47 posts in this topic

Posted

Sony's could possibly could do Backwards Compatibility by having the user put in the game disk for the PS3 and stream the game using Gaikai.
The assumes that the user would have enough Internet bandwidth to deliver the service.

However, what about longer term beyond the PS4. Could Sony use Gaikai to deliver games without a PS4 or PS5 and deliver those games to different devices such as tablets.
All you would need to buy is the game-pad controller and the service would work on many platforms at once.

What do you guys think about this?

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Posted

[quote name='Yogurtmaster' timestamp='1353925975' post='595349722']
Sony's could possibly could do Backwards Compatibility by having the user put in the game disk for the PS3 and stream the game using Gaikai.
[b]The assumes that the user would have enough Internet bandwidth to deliver the service.[/b]

However, what about longer term beyond the PS4. Could Sony use Gaikai to deliver games without a PS4 or PS5 and deliver those games to different devices such as tablets.
All you would need to buy is the game-pad controller and the service would work on many platforms at once.

[b]What do you guys think about this?[/b]
[/quote]

You pretty much answered your own question.

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Posted

as if people will stream 15gb games! Xbox and Playstation will need to have full backwards compatability otherwise many will refuse to upgrade, they spent a fortune on their ps3/360 library.

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Posted

I think this topic has been rehashed to death for a while now.... the answers are obvious by now....
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Posted

[quote name='Yogurtmaster' timestamp='1353925975' post='595349722']
Sony's could possibly could do Backwards Compatibility by having the user put in the game disk for the PS3 and stream the game using Gaikai.
The assumes that the user would have enough Internet bandwidth to deliver the service.
[/quote]

Unless Sony have managed to emulate the Cell then there is little chance of Gaikai streaming PS3 games any time soon, they would essentially need the whole hardware of a PS3 per user wanting to stream a game, which just isn't economical for them to do, especially in Sony's current state.

It is more likely that we would get streaming for PS1/2 games than PS3 games that can be emulated and virtualised on typical hardware.

[quote name='Yogurtmaster' timestamp='1353925975' post='595349722']
However, what about longer term beyond the PS4. Could Sony use Gaikai to deliver games without a PS4 or PS5 and deliver those games to different devices such as tablets.
All you would need to buy is the game-pad controller and the service would work on many platforms at once.
[/quote]

Sure, Gaikai was already able to deliver games without the need for a dedicated gaming console through TV's, as I previously mentioned I could see them streaming older games across multiple platforms.

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Posted

[quote name='torrentthief' timestamp='1353926614' post='595349734']
as if people will stream 15gb games! Xbox and Playstation will need to have full backwards compatability otherwise many will refuse to upgrade, they spent a fortune on their ps3/360 library.
[/quote]

They stream video of just the part you are playing not the entire game at once. The stream would have to be HD so that would take up bandwidth.

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Posted

[quote name='Corris' timestamp='1353929440' post='595349784']
Unless Sony have managed to emulate the Cell then there is little chance of Gaikai streaming PS3 games any time soon, they would essentially need the whole hardware of a PS3 per user wanting to stream a game, which just isn't economical for them to do, especially in Sony's current state.

It is more likely that we would get streaming for PS1/2 games than PS3 games that can be emulated and virtualised on typical hardware.
[/quote]

If they have a server built with cell, I don't see why it would not be possible to stream PS3 games to the console. The PS1/2 games can be emulated as you said.

[quote]
Sure, Gaikai was already able to deliver games without the need for a dedicated gaming console through TV's, as I previously mentioned I could see them streaming older games across multiple platforms.
[/quote]

That was my point. :)

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Posted

[quote name='torrentthief' timestamp='1353926614' post='595349734']
as if people will stream 15gb games! Xbox and Playstation will need to have full backwards compatability otherwise many will refuse to upgrade, they spent a fortune on their ps3/360 library.
[/quote]

You don't stream a whole game, the cloud crunches the whole game and streams an ultra compressed, custom low-loss video stream to your TV. Very different from downloading a game and letting your system crunch it for you. It's actually very feasible to do on a 5MB connection (yes, I am aware not everyone in the US has this).

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Posted

[quote name='Yogurtmaster' timestamp='1353925975' post='595349722']What do you guys think about this?[/quote]
I don't think it will work for the same reason that OnLive never really took off. You need a good connection, and even then you're still not seeing the game in the same way that a player who bought the disc would see the game.

Also, I haven't heard anything so far about there possibly being any issue about backwards compatibility, what brought up this idea?

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Posted

Why would you stream for backwards compatibility if it requires you have the disc in the first place? SERIOUSLY?

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Posted

[quote name='thechronic' timestamp='1353932815' post='595349848']Why would you stream for backwards compatibility if it requires you have the disc in the first place? SERIOUSLY?[/quote]
I think the point the OP is making is based on the assumption that - like the PS3 with PS2 games - the PS4 won't have backwards compatibility. As such, having the disc would do nothing if the hardware wasn't compatible. However, the OP is suggesting that we use the PS3 disc as a verification process, and then the game would stream from a server that did have the hardware capability to run it.

But again, this is a thought process that hinges on there being backwards compatibility issues with the PS4 and PS3 games. I haven't heard of anyone voicing these kinds of concerns yet.
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Posted

[quote name='Intrinsica' timestamp='1353931716' post='595349824']
I don't think it will work for the same reason that OnLive never really took off. You need a good connection, and even then you're still not seeing the game in the same way that a player who bought the disc would see the game.

Also, I haven't heard anything so far about there possibly being any issue about backwards compatibility, what brought up this idea?
[/quote]
Sony bought Gakai, its not inconceivable that they will allow backwards compatibility through streaming.

[quote]But again, this is a thought process that hinges on there being backwards compatibility issues with the PS4 and PS3 games. I haven't heard of anyone voicing these kinds of concerns yet.
[/quote]
The rumours are that the PS4 will have an x86 cpu so that means no backwards compatibility.

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Posted

[quote name='TheLegendOfMart' timestamp='1353933246' post='595349858']Sony bought Gakai, its not inconceivable that they will allow backwards compatibility through streaming.[/quote]
Fair enough, but you're still going to end up with a worse-looking game than if it ran natively on the device in your house.


[quote]The rumours are that the PS4 will have an x86 cpu so that means no backwards compatibility.[/quote]
Ah, I knew about that rumour, I just didn't put 2 and 2 together. :pinch: Thanks for clarifying. (Y)

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Posted

I agree with worse looking game but for some reason people come to expect backwards compatibility with consoles thesedays, apart from including a CELL cpu inside the PS4 which would bump the price up to ridiculous levels there is not a lot they can do to add backwards compatibility.

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Posted

[quote name='Intrinsica' timestamp='1353931716' post='595349824']
I don't think it will work for the same reason that OnLive never really took off. You need a good connection, and even then you're still not seeing the game in the same way that a player who bought the disc would see the game.

Also, I haven't heard anything so far about there possibly being any issue about backwards compatibility, what brought up this idea?
[/quote]

BC on is PS4 being gone rumor due to the rumor of Sony switching over to the Arm cpu architecture.

Also, @OP as long as the united states has the 24th worst internet (speed, price, and accessibility) in the world (not joking) streaming to completely replace physical media is a ways off.

Sony had a patent about a playstation design where you could plug in a hardware module to add BC, I wish they would do that if PS4 will not have BC.
That way people that want it would have to purchase it and give the best hardware BC possible.

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Posted

No, the current rumour is that its going to have a processor based on the AMD A10 APU, which is a quad core chip with AMD 7xxx series GPU.

ARM doesnt have anywhere near enough power to power a next generation console.

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Posted

[quote name='torrentthief' timestamp='1353926614' post='595349734']
as if people will stream 15gb games! Xbox and Playstation will need to have full backwards compatability otherwise many will refuse to upgrade, they spent a fortune on their ps3/360 library.
[/quote]

Never understood this nonsense. Are people aware its possible to have multiple consoles connected to a display? Are 360 and PS3s going to simultaneously stop working the moment their successors are released? I'd rather the cost of a console is kept lower at the expense of backwards compatibility.

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Posted

[quote name='Lord Method Man' timestamp='1353939370' post='595349966']
Never understood this nonsense. Are people aware its possible to have multiple consoles connected to a display? Are 360 and PS3s going to simultaneously stop working the moment their successors are released? I'd rather the cost of a console is kept lower at the expense of backwards compatibility.
[/quote]

With the PS3, it was more anger at the removal of PS2 BC (to push ps3 sales, not actually reduce manufacturing costs) when Sony created a superior PS2 gaming experience on the ps3 then actually playing on the ps2 system.
If it never had BC in the first place, people would not be as upset.

Lack of BC can delays people's purchases of the console until after the games they want is out. Also as console get older, it hard to find some parts.
I'm still looking for an affordable Dreamcast component cable.

If PS4 / Next Xbox doesn't have BC, it won't be until after there several games that highly interest me before considering purchasing.
I'm jumping on the Wii U early since I can play all my Wii games on it.
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Posted

I think this will be the first console I do not buy for a good ~6 months after release - Wanting to break away from the constant early adopters beta testing role, and lack of games. I have a fairly big PS3 backlog, and next year will only add more (Last of Us, Beyond, and whatever else is to come).

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Posted

[quote name='Jason Stillion' timestamp='1353939807' post='595349978']
With the PS3, it was more anger at the removal of PS2 BC (to push ps3 sales, not actually reduce manufacturing costs)
[/quote]

Wait, what? Are you saying the removal of hardware emulation on the PS3 didn't reduce the manufacturing cost of the PS3? :s

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Posted

[quote name='Jason Stillion' timestamp='1353935833' post='595349906']
Also, @OP as long as the united states has the 24th worst internet (speed, price, and accessibility) in the world (not joking) streaming to completely replace physical media is a ways off.
[/quote]
yeah internet here in the states is not that great. I'm really hoping for good things from the Google Fiber optics project :)

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Posted

I can see the next Xbox having some backwards compatibility giving it's an ATI based custom graphics card used in the 360 already and supposedly the 720/next xbox will be a ATI chipset also, not to mention it been a IBM PowerPC based cpu, not a extremely expensive custom gecko cell cpu like the PS3.

Sony will be out to make a much cheaper system this time, so no custom chips n biting the bullet n going ati also which means it will be a completely new Architect[size="3"]ure and backwards compatabilities will be unlikely.[/size]

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Posted

[quote name='Intrinsica' timestamp='1353931716' post='595349824']
I don't think it will work for the same reason that OnLive never really took off. You need a good connection, and even then you're still not seeing the game in the same way that a player who bought the disc would see the game.

Also, I haven't heard anything so far about there possibly being any issue about backwards compatibility, what brought up this idea?
[/quote]

Current rumors for the PS4 say that there will be no backwards compatibility for the PS3. However older games from the PSX/PS2 would be available on the PS4.

My thoughts say that put in a PS3 disk in the PS4 and it could read the disc code that you really own the PS3 game and it would automatically stream the menu and game to you (dynamically based on available bandwidth on your end).
This way they could save money by not putting the cell processor inside of the PS4, but still allow people to play the games they own.

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Posted

[quote name='Yogurtmaster' timestamp='1353986370' post='595351492']
My thoughts say that put in a PS3 disk in the PS4 and it could read the disc code that you really own the PS3 game and it would automatically stream the menu and game to you (dynamically based on available bandwidth on your end).
This way they could save money by not putting the cell processor inside of the PS4, but still allow people to play the games they own.
[/quote]
But as others have said, why not just put the disk in your PS3 instead? Where does it say that you have to get rid of your PS3 in order to buy a PS4? Not saying that your idea doesn't have merit - it does - just don't see why you would [i]want[/i] backwards compatibilty tbh, when you've already got real actual hardware that can play your games without any of the issues concerning additional cost of hardware, bandwidth or quality of experience.

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Posted

[quote name='Jason Stillion' timestamp='1353939807' post='595349978']
With the PS3, it was more anger at the removal of PS2 BC (to push ps3 sales, not actually reduce manufacturing costs) when Sony created a superior PS2 gaming experience on the ps3 then actually playing on the ps2 system.
If it never had BC in the first place, people would not be as upset.

Lack of BC can delays people's purchases of the console until after the games they want is out. Also as console get older, it hard to find some parts.
I'm still looking for an affordable Dreamcast component cable.

If PS4 / Next Xbox doesn't have BC, it won't be until after there several games that highly interest me before considering purchasing.
I'm jumping on the Wii U early since I can play all my Wii games on it.
[/quote]

This. Without BC on the next gen systems, I wont be diving into them any time soon after their release.
Games this generation are still stelar, and the graphics are great. And just because the new consoles will have better graphics, it wont be enough to push me to them.
I hope that with next gen consoles, we get developers who are able to put more into the worlds, animations, and behavior of items/npc's in the games.

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