Adobe halts further iPhone development, shifts to Android [UPDATED]

UPDATE: Apple has responded to Adobe’s move: "Someone has it backwards--it is HTML5, CSS, JavaScript, and H.264 (all supported by the iPhone and iPad) that are open and standard, while Adobe's Flash is closed and proprietary," said spokeswoman Trudy Miller in a statement.

Adobe yesterday announced that they would cease work on any further Flash CS5 development for the iPhone. Mike Chambers, Principal Product Manager for Flash, stated on his blog that the decision hinged on Apple’s recent changes to their SDK license.

Earlier this month Apple changed their SDK licensing terms to restrict applications built with third party compilers and languages—essentially restricting apps made with Flash CS5. While some developers have received assurance that their development platform would be protected, it is unlikely that any further Flash-to-iPhone apps will be approved into the App Store.

Chambers also had some particularly strong words about the App Store’s policies: "Developers should be prepared for Apple to remove existing content and applications (100+ on the store today) created with Flash CS5 from the iTunes store. To be clear, during the entire development cycle of Flash CS5, the feature complied with Apple’s licensing terms. However, as developers for the iPhone have learned, if you want to develop for the iPhone you have to be prepared for Apple to reject or restrict your development at anytime, and for seemingly any reason."

Because of those recent developments, attention and resources are now shifting to other platforms and operating systems. Chambers heralded the open development of Android and said that his team has been working closely with Google to ship Flash Player 10.1 and Adobe AIR 2.0 later this year on both phones and tablets.

Flash and AIR are both in private testing currently but Adobe will provide a public beta soon.

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APPLE SELLS PRODUCTS TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE NO CLUE ABOUT ANYTHING IT/TECH RELATED.

Sorry for the caps, but thats should clear up the "Good sales during the recession" bit of the comments. Oh and man... What is wrong with Apple?

"if you want to develop for the iPhone you have to be prepared for Apple to reject or restrict your development at anytime, and for seemingly any reason."

Exactly. But you know what? It's Apple's device, Apple's rules. No need to get upset. If developers or customers don't like it there are others more than happy to win them over.

C_Guy said,
"if you want to develop for the iPhone you have to be prepared for Apple to reject or restrict your development at anytime, and for seemingly any reason."

Exactly. But you know what? It's Apple's device, Apple's rules. No need to get upset. If developers or customers don't like it there are others more than happy to win them over.

You failed to see the point in that sentence. Just imagine you are a small or a one-guy developer that is investing time and money in writing apps for the iPhone/iPad and all of a sudden you are being told you can no longer offer them in the app store because of a change in policy they just made.

If I were to start investing money and time in an iPhone app, I would think about it twice about the costs and potential ROI because you can be left out in the cold by Apple's sudden policy changes.

What Adobe invested (in this case) is going down the toilet because that feature will be useless then they release the CS5 suite.

ajua said,
You failed to see the point in that sentence. Just imagine you are a small or a one-guy developer that is investing time and money in writing apps for the iPhone/iPad and all of a sudden you are being told you can no longer offer them in the app store because of a change in policy they just made.

If I were to start investing money and time in an iPhone app, I would think about it twice about the costs and potential ROI because you can be left out in the cold by Apple's sudden policy changes.

What Adobe invested (in this case) is going down the toilet because that feature will be useless then they release the CS5 suite.

So what you are saying is I should develop an App that steals information from all iPhones, Nexus phones, and every other phone on the market that blatantly breaks terms of use for those devices and then blame said phone maker for blocking it and cry about it. Random thought, maybe I could just read the terms of use for the app stores and not break a rule? The only policy change Apple has made since it came out was the porn thing which surprised people why? Has noone else paid any attention to politics and how most of the world governments that have power to do so are doing what they can to make porn harder to get to on the internet? Not sure why developers were surprised that the same thing happened on a mobile device.

well, Adobe should halts all Apple-related development. It's just waste of time and resources. Two platforms (Win & Lin) is enough for their software

cpu said,
well, Adobe should halts all Apple-related development. It's just waste of time and resources. Two platforms (Win & Lin) is enough for their software

Linux? And stop OS X's development? Are you nuts?
Would you waste thousand of dollars on a platform not so popular while you can make software on a much more popular platform that is recognized for being awesome to make videos and graphics? I wouldn't buy market shares from Adobe if you were their CEO...

You are right. But looking at what Apple does to iPad/iPhone platform, you cannot expect any more, that they will never change a license for macosx. For example, you will be not able to distribute any applications, not showing a big Steve's portrait .

Apple did it once already (NeXT). Seems, the story is repeating...

it's good... Flash isn't good for apple honestly.
Play a video or play farmville and you will see how your CPU goes 100% all time.

imagine that in your mobile, WOW

acido00 said,
it's good... Flash isn't good for apple honestly.
Play a video or play farmville and you will see how your CPU goes 100% all time.

imagine that in your mobile, WOW

Flash (Lite) works fine on my HTC Desire.

I don't see why there is so much bitching and moaning about Flash. Give Adobe a chance, if it sucks then it'll suck and you don't need to use it. Simply saying "NOOOAHAWAY! FLASH SUCKS!!!" is just a stupid position to take.

Pong said,

Flash (Lite) works fine on my HTC Desire.

I don't see why there is so much bitching and moaning about Flash. Give Adobe a chance, if it sucks then it'll suck and you don't need to use it. Simply saying "NOOOAHAWAY! FLASH SUCKS!!!" is just a stupid position to take.

Amazing how flash was never a problem until apple opened their mouth. Others seem to really have no problem with it.

Pong said,

Flash (Lite) works fine on my HTC Desire.

I don't see why there is so much bitching and moaning about Flash. Give Adobe a chance, if it sucks then it'll suck and you don't need to use it. Simply saying "NOOOAHAWAY! FLASH SUCKS!!!" is just a stupid position to take.

Apple has given them chances since the beginning of Flash 1 I think... do you really think they're going to give them an 11th chance?
Flash 10.1 was meant to be an optimization release to use as less resources as possible and all I can say is... it fails here.

You know, sometimes I'm thinking... Macromedia and Adobe made good competition back then, if they both existed again, maybe we would have better apps in this domain, and I'm confident we would get competition in Flash players. Now Microsoft entered this combat and it's not even worth trying...

Pong said,

Flash (Lite) works fine on my HTC Desire.

I don't see why there is so much bitching and moaning about Flash. Give Adobe a chance, if it sucks then it'll suck and you don't need to use it. Simply saying "NOOOAHAWAY! FLASH SUCKS!!!" is just a stupid position to take.

Absolutely right.

"Because of those recent developments, attention and resources are now shifting to other platforms and operating systems." -- So get the x64 flash out already!!! (or better yet, hurry up html5, take over SOON! lol)

FusionOpz said,
Personally I see no loss.

Only because Apple have been stopping you from seeing the benefits by blocking Adobe at every turn. You can't miss what you've never had, such as freedom if you buy an Apple product.

In the end Steve jobs decides what you get to see and what you don't and thats not something I'd pay for.

FusionOpz said,
Personally I see no loss.

You may not, but I know of a few indie devs who are ****ed off. If you can write a program once and have it compile to iPhone, Android and Blackberry applications with minimal effort, you increase your customer pool without needing additional resources.

Com on guys, the app store is not your store, not mine, its apples. Their game, their rules. Adobe should have worked more closely with Apple on such a huge project as Flash CS5. As Steve said, if you don't like it, go to Android, Adobe did, who cares...iPhone is still #1, and the sale numbers prove it. AND Flash does suck, Safari crashes often because of the Mac flash plugin. I know because I got 2 macs. Also one of the major issues with MacOS 10.6.0 was that it was shipped with a major security hole in the flash plugin. About jailbraking, most iphone users are REGULAR consumers, not hackers, 95% don't know how to jailbrake, and if they even heard about it, they might get it done somehow to take their phone to a different carrier, not to install apps.

Lenard Bartha said,
About jailbraking, most iphone users are REGULAR consumers, not hackers, 95% don't know how to jailbrake, and if they even heard about it, they might get it done somehow to take their phone to a different carrier, not to install apps.

I will have to disagree with you on this, as I know quite a few non-computer literate people, who have jailbroken their phones. It's dead easy with the software and tutorials out there, plus many people at markets (in the UK at least) advertise themselves as being able to do it for you.

Yes but the reason the major security hole in the first place was on 10.6.0 is because Apple did not update the plugin when 10.6.0 was sent out to be master. That being said, I haven't really had any issues with Flash in Safari or Firefox, what sites do you actually have issues with it crashing Safari?

Jailbraking is truly not that hard anymore. My point is that we must not fall into the thought process that if the system is closed = security. When I say hacking competitions, I'm talking about the recent competitions to find vulnerabilities in operating systems - be it Windows, Mac OSX, Linux (any distro) etc. There are things to be concerned about, and even if you are not a techie, you can be dealt a hard blow if your OS on your computer has security issue that is ignored. Technically we, Mac users, are a limited market, thus not a prime target for viruses, but we could be easily. Its important for those that own stock in a company to care more than about marketing and products sales when security is such a big thing now - but I know I'm being an exception to that thinking, really us share holders simply want a profit at the end of the day.

JustinN said,

I will have to disagree with you on this, as I know quite a few non-computer literate people, who have jailbroken their phones. It's dead easy with the software and tutorials out there, plus many people at markets (in the UK at least) advertise themselves as being able to do it for you.

Ho JustinN. I was going by the article that did a statistic about 8-9% iphone users jailbrake. But even if they do, i think the reason is to take the phone to a different carrier. But I might be wrong...

http://www.iphonefreak.com/200...iphone-users-jailbreak.html

Edited by Lenard Bartha, Apr 21 2010, 4:38pm : Missing link

That's true, but even without jailbraking the phone there are inherent vulnerabilities like the SMS vulnerability that was, thankfully patched with OS 3.0.1. There are others supposedly floating around. Its a shame though that those that do jailbreak (other than to get on another carrier) are doing so to get applications that are not offered on the iTunes store, or for that matter activating services that are disabled on their model of iPhone. Take the multitasking feature coming out, it will be disabled on 1st and 2nd generation iPhones (iPhone 3G). But the development kit it can be turned on, and works perfectly with a few exceptions. That being said Lenard, I see your point, and I'm sure you see mine. Its just we need to look at this from all sides. If Apple wants to limit developers, its in their right, but it does not mean they should. They still could do a thorough review process on applications created with other developing kits, instead of locking out everyone except themselves.

Hi Alan, I do see your point. I just found out that the 3g can handle multitasking. I wonder why they don't support it in the official release? Maybe because of the battery is different in the 3g vs 3gs and it would drain it? I don't know...but its sad, I want multitasking on my 3g, especially because I just got it. Couldn't afford a 3gs, my newborn is stealing all my money away from me However I did notice that push notification is the one that is draining my 3g's battery life like crazy which is a fake multitasking feature if you ask me and that could be why the 3g will not support it. Maybe that doesn't make sense, i don't know, its too early in the morning.
However, MonoTouch i think its clear from all the mess with the app store.

Lenard Bartha said,
Com on guys, the app store is not your store, not mine, its apples. Their game, their rules. Adobe should have worked more closely with Apple on such a huge project as Flash CS5. As Steve said, if you don't like it, go to Android, Adobe did, who cares...iPhone is still #1, and the sale numbers prove it. AND Flash does suck, Safari crashes often because of the Mac flash plugin. I know because I got 2 macs. Also one of the major issues with MacOS 10.6.0 was that it was shipped with a major security hole in the flash plugin. About jailbraking, most iphone users are REGULAR consumers, not hackers, 95% don't know how to jailbrake, and if they even heard about it, they might get it done somehow to take their phone to a different carrier, not to install apps.

Yet when it's Microsoft everybody says the different. apple has a monopoly there, they must be stopped the same way it was done to MS.

Kudos to Adobe, because they produce some really good apps for the mac platform anyway. The software they produce is bloated and pretty much hasn't moved on from CS1 / CS2. Adobe has treated the Mac platform as a cash cow for the past decade it's about time a stand was made against them.

However i agree with Adobe's actions in this case. If the platform is not to their liking them simply move to another. Android is rock solid and gaining momentum, at the end of the day the only way large companies will get the hint from users is when we vote with our feet.

What would be hilarious will be the day that Apple ****es Adobe off to the point of them no longer making ANY products for the Mac. There goes your Photoshop/Illustrator/etc designers raving on about Mac being the ideal platform.

I'm personally glad to see that they are shifting to Android (selfishly because I own a few), but I still don't see what the point of running flash on the device is good for. I only like visiting sites that are pre-formated for mobile devices while using my phone.

Perhaps I'm thinking small minded, and am not considering the untouched potential market of say, apps, or other online content yet to be made.

Kudos to Adobe. Seriously though, it is a shame that Apple is pursuing a 'closed system' as a means of protection and controlling their product. They have the right, but it can't be for security issues - due to the fact that Apple in general is taking out of first in hacking competitions, and their products lately have been easily jailbroken (including the latest iPhone OS 4.0 beta). They limit their market, and still shroud themselves in a false sense of security when they lockdown what to use in developing applications and tools for their products. Maybe Jobs will realize this, but I doubt it. Simply due to the fact that a majority of Apple users have accepted short term product lifespans - btw I made this comment on my Mac Pro 2006 model.

what we really need is some feedback from developers, is there any need for flash if everything is written in HTML5 and a standard video format is used ?

craybox said,
what we really need is some feedback from developers, is there any need for flash if everything is written in HTML5 and a standard video format is used ?

Well it will take a while to migrate all Flash programs/applets to HTML5...

I don't have any knowledge in this matter, but would HTML5 be able to replace Flash games efficiently?

LaserWraith said,

would HTML5 be able to replace Flash games efficiently?

I have heard that Flash CS5 will be able to export flash stuff to HTML 5 (canvas)... so That will replace flash games I think, don't know about efficiency though.
Can any1 throw light on that?

Edited by codename.venice, Apr 21 2010, 7:00pm :

LaserWraith said,
Well it will take a while to migrate all Flash programs/applets to HTML5...

I don't have any knowledge in this matter, but would HTML5 be able to replace Flash games efficiently?

A few days ago they showed off Google having ported Quake 2 to HTML5.


Sure, they are clearly smart guys, but they are also some of the first people doing it. It will become easier to do naturally and I would bet that Adobe is hard at work on their Flash-to-HTML5 converter, which already exists in Flash CS5.


As for the efficiency question, I think all of the jokes about Flash's efficiency should answer that (yes: anything could). More seriously, all of the browsers are in a war to develop the fastest JavaScript and display engines, which combined are what will be used to compete with Flash. The developments in all serious browsers, except IE prior to proposed changes coming in IE 9, are very promising (e.g., Chrome, Safari, FireFox and even Opera) and they will probably overtake Flash soon, if it already hasn't happened.

There is reason for this......it's so Apple can save the 'state' of the program. In order to enable multitasking, the iPhone OS 4 will save the state of the program when you exit. Then next time you open the program, it will restore the state.

If the program is made in a language that's not Objective-C, then the OS has no means to saving the state, thus not allowing for multitasking on that application.

Apple doesn't want to allow some applications to multitask and other's not, so by forcing developers to use their SDK to develop applications, then it should all work.

Kayle12 said,
There is reason for this......it's so Apple can save the 'state' of the program. In order to enable multitasking, the iPhone OS 4 will save the state of the program when you exit. Then next time you open the program, it will restore the state.

If the program is made in a language that's not Objective-C, then the OS has no means to saving the state, thus not allowing for multitasking on that application.

Apple doesn't want to allow some applications to multitask and other's not, so by forcing developers to use their SDK to develop applications, then it should all work.


You don't know much about applications in general, do you?

Kayle12 said,
There is reason for this......it's so Apple can save the 'state' of the program. In order to enable multitasking, the iPhone OS 4 will save the state of the program when you exit. Then next time you open the program, it will restore the state.

If the program is made in a language that's not Objective-C, then the OS has no means to saving the state, thus not allowing for multitasking on that application.

Apple doesn't want to allow some applications to multitask and other's not, so by forcing developers to use their SDK to develop applications, then it should all work.

That would be horrible programming if true, based on my VERY limited knowledge of programming

I highly doubt Apples programmers are at my level of skill, and I can barely write a VB script at this time

Kayle12 said,
There is reason for this......it's so Apple can save the 'state' of the program. In order to enable multitasking, the iPhone OS 4 will save the state of the program when you exit. Then next time you open the program, it will restore the state.

If the program is made in a language that's not Objective-C, then the OS has no means to saving the state, thus not allowing for multitasking on that application.

Apple doesn't want to allow some applications to multitask and other's not, so by forcing developers to use their SDK to develop applications, then it should all work.

To pause any application, even in a full scale OS, one simply needs to pause all running threads for the application and save the state of the memory. The language that it was originally written in is completely, 100% irrelevant because to run on the iPhone, for instance, every program is forced to be compiled (the key step) into a lower level [machine] language than even Objective C (this includes programs originally written in Objective C).

So, whether it was originally written in Flash, C#, C, C++, or Objective C, it will all look the same to the processor once it is compiled to machine code.

Now, whether the Flash and C# (not traditionally used for compiled code) are running at the peak efficiency is different story, but it is also not one that Apple chose to take on.

Anything that Apple wanted to require in order to interoperate with the multitasking framework could have been easily implemented by Flash, MonoTouch (C#), and anyone else making a cross compiler, which means converting a language conventionally compiled to one thing, into a different thing compiled form (e.g., C# is generally .NET IL byte code or x86 assembly at best, but compiled to ARM assembly code for the iPhone).

The claim that Apple actually can make is that some of these third party frameworks may not update fast enough (specifically Flash) and thus, to the detriment of a lot of users and app developers, delay the forced migration to iPhone OS version XYZ. So, regardless of this pausing business, Apple could theoretically change an existing framework that breaks backwards compatibility (by changing the signature of an important function call for instance), and anything built with an existing third party framework would stop working in future releases until the tools were updated--and, unfortunately, Adobe has showed that it is not quick to update, which means they ruined it for the rest of us.

Now, with all of that said, I would hope that iPhone OS 3 applications can run on iPhone OS 4 devices, but I have my doubts simply so that Apple can force upgrades (and force people with out-of-date iPhones and iPod touches to upgrade their hardware). Also, anything new will certainly not work on an older device only running iPhone OS 3, which makes sense (simply to avoid making library calls that do not exist, even if not every app is guaranteed to do so), but really it's all about Apple forcing upgrades.

pickypg said,

To pause any application, even in a full scale OS, one simply needs to pause all running threads for the application and save the state of the memory. The language that it was originally written in is completely, 100% irrelevant because to run on the iPhone, for instance, every program is forced to be compiled (the key step) into a lower level [machine] language than even Objective C (this includes programs originally written in Objective C).

So, whether it was originally written in Flash, C#, C, C++, or Objective C, it will all look the same to the processor once it is compiled to machine code.

Now, whether the Flash and C# (not traditionally used for compiled code) are running at the peak efficiency is different story, but it is also not one that Apple chose to take on.

Anything that Apple wanted to require in order to interoperate with the multitasking framework could have been easily implemented by Flash, MonoTouch (C#), and anyone else making a cross compiler, which means converting a language conventionally compiled to one thing, into a different thing compiled form (e.g., C# is generally .NET IL byte code or x86 assembly at best, but compiled to ARM assembly code for the iPhone).

The claim that Apple actually can make is that some of these third party frameworks may not update fast enough (specifically Flash) and thus, to the detriment of a lot of users and app developers, delay the forced migration to iPhone OS version XYZ. So, regardless of this pausing business, Apple could theoretically change an existing framework that breaks backwards compatibility (by changing the signature of an important function call for instance), and anything built with an existing third party framework would stop working in future releases until the tools were updated--and, unfortunately, Adobe has showed that it is not quick to update, which means they ruined it for the rest of us.

Now, with all of that said, I would hope that iPhone OS 3 applications can run on iPhone OS 4 devices, but I have my doubts simply so that Apple can force upgrades (and force people with out-of-date iPhones and iPod touches to upgrade their hardware). Also, anything new will certainly not work on an older device only running iPhone OS 3, which makes sense (simply to avoid making library calls that do not exist, even if not every app is guaranteed to do so), but really it's all about Apple forcing upgrades.

+10

it's aggravating that a platform so popular is so narrow minded - telling you what you want and how much you want to pay for it has got them how far with their computers?

koppit said,
it's aggravating that a platform so popular is so narrow minded - telling you what you want and how much you want to pay for it has got them how far with their computers?

It's gotten them constant sales growth, even during a recession.

roadwarrior said,

It's gotten them constant sales growth, even during a recession.

Considering the customer base for tech products is also growing this is no big deal. They could've grown much faster.

roadwarrior said,

It's gotten them constant sales growth, even during a recession.

What? No it hasn't. They've had growth DESPITE their stubborn inconsistent treatment of developers, not because of it.

Mike Chipshop said,

Considering the customer base for tech products is also growing this is no big deal. They could've grown much faster.


??? An overall tech market growth during the recession, is that what you're saying?

Mike Chipshop said,

Considering the customer base for tech products is also growing this is no big deal. They could've grown much faster.

That's what I was getting at. They could be huge! Their OS has so much potential market its rediculous, but they want to tie it to hardware sales.

Northgrove said,

??? An overall tech market growth during the recession, is that what you're saying?

More and more people starting to use high-tech devices than before, I would think.

Well, my next phone is an android phone for sure. iPhone 3G was fun, but I'll never buy an Apple product again.

Personally I love the iPhone. Best phone for a long time. I will be wanting to upgrade to the next one. I would like to play with the Nexus One though. Google products/ideas always rock.

billyea said,
What's worse than a closed market is a closed market with inconsistent rules.

+1 It's really sad. I don't feel like you can totally trust Apple. Steve Jobs is brilliant, but this guy has had problems since he was a teenager. He has always been basically a spoiled brat or at least had "problems". This eventually led to him getting canned from Apple. But, he is brilliant in certain areas and once Apple re-hired him, he clearly has done a fantastic job of turning the company around. But, I feel like Apple could do an about-face at any time and change something, leaving you in the cold.