Ouch: Bada OS market share larger than Windows Phone

You know things are bad over in the Windows Phone camp when an operating system that almost no-one talks about is beating Microsoft’s latest and greatest. Yep, according to the latest reports from research firm Gartner, Samsung’s seldom-used Bada OS is actually beating Windows Phone in worldwide smartphone sales. Just take a look at the chart below:

Gartner is reporting that Windows Phone had a worldwide smartphone sales total of 2.759 million units in Q4 2011, while Bada had a sales total of 3.111 million units. This does indeed equate to the latter operating system beating Microsoft’s by a grand total of 352,000 units for the previous quarter. This must surely hurt Microsoft considering all the effort they went to, along with Nokia, to promote their operating system on Nokia’s Lumia range.

As you will also notice from the chart above, Microsoft’s smartphone market share has decreased year-on-year from 3.4% to 1.9% while Bada actually grew by 0.1%. Despite Microsoft’s market share loss they actually only sold 650,000 fewer units year-on-year, which isn’t all that much less considering giants like Android occupy 75 million units with an increase of 45 million year-on-year.

Another thing to remember is that in 2010 many people were still rocking Windows Mobile devices, and between now and then they have likely ditched these old devices for a newer smartphone that runs a more established OS such as iOS or Android.

As the 2011 numbers have likely scraped away most of the Windows Mobile figures and reflect almost solely Windows Phone, from here on out there is only going to be growth for the Windows Phone platform. Gartner predicts that by the end of 2012 Windows Phone will grow to reach 8.6% market share, helped along by multiple OS updates (“Tango” and “Apollo”) and new devices such as the top-tier Lumia 900.

One would have hoped that by now Windows Phone would be occupying a larger share of the market, but hey, Android started out in relatively similar rocky waters and look where it is now.

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These numbers are before any Nokia phones were released / before the Nokia marketing ... I'll wait for the 2012 Q1 / Q2 numbers.

Edit: Even your link to the airplane ad is Jan 5th...

Why do they mix company names with OS names in most of these statistics? Either name the operating system (Android, iOS, Symbian, BlackBerry, Bada, Windows Phone, Windows Mobile, WebOS) or just name the company name (Google, Apple, Nokia, RIM, Samsung, Microsoft, HP). Mixing the two is just bizarre...

THese are terrible numbers for any phone that is about a year old. Still waiting for Windows Phone to be a success.... The Mango update was said to be the kick start that the platform needed.... still waiting.

jasonon said,
what the heck is bada?

LOL, no one knows except Steve Ballmer ( who likely has an Android device) and will likely rage on public television and continue make himself look like an idiot. I cannot imagine how good the sex must have been with Bill and Steve, for Bill to allow Steve to remain employed at Microsoft. I would have fired him 4 years ago. No questions asked.

There's no doubt that those phones sell.. But at the $75 unlocked price point its a better deal than a featurephone.. This comparison doesn't make sense

SVG said,
There's no doubt that those phones sell.. But at the $75 unlocked price point its a better deal than a featurephone.. This comparison doesn't make sense

By your logic it doesn't make sense to compare to Android as well as 90% (look at Samsung sale numbers) of Android sales are $35-$75 cheap phones.

alexalex said,

By your logic it doesn't make sense to compare to Android as well as 90% (look at Samsung sale numbers) of Android sales are $35-$75 cheap phones.


There is no Android below $75 and there is no WP below $200 and yes I am speaking about the real-world prices not the illusion of cheap created by US carriers.. So as far as pricing goes Bada holds an edge over featurephones as it is a smartphone OS

SVG said,

There is no Android below $75 and there is no WP below $200 and yes I am speaking about the real-world prices not the illusion of cheap created by US carriers.. So as far as pricing goes Bada holds an edge over featurephones as it is a smartphone OS

Who said anything about a small country named US which doesn't influence worldwide smartphones sales ? Out there there are Billions of people in China and India where Android running "iPhone copycats" smarthphones sale for $35-$50. Just look it up at eBay.

Enron said,
You mean you actually go outside?

Have I ever said that I never go outside? Have I ever said anything remotely to I am a person that likes to stay home? Nice try though.

Between the bars, casinos, restaurants and work functions I go to, I've only seen that crap phone twice. One of those times that crap phone was being returned.

Android and iOS more than doubled their units sold from the same quarter last year. That's pretty impressive.

Regarding WP7, how much of that 1.9% is Windows Mobile? Everyone always seems to lump the two together for some reason.

In Microsot's defense, Bada caters for a completely different low budget segment than Windows Phone. They aren't competing. And the higher cost of Windows Phones should at least help with the actual revenue.

Northgrove said,
In Microsot's defense, Bada caters for a completely different low budget segment than Windows Phone. They aren't competing. And the higher cost of Windows Phones should at least help with the actual revenue.

That kind of rational reasoning and logic has no place on Neowin.

Northgrove said,
In Microsot's defense, Bada caters for a completely different low budget segment than Windows Phone. They aren't competing. And the higher cost of Windows Phones should at least help with the actual revenue.

With all the cash that has to be pumped into advertising and incentives and taking over entire companies just to get it into the customer's hands, I doubt its revenue is any help for their bottom line.

I have the first bada device the samsung wave and I am just waiting for my contract to end so I can jump ship. The phone itself is great with the same specs as the first gen galaxy with a smaller screen but better build quality. However, the OS really is atrocious it regularly hangs, and spews out memory full messsages when not doing anything. Web browsing is a pain as some full content sites cant be viewed as it says they are too large to load. The app store is beyond woeful with hundreds of abysmal apps and a handful of good ones. Finally the store is segmented because they cant be arsed to push out the latest update and the latest apps such as angry birds can only be downloaded on the latest firmware. Overall it is a slow and buggy mess and I cant wait to jump off. My brother has a nokia 800 and the difference is amazing it is so smooth and slick. So my next phone is going to be a WP as my experience with Bada is a poor one. Same goes for android too in my opinion it has many of the same flaws as bada.

For the limited time I tried Bada OS on a "smartphone", I had the most laggy experience. The lag and jerky animations were horrible.

tiagosilva29 said,
"Sea" in Korean.

That just means Korean doesn't sound good at all. The only languages that sound good to me are Spanish and Japanese. I hate English as well.

Saex_Conroy said,

That just means Korean doesn't sound good at all. The only languages that sound good to me are Spanish and Japanese. I hate English as well.

Then you are a total jack my friend ^_^

Saex_Conroy said,

That just means Korean doesn't sound good at all. The only languages that sound good to me are Spanish and Japanese. I hate English as well.

Ha, I'm from latinoamerica and if a Language sounds powerful it's the German one, and a lot of other nordic languages.

Aren't those number for units sold in Q4 2011?
So any numbers of old WM phones that have been ditched and replaced are absolutely irrelevant for these numbers.

I think the figures are at the right stage for MS market share, unfortunately WM6.5 has took a long time to be phased out and the owners of these phones will probably not go to WP7 because of bad experiences etc, and MS marketing is below average at best.

The next quarters figures will probably be more representative of WP7 market share and i would hope these will increase slowly and then gain more traction towards the end of this year.

As for WP7 becoming the third player, personally i don't think this will happen until late next year.

I don't mind though, people always comment on my phone because they haven't seen anything like it before, and so far they have all been impressed.

Here is an interesting fact: according to alexa.com, a web site that keeps track of global page rankings, neowin.net is ranked #5357 in the world. Meanwhile, windowsphone.com is ranked #4466 in the world.

So the web page for a phone that is supposedly worse than a "seldom used" OS is beating your web site.

Ouch.

StephenBratz said,
Here is an interesting fact: according to alexa.com, a web site that keeps track of global page rankings, neowin.net is ranked #5357 in the world. Meanwhile, windowsphone.com is ranked #4466 in the world.

So the web page for a phone that is supposedly worse than a "seldom used" OS is beating your web site.

Ouch.

Not sure what that's supposed to mean, eg ubuntu.com beats both with a #1404 rank.

I have been using Symbian, BadaOS and Blackberry, out of which i find BadaOS best. I hope to test WP7 phone in a near future to have it compared with above ones...

I wouldn't worry at all with Microsoft's market share as this is going to skyrocket starting in 2013. With Windows Phone 8 plus Native Applications and much more form factors and higher end Dual core and Quad core arm processors Microsoft have a huge lift coming next year.

Windows 8 + Windows 8 Arm Tablets + Windows Phone 8 is going to be huge and it's going to be a game changer because now you have a store for all devices and the same interface for all devices and you can make the same app for all devices and not lose anything but complexity.

Yogurtmaster said,
I wouldn't worry at all with Microsoft's market share as this is going to skyrocket starting in 2013. With Windows Phone 8 plus Native Applications and much more form factors and higher end Dual core and Quad core arm processors Microsoft have a huge lift coming next year.

Windows 8 + Windows 8 Arm Tablets + Windows Phone 8 is going to be huge and it's going to be a game changer because now you have a store for all devices and the same interface for all devices and you can make the same app for all devices and not lose anything but complexity.

I don't know from where you bring these assumptions.
When WP7 was out , many here were sure in will trash iOS and Android. As nothing happend, many were sure that with the new updates the wheel will turn, and than with next update, and than surly with Mango, and now you are certain that with WP8 and Apollo, quad-core... WP8 will see salvation. No, it won't.
Android + iOS sale 1.25M phones per DAY. Just to keep its 1% market share (without Windows Mobile) Microsoft has to better this number, while now they sell less that that in a month.

Windows phones aren't selling well for a couple of reasons.

1) Verizon doesn't have but a few Windows phones (Same with Sprint?). Around here, people pretty much only use Verizon. Unfortunate, but them's the ropes. Verizon was all hurr durr, these aren't 4G LTE so you can suck it.

2) Remember the Kin? Yeah, Verizon sure does. That was a flop and probably didn't instill a bunch of confidence in Verizon folk.

3) Microsoft doesn't advertise and if they do their commercials are usually mediocre at best. That hasn't been their strong point in a long time anyway.

This all being said, I still want to try a Windows phone, but I'm with Verizon so until they get some Windows Phones, I'm S.O.L. I think their latest Windows phone may have 4G LTE capabilities though, but I'm not sure.

I really don't understand why Windows Phones do not sell better. The only things I think Microsoft should do is allow handset manufacturers to go crazy with better hardware specs and market the absolute crap out of WP with TV/Radio/Newspaper advertising. They need better diversity between models. I know this is coming with the Apollo update (WP8) but right now all handsets are locked to stringent specs enforced by Microsoft. This does make the platform much better in its current state but people want monster specs these days just so they feel like they have a beastly phone. I reckon once WP8 is released and ties in nicely with Windows 8, these phones will sell like hotcakes though.

Simmo3D said,
I really don't understand why Windows Phones do not sell better. The only things I think Microsoft should do is allow handset manufacturers to go crazy with better hardware specs and market the absolute crap out of WP with TV/Radio/Newspaper advertising. They need better diversity between models. I know this is coming with the Apollo update (WP8) but right now all handsets are locked to stringent specs enforced by Microsoft. This does make the platform much better in its current state but people want monster specs these days just so they feel like they have a beastly phone. I reckon once WP8 is released and ties in nicely with Windows 8, these phones will sell like hotcakes though.

It's because WP OEMs aren't doing their part to market and drive awareness to their Windows phones. There are 3 seconds generation phones available at AT&T and there have been a total of 2 commercials and they were both for the same phone.

Simmo3D said,
I really don't understand why Windows Phones do not sell better.
Microsoft “Cloud mentality Ivory Tower" dreamers refused to give people what they wanted from the start - phone was lacking basic features. This is why WP7 OS became a complete fail and Microsoft managed to loose even more mobile market. To this day there is no local Outlook address book sync, ability to connect phone as USB disk - which makes all synchronization difficult for developers. No Skype app till this day. Microsoft spend 8.5 billions on Skype, but could not afford like 40K (0.0005%) for a developer to make MP7 app? Zune is also fail. Reality is - biggest developers ignore this phone like it doesn't exist. I regret the day when I've “upgraded” from WM6 to WP7. I had a lot of tools on my old phone, now I can't use this phone for anything else than make calls and play crappy games which I don't. FYI: I use Microsoft development and programming tools professionally for 25 years now and had windows phones exclusively. It looks like Windows 8 is moving into same direction and some managers at Microsoft are living in the bubble.

Edited by EJocys, Feb 18 2012, 12:08pm :

EJocys said,
now I can't use this phone for anything else than make calls and play crappy games which I don't.

Heaven forbid you use a phone to make calls! /s

Seriously though, I don't understand why you're complaining about missing features. Granted syncing is tied to Zune software but that isn't very complicated - if anything it makes it easier. Simple drag-and-drop music / videos and out the door. How is Zune fail? Works perfect on my device.

What tools are you missing from Windows Mobile that you can't find in Windows Phone? I switched from Android to Windows Phone and couldn't be happier.

No Skype app? They only just finalized the buyout and you're wondering why they haven't released an app for it? Sure they could pay some guy to whip one up in a week but this is going to be a bulletpoint feature when Apollo drops. We'll see it baked into the OS similar to Facebook and Twitter is now. I, for one, would rather they do it right the first time than release some half ass attempt. Beside, I venture to guess the majority of the Windows Phone devices are even equipped to take full advantage of a Skype app to begin with - front-facing camera for video chat.

It's not Microsoft that's ****ing up here. It's the carriers that can't be bothered to put a modicum of effort into marketing the phone. Here in Australia, you're lucky if you can even find a carrier that carries them. Of the five big name carriers, only one carries Windows Phone. The others are BYOB or GTFO.

Sranshaft said,
Seriously though, I don't understand why you're complaining about missing features.

For example: local outlook synchronization would allow business people to sync mobile phone securely without sharing all their contacts with The Internet.
Sranshaft said,
if anything it makes it easier. Simple drag-and-drop music / videos and out the door. How is Zune fail? Works perfect on my device.

On WM6 I had a video player (not available on WP7) which allowed me to play nearly all video formats on my old phone. All I had to do is to drop video file into folder on my phone connected as USB disk (not possible on WP7) or directly on to removable SD card (not possible on WP7). Problem is that instead of 5 minutes copying, Zune tries to auto-convert some video files and it takes more than 1 hour to do that and I have no time for such BS.
Sranshaft said,
What tools are you missing from Windows Mobile that you can't find in Windows Phone?

Nearly all apps are not available on WP7 (including video player, password synchronizers, GPS, various math tools, messaging, etc…) because developers bought different phones and they are not going to spend their time on some minuscule 2% market share. If WP7 won't allow upgrade to WM8 OS ten all WP7 users will be abandoned with “basic” functionality with no future.
Sranshaft said,
I switched from Android to Windows Phone and couldn't be happier.

Long time ago I was very happy with my Nokia 6210 too. WP7 is a good basic phone with limited functionality. Unfortunately my requirements changed.
Sranshaft said,
No Skype app? They only just finalized the buyout and you're wondering why they haven't released an app for it?

I had Skype on WM6 long time before buyout. Skype, just like many other companies, ignored WP7.

Edited by EJocys, Feb 18 2012, 2:37pm :

EJocys said,
Microsoft “Cloud mentality Ivory Tower" dreamers refused to give people what they wanted from the start - phone was lacking basic features. This is why WP7 OS became a complete fail and Microsoft managed to loose even more mobile market. To this day there is no local Outlook address book sync, ability to connect phone as USB disk - which makes all synchronization difficult for developers. No Skype app till this day. Microsoft spend 8.5 billions on Skype, but could not afford like 40K (0.0005%) for a developer to make MP7 app? Zune is also fail. Reality is - biggest developers ignore this phone like it doesn't exist. I regret the day when I've “upgraded” from WM6 to WP7. I had a lot of tools on my old phone, now I can't use this phone for anything else than make calls and play crappy games which I don't. FYI: I use Microsoft development and programming tools professionally for 25 years now and had windows phones exclusively. It looks like Windows 8 is moving into same direction and some managers at Microsoft are living in the bubble.

Windows Mobile was an OS aimed at enterprise, Windows Phone is an OS aimed at consumers, specifically first-time smartphone buyers. They aren't syncing with Outlook or using their phones as a mass storage device. If you are unable to do things you were able to do before, then it is your fault for not doing your research about the product. It didn't simply upgrade to the next version of Windows Mobile, you purchased a whole new product with a whole new user experience. The name change alone should have been enough for you to stop and wonder what's different.

Microsoft screwed up with their previous mobile strategy, they know that, we know that, the industry knows that, which is why they went in a different direction. Is it the right direction? I don't know for a fact if it is, but I definitely think it is. You need to look at what they're doing from a general consumers point of view. People love their Windows Phones, ratings all over the internet show that, it just lacks the awareness iOS and Android, with the latter having lower customer satisfaction rates.

wixostrix said,
Windows Mobile was an OS aimed at enterprise, Windows Phone is an OS aimed at consumers, specifically first-time smartphone buyers.

I am not buying this excuse. Microsoft would be too dumb to abandon enterprise market and tailor their phone to consumers. Truth is that WP7 was designed for both because Synchronization can be done trough Exchange which is exclusive enterprise thing.

They aren't syncing with Outlook or using their phones as a mass storage device.

Yes, they are. I've synchronized with Outlook and used phone as mass storage device for personal purpose and not only as corporate user. Every enterprise user is a consumer too because most of the people use same mobile phone for work and for personal life.

If you are unable to do things you were able to do before, then it is your fault for not doing your research about the product.

Where you saw a company which puts information on what their product can't do? I've expected for a new product to support at least basic features. Microsoft, like many other companies, tried to hide product flaws by avoiding this subject and expected that will go away. They paid for that with bad press and reduced market share.

It didn't simply upgrade to the next version of Windows Mobile

WP has version 7.0, and not 1.0. New version is called "upgrade" when you release product and increment major number and by default its assumed that upgrade retains all old features. Apple also learned it hard way with Final Cut Pro.

Market share (actual votes of real people) and independent reviews show completely different picture. Probably this is why I don't know any user who is happy with WP7 unless that person didn't had proper smart phone before.

EJocys said,

I am not buying this excuse. Microsoft would be too dumb to abandon enterprise market and tailor their phone to consumers. Truth is that WP7 was designed for both because Synchronization can be done trough Exchange which is exclusive enterprise thing.

Yes, they are. I've synchronized with Outlook and used phone as mass storage device for personal purpose and not only as corporate user. Every enterprise user is a consumer too because most of the people use same mobile phone for work and for personal life.

I never said Microsoft was abandoning their enterprise customers, they obviously have plans for enterprise with Windows Phones but right now, the focus is the general consumer, first smartphone buyers who are not syncing with Outlook or using their phones has mass storage.


Where you saw a company which puts information on what their product can't do? I've expected for a new product to support at least basic features. Microsoft, like many other companies, tried to hide product flaws by avoiding this subject and expected that will go away. They paid for that with bad press and reduced market share.

WP has version 7.0, and not 1.0. New version is called "upgrade" when you release product and increment major number and by default its assumed that upgrade retains all old features. Apple also learned it hard way with Final Cut Pro.

Market share (actual votes of real people) and independent reviews show completely different picture. Probably this is why I don't know any user who is happy with WP7 unless that person didn't had proper smart phone before.

I don't know what you think they are hiding but they have been clear about who they are targeting at the moment and are focusing on features and functionality to cater to that target. Windows Phone 7 is a version 1 product, there is NO upgrade path from Windows Mobile only personal data migration. The only thing WM and WP have in common is their underlying Windows CE kernel which is why WP starts at 7.0.

Can you show me these individual reviews? There are reviews all over the internet praising WP, they still hold 6 of the 10 top rated positions on Amazon, they are amongst the highest rated phones on all 4 US carriers, are selling out and drawing crowds in Europe, and almost everyone I show mine too are amazed by it, even those with iPhones.

Btw, anyone can use Exchange as long as they license it from Microsoft. Google and Apple have supported it for years. It's also support in Hotmail, which is a consumer email service.

Tim,
I'm not sure how you can conclude that the growth of WP7 is bad because the market share of the total Windows Mobile + WP7 is declining. It could be that the rate at which WM declines is faster than that at which WP7 increases so that net result is a decline in marketshare. The report says that Microsoft marketshare (i.e. WM+WP) is declining not that of WP7. Also remember WP7 was released in October 2010 and Bada was February 2010. To see growth of WP7 vs Bada, you would really need to separate out WM & WP7.

KevinN206 said,
Tim,
I'm not sure how you can conclude that the growth of WP7 is bad because the market share of the total Windows Mobile + WP7 is declining. It could be that the rate at which WM declines is faster than that at which WP7 increases so that net result is a decline in marketshare. The report says that Microsoft marketshare (i.e. WM+WP) is declining not that of WP7. Also remember WP7 was released in October 2010 and Bada was February 2010. To see growth of WP7 vs Bada, you would really need to separate out WM & WP7.

people are just having some excuse to make them self feel better about WP7 decline...
WM sales is nothing compared to WP.. how long are people going to do this???
i never hear about Wm sales anywhere and not sure who is still selling or buying WM...
http://wmpoweruser.com/accordi...indows-phones-till-q3-2011/

Edited by still1, Feb 18 2012, 7:13am :

KevinN206 said,
Tim,
I'm not sure how you can conclude that the growth of WP7 is bad because the market share of the total Windows Mobile + WP7 is declining. It could be that the rate at which WM declines is faster than that at which WP7 increases so that net result is a decline in marketshare. The report says that Microsoft marketshare (i.e. WM+WP) is declining not that of WP7. Also remember WP7 was released in October 2010 and Bada was February 2010. To see growth of WP7 vs Bada, you would really need to separate out WM & WP7.

Well if WM declines and WP7 increase does not compensate the losses it means that people were moving from WM to another platform which is not so positive.
IMO WP8 will be "moment of truth": I know a several people who are waiting to see what the next iteration of the OS will bring on the table to decide to move to WP or somewhere else.
Even more important I know people, as myself, that were early adopters and like the new GUI and some of the OS functionalities but are frustrated by the many shortcomings; either way WP8 will deliver what "Educated" or business oriented customers need and achieve a faster adoption rate or the road ahead will remain very bumpy.

still1 said,

people are just having some excuse to make them self feel better about WP7 decline...
WM sales is nothing compared to WP.. how long are people going to do this???
i never hear about Wm sales anywhere and not sure who is still selling or buying WM...
http://wmpoweruser.com/accordi...indows-phones-till-q3-2011/

There is no WP decline though, it started at 0% and it's at 1.9% now in a market that's still growing itself. A year ago the same unit sales, 2.7 million, would have given you a higher %. Regardless now that Nokia is going strong the next numbers will be interesting to see. Gartner expects WP to end the year around 8.6%.

Fritzly said,

Well if WM declines and WP7 increase does not compensate the losses it means that people were moving from WM to another platform which is not so positive.
IMO WP8 will be "moment of truth": I know a several people who are waiting to see what the next iteration of the OS will bring on the table to decide to move to WP or somewhere else.
Even more important I know people, as myself, that were early adopters and like the new GUI and some of the OS functionalities but are frustrated by the many shortcomings; either way WP8 will deliver what "Educated" or business oriented customers need and achieve a faster adoption rate or the road ahead will remain very bumpy.


alexalex said,
Windows Mobile phones are still sold and have a big share out of Microsoft's 1.9% market share.

No they're not. Gartner who posted the 1.9% said so clearly in the posting, which you obviously didn't read. That 1.9% counted by them is all WP which is still growing.

greenwizard88 said,
I wish these reports would split WP7 and WM into 2 seperate camps. Q4 2010, WP7 was brand new. WP7 grew 1.9%, to Bada's .1%...

No, it did not. Windows Mobile is still larger than WP7. 1.9% is Windows Mobile + Windows Phone.

still1 said,

WM is not selling at all... according to Gartner. the one who released this data as well WM is not selling at all.... so Bada sells better than WP7
http://wmpoweruser.com/accordi...indows-phones-till-q3-2011/

Which is no surprise because BadaOS is slapped on a large number of feature phones that sell for cheap or for nothing with a cheap contract. That said, the 1.9% being only WP shows it's actually growing, last time the WP % alone was 1.2%. It's also still not taking in the full effect of the Nokia push which started late in Q4.