Samsung puts the burn on Microsoft, disses Windows 8

Corporate mudslinging should be a national sport, as corporate executives are fantastic at blaming others for their shortcomings rather than looking internally to find the fault behind their poor market performance.

On this edition of “it’s not my fault that my company didn’t do as well as expected,” Samsung is blaming Windows 8 for its poor performance in the PC market and the overall decline of the industry as a whole. Jun Dong-soo, who runs Samsung’s memory chip business, dropped the diss while addressing a report that the market would continue its remission going forward.

Dong-soo stated that the market failed to see a boost from Windows 8 and that Windows 8 is "no better than the previous Windows Vista platform” and also called Windows 8 a less competitive platform.

Not surprising, as Samsung has been investing heavily in its Galaxy and Note brands and promoting these devices at every stop which has given them brand equity in the tablet and smartphone markets. Imagine if Samsung gave the same attention to detail when it came to building its Windows 8 machines and marketed them with the same budget as the Galaxy and Note devices; maybe, just maybe, their luck might turn around in the PC market. 

Source: Korea Times via Engadget

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Samsung know what they are talking about. Samsung's opinion is based on years of making and marketing and selling PC's.

"Dong-soo stated that the market failed to see a boost from Windows 8 and that Windows 8 is "no better than the previous Windows Vista platform” and also called Windows 8 a less competitive platform"

Could not agree with that more!!

OEM's have been making crappy hardware for years now. Samsung is one of them. PC sales were declining long before Windows 8 was released. The world economy is in a real bad situation right now. Most consumers who purchased a Windows 7 laptop, PC wont be upgrading for another couple years yet. With all that I just mentioned above its no wonder that growth is very slow for Windows 8 (but it is still growth month on month).

you know. when one boy cried wolf. it's one thing. but when the whole village cry wolf. now that's a calamity in the making. lmao.

i've brought this less discussed issue before:

"Samsung Galaxy may cause random temporary windows deactivation, when plugged to random windows 8 computer."

its 'random' because its may or may not happens,
this issues should've resolved already by respective updates.

but i wonder if this actually coincindent ?
Samsung diss Microsoft,
Samsung product (Galaxy S3) casue strange issue on Microsoft product (Windows 8)

Pull your finger out Samsung - they had no decent kit available at launch that's why they've sold so little. Lenovo X1 Carbon for me!

It's great that the hardware manufacturers are calling out Microsoft on their terrible OS! For the record, fan boys and girls, it's not JUST the Start button, or "Metro". The interface IS horrid, but the true problem is that they are locking down the hardware with "secure boot", making it more difficult (especially for novices) to try a competing OS, they are creating a "walled garden" with ALL "Metro" apps having to be downloaded from the official MS store (with MS taking a 20-30% cut of the gross!), and the "classic" desktop applications are now being referred to as "legacy". Does NO ONE see a problem here?

If I wanted a "walled garden" experience, I would have bought a Mac! It will be a cold day in hell before I buy a Windows 8 box.

John Nemesh said,
It's great that the hardware manufacturers are calling out Microsoft on their terrible OS! For the record, fan boys and girls, it's not JUST the Start button, or "Metro". The interface IS horrid, but the true problem is that they are locking down the hardware with "secure boot", making it more difficult (especially for novices) to try a competing OS, they are creating a "walled garden" with ALL "Metro" apps having to be downloaded from the official MS store (with MS taking a 20-30% cut of the gross!), and the "classic" desktop applications are now being referred to as "legacy". Does NO ONE see a problem here?

If I wanted a "walled garden" experience, I would have bought a Mac! It will be a cold day in hell before I buy a Windows 8 box.

First off, secure boot can be disabled allowing any OS to boot and there's also a shim boot loader for GRUB to boot Linux if you so choose.

Second requiring apps only to be downloaded from the store is fine. Users know that these apps are not malware and can read reviews to help decide whether or not to get it.

Third, it is possible to use your own payment options such as PayPal instead of going through the store which allow you to keep all of the revenue.

Fourth, you can still install desktop apps which will never disappear or be limited so who cares what they are called? The consumer market is moving to be touch centric. Many old apps don't work well with touch and therefore being called "legacy" is appropriate.

John Nemesh said,
It's great that the hardware manufacturers are calling out Microsoft on their terrible OS! For the record, fan boys and girls, it's not JUST the Start button, or "Metro". The interface IS horrid, but the true problem is that they are locking down the hardware with "secure boot", making it more difficult (especially for novices) to try a competing OS, they are creating a "walled garden" with ALL "Metro" apps having to be downloaded from the official MS store (with MS taking a 20-30% cut of the gross!), and the "classic" desktop applications are now being referred to as "legacy". Does NO ONE see a problem here?

If I wanted a "walled garden" experience, I would have bought a Mac! It will be a cold day in hell before I buy a Windows 8 box.

I love how you say it's not about the start screen or metro and then your only complaints are specific to metro and the start screen. As has already been mentioned secure boot can be disabled and anyone who doesn't know how and can't find out probably wouldn't or shouldn't be messing with alternate OS installs.

Who cares what they refer to the desktop apps as? And who cares about a walled garden of apps you NEVER HAVE TO USE?

As long as the desktop is still there it makes no difference. Complaining about it on principle is just childish.

Windows 8 is not the problem (many consumers who use it as their primary machine actually love it, in fact most I've spoken to and talked to in stores/events/forums/etc. say it's a fun OS (which it is!)... it'll only get better with Blue and even better in Windows 9.

The issue is people are accustomed to their current hardware and don't feel the need to invest in new hardware yet. Most people feel Windows 7 works fine for them still... i.e. if it ain't broke why upgrade? They'll upgrade eventually when they feel the need to upgrade (i.e. when lack of support hits, hardware breaks, lack of software support, etc.). It's the same issue with how Windows XP was. It's not rocket-science.

I just can't believe people are still comparing Win8 to Vista..
- Does Win8 have driver issues in the same league as Vista? No.
- Does Win8 make the HDD churn for hrs on end? No.
- Is Win8 slow? No.

I could be wrong but isn't the rate of adoption even much faster than Vista? Even if total numbers are still low compared to Win7.

Lenovo CEO

new technologies like Windows 8, ultrabooks, and convertibles will drive new demand. 2013 will be better than 2012

I foresee Lenovo becoming one of the biggest players in technology. Anyone see their products? Amazing. Compare it to the crap from Samsung, HP,etc... Worlds of a difference.

Giving users a choice of UI to use would have solved so many problems. Making a UI focused on touch-screen devices (and ignoring the others) certainly didn't endear MS to traditional laptop and desktop users.

TsarNikky said,
Giving users a choice of UI to use would have solved so many problems. Making a UI focused on touch-screen devices (and ignoring the others) certainly didn't endear MS to traditional laptop and desktop users.

You're never going to get that. Not when Microsoft is steering the ship in a new direction. It's time for computing 3.0. The era of the desktops is over, and now we're moving on.

Even without touch Windows 8 is a great UI once you are familiar with the functionality. I recently dropped my touchscreen laptop and killed the hard drive. I spent 4 or 5 days on my old desktop with win8 and non touch monitor and it was really nice having a big screen with more tiles on it even without touch. I really don't grasp the problem people have with the start screen. You just arrange it so the stuff you use is easily accessible. It's pretty accommodating. Way more accommodating than alot of users apparently.

Dot Matrix said,

You're never going to get that. Not when Microsoft is steering the ship in a new direction. It's time for computing 3.0. The era of the desktops is over, and now we're moving on.

...to a desktop with larger icons with forced tile/auto align mode? The era of desktops isn't over until desktops themselves cease to exist or are no longer sold which won't be the case for a long time and even if they were going to be phased out it wouldn't be because of a touch screen device it would have to be something truly worthy of the title "computing 3.0" that would come along and it's not a touch oriented operating system by Microsoft this is just a dumbing down phase they are going through to appeal to the masses who can do all their work/computing related stuff on a tablet device which is only a small spectrum of the capabilities a computer can provide

DDStriker said,

...to a desktop with larger icons with forced tile/auto align mode? The era of desktops isn't over until desktops themselves cease to exist or are no longer sold which won't be the case for a long time and even if they were going to be phased out it wouldn't be because of a touch screen device it would have to be something truly worthy of the title "computing 3.0" that would come along and it's not a touch oriented operating system by Microsoft this is just a dumbing down phase they are going through to appeal to the masses who can do all their work/computing related stuff on a tablet device which is only a small spectrum of the capabilities a computer can provide

The era of the desktops has come and gone, they've matured, and still play a role in our lives, but it's a small one. Most of people's work has been offloaded to mobile devices - laptops, tablets, and smartphones. Not to mention, these are the devices selling the most in the market - Unless you're a person who needs an actual workstation for your work, which let's face it, the majority of workers don't.

The market has been on a decline since the Windows 7 days, the fact is that it's a mature market and people don't replace PCs like they replace phones. A system from 2010 is still good today and this is why you need new systems with touch and so on, just slapping 8 on a older style laptop isn't going to cut it anymore. I for one like my Samsung smart pc hybrid windows 8 device and think that if the price was lower more people would buy it but not everyone is going to drop $750 on this like I did.

And that's the other problem the pc market got hurt by the cheap and low performance netbooks. Now they have consumers used to paying $300 for a pc and it's just hurting things because newer devices with touch are not going to come in at that price, not for a 10 inch model. If blue brings in support for 7 inch devices at the $300 and less price then fine that would help but those are just tablets and for consumption not work.

If I remember right I think either IDC or Gartner said that PC sales will pick up in the second half of the year so this lull could be just a temporary blip on a mature market and nothing more.

That is why PC sales in general are down, but they still far outnumber tablets. Don't know about smartphones. And probably will for some time, but the numbers for PCs are so large. That's why the "growth" is in mobile devices. Desktop users upgrade components and build their own. The enthusiast market hasn't slowed. I think a lot of people misinterpret the growth in mobile devices. They're looking at sales curve, not active base.

CPUs, mobos, GPUs, HDs, SSDs, these things sell a lot. MS forgot to make Windows 8 a component the huge desktop base needed to upgrade to. They have time. How significant the upcoming core app upgrades will tell if they get it or not.

For the first time I have a use for Share. Itectures fantastic Package Tracker app that supports just about every WP8 and W8 feature just adding sharing. Highlight the tracking number in an email, go to share Charm and select the Package Tracker apps and it creates a tracking entry for that package with the appropriate carrier. Nice. Unfortunately Share only works with Modern Apps and the Modern mail app leaves a lot to be desired. I use Outlook 2013 so ... so much for that. But properly utilized, it's quite nice. MS should have made sure their apps made innovative use of this as an example.

People don't usually upgrade to theoretical potential. While there's plenty of time to fix things on the desktop side (no competition), the tablet and phone space aren't so easy, or forgiving.

Luckily I bought the coverage for my Surface Pro. Last night I dropped it, and major dent on the corner and causing the white wash on the corner. So I took it back for a replacement. Had to pay $59 for the replacement, but worth it. Anyway, while I was there, some corporation is purchasing 15 surface Pros(not sure if they are 64 or 128gb). I think THIS is why OEM are worrying about their sales.

I wish everyone would shut up and stop complaining about Windows 8 already. It's NOT A BAD OS.

I really don't get everyone's problem. Yes the start menu is gone, and now there's a start screen instead. Pretty much everything else is the same or better than Windows 7 which was apparently a "great" OS.

I didn't like it that the start menu got pulled either, so I installed one of the 3rd party ones. It's not as convenient as having it there by default, and I get that some people resent having to install a 3rd party application but that's life. By all means complain to Microsoft and tell them you miss this feature. This one thing doesn't magically make Windows 8 a bad OS.

Maybe the thing that's killing sales are all the brainless loudmouths that keep repeating this garbage and dredging up these stories over and over again so that average Joe is too afraid to even try Windows 8.

Windows 8 is a modern OS and is improved compared to Widows 7. The only thing that is missing is the start menu. That is the biggest thing people are crying about, but I do not understand why people complain when the start screen is the start menu and more. So all of the things that the media and 3rd parties are saying and complaining about are not legitimate reasons. They need to stop pointing fingers and do their part promoting their products. Once all of their attitudes change then people will stop listening to the negative reports and see the truth. Windows 8 is a great operating system for touch and for non-touch PCs.

Can't we all just along? Jeez, every day companies are bitching about other companies. I'd rather Samsung, Microsoft, Google, Apple, and all the rest just stfu and focus on their own products and services.

So much for having some class these days.

Samsung, those days with cheap plastic for laptops are OVER! Time to invent better quality laptops or else...SHUT THE F&#&$ UP!!!!

I actually like the Samsung laptops I've used over many others. More of the problem is that people are moving to mobile devices and the computer market is saturated.

I don't think that's the problem. I think if Samsung made a cheap Windows 8 tablet, it would sell almost as well as cheap Android tablets.

Have they ever considered that maybe it's because people start to build more and more their own PC's or use the "local techie" to do it rather than buying that bloated OEM crap?

Actually the enthusiast market is booming. Can you believe GTX Titans are selling quite well given their price tag: $999.

alwaysonacoffebreak said,
Have they ever considered that maybe it's because people start to build more and more their own PC's or use the "local techie" to do it rather than buying that bloated OEM crap?

Tyler R. said,
This is like the 50th time an OEM has spoken out. Why doesn't Microsoft realize and admit W8 has flaws?

Cause Windows 8 isn't the issue.

The issue is the OEMs can't innovate. It's been a problem for years.

@Dot: I'm really digging my friend's VAIO. You get what you pay for. The OEM's need to stop offering 200-300 dollar PC's and replace them with 300$ RT tablets. (can't believe I'm saying that) Microsoft also needs to put their foot down on crapware.

I think Windows 8 is the issue. How innovative is the Surface? I mean, it's a tablet form factor. WTH.

However, I disagree about the conclusion that Windows 8 is no better than Vista. Maybe from it's failure to set sales on fire, but technically it is superior.

I think the problem is the core apps. Microsoft should be ashamed of them and that ruined the entire Win 8 marketing blitz Window. Technically it's sound, but for consumers, the core apps are basically turds.

MS is fixing these and if they really get the core media apps together and push out some more Modern UI games, not just tablet games like now, but game that make desktop users happy too, I think they can turn it around with a second Grand Opening.

Hopefully Microsoft has learned that releasing something before all the parts are ready and fixing it later through updates won't fly anymore.

He just said it has flaws, and it does. Let's hope they get shored up.

morden said,
'cause it's not about the classic UI

Because it's about the few percent decline in the industry as a whole. Samsung's money isn't in selling windows and the growth isn't in that market. The problem is that if they start selling 8 core phones and tabs then the need to upgrade will turn out just like the PC when they can't build a phone that will be a must have and then the growth won't be in that market either. I see that happening in not too long. This whole thing will hit an equilibrium where there will be less growth fueled by device replacements for PC and mobile devices at some point. PC's might sell in much smaller quantities but blaming the OS OR the quality of. devices is kind of off the mark.

It's already there for the PC Market yet people still upgrade, a lot. $1000 video cards are selling because it's what enthusiasts want. Enthusiasts carry technology during periods like this and to a degree Windows 8 has alienated many of them for various reasons.

With regards to mobile devices, I see new iPads (quality) and Andorid tablets (cheap) being sold. Windows 8 RT tablets aren't selling a whole lot period. We can only speculate as to why 8 is having a large impact. It is affected by many things but I don't think it's actually the economy so much, except in the case of the cheap Android Market.

If MS fixes the core apps, and can actually market people actually doing something Windows 8-centric, the devices will sell. They get people's attention and they play with them a little, but there's no substance because the core apps are close to unusable. Doesn't help that you can't sync WP8 & Surface 8 with a slick piece of middleware ala Apple.

If I copy my whole music library to my new 64GB One X+ and create playlists in WMP and copy them to a playlist folder on the Android phone from my Windows 8 desktop, all music apps will read the playlists and find the music on the phone and play it. Xbox music service, while it syncs the playlists across all 8 devices, won't do that. It doesn't download the songs to the devices, doesn't find them locally. It finds "some" of them, "some" of the time. It's that sort of thing that causes buzz to fizzle out quickly.

As soon as the new One is out, I'm getting a 64GB one of those. But I'm done with WP8 because it doesn't sync with Windows 8 Desktop and the Xbox Music Syncing things never worked, it doesn't support BT 4.0 and fitness devices, doesn't support apt-x, and the Android does all those things, so yea, it's the OS to a large degree from my perspective. Millions of runners will NEVER go to Windows Phone 8 or even an RT tablet because of no BT 4.0. It'll never sync with their Bluetooth Heart Rate Monitors and GPS'. Will never work with the Nike fuel band, etc. This is 2 major releases in. What's worse it doesn't appear MS is even thinking about these sorts of things, totally clueless.

Edited by MorganX, Mar 8 2013, 9:05pm :

wasn't the PC industry on a decline when Windows 7, the fastest selling Windows version ever, was on sale as well?

YEAH THAT'S RIGHT, BLAME IT ON WINDOWS 8

Windows 8 has it's faults, but PC oems have been horrible as well, every single Windows computer comes with a whole lot of crap that Microsoft did not put in there, and that is not Microsoft's fault.

The PC market is saturated and if Samsung were to spend huge amounts promoting its Windows machines it would have to bump up the price to consumers, just like Microsoft did with the Surface RT (and we all know how badly that's doing). I'd rather see Samsung focus on Android tablets given how good its mobile products are.

As for the comparison to Vista, I think it's perfectly appropriate (even though I liked Vista and Windows 8).

Perhaps if they had hardware worth a damn...? Plus, the market has been declining long before Windows 8 was a gleam in Microsoft's eye... Again, NONE of the PC OEMs have even made hardware that's worth a damn in forever. There's nothing coming from them anymore, which is why Microsoft developed the Surface tablet.


Just sayin.

I do not agree with Samsung on this as well, but on hardware they have improved dramatically in many cases. The newly introduced Chronos Series 7 2013 is probably the best in its category right now. Gorgeous aluminium design, 15'' 1080p TouchScreen, AMD 8870M, JBL Speakers, ~8-11 hours (according to Samsung) battery life, HDMI, VGA, USB 3.0 Ports and more Desktop replacement goodness in an Ultrabook size.

Series 9 is also the ideal design of Ultabook PCs.

These OEM's are useless. I've been waiting for an OEM to release a GOOD Win 8 tablet/laptop hybrid since the OS was released so i can upgrade... still waiting. I know i'm not the only person in this boat. The Surface is great but not for me. The Asus Transformer Book looked good but thats still not out because of delays, so now i may as well wait for Intel Haswell devices. Win 8 was made for this type of device and all these companies have failed to deliver, it's just the same old **** over and over.

One of them could have really got a lot of sales if they made something good for release last year.

1Pixel said,
These OEM's are useless. I've been waiting for an OEM to release a GOOD Win 8 tablet/laptop hybrid since the OS was released so i can upgrade... still waiting. I know i'm not the only person in this boat. The Surface is great but not for me. The Asus Transformer Book looked good but thats still not out because of delays, so now i may as well wait for Intel Haswell devices. Win 8 was made for this type of device and all these companies have failed to deliver, it's just the same old **** over and over.

One of them could have really got a lot of sales if they made something good for release last year.

Check the Lenovo Helix, that is what I am waiting for...

Fritzly said,

Check the Lenovo Helix, that is what I am waiting for...

Thanks, that looks great and comes with a pen! But i feel it might be too late again, this should have been out sooner... Seems that just like the Transformer Book this device was also delayed. So might still wait for Haswell stuff.

Dot Matrix said,
Perhaps if they had hardware worth a damn...? Plus, the market has been declining long before Windows 8 was a gleam in Microsoft's eye... Again, NONE of the PC OEMs have even made hardware that's worth a damn in forever. There's nothing coming from them anymore, which is why Microsoft developed the Surface tablet.


Just sayin.


The fault always lies with someone else but Microsoft, eh?

Dot Matrix said,
Perhaps if they had hardware worth a damn...?
Just sayin.

But Samsung is doing quite well in the Android market, it seems, so it's hard to argue that they can't build good marketable systems and that's the explanation for this.

Dot Matrix said,

It's sold out multiple times...

Anyone can sell out of something. Depends on how much you produce. Since we don't know how many units they produced or sold, moot argument on both sides really.

Dot Matrix said,

It's sold out multiple times...

Whether or not that is good news depends entirely on the number of units being moved before it's "sold out". Look at the Nexus 4. Sold out weekly for ages after launch, but very few people could actually get one because it was manufacturing issues, rather than popularity.

Until we see some actual numbers, rather than marketing spiel, "Sold out" is a moot point.

Dot Matrix said,
It's sold out multiple times...

Irrelevant, considering how few they're actually shipping to stores. Also worth noting that people seem incredibly stupid trying to buy it from the Microsoft store when Best Buy and others would have them in stock...

I do agree with you on Samsung's shoddy hardware. I clench my teeth every time I see a Samsung laptop not booting up properly... Though, you could probably call me biased, as I'm not enjoying my phone either, I find their tablets to be ugly as sin, and the Samsung rep I know is a douche bag.