World-Wide. I just let the numbers do the talking for me on this one.

http://www.google.com/search?s...&q=lumia+800+top+seller
On the first two pages alone, Lumia 800 top seller in Finland, O2 Germany, UK, Orange Austria, Dutch Carrier KPN (outselling the iPhone 4S), UK, Expansys AU, France. And that's just ONE Windows Phone device.

Oh but the numbers you have say different don't they.

Edited by -Razorfold, Mar 9 2012, 4:02am :

Razorfolds said,
..

BlackBerry was available on all carriers. Just wanted to get that out of the way. Second, like I salid before , Android was on one carrier with one phone. They did well from themselves with that start and that competition. I've already said that. Try to keep up with me.

The comScore (http://www.comscore.com/Press_...ile_Subscriber_Market_Share) numbers and Gartner (http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=1924314) numbers tell a different story. But hey who are they, right? They are no good indicator so I guess you are a 100% right. /s

I'm sure there a couple of fanboys that want it but not enough for any meaningful numbers to persuade them to carry it right now. But please provide me with such a fact. From what I can see, no big outcry against these companies. Just a couple of mindless, fanboys that want it and bitc*ing about on Internet forums. Wow, I see results from that. whoop-dee-fu**ing-doo

Amazing how you can't read?

comScore in giant bold letters too - comScore Reports January 2012 U.S. Mobile Subscriber. I thought we were talking about worldwide here.

And Gartner? Well look at the date the report was for. Fourth quarter 2011. The Lumia 800 went on sale in 4 (or something countries) at the end of November. The other WP7 devices (apart from the Titan) aren't doing really good, but the lumia series are as I pointed out in that Google search. So you're going to now claim that European and Australian carriers are lying when they sell the Lumia 800 is one of their best selling devices (and T-mobile too)?

BlackBerry was available on all carriers. Just wanted to get that out of the way. Second, like I salid before , Android was on one carrier with one phone. They did well from themselves with that start and that competition. I've already said that. Try to keep up with me.

And like I'll point out again. The competition and smartphone market is nowhere near the same in 2012 as it was in 2008. If you really think WP7 has the same competition as Android does then you're delusional or just trolling.

Razorfolds said,
And like I'll point out again. The competition and smartphone market is nowhere near the same in 2012 as it was in 2008. If you really think WP7 has the same competition as Android does then you're delusional or just trolling.

Actually Microsoft is delusional. Like you said, it is a different market. But for the second time I'll say it again. Microsoft can't come out with the same thing as the completion in this market. They need to go over the top. Otherwise it is just dumb.

I have been accused every quarter by fanboys like yourself that "those numbers are from the previous quarter and [Insert lame excuse this time] was barely released."

OK, so we'll do it your way, I'll wait till next quarter then. Because by your argument the Nokia 710 and 800 should have made a dent. But it really isn't fare you know I've been doing a lot of waiting. When will it be safe to laugh and say I told you so? That's the best part of winning an argument with people like you. I have to dumb down to be on the same level of but-hurt fanboys you know?

So I'll wait, again. Nice chatting with you. See you next quarter? Ah, we'll just play it by ear. Oh I forgot the Lumia 900 is coming out soon so I'll have to wait another quarter. Ok, See you in two quarters then.

Actually Microsoft is delusional. Like you said, it is a different market. But for the second time I'll say it. Microsoft can't come out with the same thing is the completion. They need to go over the top.

Oh they have gone over the top because you see they made a mobile OS that was hardware accelerated from day 1. Only took Google 4 years to do that.

There's plenty of other innovations in WP7, especially with the way it handles social networks which people seem to care about these days. But don't let those facts get in your way either.

What did Android do differently to iOS when it first came out? Hm lets see oh that's right it didn't have a closed off app garden which to be honest only matters to geeks (highly doubt the average person on the street goes YEAH I CAN GET CUSTOM ROMS AND APPS FROM XDA).

I have been accused every quarter by fanboys like yourself that "those numbers are from the previous quarter and [Insert lame excuse this time] was barely released.

Too bad I'm not really a fanboy since I've used every single mobile OS with the exception of blackberry.

That's the best part of winning an argument with people like you. I have to dumb down to be on the same level of but-hurt fanboys.

Actually tbh you're the one who feels the need to go into every WP7 and iOS topic and claim it sucks and "inform" us about how great Android is. Guess that makes you a much bigger fanboy than me.

Razorfolds said,
Actually tbh you're the one who feels the need to go into every WP7 topic and claim it sucks. I haven't done that in Android topics or iOS ones (in quite a while).

Really, every topic. Show me? Let's narrow it down to this week. Or may two weeks if it helps? I dare you.

Don't get me wrong, I started off naive. I too was a Microsoft fanboy. I'll admit it. Eventually, I grew up. Now I like certain Microsoft products, certain Google products, and certain Apple products. I have matured. But it doesn't mean I can't be critical. If I criticize, it's only because they deserve it not because I'm trolling. Yesterday I laughed at some of the ridiculous claims that Apple made as I was per-ordering the new iPad .

But hey, sorry I didn't know the rules were "don't comment if you are not a fan". I apologize. I hope I didn't disrupt that bubble of yours. But to my defense, this article is mainly about ComScores latest numbers so good luck finding all those topics I supposedly troll. Your findings should be interesting.

If I criticize, it's only because they deserve it not because I'm trolling. Yesterday I laughed at some of the ridiculous claims that Apple made as I was per-ordering the new iPad .

Oh so when I criticize stuff even though I've supported Android in some situations, iOS in others and WP7 in others, I'm a butt-hurt fanboy. But when you do it, then its all good

Hell go to the iPad vs. Tegra 3, I'm pretty critical of Apple's bull**** claims but I also recognize that iOS does hardware acceleration better than Android (in some cases). And I also pointed out that Google has made some huge advancements in that area with ICS.

But hey, I'm a butthurt Microsoft fanboy what do I know.

I'm not targeting anyone here, but why do so many discussions often turn out in personal insults?

I like this site, but that's contrary to its moderation...

M_Lyons10 said,

Good post. It really is ridiculous here. I wish it were handled similarly to the rest of the world... lol

Let us try to elect some State Attorneys able to charge carriers with racketeering.............

i think enough people were burned with the earlier windows phone efforts they steer clear any of anything branded microsoft or windows on a phone. sad but true.

it's not just that though, the 710 is not a must have phone, it can't compete with the year old galaxy or iphone 4 and by the time the galaxy 3 comes out in a few months time it will look positively obsolete.

but the biggest problem is that the whole app ecosystem and experience on windows phone is really a generation behind that of android and apple. apps are limited and what is there tends to cost more than the other platforms. i'm not saying that the windows phone platform is all bad, it's just the competition is so established they really have to release something really, really special to make people sit up, listen and run buy it (like apple did with the original iphone - there wasn't anything like on the market at the time) but the market is flooded with cheap smartphones and neither Nokia or Microsoft have anything that good to compete.

[quote=Mr Winkle said,]i think enough people were burned with the earlier windows phone efforts they steer clear any of anything branded microsoft or windows on a phone. sad but true. ]

The number of people who ever owned a old windows mobile devices was tiny. There never was 100 million people owning windows mobile! Not even 10 million

Microsoft has been very late in getting it mobile-ecosystem act together. So they are just battling agaist the massive momentum of the iphone/android market.... and the 800 and 900 are not even availible yet

Deviate_X said,

The number of people who ever owned a old windows mobile devices was tiny. There never was 100 million people owning windows mobile! Not even 10 million

In 2006 Windows Mobile enjoyed a 42% market share. I am afraid not even WP9, if it will ever exist, will reach such market share percentage.

It's sad to see it slowly become a two player race. As Blackberry keeps falling it is slowly becoming just Apple and Google. Perhaps with their recent changes in the company they can make some kind of comeback and there will be more competition. I also feel bad for Microsoft in the heat of a new platform launch to see numbers still diving. On a positive note cheers to iOS 5 and ICS they are both an amazing and fluid OS and its good to see them doing so well.

NAT1V3 said,
It's sad to see it slowly become a two player race. As Blackberry keeps falling it is slowly becoming just Apple and Google. Perhaps with their recent changes in the company they can make some kind of comeback and there will be more competition. I also feel bad for Microsoft in the heat of a new platform launch to see numbers still diving. On a positive note cheers to iOS 5 and ICS they are both an amazing and fluid OS and its good to see them doing so well.

I call it Karma. Microsoft is still paying for how they abandoned customers that were on the Windows mobile platform back in 2010.

You do realize ComScore, for whatever reason, counts WinMo and WP7 under the same name right? WinMo has been dropping for a few years now.

Also keep in mind that the Lumia 800 (which I think is the best selling WP7 device) isn't sold in America off contract. And that more than half of the carriers in the US don't really have any new WP7 on sale and since they're all CDMA they won't have any good new ones either.

Razorfolds said,
You do realize ComScore, for whatever reason, counts WinMo and WP7 under the same name right? WinMo has been dropping for a few years now.

Also keep in mind that the Lumia 800 (which I think is the best selling WP7 device) isn't sold in America off contract. And that more than half of the carriers in the US don't really have any new WP7 on sale and since they're all CDMA they won't have any good new ones either.

Agreed. And Verizon really needs to get their act together as well.

And then there was a few other studies predicting that WP7 market will skyrocket and share will be double or tripple. This was like a month ago.

Krome said,
And then there was a few other studies predicting that WP7 market will skyrocket and share will be double or tripple. This was like a month ago.

WP7 market share HAS improved.
Microsoft's market share includes WM6 marketshare, and WM6 devices are almost no longer on sale, that's why it is slipping.

Krome said,
And then there was a few other studies predicting that WP7 market will skyrocket and share will be double or tripple. This was like a month ago.

Didn't those studies make predictions for that growth taking off somewhere between now and 2015?

derekaw said,
Mango was meant to propell Windows Phone market share, so was Nokia, what are we waiting for now?

"Microsoft marketshare" = "Windows Mobile 6.x marketshare" + "WP7 marketshare"

WM6.x marketshare is dropping
WP7 marketshare is improving, but not as much as WM6 drops, which is normal since android is a closer successor to WM6.x (in term of openness) than WP7.

btw, we hear this kind of news since WP7 was released. Maybe it's time to differentiate WM6 and WP7 marketshare....

derekaw said,
Mango was meant to propell Windows Phone market share, so was Nokia, what are we waiting for now?

If VZW had more than one old phone, I'd probably own it, but Verizon seems to hate Microsoft these days.

link8506 said,

"Microsoft marketshare" = "Windows Mobile 6.x marketshare" + "WP7 marketshare"

WM6.x marketshare is dropping
WP7 marketshare is improving, but not as much as WM6 drops, which is normal since android is a closer successor to WM6.x (in term of openness) than WP7.

btw, we hear this kind of news since WP7 was released. Maybe it's time to differentiate WM6 and WP7 marketshare....

Exactly. They should be breaking this out at this point...

I still love how some people expect it to sell millions a month after something happens, whether it be Mango, or Nokia, or whatever. It's silly.

derekaw said,
Mango was meant to propell Windows Phone market share, so was Nokia, what are we waiting for now?

An actual Nokia WP7 device! Only T-Mobile has a Nokia as of yet.

pwgarner said,

An actual Nokia WP7 device! Only T-Mobile has a Nokia as of yet.

Exactly, and TMobile has said they are very happy with how well the Nokia Lumia 710. ATT is getting ready to launch the Nokia Lumia 900 sometime this Month. No one knows when VZ will get a new phone.

NPGMBR said,

Exactly, and TMobile has said they are very happy with how well the Nokia Lumia 710. ATT is getting ready to launch the Nokia Lumia 900 sometime this Month. No one knows when VZ will get a new phone.


Waiting for a Titan II but the Lumia 900 may beat it out. After Mango on the Titan, going back to iPhone for an app was squinting torture. It's slow, but Windows Phone is winning over the executive branch as we expose them to it. iPhone definitely has more visibility.

Android is the cheap commodity for people who want all their apps free, could care less about security, and need the cheapest smartphone plans available. It will probably remain the leader for some time to come.

MorganX said,

Waiting for a Titan II but the Lumia 900 may beat it out. After Mango on the Titan, going back to iPhone for an app was squinting torture. It's slow, but Windows Phone is winning over the executive branch as we expose them to it. iPhone definitely has more visibility.

Android is the cheap commodity for people who want all their apps free, could care less about security, and need the cheapest smartphone plans available. It will probably remain the leader for some time to come.

You are absolutely right. Devices like the SGS II, Galaxy Note or the Nexus S are sooo cheap commodities...

MorganX said,

Waiting for a Titan II but the Lumia 900 may beat it out. After Mango on the Titan, going back to iPhone for an app was squinting torture. It's slow, but Windows Phone is winning over the executive branch as we expose them to it. iPhone definitely has more visibility.

Android is the cheap commodity for people who want all their apps free, could care less about security, and need the cheapest smartphone plans available. It will probably remain the leader for some time to come.


But right now Windows Phone 7 is being smoked by Android...don't hate.