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Orbis Unmasked: What to expect from next-gen


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#121 theyarecomingforyou

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 21:03

No it's not, that's extremely subjective. YOU think you get a better experience that way, that doesn't mean everyone does.


Same controller. Same display. Better graphics. Better framerate. Better loading times.

I'm talking about the gaming experience itself - that is, from the moment you launch the game. I simply don't see where consoles are subjectively or objectively better.


#122 HawkMan

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 21:13

Also the only thing you can truly upgrade on a PC today is the graphics card, it's also the part that has any real merit in most cases, except for certain storage medium upgrades, in both cases you're upgrading at the costs of a new console, which is the worth of 2-3 full price games. but then again over here, the big chains usually sell the big triple A games at 40-50% off normal price in the firs few weeks, to get people into the stores (the chains usually rotate which offers it on which games)

For upgrading other parts of the computer, you're looking at a chain reaction of costs, need a new CPU, well then you have to have a new motherboard, you probably need new memory to make use of it, and depending on your graphics card, upgrading the CPU may have no effect. and when you've upgraded all these, you probably need a new PSU as well.

Same controller. Same display. Better graphics. Better framerate. Better loading times.

I'm talking about the gaming experience itself - that is, from the moment you launch the game. I simply don't see where consoles are subjectively or objectively better.


Still missing a whole lot of variables there.

Since yo're talkign about the gaming experience. how about the experience that you can sit back, click on the controller and the gaming machine starts up. instantly putting you where you can launch you game. It automatically gives you the best visuals you can get without need for tweaking and messing about. you get proper surround sound right away, no messing around, no configuration and messing about. Want to play music while you play, well that's also available, right there on your controller, no need to grab a keyboard to alt tab. Friend lists and multiplayer, also on the controller.


Also same display doesn't always apply, unless you are willing to have a huge noisy gaming rig in your living room, or you have an expensive media center box, and/or probably live alone with no GF.

Personally I play PC games on my PC, either laptop ion the living room or my gaming rig in our computer room. and I play my console games in my 55 inch in my living room, I've tried at times to play through the HTPC, but I get bored with it quickly and find the 360 offers a better experience, even thought he HTPC may give better graphics and whatever, Last time I just played some Trackmania simply to test out the 3D in Trackmania on the TV.

#123 theyarecomingforyou

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 21:37

Since yo're talkign about the gaming experience. how about the experience that you can sit back, click on the controller and the gaming machine starts up.


Computer standby.

instantly putting you where you can launch you game.


Steam Big Picture mode.

It automatically gives you the best visuals you can get without need for tweaking and messing about.


nVidia's GeForce Experience.

Want to play music while you play, well that's also available, right there on your controller, no need to grab a keyboard to alt tab.


Most people wouldn't want to play music over a game but that option is available on PC with a wireless keyboard and mouse.

Friend lists and multiplayer, also on the controller.


Steam Big Picture.

Also same display doesn't always apply, unless you are willing to have a huge noisy gaming rig in your living room, or you have an expensive media center box, and/or probably live alone with no GF.


Computers can be as quiet as you like. At the extreme end, passive coolers and watercooling systems allow for less noise than consoles; with a regular budget you can create a system that makes very little noise, with "silent" fans and sound dampening. As for the last part, way to make baseless insinuations - my last girlfriend really enjoyed gaming with me on PC, using wireless X360 controllers and playing games through my 42" HDTV from my bed.

And you downplay how substantial the visual difference is. Even PC gaming on low settings isn't as bad as console performance. If people want to game at 720p or below at 30fps then that's fine but that's not acceptable to people who are used to what PC gaming can deliver. It's like recommending cassette tapes and earbuds to someone used to 24-bit audio with high-quality speakers - sure you can listen to music but you're not getting the best experience. It may be more convenient (in some respects) and cheaper but it's certainly not acceptable to those who have experienced better.

#124 HawkMan

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 22:06

Computer standby.



Steam Big Picture mode.



nVidia's GeForce Experience.



Most people wouldn't want to play music over a game but that option is available on PC with a wireless keyboard and mouse.



Steam Big Picture.



Computers can be as quiet as you like. At the extreme end, passive coolers and watercooling systems allow for less noise than consoles; with a regular budget you can create a system that makes very little noise, with "silent" fans and sound dampening. As for the last part, way to make baseless insinuations - my last girlfriend really enjoyed gaming with me on PC, using wireless X360 controllers and playing games through my 42" HDTV from my bed.

And you downplay how substantial the visual difference is. Even PC gaming on low settings isn't as bad as console performance. If people want to game at 720p or below at 30fps then that's fine but that's not acceptable to people who are used to what PC gaming can deliver. It's like recommending cassette tapes and earbuds to someone used to 24-bit audio with high-quality speakers - sure you can listen to music but you're not getting the best experience. It may be more convenient (in some respects) and cheaper but it's certainly not acceptable to those who have experienced better.


Standby is not what I was talkign about, but anyway

Steam big picture mode, sure.. except you still need to start steam and all that.

yeah, GeForce experience, what about the 99.9% of games that are not supported by it, and the ~50% gamers who use AMD ?

Funny, Xbox has shown that people DO want to play their OWN music over a game instead of listening to a crappy soundtrack, so did the PS3 with all the complaining about how it didn't support this. Since the majority of games I play on my computer will be MMO's, I can tell I'll not be listening to their monotonous repetitive music for years on end, or even months or weeks. generally I have a movie or something going on while playing these though, or an audio book.

And what about the games that are not on steam big picture, oh and... wait a minute.. last I checked, getting the steam overlaye require keyboard shortcuts, NOT the xbox 360 controller.

sure computer can be as expensive... sorry quiet as you like. you can buy a nice looking HTPC case that you can actually put next to the TV and not look terrible, this one alone costs as much as a console, then you can buy another console worth of liquid coling for it(that's the cheaper and easier fully encapsulated ones... oops, need to cover the GPU to, then you pretty much need to build a more expensive custom set...

And seriously, there are MILLIONS of people used to PC gaming, who still game on PC. who still finds console gaming just as enjoyable and even better in many cases to that of PC gaming.

and you're highly over exaggerating the visual difference.

#125 theyarecomingforyou

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 22:33

Steam big picture mode, sure.. except you still need to start steam and all that.


Steam starts with Windows and you can configure Big Picture mode to launch by default, turning your system into a gaming hub. Plus you have numerous additional features, like in-game screenshot functionality and game guides.

yeah, GeForce experience, what about the 99.9% of games that are not supported by it, and the ~50% gamers who use AMD ?


The vast majority of games auto-detect the appropriate resolution and graphical settings anyway. And at least with PC games if you get any slowdown you can simply upgrade your computer; if you get slowdown on console games—and that does happen—then there's nothing you can do about it.

Funny, Xbox has shown that people DO want to play their OWN music over a game instead of listening to a crappy soundtrack, so did the PS3 with all the complaining about how it didn't support this.


As I said, you can achieve the same thing on PC. But it's not directly related to the gaming experience and I've seen nothing to suggest it is used by anything more than a tiny minority of players.

And what about the games that are not on steam big picture, oh and... wait a minute.. last I checked, getting the steam overlaye require keyboard shortcuts, NOT the xbox 360 controller.


Steam Big Picture supports all games. Not all can be installed through it—support is still being added—but having to install games with mouse and keyboard is no more of an inconvenience than having to insert a game disc into the console.

and you're highly over exaggerating the visual difference.


:| Take a game like Black Ops 2 - it runs at 880x720 on X360 (lower on PS3), which amounts to 0.6m pixels; on the PC it can run at 2560x1600, which is 4.1m pixels. That means the X360 version is 15% the resolution of the PC version. Even the games that run at 720p do so at 30fps (half the framerate, possibly a quarter depending on the PC display) and their resolution is only 22% that of the PC. That's without factoring in the inferior performance, lower quality visuals, etc. The PC has—depending on the game—higher resolution textures, hardware tessellation, hardware accelerated physics, 3D-support, higher polygon counts, better anti-aliasing and more.

Reducing the resolution by 85%, halving the framerate and reducing visual fidelity is substantial - there really is no other way to put it. Especially when this discussion is about the next-gen consoles, which are going to be a huge improvement but won't even come close to PC level fidelity. If you're still not willing to accept that the PC has a substantial advantage then there really is nothing more I can say.

#126 HawkMan

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 23:13

So on one end you say, "PC gamign is just as good because you can use a gamepad" while on the other hand" having to use the keyboard to do all the advanced functions is of no big deal".

sorry but when I'm in the sofa or good chair playing a game, what I do NOT want to do, is pull out the keyboard to load up the Steam overlay, or to alt tab for music management, Even my tiny logitech keyboard with a pad I use on my media center, I get annoyed when I have to pull out the keyboard to do something instead of just using my remote. which is every time I switch to it right now due to a bug with MediaPortal that makes makes me have to alt+enter twice to get proper full screen again.

and I mean what about the games not on steam at all. dunno why I wrote big picture in there. Not all games are on steam.

So BO has less pixels on the console.. still looks great, still plays great, for those who like CoD... and millions prefer it on the console.

Seriously, when are you going to understand that your opinion is a SUBJECTIVE opinion, and not all people are going to agree with it. some people enjoy and like playing on other more convenient and more accessible devices.

Also while they have that many more pixels, you can't count resolution that way, the perceptible difference between resolution are at least half of the way you calculate it. While 1000x1000 is 4x the amount of pixels of 500x500, the perceptible difference makes it more like twice.

Steam starts with Windows and you can configure Big Picture mode to launch by default, turning your system into a gaming hub. Plus you have numerous additional features, like in-game screenshot functionality and game guides.

Doesn't solve the issue I actually brought up though, still needs keyboard to alt tab to other apps, like video and music, still needs keyboard fo actually interact with steam while in the game, meaning you need both the keyboard and the gamepad...