official F1 World Championship 2012 Thread

[simonlang]

this was so clear. i have said it time and time again but will repeat it. alonso is the worst loser and probably worst character the f1 grid has ever seen. anyone knowing a bit about the flag/light situation would know that this is monaco 2010 with alonso/schumacher reversed. at that time schumi thought if the light shows green you can pass. see here:

but apparently waved flags overrule electric lights, therefore neither vettels electric yellow lights in the cockpit nor the electric lights on the track count as soon as a track marshall waves the green flag.

however with fia favoring ferrari all the time, you newer know. all over the year alonso has proven to be a horrible loser and couldnt accept being beaten in 2007, 2010 and now in 2012.

damn. i really hope redbull builds a car even better than theirs in 2011 and ferrari builds one with redbulls reliability of 2012 and their own pace of 2011.

[TheLegendOfMart]

Why do you rag on Alonso all the time, I don't really like the guy but he has done nothing wrong this year, it doesn't say Alonso is going to lodge a protest, it says Ferrari.

Give it a rest, christ.

[simonlang]

Why do you rag on Alonso all the time, I don't really like the guy but he has done nothing wrong this year, it doesn't say Alonso is going to lodge a protest, it says Ferrari.

Give it a rest, christ.

why do i? because it tends to be true...

The 31-year-old Alonso, who was world champion in 2005 and 2006, is believed to be pushing Ferrari to make an official protest to the FIA.

source: BBC

[TheLegendOfMart]

Alonso presiona a Ferrari para que recurra el t?tulo mundial de Vettel (ABS, Spanish)

This Spanish newspaper claims Ferrari communications director Luca Colajanni has said they will not attempt to have the results of the Brazilian Grand Prix changed.

You are letting your hatred blind you to the facts, Vettel is as much a **** as Alonso is.

[simonlang]

using a spanish website, one of those who first tried to make out a case of vettels pass on kobayashi but after that was cleared it was under red-yellow now trying to find a 2nd "illegal pass" and using the old colajani quote for the 2nd....

you might try to sort the timeline out first.....

[TheLegendOfMart]

This is all moot anyway, the FIA states that they will never change the result of a championship on technicalities like this. Ferrari have stated multiple times that they aren't going to lodge a protest, the media is whipping up a story where there isn't one.

You are just a ridiculous Vettel fanboy, I bet you drop him like a stone the year that the RBx car doesn't even come close to allowing Vettel to win championship. Typical glory hunter.

[MightyJordan]

This is all moot anyway, the FIA states that they will never change the result of a championship on technicalities like this. Ferrari have stated multiple times that they aren't going to lodge a protest, the media is whipping up a story where there isn't one.

Indeed. The stories of Ferrari lodging a protest are about as true as this story...

The Ferrari F1 team has announced that it is ?evaluating? whether to launch an official protest against Christmas.

?Last December we became aware that a man travelled the world giving gifts to children whilst wearing a suit that made unauthorised use of the signature red and white Ferrari colours,? said Maranello spokesman Paul Oozer. ?Since then we have been carefully examining footage of this ?Christmas? event and, although we did not mention it at the time, we now believe we have a case against the gentleman who infringed our copyright, Mr Claus, which we can string out in as over-dramatic and pathetically childish a way as possible.?

If the Italian team decides to go ahead with its action against Father Christmas, it could have dire consequences for the jocular Laplander?s usual present distribution routine and indeed for Christmas itself. However, Ferrari believe they have a solution to this potential seasonal crisis; ?As the rightful users of the red and white colour scheme, we would take over the whole Christmas event,? said a spokesman. ?Fernando Alonso has the pace to deliver presents all over the world in just one night and Felipe Massa looks like an elf. Plus, the 2013 car was basically a bit of a turkey.?

As for the actual presents to be delivered to youngsters across the globe, Ferrari claim they would have a solution to that too. ?What child would not want to receive a Ferrari-branded golfing glove or Ferrari-branded ice scraper?? their spokesman asked. ?Although of course in return the child would owe us 390 and 735 Euros respectively.?

Whilst Ferrari continue to deliberate on their next move, others are less than impressed with their potential plan to ruin Christmas. ?For f**k's sake, can?t they just drop it and move on,? said the rest of the world, yesterday.

[Lingwo]

Looks like they're seeking "clarification"

Which means they're testing the water first to see if it is worth appealing it.

I don't think anything will come of this. Stewards have already stated that the move was legal and it has been explained countless times.

Also i doubt very much Alonso would want to win his third world title in this fashion.

http://www1.skysports.com/formula-1/news/12433/8293693/Ferrari-confirm-they-want-clarification-from-the-FIA-over-Sebastian-Vettel-overtake

[Noir Angel]

source: BBC

If the rules were broken he has every right to complain about it.

[simonlang]

If the rules were broken he has every right to complain about it.

problem is, that as i have proven with my picture and difference between flags and electric lights, there was no rule broken at all. all these twitter lines from alonso and rumors in the spanish press have just the same goal as what ferrari and alonso did in the last races. to destabilize vettel and undermine his achievements. very poor!

meanwhile fia confirmed that vettel did nothing wrong :)

[TheLegendOfMart]

Mate just drop it, if Alonso had won in a similar fashion I'm pretty sure you would be screaming bloody murder.

[Guth]

Nobody can appeal anything.

Article 174 (d) of the International Sporting Code makes this clear:

Protests against any error or irregularity occurring during a competition, referring to the non-compliance of vehicles with the regulations and concerning the classification established at the end of the event shall, except in circumstances which the stewards of the meeting consider as physically impossible, be made within thirty minutes of the official publication of the results.

This will be familiar to everyone who remembers the end of the 2007 season, when McLaren attempted to protest the result of that?s year season finale in Brazil in a dispute over fuel temperatures. Their appeal was declared inadmissible because they had protested against a stewards? decision instead of doing what article 174 (d) told them to ? namely, to protest the race classification within 30 minutes of the results being published.

.source

[Daedroth]

Ferrari did write to the FIA (Source: Sky Sports F1), but it has been rejected by the FIA saying Vettel passed under green flag conditions.

You can view the video here.

However, they simply wrote a letter, they didn't launch an official protest.

[Noir Angel]

problem is, that as i have proven with my picture and difference between flags and electric lights, there was no rule broken at all. all these twitter lines from alonso and rumors in the spanish press have just the same goal as what ferrari and alonso did in the last races. to destabilize vettel and undermine his achievements. very poor!

meanwhile fia confirmed that vettel did nothing wrong :)

I bet you'd be screaming blue murder if the same thing happened to Massa. There's no interest in reality for you, you just hate Alonso blindly.

[simonlang]

I bet you'd be screaming blue murder if the same thing happened to Massa. There's no interest in reality for you, you just hate Alonso blindly.

well not interested in getting into an argument with u but JFYI:

- massa was in kinda similar situation in 2008, won the final race.

- hamilton gained the deciding place in the last corner from timo glock who happend to have placed a bet for the championship outcome just before the start of the race.

- felipe handled the defeat in a way never seen before or after. right after the race he went to the toyota pits and warned them not to leave the track with toyota team-wear on as fans probably would be dangerous and angry. he gave them ferrari dresses.

thats why everyone says felipe was worldchampion of the hearts in 2008, something alonso will never achieve with his stupid and arrogant behavior. he shown the middle-finger to petrov in 2010 and in 2012 he claims vettel won outside the rules. to quote his famous pitradio outrage: "this is ridiculous". remind you: in 2 out of 3 last races vettel had to start from behind. couldnt imagine a bigger challenge for a wdc contender.

[JoeC]

couldnt imagine a bigger challenge for a wdc contender.

I can: driving the 2012 Ferrari.

It's been a helluva year - memorable moments for both Lewis and Jenson, Kimi being back to his old hilarious self, and for Ferrari to finish 2nd in the Constructors is a massive testament to Alonso and Massa, they had an absolute dog of a car in terms of speed. On top of that, the midfield's been topsy-turvy all year with Sauber, Williams, Force India and even Mercedes getting caught up in very entertaining crashes battles all the way down the field.

Roll on 2013, things are looking very interesting already :)

[simonlang]

I can: driving the 2012 Ferrari.

:rofl: thought that topic was over? vettel and hamilton (probably button too) would KILL for such a 100% reliable car. :woot:

[Noir Angel]

well not interested in getting into an argument with u but JFYI:

- massa was in kinda similar situation in 2008, won the final race.

- hamilton gained the deciding place in the last corner from timo glock who happend to have placed a bet for the championship outcome just before the start of the race.

- felipe handled the defeat in a way never seen before or after. right after the race he went to the toyota pits and warned them not to leave the track with toyota team-wear on as fans probably would be dangerous and angry. he gave them ferrari dresses.

thats why everyone says felipe was worldchampion of the hearts in 2008, something alonso will never achieve with his stupid and arrogant behavior. he shown the middle-finger to petrov in 2010 and in 2012 he claims vettel won outside the rules. to quote his famous pitradio outrage: "this is ridiculous". remind you: in 2 out of 3 last races vettel had to start from behind. couldnt imagine a bigger challenge for a wdc contender.

Massa also ranted about how the destiny of the 2008 title was changed and how he deserved it more than Hamilton after "Crashgate" hit the news. Newsflash: Formula 1 drivers ALWAYS look out for their own interests. Alonso is not special in that regard. The simple fact that you're accusing Glock of cheating when there's no evidence of it at all tells me all I need to know about you.

[simonlang]

Massa also ranted about how the destiny of the 2008 title was changed and how he deserved it more than Hamilton after "Crashgate" hit the news. Newsflash: Formula 1 drivers ALWAYS look out for their own interests. Alonso is not special in that regard. The simple fact that you're accusing Glock of cheating when there's no evidence of it at all tells me all I need to know about you.

well everyone was shocked about crashgate and masssa was easily leading that race when team alonso decided to manipulate the outcome.

reminder: f1 has never seen SUCH a manipulation. risking a drivers life for 10 pts. says everything. and the fact that renaults technical director and teamboss both got a LIFE-TIME BAN also might mean something.

and you are complaining about massa being unhappy that crashgate influenced the outcome of the wdc? get a grip!!!

[Noir Angel]

Coming from a guy that's basically raging because Alonso is royally handing Massa his arse? priceless. Alonso didn't make Ferrari screw their pit stop up, that was entirely their own fault. The fact that they screwed up 2 stops in Valencia a couple of races before kinda evidences that. Basically what you're saying is that it's OK for Massa to whinge about other people's actions hurting him but when Alonso does it he's just a cheat. Sure that it's me that needs to get a grip? ;)

[simonlang]

Massa won in valencia. No screw up there. Unsafe release was and still is a minor incident only.

to Singapore: hadn't there been a SC massa wouldn't have pitted. It's that easy.

[Noir Angel]

Unsafe release is supposed to be a drive through penalty and Massa got off with a warning. If it hadn't been for the FIA constantly trying to hamper Lewis with idiotic penalties he would have had the championship sewn up way before the final race in brazil so to me it's all gravy. Lewis was the better driver that year and he won quite deservedly. In my mind the true talent of a driver shows in wet conditions, and Lewis drove rings around Massa in every wet race that year.

[JoeC]

Really quite amusing how you keep banging on about the Ferrari's reliability, let's have a quick look at some numbers shall we?

Ferrari had a total of 3 slip-ups, but none were reliability on the car - typically, these were accidents (eg. Alonso nearly being decapitated)

Red Bull had 3 electrical failures across both cars, and 2 slip-ups unrelated to reliability

Critically though, the Red Bulls actually completed more laps - 96.2% compared to 95.3% - than the Ferraris. Also note that both of the 2 above numbers are for the team, not for an individual driver

If anyone can complain of reliability, it's McLaren, with a total of 4 failures and 6 slip-ups

Alonso has 3 victories but only 2 pole positions, a hit rate of 1.5, while Vettel is 5 for 6 putting him at an 85% conversion rate

- with qually being more about single-lap pace, and the race allowing a driver to compensate for the car, Alonso gets the nod on this stat

- supporting this, Alonso had 0 fastest laps, Vettel had 6

Alonso stood on the podium 16 times out of a possible 20, beating Vettel by 1

Comparing the teams second drivers (Webber and Massa), the Red Bull clearly comes out on top as a better car, with 2 wins, 2 poles and a hot lap playing zero of each for Massa

Vettel averaged out qualifying 4.3rd on the grid and finishing 4.4th in the race - a small net loss. Alonso on the other hand averaged out at qualifying 6.6th but boosting up to 3.3rd by Sunday evening

No comments really needed on this one :)

Vettel has been investigated 9 times for breaking various rules, with 8 of those resulting in a penalty.

For comparison, Schumacher was investigated 11 times and penalised on 8 occasions (same as Vettel), and the only other person who's even remotely close to that figure is Disaster Maldonado, with 11 investigations resulting in 10 penalties

Alonso drove to the letter of the law for the entire season, not being so much as investigated

------------------------------

Here ends today's lesson. Is Alonso still a whiny little Spaniard, and Vettel a walking saint? :)

[Noir Angel]

Something tells me that Vettel wouldn't have achieved what Alonso did in this year's ferrari. Let's face it, it was an awful car. Just taking 3 wins in that car was a massive achievement on it's own.

[simonlang]

Ferrari had a total of 3 slip-ups, but none were reliability on the car - typically, these were accidents (eg. Alonso nearly being decapitated)

see. thats what im saying. i dont whine arround about ricciardo brake-testing vettel as too costly or about karthikeyan crashing vettel in malaysia. race accidents happen.

its the technical problems which are costly. and vettel had about 2 race ending ones in monza and valencia, plus the defective fuel pump in abu dhabi qualifying.

hamilton probably had as much or even more problems, button had at least 2 times problems with his gearbox.

alonso had a perfect, 100% reliable car. for his brain farts against raikkonen in suzuka is only he himself to blame - if you lead the championship by a double digit margin you should not drive that risky. knowing the ferrari topspeed is superior to everyone especially lotus, he would have got raikkonen later on anyway.