Steve Jobs responds to iPhone 4 reception issues

The launch of Apple's new iPhone 4 today has been overshadowed with issues surrounding signal loss when the device is held in the user's left hand. Engadget has spoken to Apple themselves about the iPhone 4's reception problems - Apple has essentially admitted it's a problem, but say it isn't related to how the phone was manufactured or the software - but rather how you're holding it.

They got this response from the Apple PR department:

Gripping any mobile phone will result in some attenuation of its antenna performance, with certain places being worse than others depending on the placement of the antennas. This is a fact of life for every wireless phone. If you ever experience this on your iPhone 4, avoid gripping it in the lower left corner in a way that covers both sides of the black strip in the metal band, or simply use one of many available cases.

A user even pinged Steve Jobs' email address and got an odd reply:

"Just avoid holding it that way"

Engadget says that the issue only happens on some iPhone 4's, as well as the 3G and 3GS, so it can't just be a hardware problem - and that it happens if "you cover the bottom-left corner of the phone and bridge the gap between the notch there with your naked flesh, you could see some signal degradation."

The iPhone 4 launch has been plagued with problems, with AT&T's servers crashing and leaking private information, pre-orders being cancelled and other hardware problems since it became available only two days ago.

 

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I just grabbed my old $1 phone (Sony-Ericsson C902), covered it with my both hands so it's like completely covered and it didn't loose a bar. As for the newest iPhone it's definitely not like the high-end phone should behave.

I first thought the responses by Aplle and Steve Jobs that you shouldn't keep a phone "in that way" were some jokes. Apple just failed and I think they are in some panic now because if this is a hardware issue it basically can't be fixed by some software update.

And the interesting thing is why those test units (Engadget) don't have this problem.

WoW! Did Jobs go to charm school? Guess not. Has he heard of the word professionalism? Guess not. What a tosser. And there I was seriously considering an iPhone purchase but with that sort response and example I guess the customer service ain't going to be up to much from the rest of his company. Time to think again about that purchase and buy something else.

Awesome. All those people in forums bashing the HTC Evo saying the "iphone 4 is better then the EVO" well at least HTC admitted the problems were theres and not tell people "well dont use the phone that way" maybe iphone 4 is better then evo.. but hey at least i can hold mine in my left hand and make a phone call

Holy crap, this article should really about someone blindly emailing Steve Jobs, and him apparently answering lol Reminds me of the time John Smedley called me on the phone to get more information on the Voodoo II issue I was having in beta Everquest a day or two before launch.

I love how apple users all seem to blame themselves for apples products faults I mean why should you need a case. As for the 3GS news flash my feature phone for £10 has 3g and video chat isnt somthing new... been around for years and it "just works" (since you apple people like to use the phase to explain why apple is better than anything else without any other logical reason)

Why are people still e-mailing this psychopath Steve Jobs about their problems with Apple products. Doesn't everyone who uses their stuff know the only reply they're going to get from him is a dismissive, curt, and pretty much unhelpful response? Enjoy your electronic products from the company run by a megalomaniac.

Sorry, can't sympathize with the OP on this one. If you hold any kind of electrical device by its antenna, the same thing will happen.

Then it's a design failure on Apples part - they should not have designed the antenna so holding it with the left hand blocks it. That is ridiculous.

bjoswald said,
Sorry, can't sympathize with the OP on this one. If you hold any kind of electrical device by its antenna, the same thing will happen.

yeah so why would you desgin a phone to be held by it's antenna? I mean this happens just by holding it how you'd hold any other phone, it's not like anyone is going out of their way to hold it all strange so they drop calls.

I think the response was pretty damn funny. I'm sure Jobs gets thousands of these emails daily. I mean, is he going to sit there and write out a detailed response to every one? Hell no. I mean what is he supposed to do in the moment?

soLoredd said,
I think the response was pretty damn funny. I'm sure Jobs gets thousands of these emails daily. I mean, is he going to sit there and write out a detailed response to every one? Hell no. I mean what is he supposed to do in the moment?

copy and paste anyone?

dagrimdialer619 said,
stupid article. Signal loss of some form or another happens with most phones.

Have you actually used one of the affected phones (not all of them suffer from this issue.)

If you have then you will know this is a lot more than just "some form or another of signal loss."

Touching the break with a finger kills the signal in seconds, not signal degradation, complete loss of signal.

Another punch in the face for iPhone users and they still don't seem to learn their lesson. There are some Apple products I like, but I'll never buy any of them because of their miserable price-performance ratio, bad support and especially Steve Jobs' arrogance.

I think I'm weird now. I'm completely right handed yet I hold the phone with my left. I guess I trained myself that way doing IT support calls and obviously controlling the mouse with my right.

I would like to think this is a software issue but I doubt it this is going to be the case as its pretty obvious a hardware issue. I haven't upgraded yet but its something I need to be aware of before I do.

Wow...just amazing. Apple sells a phone with an obvious design flaw, whether it be software/hardware, and they just make excuses? I smell more lawsuits in their future...the iPhone 4 Apple's Vista...haha...sadly, people will still buy these.

I think the problem is that the case is the antenna on the outer rim. Since the human body is conductive it affects the way the antenna performs. If you happen to close the gap on the lower left corner you may cause the 2 antennas to close circuit and therefore lose effectiveness by varying amounts. There is a report of a potential left-handed version. I assume they will just move the break to the other side of the phone.

Wow look at the craziness in this thread just over a mobile phone... Interesting that most the people bagging it seem to care more about it than the people that actually have bought one, would've thought it'd be the other way around...

offroadaaron said,
Wow look at the craziness in this thread just over a mobile phone... Interesting that most the people bagging it seem to care more about it than the people that actually have bought one, would've thought it'd be the other way around...

It's called Jealousy. This way they can say, hey, look it's a POS after all, phew, now I don't have to feel bad not having one. Unfortunately for them it's an awesome phone.

Is it possible for you guys to update this post to show the fix or how to avoid the issue?

Most cases will help/stop the issue. The nicer looking 'bumper' cases by Apple work.

http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC597ZM/A

FYI If i held my Motorola phone wrong it too would degrade in signal quality, along with two of my LG phones.

I'm not saying the issue isn't bad, just that it IS avoidable. I too am left handed and curious as to why they didn't TEST the bloody thing with lefties too.

unkdirkpitt said,
Is it possible for you guys to update this post to show the fix or how to avoid the issue?

Most cases will help/stop the issue. The nicer looking 'bumper' cases by Apple work.

http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC597ZM/A

FYI If i held my Motorola phone wrong it too would degrade in signal quality, along with two of my LG phones.

I'm not saying the issue isn't bad, just that it IS avoidable. I too am left handed and curious as to why they didn't TEST the bloody thing with lefties too.


that is really screwed up to have to buy a case just to get the phone to work properly. That is not some minor problem. This is a class action lawsuit waiting to happen

majortom1981 said,

that is really screwed up to have to buy a case just to get the phone to work properly. That is not some minor problem. This is a class action lawsuit waiting to happen

+1

majortom1981 said,

that is really screwed up to have to buy a case just to get the phone to work properly. That is not some minor problem. This is a class action lawsuit waiting to happen

I doubt any class action lawsuit would even be possible if the fix is indeed even possible. Free cases for lefties? haha

ANYONE who knows ANYTHING about RF, radios, antennas would know you wouldn't want that kind of antenna, especially at that high of a frequency to be anywhere near skin because of attenuation.
I can see it now, Apple will come out with a new "skin" protector, that you have to purchase, to insulate the antenna from your hand.
Apple is 75% hype, as with anything version 1.0, NEVER NEVER be the first on your block, unless you want to put up with the early adopter syndrome.

naap51stang said,
ANYONE who knows ANYTHING about RF, radios, antennas would know you wouldn't want that kind of antenna, especially at that high of a frequency to be anywhere near skin because of attenuation.
I can see it now, Apple will come out with a new "skin" protector, that you have to purchase, to insulate the antenna from your hand.
Apple is 75% hype, as with anything version 1.0, NEVER NEVER be the first on your block, unless you want to put up with the early adopter syndrome.

What would happen to the skin?

Nothing would happen to your skin, the RF energy isn't enough to bother you, but, your skin would act like a giant resistor, attenuating "clamping down" the signal level

Pegus said,

What would happen to the skin?

naap51stang said,
ANYONE who knows ANYTHING about RF, radios, antennas would know you wouldn't want that kind of antenna, especially at that high of a frequency to be anywhere near skin because of attenuation.
I can see it now, Apple will come out with a new "skin" protector, that you have to purchase, to insulate the antenna from your hand.
Apple is 75% hype, as with anything version 1.0, NEVER NEVER be the first on your block, unless you want to put up with the early adopter syndrome.


Version 1? Isn't this the 4th iPhone, hence the iPhone 4??

I was considering buying one, but I'm left handed and seeing Steve's response, that sure as hell has went out the window. FFS.

GeXeH said,
I was considering buying one, but I'm left handed and seeing Steve's response, that sure as hell has went out the window. FFS.

Then wouldn't you hold the phone in your right hand to touch the screen with your left hand?

Larry David said,

Then wouldn't you hold the phone in your right hand to touch the screen with your left hand?

Some of us are skilled enough to use a phone with one hand. We have these things called "thumbs", you know.

LiquidSolstice said,

Some of us are skilled enough to use a phone with one hand. We have these things called "thumbs", you know.

Did that same thumb cause you to double post? Or was that your index finger?

andrewbares said,

Did that same thumb cause you to double post? Or was that your index finger?

I'm currently on a 1x Tether phone connection that is lagging like a mother. Doesn't change the fact I'm still quite capable (along with the rest of the developed world) in using one hand to operate a phone.

Nice, by the way. When you've got no other substance to go on you turn to trivialities.

Larry David said,

Then wouldn't you hold the phone in your right hand to touch the screen with your left hand?

As LiquidSolstice said, I use my thumbs to control the screen, not switch hands.

LiquidSolstice said,

I'm currently on a 1x Tether phone connection that is lagging like a mother. Doesn't change the fact I'm still quite capable (along with the rest of the developed world) in using one hand to operate a phone.

Nice, by the way. When you've got no other substance to go on you turn to trivialities.

If you want a serious answer, I can disprove you instantly. Your response to the other guy was snappy, so I gave you a snappy response too!

But to be serious, you DO use your index finger with the phone, while holding it in the left hand, quite often. Even Apple does in their commercials/demos: http://www.blogcdn.com/www.eng...-youre-holding-it-wrong.jpg

Now what?

LiquidSolstice said,

I'm currently on a 1x Tether phone connection that is lagging like a mother. Doesn't change the fact I'm still quite capable (along with the rest of the developed world) in using one hand to operate a phone.

Nice, by the way. When you've got no other substance to go on you turn to trivialities.

Much like your substance....hahaha

qdave said,
I am so glad that i have iphone 2g. It just works!

LOL, epic response. Same here. As far as multitasking goes for 3G, the redsn0w jailbreak (AFAIK) unlocks all the locked features, so you can get the same stuff as the newer models.

And for the 2G, I'm sure there are some porting endeavors going on in the iphone-dev world that will soon bring iOS 4.0 to us.

Typical Apple response. They never want to admit it's their fault. Just charge it, just don't hold it like that, just turn it off, etc. Jobs is an arrogant piece of ****.

Xilo said,
Typical Apple response. They never want to admit it's their fault. Just charge it, just don't hold it like that, just turn it off, etc. Jobs is an arrogant piece of ****.

Picked up HTC Desire today. Carphone warehouse employee actually asked me if I was sure and not wanted iPhone 4. I couldn't have been more right!

Smart move on apples part. They knew they were going to have that issue. So what did they do? BUMPERS! Now for 29.99 you can use your cellphone in your hand!

I've been trying to find a place on my Samsung phone where holding it affects the reception and I've not found one yet.

Apple seems to put a lot of time and effort into some areas but f up on the fundamental things. You could attribute it to them still being inexperienced in the cell phone field, but they do this with their computers as well. Maybe they should spend a little less time trying to keep it hidden before release and get more people out actually testing it.

lothodon said,
don't worry apple fans/users. this fictitious problem will be fixed with the second generation iphone 4.

Starting at $599 for the 8 Gig model.

Steve jobs is an ass, Apple is an ass, anyone whom buys their products must be an ass. (note the word "ass" is an animal so dont delete this comment)

I can hold my phone how i wish using a £10 feature phone

JoshW02 said,
Steve jobs is an ass, Apple is an ass, anyone whom buys their products must be an ass. (note the word "ass" is an animal so dont delete this comment)

I can hold my phone how i wish using a £10 feature phone

Same here, I have a NZ$149 and I can use it anywhere I want, great coverage, I can use it for tethering, I can expand it with mini-sdcards. It is an ordinary phone that makes phone calls and sends text messages because unlike all the other idiots here, I don't live on my mobile phone 24/7 like sort sort of bluetooth wearing jackass.

Let's face it, this whole "Just avoid holding it that way" answer is borderline a slap in the face and a cop-out. It seems like one could easily & innocently hold their iPhone 4 and invoke the problem. It's not like you have to mangle your hand(s) holding the phone to invoke the problem.

So much for the looks-cool form over function...

I don't have any problems using my phone currently. I noticed the issue at home yesterday, but at work there isn't any such problem at all. That doesn't jive with any of the theories about why out there... but I'm happy with it, it's definately the nicest phone I've ever had.

Steve Jobs said,
I don't have any problems using my phone currently. I noticed the issue at home yesterday, but at work there isn't any such problem at all. That doesn't jive with any of the theories about why out there... but I'm happy with it, it's definately the nicest phone I've ever had.

You picked a terrible, terrible username for this article.

LiquidSolstice said,

You picked a terrible, terrible username for this article.


I think he is actually Steve jobs..

@Steve Jobs If you are Steve jobs please try to fix the issue and dont tell the users how to hold the phone.....

Steve jobs is an ass, Apple is an ass, anyone whom buys their products must be an ass. (note the word "ass" is an animal so dont delete this comment)

JoshW02 said,
Steve jobs is an ass, Apple is an ass, anyone whom buys their products must be an ass. (note the word "ass" is an animal so dont delete this comment)

There's that many donkeys in this world? Dam (that's a water blocking structure, don't delete this comment)

andrewbares said,

There's that many donkeys in this world? Dam (that's a water blocking structure, don't delete this comment)

LOOOL. I bought an iPhone 4 yesterday but oh well, if this issue affects me this much I will continue to get replacements until its fixed I will go through as many iPhone 4's as it takes!!

witalit said,

LOOOL. I bought an iPhone 4 yesterday but oh well, if this issue affects me this much I will continue to get replacements until its fixed I will go through as many iPhone 4's as it takes!!

You go you! Stick it to the man!

WD Steve....My LG can be held anywhere and I don't lose reception no does my Misses Nokia E71....

Buy a iPhone cause Steve say's uFail at holding it lol

Troll said,
OK - I've got a good analogy for this now...

Car windshield wipers don't work? Don't drive in the rain!

Dude, it's AWESOME driving in the rain while not using your wipers!!!! Once you hit about 40 mph, the rain starts to lift up across the window, it's super neatt!!!

Troll said,
OK - I've got a good analogy for this now...

Car windshield wipers don't work? Don't drive in the rain!

Steve's answer to this:
Just avoid driving in the rain

like:
Just avoid holding it that way

androidking ...

I agree ... Apple is acting like other big companies now ... Microsoft and
Intel ... are looking better every day now.

I'm not surprised to a degree at the response. I mean, if part of the problem is the way they designed the phone's antenna system, what can they do except try to do something thru software or recall the phone? This has potential to be a huge f***-up for Apple. Steve knows this. And he has always been (or seemed to be) arrogant and/or egotistical.

I was thinking about buying an iPhone 4, but if I had and was having problems, I think I would be fairly frustrated at this point... Of course, I would probably get a white one and have to wait another freaking month for that...

JayZJay said,
I'm not surprised to a degree at the response. I mean, if part of the problem is the way they designed the phone's antenna system, what can they do except try to do something thru software or recall the phone? This has potential to be a huge f***-up for Apple. Steve knows this. And he has always been (or seemed to be) arrogant and/or egotistical.

I was thinking about buying an iPhone 4, but if I had and was having problems, I think I would be fairly frustrated at this point... Of course, I would probably get a white one and have to wait another freaking month for that...

Its not the fact its faulty that i'm miffed about...Android hasnt been perfect...it's the way Apple generally handle these situations with arrogance, aloofness and rudeness. I was to make my next computer a 27" mac but this has put me off totally.

androidking said,

Its not the fact its faulty that i'm miffed about...Android hasnt been perfect...it's the way Apple generally handle these situations with arrogance, aloofness and rudeness. I was to make my next computer a 27" mac but this has put me off totally.

That's why I said I'm not surprised to a degree at the response. Steve has always seemingly been arrogant and "jerky". The initial response is all sorts of things... rude, arrogant, etc. It remains to be seen if problems persist and more and more people complain, will Apple own up and handle this with class and humility.

why anyone defends this company is beyond me. keep pumping your money into this douche so his ego can get even bigger......

I've never had a problem like this with any phone before, this seems like a flat out lie from jobs. Yeah sometimes you lose "some" signal degradation when holding phones certain ways but I've never just completely lost a call on any phone just from holding it.

Steve Jobs (Jobsworth??)has appeared to be one of the biggest douches I've ever heard about.... basically his company has produced a substandard, faulty product and he openly doesn't seem to care. Any temptation I had for moving from Android to iOS just evaporated upon reading this article....

WOW. That's the worst way to respond to such a query. What a dick-brained move. Way to go, Steve, show what your company's customer support is TRULY like.

How do Apple fanboys even exist?

joemagoe said,
WOW. That's the worst way to respond to such a query. What a dick-brained move. Way to go, Steve, show what your company's customer support is TRULY like.

How do Apple fanboys even exist?


+1 What a response.... pffft

joemagoe said,
WOW. That's the worst way to respond to such a query. What a dick-brained move. Way to go, Steve, show what your company's customer support is TRULY like.

How do Apple fanboys even exist?

How is Apple's customer support? Every year it is rated one of the best, if not the best in the tech industry. Your personal feelings aside, Apple consistently is praised for its customer service.

asdavis10 said,

How is Apple's customer support? Every year it is rated one of the best, if not the best in the tech industry. Your personal feelings aside, Apple consistently is praised for its customer service.

people forget that steve jobs is not customer support. doesnt justify how he responded, but his response is in no way a reflection of apples customer support.

ekw said,
just get a plastic/rubbery case for it, it should mitigate the hand from affecting the antenna.

You don't buy a product to have to buy an accessory in order for it to work. It's a flaw, it needs to be fixed and fast or else they run the risk of seriously hurting their reputation.

This is a fact of life for every wireless phone

Apple FUD at work.
No matter how I hold my mobile phone, even if I cover the entire phone with my hands, I never loose any bars.

Again the quote NEVER said you would see dropped bars or even any noticable difference in the reception quality. They merely state the signal is effected...not that it would be a significant change however. Signals do degrade when they have to pass through objects, be it a person or whatever...if that wasn't the case your phone would work 100m underground in some bomb shelter somewhere.

This issue isn't acceptable what so ever and it is a large design flaw, but people need to stop putting words in Apples mouths.

figgy said,

Apple FUD at work.
No matter how I hold my mobile phone, even if I cover the entire phone with my hands, I never loose any bars.

How do you know that you're not losing any bars if you can't see the screen?

DigitalE said,

How do you know that you're not losing any bars if you can't see the screen?

Speedtest.net, fool. Dont' even bother defending Apple, people have tested the speeds using bandwidth meters and it IS affected.

DigitalE said,

How do you know that you're not losing any bars if you can't see the screen?

Yet, if you don't even cover the iPhone's screen, simply hold it naturally with your left hand, you risk dropping a call. Watch any of the vidoes on YouTube or Engadget, they proved it.

I holded my HTC Magic with my both hands and only loosed 1 signal bar (from full 4 bras to 3 bars)...

Definetly I don't like apple ...

:No-Frost: said,
I holded my HTC Magic with my both hands and only loosed 1 signal bar (from full 4 bras to 3 bars)...

Definetly I don't like apple ...

4 bras? Your phone has bras?

:No-Frost: said,
I holded my HTC Magic with my both hands and only loosed 1 signal bar (from full 4 bras to 3 bars)...

Definetly I don't like apple ...

Exact same thing with my HTC Touch Pro 2.

Minus the bras.

:No-Frost: said,
I holded my HTC Magic with my both hands and only loosed 1 signal bar (from full 4 bras to 3 bars)...

Definetly I don't like apple ...

Sure you havent got an iphone only tits have them

:No-Frost: said,
I holded my HTC Magic with my both hands and only loosed 1 signal bar (from full 4 bras to 3 bars)...

Definetly I don't like apple ...

all this talk of bars and bras is makin' me powerful thirsty....yes powerful thirsty indeed!

Wow, and I was thinking about getting this for my wife because of Sprint's $10 "premium data" charge for the EVO.
When will these companies start providing customer service? You know, the main ingredient in a service based organization...of course the answer is when we stop buying their crap, but I don't see that happening.

Troll said,
Wow, and I was thinking about getting this for my wife because of Sprint's $10 "premium data" charge for the EVO.
When will these companies start providing customer service? You know, the main ingredient in a service based organization...of course the answer is when we stop buying their crap, but I don't see that happening.

Yeah because paying $80 ($69.99 + $10) for Unlimited everything on a great network with great customer service is so much more expensive than $130 with a 2GB cap on the worst network in the country....

vaximily said,

Yeah because paying $80 ($69.99 + $10) for Unlimited everything on a great network with great customer service is so much more expensive than $130 with a 2GB cap on the worst network in the country....

Nice job not understanding how prices work! It isn't $69.99 for unlimited everything, but for 450 minutes. I've had Sprint for 5+ years and AT&T for 4 from work - both have their issues.

The EVO will cost me approx $70/mo with my corporate discount and the iphone4 will cost me $60.

Look up the facts first and understand that I'm still undecided, but leaning toward the EVO. I *hate* Apple, but will look at whatever product is the best for the money. I'm also waiting for the Droid X to come out too for comparisons, but it will most likely be the highest priced one.

Which might make more sense if I didn't have corporate discounts at BOTH

Troll said,

Nice job not understanding how prices work! It isn't $69.99 for unlimited everything, but for 450 minutes. I've had Sprint for 5+ years and AT&T for 4 from work - both have their issues.

The EVO will cost me approx $70/mo with my corporate discount and the iphone4 will cost me $60.

Look up the facts first and understand that I'm still undecided, but leaning toward the EVO. I *hate* Apple, but will look at whatever product is the best for the money. I'm also waiting for the Droid X to come out too for comparisons, but it will most likely be the highest priced one.

Which might make more sense if I didn't have corporate discounts at BOTH

Seriously, as a former iPhone owner now running a Winmo-based HD2, get the EVO, it is a sweetass phone with Android. Double win and more proper-functioning tech in that little device than in a whole palette of iPhone 4's.

Course, I'm an HTC fanboi so nyaaaaa!

Osiris said,
LOL thats just awesome customer service

If you're an iPhone user and want customer service, you mail their support, not Steve Jobs.

Northgrove said,

If you're an iPhone user and want customer service, you mail their support, not Steve Jobs.

Steven should just stfu to be honest and let highly trained and paid professional PR people do what they do best. I mean, you think Bill Gates responds to "Windows sucks UBUNTU FTW!" emails? What was this guy thinking?

Theirs your answer ... GOD has spoken ... your holding it wrong ...

What a pile of crap ...

People need to return these phones and ask for a refund ...
I bet they will change their tune when hundreds return
them ...

GenBlood said,
Theirs your answer ... GOD has spoken ... your holding it wrong ...

What a pile of crap ...

People need to return these phones and ask for a refund ...
I bet they will change their tune when hundreds return
them ...

That would be the best thing to ever happen but people won't stand together and do that cause they maybe to busy showing off.

GenBlood said,
Theirs your answer ... GOD has spoken ... your holding it wrong ...

What a pile of crap ...

People need to return these phones and ask for a refund ...
I bet they will change their tune when hundreds return
them ...

Oh I can see a lot more than just hundreds. I think you might mean thousands. It must suck to invest in something so big and spend so much to make sure this is the best thing ever just to have to replace them or even lose customers and support.

GenBlood said,
Theirs your answer ... GOD has spoken ... your holding it wrong ...

What a pile of crap ...

People need to return these phones and ask for a refund ...
I bet they will change their tune when hundreds return
them ...

Somewhere on the planet right now, HTC execs are popping champagne...

wow... what an pompus ass he is becoming to the public..... yet people still buy into his were the good guys idea system......

neufuse said,
wow... what an pompus ass he is becoming to the public..... yet people still buy into his were the good guys idea system......
who's to say that Mr. Jobs actually wrote that response?

timster said,
who's to say that Mr. Jobs actually wrote that response?

If I let someone use my email to respond to people, I would make sure that it wouldn't be anything horrible.

Temperingpick said,

If I let someone use my email to respond to people, I would make sure that it wouldn't be anything horrible.

Emails can be easily forged.

neufuse said,
wow... what an pompus ass he is becoming to the public..... yet people still buy into his were the good guys idea system......

You make decisions based on how the CEO behaves? so I guess you don't own a single Microsoft product after the way Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates claimed that the GPL is equal to cancer and communism, or the Ballmer screaming and yelling on stage screaming "developers, developers, developers".

How about this honey bun, make a decision on what the product can do and ignore the theatrics. I own a Mac because I like Mac OS X and until Microsoft produces an operating system that doesn't royally suck, I'll continue purchase Mac's.

rawr_boy81 said,

You make decisions based on how the CEO behaves? so I guess you don't own a single Microsoft product after the way Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates claimed that the GPL is equal to cancer and communism, or the Ballmer screaming and yelling on stage screaming "developers, developers, developers".

+1000
Buy products and services that work for you. I don't see how having personal feelings about a CEO helps your life any.

asdavis10 said,

Buy products and services that work for you. I don't see how having personal feelings about a CEO helps your life any.
Exactly. I cannot stand Steve Jobs, yet I own a MacBook Pro (low end, Core i5) and iPhone 3GS. My experience has been great.

I don't like the direction that he is taking Apple, but until it gets past the breaking point (where they control my computer), their stuff is top notch. Really, I hate the App Store, but it does help stop people from releasing all sorts of Trojans, and I don't mind that benefit. I wish there was a way to get around it, without jailbreaking, but I use my phone for the internet, phone calls, texting, and a few other apps--I'm not downloading everything on this side of the Sun.

rawr_boy81 said,
You make decisions based on how the CEO behaves? so I guess you don't own a single Microsoft product after the way Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates claimed that the GPL is equal to cancer and communism, or the Ballmer screaming and yelling on stage screaming "developers, developers, developers".

How about this honey bun, make a decision on what the product can do and ignore the theatrics. I own a Mac because I like Mac OS X and until Microsoft produces an operating system that doesn't royally suck, I'll continue purchase Mac's.


Well, when someone is leading a company down a road many do not want them to and acts like a douche bag on top of it, it certainly does put you off from wanting to buy any of their products. Activision suddenly comes to mind...

There is nothing wrong with the iPhone (well, you know what I mean). You don't have to be a fanboy to own one. The majority of owners are not. No, it just that some in the media and on the forums seem to swept up in the Apple hype. With this can come problem for consumers that view their products as be all and end all.

timster said,
so everyone that has an iPhone is a fanboy?

No, just those that buy everything apple releases and argue with everyone about how their apple products are the best things ever made on Earth.

Odd, when I hold my mobile with my left hand, it doesn't lose reception. Good lie Apple, very good lie.

I hope Apple does a recall for an actual working iPhone 4.

stablemist said,
Odd, when I hold my mobile with my left hand, it doesn't lose reception. Good lie Apple, very good lie.

I hope Apple does a recall for an actual working iPhone 4.

Mine doesn't do this either. No matter which way I hold it.

Frylock86 said,

Mine doesn't do this either. No matter which way I hold it.

Lucky you I guess, feel sorry for all those who bought it and now have this problem.

stablemist said,
Odd, when I hold my mobile with my left hand, it doesn't lose reception. Good lie Apple, very good lie.

I hope Apple does a recall for an actual working iPhone 4.

i think this is just a faulty batch of iPhone 4s, it's probably not going to effect everyone

timster said,
i think this is just a faulty batch of iPhone 4s, it's probably not going to effect everyone

3GS with iOS4 are affected too.

Haegr said,

Lucky you I guess, feel sorry for all those who bought it and now have this problem.

I forgot to mention, I own a Samsung Impression, NOT an iPhone 4G.

That said I have NEVER had a phone loose signal from it being held. I'd have to say Jobs is either lying to blow this away, or lying to cover something up while Apple looks into it (Kinda like the iPad's WiFi issues).

stablemist said,
Odd, when I hold my mobile with my left hand, it doesn't lose reception. Good lie Apple, very good lie.

I hope Apple does a recall for an actual working iPhone 4.

iPhone 3G on 3.1.2 here. No signal loss no matter how I hold it. Same with my gf's cheap Nokia. Clearly Steve is talking out of his ass again (may as well just zip his lips shut; most of his talking these days seems to be from his ass).

stablemist said,
Odd, when I hold my mobile with my left hand, it doesn't lose reception. Good lie Apple, very good lie.
They never said that it would lose reception. They said holding a phone affects the signal and that where you hold it can matter. They never said that losing reception or massive degrades happened on all handsets.

stablemist said,
Odd, when I hold my mobile with my left hand, it doesn't lose reception. Good lie Apple, very good lie.

I hope Apple does a recall for an actual working iPhone 4.

I don't like Apple's response, but their claim isn't limited to their phone. The manual for my Touch Pro 2 (and every cell phone I have ever owned) has a similar warning in it.

As shown in this snippet from the manual... http://www.frazell.net/random/Cell_Pic.PNG

Frazell Thomas said,

I don't like Apple's response, but their claim isn't limited to their phone. The manual for my Touch Pro 2 (and every cell phone I have ever owned) has a similar warning in it.

As shown in this snippet from the manual... http://www.frazell.net/random/Cell_Pic.PNG

Yet, my Touch Pro 2 doesn't get affected by how I hold it. If I really really try to completely cover the top half of the phone with my hands, then maybe it'll drop ONE bar, that's all.

andrewbares said,

Yet, my Touch Pro 2 doesn't get affected by how I hold it. If I really really try to completely cover the top half of the phone with my hands, then maybe it'll drop ONE bar, that's all.

If it drops one bar then it WAS affected.

Smigit said,
If it drops one bar then it WAS affected.

Yes but I think the article mentions that it may lose reception entirely. Quite different than just one bar.

shinji257 said,

Yes but I think the article mentions that it may lose reception entirely. Quite different than just one bar.

For the iPhone....yes some are. But no one, Apple or otherwise, are claiming that dropped calls are common for other handsets.

Smigit said,
If it drops one bar then it WAS affected.

If it drops a call > if it drops one bar.

Plus, the iPhone drops the call from holding it normally, in the left hand. I have to make an effort to cover the top half of my phone to make it drop one bar. There's a huge difference buddy.

andrewbares said,

If it drops a call > if it drops one bar.

Yes...but you stated "Yet, my Touch Pro 2 doesn't get affected by how I hold it" and then followed with "If I really really try to completely cover the top half of the phone with my hands, then maybe it'll drop ONE bar, that's all." which is what I was responding to.


No one is arguing that a small signal degradation isn't far far more preferable to a complete signal lost. I do however think people are now either claiming their own phones are in every way shape or form immune to objects degrading the signal to the handset or that Apple has claimed other phones will drop calls like this two...both of which are false.


Agreed, this situation is crap and Apple should give every buyer one of those cases if that helps things. Doesn't mean it warrants a slew of invalid responses but.

Frazell Thomas said,

I don't like Apple's response, but their claim isn't limited to their phone. The manual for my Touch Pro 2 (and every cell phone I have ever owned) has a similar warning in it.

As shown in this snippet from the manual... http://www.frazell.net/random/Cell_Pic.PNG

Thank you for intelligently doing some research. This phenomena isn't unique to the iPhone. Maybe the severity is. Maybe. But the issue itself is not unique.

asdavis10 said,

Thank you for intelligently doing some research. This phenomena isn't unique to the iPhone. Maybe the severity is. Maybe. But the issue itself is not unique.

The severity is (that's the ISSUE, since on any other phone, it isn't a problem), and the hand position is also the issue. Holding it left handed is natural, covering the top half of my Touch Pro 2 with my hands to make it loose a bar isn't natural.

It's a problem, and it's only a problem with the iPhone. Yes.

stablemist said,
Odd, when I hold my mobile with my left hand, it doesn't lose reception. Good lie Apple, very good lie.

I hope Apple does a recall for an actual working iPhone 4.

Ya know, this is just an Apple iPhone deal. When I bought my first gen iPhone, couple months post-launch and at $200US reduced price - I remember the suggestions on the jailbreak sites to improve reception was to NOT cover up the black bottom plastic portion on the back as that was where the antenna was...and ya know what? it worked! If I was in spotty coverage, maybe a couple bars, holding it with 2 fingers and getting that black (bottom) portion of the phone outward would give me a couple more bars - always. Looked pretty silly talking on this new fancy phone while it was upside down - was tough to explain that and often embarrassing

Blasius said,
30 day return periods ftw

If they don't voluntarily recall the phone and fix the issue, than yes the returns will start pouring in at record numbers. We have 14 return policies on phones here, at least that's how it is here in Windsor, Ontario.

vip said,
Thats like a really generic response ...

Certainly not a generic response for a CEO of a large company, should show some professionalism instead of being a dick.

InfinitiProject said,
What the hell? I'm left handed! Everything I hold onto is in my left hand, except.....

Let's just not take it there.


Apple prescribes right handedness or the highway. Just remember - you're always free to do as they tell you.

InfinitiProject said,
What the hell? I'm left handed! Everything I hold onto is in my left hand, except.....

Let's just not take it there.

You meant your stick shift right

InfinitiProject said,
What the hell? I'm left handed! Everything I hold onto is in my left hand, except.....

Let's just not take it there.

I'm Ambidextrous (though I was born as a righty) and I hold my 3G with my left most of the time... especially when txting my woman lol

Leeoniya said,

Apple prescribes right handedness or the highway. Just remember - you're always free to do as they tell you.

Reminds me of a certain WWII Axis Leader...

Ridlas said,
And you people still keep buying stuff from this guy.
Sure..."this guy" didn't make it so what do I care. If the device is good, which I'll evaluate on a case by case basis, then I may buy it. Steve Jobs doesn't exactly factor into my decision.

Smigit said,
Sure..."this guy" didn't make it so what do I care. If the device is good, which I'll evaluate on a case by case basis, then I may buy it. Steve Jobs doesn't exactly factor into my decision.
He doesn't have to write a dbag reply to the email. How about actually being helpful about it?

Smigit said,
Sure..."this guy" didn't make it so what do I care. If the device is good, which I'll evaluate on a case by case basis, then I may buy it. Steve Jobs doesn't exactly factor into my decision.

Right. "This guy" who dictates to you what you can and can't do with an expensive phone you paid for, "this guy" who continually runs the App Store with an iron fist and is incredibly inconsistent, and now, "this guy" who's actually telling you how to HOLD your own damn phone.

No factors from Steve Jobs here, no no no.

LiquidSolstice said,

Right. "This guy" who dictates to you what you can and can't do with an expensive phone you paid for, "this guy" who continually runs the App Store with an iron fist and is incredibly inconsistent, and now, "this guy" who's actually telling you how to HOLD your own damn phone.

No factors from Steve Jobs here, no no no.

But I don't deal with "this guy". As I said, I'm quite capable of evaluating a device for what it is and isn't. If you don't like the App store don't buy an iPhone. Furthermore how Apple runs that store effects one product, it doesn't have to effect others so they may have a policy I don't agree with for their phones but that doesn't mean I would then overlook buying a laptop from them for instance.


Not buying a device because you don't like the CEO seems rather short sighted to me. And yes, that email response was short but why not email the support team instead...you know, the guys responsible for offering support. Do you think emailing Steve Ballmer will give some length step by step solution for a broken XBox?

In the end of the day you are still buying Apples product for better or worse. Not Steve Jobs product regardless of how much influence he may or may not have in its design.

Ridlas said,
And you people still keep buying stuff from this guy.

I buy off that guy (iMac, MacBook Pro, iPod Classic (I have no interest in the iPhone or iPod Touch)) because Microsoft provides no better alternative. Windows 7 still sucks, Zune isn't available in New Zealand, the OEM's butcher Windows installations every time. So yes there is a reason why 'us people' buy stuff off this guy.

How about you troll back to your Microsoft campus and fix up your ****ty software then I might consider moving back to the PC.

rawr_boy81 said,

I buy off that guy (iMac, MacBook Pro, iPod Classic (I have no interest in the iPhone or iPod Touch)) because Microsoft provides no better alternative. Windows 7 still sucks, Zune isn't available in New Zealand, the OEM's butcher Windows installations every time. So yes there is a reason why 'us people' buy stuff off this guy.

How about you troll back to your Microsoft campus and fix up your ****ty software then I might consider moving back to the PC.

Windows 7 is way better than Snow Leopard. This is coming from a person who owns a Macbook Pro

Remote Sojourner said,
Windows 7 is way better than Snow Leopard. This is coming from a person who owns a Macbook Pro

Based on what evidence? it is the same problem prone operating system with the same half finished flawed API's, the same poor battery life, the same crappy third parties creating the same crappy installers that ruin a pristine virgin installation of Windows, the lack of Direct2D/DirectWrite fully replacing GDI in the various components that use GDI and so on and so on.

rawr_boy81 said,

I buy off that guy (iMac, MacBook Pro, iPod Classic (I have no interest in the iPhone or iPod Touch)) because Microsoft provides no better alternative. Windows 7 still sucks, Zune isn't available in New Zealand, the OEM's butcher Windows installations every time. So yes there is a reason why 'us people' buy stuff off this guy.

How about you troll back to your Microsoft campus and fix up your ****ty software then I might consider moving back to the PC.


Or how about you grow a pair, do a bit of Googling (or use common sense, I really dont' care) and realize that PCs would cost a ridiculously larger amount if the OEMs weren't there to subsidize the cost of each Windows license. Did it ever occur to your oh-so evil computer manufacturers might NOT want all that OEM crap on your machine? But they have to worry about their costs, and having third part companies pay them to preload their software is how the license gets paid.

<snipped>

It's exactly this ignorance which drives people to Macs. They need their hand held with EVERYTHING and now it seems that includes their own bloody thought process too.

Edited by markjensen, Jun 25 2010, 11:01am : Removed suggestion to violate copyright

Smigit said,
But I don't deal with "this guy". As I said, I'm quite capable of evaluating a device for what it is and isn't. If you don't like the App store don't buy an iPhone. Furthermore how Apple runs that store effects one product, it doesn't have to effect others so they may have a policy I don't agree with for their phones but that doesn't mean I would then overlook buying a laptop from them for instance.

That's wonderful. A company image is reflected by its managing officers. And this is a pretty clear reflection if you ask me.

Not buying a device because you don't like the CEO seems rather short sighted to me. And yes, that email response was short but why not email the support team instead...you know, the guys responsible for offering support. Do you think emailing Steve Ballmer will give some length step by step solution for a broken XBox?

This is an INHERENT issue with the phone from DAY 1. So that logic doesn't work. And trust me, if Steve Ballmer was to answer such a question, it would be FAR more polite than what Jobs replied.

In the end of the day you are still buying Apples product for better or worse. Not Steve Jobs product regardless of how much influence he may or may not have in its design.

At the end of the day you're buying into his vision of a closed-source software and hardware ecosystem, and that, my friend, is entirely his influence. I can't stand for computing like that.

LiquidSolstice said,
Or how about you grow a pair, do a bit of Googling (or use common sense, I really dont' care) and realize that PCs would cost a ridiculously larger amount if the OEMs weren't there to subsidize the cost of each Windows license. Did it ever occur to your oh-so evil computer manufacturers might NOT want all that OEM crap on your machine? But they have to worry about their costs, and having third part companies pay them to preload their software is how the license gets paid.

Where is the option to pay more? provide me a link to a big mainstream laptop vendor who sells in New Zealand which provides such an option.

<snipped>

Why should I have to jump through hoops to get something that I get already with my Mac out of the box?

It's exactly this ignorance which drives people to Macs. They need their hand held with EVERYTHING and now it seems that includes their own bloody thought process too.

Coming from a left hander whose thumb causes double posts.

I don't need my hand held, it is the fact that I have better things to use my time for than fixing up vendors screw ups and Microsoft incompetence.

Edited by markjensen, Jun 25 2010, 11:47am : snipped quoted text

rawr_boy81 said,

Where is the option to pay more? provide me a link to a big mainstream laptop vendor who sells in New Zealand which provides such an option.

I said hypothetically. As in IF this system didn't exist. I don't give a damn about your New Zealand sobstory, so you can quit with that. For example, here in America, Sony charges a "clean slate" fee for there to be no OEM software on the computer and last time I checked, it was between $50 and $100.

Why should I have to jump through hoops to get something that I get already with my Mac out of the box?

Why should you have to do anything at all when Windows "just works" out of the box as well? That's such stupid logic. If you feel that paying a couple extra hundred dollars in Apple Tax because it's too strenuous of a process to download an image (or hell, even use your friend's disc for all it matter) and clean install, which is damn near painless since Windows Update finds all the drivers on first boot for you, than I suppose that's your loss.

Coming from a left hander whose thumb causes double posts.

Because that's a reply to an entirely different comment. You know, a comment that was actually intelligent, and not barging in raging about how Microsoft is the scourge of the earth, it was a comment that was on topic. It's actually kind of cool to be on-topic. Try it sometime.

I don't need my hand held, it is the fact that I have better things to use my time for than fixing up vendors screw ups and Microsoft incompetence.

It's not a screw-up, it's called a profit model. Microsoft is not incompetent, you're just a whiny little child who is mad that the Zune hasn't yet come to your country, because from what you've said, you've got no substance behind your hate for Windows 7. How can I tell this? Because of how you say:

"How about you troll back to your Microsoft campus and fix up your ****ty software then I might consider moving back to the PC."

when the only thing you've said that you hate about about Windows 7 is "the OEM's butcher Windows installations every time". Right. That makes perfect sense. Let's suddenly make the binary decision that Windows 7 "sucks" due to unrelated non-Microsoft affiliated third-party OEM software that Microsoft has no control over and is installed purely for financial reasons of the computer manufacturer, right?

Your poor fool. And you have the gall to come in here and say that some Microsoft fanboy is here trolling.

If you like your computer, enjoy it and just stuff it. As far as I'm concerned, your inadequacy to understand anything beyond the shiny buttons you click on your monitor and inability to figure out how the commercial side of computer sales works makes it damn hard for you to be the judge of anything that concerns other people.

Ridlas said,
And you people still keep buying stuff from this guy.

As if Microsoft's CEOs haven't said anything idiotic. How does a CEO's comments affect whether or not a product of service suits your needs? Regardless of what Jobs said in this email, most in the forum wouldn't have bought an iPhone anyway. The idea that what a CEO says or does affects the usefulness of a product is idiotic. People keep their money in banks bailed out by governments that are run by CEOs earning millions in salary each year but won't buy a phone from a guy taking $1 in salary. This is all very laughable.

rawr_boy81 said,

Based on what evidence? it is the same problem prone operating system with the same half finished flawed API's, the same poor battery life, the same crappy third parties creating the same crappy installers that ruin a pristine virgin installation of Windows, the lack of Direct2D/DirectWrite fully replacing GDI in the various components that use GDI and so on and so on.

I'd rather have what you describe than the insecure, poorly performing pile of trash that OS X is.

rawr_boy81 said,

Where is the option to pay more? provide me a link to a big mainstream laptop vendor who sells in New Zealand which provides such an option.

Go to http://www.dell.co.nz
Go to For Small And Medium Business.
Go to Laptops and Netbooks.
Click the green Shop Vostro button.
Choose the model you want. HINT: The 3x00 series have Core i Series processors. Choose one of these.
Find the base specification level that suits you. Click the Green Customize button.
Either switch to a full version of Office or take Works or Office Starter like a man and uninstall it upon it's receipt (So, one thing to uninstall that will take all of ten minutes. Big whoop.)
Customize forward.
Pay for it.

You have now sucessfully customized and ordered your own Dell Vostro laptop. Included software is thusly: Works\Office, Dell webcam software (which would come on a Mac as an app called Photo Booth, if I recall), Roxio Creator, Dell Backup and Recovery and Windows Live suite (which can be easily nuked as not everybody has a need for it, but has nice things like an email client, instant messaging client, and so forth).

LiquidSolstice said,

This is an INHERENT issue with the phone from DAY 1. So that logic doesn't work. And trust me, if Steve Ballmer was to answer such a question, it would be FAR more polite than what Jobs replied.
And thus why I said devices should be evaluated on a case by case basis. And so what if it's a 1st day issue, why wouldn't you contact support directly? The logic still stands. The only reason you would go to the CEO for a support issue is if you were deliberately looking to get attention, not if you were looking for a real solution to your issue.


And yes the response was short, I said that. Notice that all his replies are like that. People who send emails like this are lucky to even get a response IMHO given it's clearly not the right way to get the individuals problem fixed and Jobs would be well aware of whats happening relating to this already.

LiquidSolstice said,

I said hypothetically. As in IF this system didn't exist. I don't give a damn about your New Zealand sobstory, so you can quit with that. For example, here in America, Sony charges a "clean slate" fee for there to be no OEM software on the computer and last time I checked, it was between $50 and $100.

Why should you have to do anything at all when Windows "just works" out of the box as well? That's such stupid logic. If you feel that paying a couple extra hundred dollars in Apple Tax because it's too strenuous of a process to download an image (or hell, even use your friend's disc for all it matter) and clean install, which is damn near painless since Windows Update finds all the drivers on first boot for you, than I suppose that's your loss.

Because that's a reply to an entirely different comment. You know, a comment that was actually intelligent, and not barging in raging about how Microsoft is the scourge of the earth, it was a comment that was on topic. It's actually kind of cool to be on-topic. Try it sometime.

It's not a screw-up, it's called a profit model. Microsoft is not incompetent, you're just a whiny little child who is mad that the Zune hasn't yet come to your country, because from what you've said, you've got no substance behind your hate for Windows 7. How can I tell this? Because of how you say:

"How about you troll back to your Microsoft campus and fix up your ****ty software then I might consider moving back to the PC."

when the only thing you've said that you hate about about Windows 7 is "the OEM's butcher Windows installations every time". Right. That makes perfect sense. Let's suddenly make the binary decision that Windows 7 "sucks" due to unrelated non-Microsoft affiliated third-party OEM software that Microsoft has no control over and is installed purely for financial reasons of the computer manufacturer, right?

Your poor fool. And you have the gall to come in here and say that some Microsoft fanboy is here trolling.

If you like your computer, enjoy it and just stuff it. As far as I'm concerned, your inadequacy to understand anything beyond the shiny buttons you click on your monitor and inability to figure out how the commercial side of computer sales works makes it damn hard for you to be the judge of anything that concerns other people.

+1

Constant trolling against anything MS related by this guy, yet the first to defend Apple.

Smigit said,
And thus why I said devices should be evaluated on a case by case basis. And so what if it's a 1st day issue, why wouldn't you contact support directly? The logic still stands. The only reason you would go to the CEO for a support issue is if you were deliberately looking to get attention, not if you were looking for a real solution to your issue.

And yes the response was short, I said that. Notice that all his replies are like that. People who send emails like this are lucky to even get a response IMHO given it's clearly not the right way to get the individuals problem fixed and Jobs would be well aware of whats happening relating to this already.

Perhaps I should rephrase, since I was using my principle of professionalism in computing to answer your question; the fact of the matter is the phone has a serious design flaw and not even the CEO has an answer as to whether or not it will be fixed, rather just telling them to hold the phone differently. It's not the fact that jobs is being an @$$, it's the fact that the phone will not be fixed and not even the CEO would be willing to do so.

majortom1981 said,
wow so basically oh well deal with it. hmm guess i am not going to get the iphone 4g

Looks like the Wifi in the iphone 4 is crap compared to the previous version of iphone.
In the kyenote you could clearly see the iphone 4 had wifi issues and failed to load the website the older version was able load the site.
Clearly the quality has fallen with the new iphone.

figgy said,

Looks like the Wifi in the iphone 4 is crap compared to the previous version of iphone.
In the kyenote you could clearly see the iphone 4 had wifi issues and failed to load the website the older version was able load the site.
Clearly the quality has fallen with the new iphone.

Smells like a troll...

FusionOpz said,
smells like troll food.
how am i a troll? I was going back and forth on weather to by the phone from the apple site but this made the decesion for me. I will wait for my contract on my iphone 3gs to run out and get an android phone on verizon

FusionOpz said,
smells like troll food.

He seems to be making sense to me, its not like what he's saying is not true.

wow!!! what a BS response. my BB never lose reception if i cover my phone.
"Apple has essentially admitted it's a problem, but say it isn't related to how the phone was manufactured or the software" Steve is saying that its not the prob with the phone but with the users.

figgy said,

Looks like the Wifi in the iphone 4 is crap compared to the previous version of iphone.
In the kyenote you could clearly see the iphone 4 had wifi issues and failed to load the website the older version was able load the site.
Clearly the quality has fallen with the new iphone.

If you had watched the entire keynote you will see where he made everyone (yea there were alot of people) hibernate/standby/shutdown their laptops, airports, ipads, iphones, and other wifi capable devices since the wifi network was bogged down. Once that was done all was good. The facetime demo was done over wifi since it doesn't work over cellular.

shinji257 said,

If you had watched the entire keynote you will see where he made everyone (yea there were alot of people) hibernate/standby/shutdown their laptops, airports, ipads, iphones, and other wifi capable devices since the wifi network was bogged down. Once that was done all was good. The facetime demo was done over wifi since it doesn't work over cellular.

but still it did work on the 3GS while it didn't on the 4..

figgy said,

Looks like the Wifi in the iphone 4 is crap compared to the previous version of iphone.
In the kyenote you could clearly see the iphone 4 had wifi issues and failed to load the website the older version was able load the site.
Clearly the quality has fallen with the new iphone.

I have a iPhone 4 and i don't have any issues. It has become common to criticize any issues that iPhone's have but ignore issues on other phones. Every phone has problems, but iPhone's issues are blown out of proportion. After all, it is not a big deal.

figgy said,

Looks like the Wifi in the iphone 4 is crap compared to the previous version of iphone.
In the kyenote you could clearly see the iphone 4 had wifi issues and failed to load the website the older version was able load the site.
Clearly the quality has fallen with the new iphone.

Clearly you don't understand the technical limitations of WiFi if mentioning the WWDC keynote is your example.

spenumatsa said,

After all, it is not a big deal.

Of course it's not a big deal, you just have a phone that when you hold it can't be used as a phone. DOH!!

spenumatsa said,

I have a iPhone 4 and i don't have any issues. It has become common to criticize any issues that iPhone's have but ignore issues on other phones. Every phone has problems, but iPhone's issues are blown out of proportion. After all, it is not a big deal.

My HD2 doesn't have issues to be honest. Granted, I'm running a custom ROM which makes it greasy fast and stable, but I didn't have issues prior to flashing it. But hey, good luck with that.