Editorial

Can Nokia reverse Windows Phone's fortunes

There is no doubting that Microsoft needs Nokia’s new Windows Phone 7 based mobile phones to be a hit with both the public and the media when they get in London on Wednesday. In saying that, there is very little doubt that Nokia needs the launch to be a major turn around for themselves too, especially after the huge decline in sales that the company has seen over the last few years.

The question is, how do both companies turn things around? Nokia needs to get their phones selling again while Microsoft desperately need consumers to buy into their new OS.

At the moment Nokia isn’t seen a major sales force in America, they need to become one if there is any chance of Windows Phone 7 becoming anything more than a poor selling but underrated OS while placing another nail in Nokia’s coffin. To boost their sales, Nokia really needs to push themselves with carriers in America, both during their announcements this week and during the months after. The worry at the moment is that Nokia has stated that they will only sell devices in “select markets” at first. Which rumors in the industry are suggesting would exclude the US at launch.

Some of Nokia’s new phones need to be cheap too; at the moment there are very few low-priced Windows Phone handsets, a section of the market that Android thrives on. Nokia devices have been great sellers in the past thanks to their low cost range and this could be a great way to drive Windows Phone 7 to a large collection of consumers. I remember specifically choosing a Nokia phone when I was younger simply because it looked decent and was cheap for a pay as you go device and this is where Microsoft are missing out at the moment.

Most handsets released since Windows Phone 7 was first announced have been far too similar to each other to stand out, something that Nokia could well change if their excellent Nokia N9 design is anything to go by. It may seem like a small thing, but better designs will help differentiate Nokia from others and boost sales.

Apart from some of the major Microsoft news sites and Microsoft friendly press there hasn’t been a great deal of hype for the Nokia press conference, most likely because the main details and specs of the handsets seem to have been potentially leaked to many people for months, something that HTC and Apple manage to keep from the public eye thus building interest.

Windows Phone 7 is a respectable OS; there is no doubt about it. Yes I personally find it hard to get on with and feel that apps need to be cheaper to compete with Android and iOS, but that doesn’t blind me to the fact that it is well designed and has a unique feel to it. The more competition there is in this market, the better it will be for everyone and Nokia could be the company to bring that.

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There seems to be a lot of good and bad commenting but the bottom line for Nokia and Windows is practically this. If Nokia cant get the amount of devices to the market fast then there is no point of having partnership with them at all, there already just another OEM and not a fully company there relying on something that might not workout in the end. But. The more manufactures and the more devices the better for Microsoft. PERIOD.


LOVE TO BE BACK AT NEOWIN.

OEM's simply can't differentiate their phones with WP7. That's the biggest problem. At least with Android, they can create a unique experience.

I fear Nokia will just fade into the crowd. Meego or Android would have been a far better choice for Nokia. The Meego N9 is getting rave reviews because of the great OS. Yet Nokia's dumping it for Windows WTF? Is Nokia trying to self-destruct? If so it's doing a great job lol.

Joey S said,

Is Nokia trying to self-destruct? If so it's doing a great job lol.

At the moment Nokia is run by a MS "Fifth column"...... Time will tell if the gamble will work.....

MS's problem is advertising. No one knows about the OS! It's pretty simple!!!

Great OS but no visibility. iPhone is everything ppl know about around here (canada). SOME ppl know about android and then "wtf is windows phone?"

They want to turn things around?

Release the god dam hardware!!!!!!

WP7 is great, its just taking far to long to get the devices out and around the globe...

brent3000 said,

WP7 is great, its just taking far to long to get the devices out and around the globe...

That's because no one's buying them. Retailers are reluctant to push devices which aren't selling/popular.

Funny how many of us USA consumers live in a fishbowl. Europe is Nokia's strength not the US. They enjoy a great fanbase there as well as the slow but steady adoption of windows phone. It would be wise for them to release it there first and of we can get a part of that release as well the all the better. Nokia is still a HUGH player despite their recent losses and drop. WP7 with Ovi maps and their apps store know how will be a big hit here and abroad. I just ordered my N9 64GB BLK from a friend in Hong Kong. I can't wait. It will be all that I need from that phone. I can always break even or get close to what I paid for it. The micro sim slot helps me switch between my IPhone 4s easier too.

The N9 is a 3.9" screen. But I keep on hearing the "searay" is a 3.7". I hope it's the exact same phone screen wise as the N9. I cant wait to see Nokia's twist they will put on the WP7 OS. I hope OVI maps will be part of the standard package in the US. I know it can compete against Bing Maps. 2 more days and we will what is in store for the holiday season from Nokia

mrmomoman said,
Europe.. They enjoy a great fanbase there

True, but that was when they were selling Symbian and before Android came out. Meego looks like it could be the third major OS, but Nokia's decided to commit suicide instead by going with an unpopular OS like Windows Phone.

What with all the drama articles concerning Windows Phone?

The OS is extremely performant and has a great feel of high quality. There is tons of great built-in functionality since Mango and after 1year the marketplace has almost 40,000 applications which is impressive(and dont forget that at least 30-50% of apps on Windows Phone offers trial instead of two separate apps). Also a majority of popular Apps on other platform are also available on Windows Phone.

I was an Android users 1 year ago, and since i switched to Windows Phone the grass has never been greener!

Microsoft clearly showed that they here to stay, and Windows Phone only kept evolving more and more. Thats only good things to my eyes.

Enill said,
What with all the drama articles concerning Windows Phone?

The OS is extremely performant and has a great feel of high quality. There is tons of great built-in functionality since Mango and after 1year the marketplace has almost 40,000 applications which is impressive(and dont forget that at least 30-50% of apps on Windows Phone offers trial instead of two separate apps). Also a majority of popular Apps on other platform are also available on Windows Phone.

I was an Android users 1 year ago, and since i switched to Windows Phone the grass has never been greener!

Microsoft clearly showed that they here to stay, and Windows Phone only kept evolving more and more. Thats only good things to my eyes.

Actually it has just reached 35,000 but...... whatever..........

Why the rush? Why do there have to be big sales, now now NOW? I understand Nokia's on the ropes, but Microsoft can nurture their OS long term

Let's cut the hyperbole and setting these tremendous expectations for Nokia

burnblue said,
Why the rush? Why do there have to be big sales, now now NOW? I understand Nokia's on the ropes, but Microsoft can nurture their OS long term

Because Nokia's loosing market share daily. If the trend continues, they won't exist in 2 years. Maybe even sooner with Elop leading them into the abyss.

burnblue said,

Let's cut the hyperbole and setting these tremendous expectations for Nokia

Nokia's put all their proverbial eggs in one basket. If WP7 doesn't sell well in europe, Nokia is finished.

What Nokia should have done is increase its chances by making Android, Meego, and WP7 phones. But that will never happen with an ex Microsoft executive leading the company.

Way to build up the tension and blow your load on the wall Nokia. You want some U.S. excitement? Pull an IPHONE 4s on us in the opposite direction. Give us our GD phones, THIS year, in THIS country, on ALL carriers. It's time to ask too much and actually see someone deliver, what a concept.

jimmyfal said,
Way to build up the tension and blow your load on the wall Nokia. You want some U.S. excitement? Pull an IPHONE 4s on us in the opposite direction. Give us our GD phones, THIS year, in THIS country, on ALL carriers. It's time to ask too much and actually see someone deliver, what a concept.

There is a big difference between US and Europe: US market is "controlled" by carriers, The Europe one is not........

The question is, how do both companies turn things around? Nokia needs to get their phones selling again while Microsoft desperately need consumers to buy into their new OS.
Is very amusing seeing how Nokia is still outselling any other phone manufacturer worldwide.

The thing is WP7 has been out for a year and on it's own, without any help from marketing or anything like that has created a little nice of it's own and a usable 'base' for when they start the push, which can be expected to start in a day or so.

Personaly I am convinced it will be a totally different story a year from now. Apple has good reason to hold off on the iPhone5 and release basically an upgrade to the flawed iPhone4 as a stopgap and to catch up as far as they can to the rest of the smartphone market without spilling the beans on the nextgen.

I would never buy an iPhone, not because they are bad phones but the tie into my custom system idea behind it is just not appealing to me. I believe it is more hype and blind followers who will buy anything Apple releases then a proper phone and let's face it up until now the iPhone has been flawed in one way or another but had a clever marketing engine called Steve Jobs to cover it up.

And we should applaud Apple for doing what they have down with what they have had so far.

Now this year the real game starts and we'll see where they are by Xmas next year. Me, I am certain WP7 will be well and I mean WELL into two digit marketshare by then with a number of excellent phones for both techies and the masses. No amount of give away 3GS tricks will prevent that. I fact I would not be surprised if they manage to get >10% by this years end.

MS and Nokia are revving up and have their foor wel on the gas for the next few days.. It's abuzz done right.. A Nokia design exibition in a prominent location, posters all around london with all the Nokia Classic phones on them and a smart blueish nice loking big screened promise in the middle. We'll talk in a day or so. Meanwhile I have a call coming in on mine..

Nomatter what happens though, Nokia will be outselling anyone in numbers by the end of next year still.

Oh and the N9 looks WAY more sleek and cool when it's in your hands.. no images I have seen sofar do it justice.. honestly..

i bet $$ the nokia line will not launch here in the US just as i expected. this is why wp7 is not popular in the states, only overseas. there is virtually no demand or marketing for it here.

i literally know one person who owns wp7 and she is not what id call tech savy.

smooth3006 said,
i bet $$ the nokia line will not launch here in the US just as i expected. this is why wp7 is not popular in the states, only overseas. there is virtually no demand or marketing for it here.

i literally know one person who owns wp7 and she is not what id call tech savy.


she's one smart person who want something that works without any headache

smooth3006 said,
this is why wp7 is not popular in the states, only overseas.

From what I've read, it's sold poorly in europe too. Maybe it will be successful in China or something, who knows.

smooth3006 said,

there is virtually no demand or marketing for it here.

If it's anything like the UK, the marketing won't make a bit of difference. I've seen many adverts, yet it's not selling here regardless.

Joey S said,

From what I've read, it's sold poorly in europe too. Maybe it will be successful in China or something, who knows.

Get over yourself, UK ain't the only country in Europe. It sold very well outside of the UK and US.

If it's anything like the UK, the marketing won't make a bit of difference. I've seen many adverts, yet it's not selling here regardless.

seriously the N9 looks like crap.... is that the best they could make?? i was a big fan of Nokia few years ago and Samsung was never in my book but now Samsung makes very good products

still1 said,
seriously the N9 looks like crap.... is that the best they could make?? i was a big fan of Nokia few years ago and Samsung was never in my book but now Samsung makes very good products

Well, that is your opinion. According to Engadget, it it a device on its own level. Rivaling the iPhone in design.

still1 said,
seriously the N9 looks like crap.... is that the best they could make?? i was a big fan of Nokia few years ago and Samsung was never in my book but now Samsung makes very good products

huh.even fanboys of Apple and Android are liking the design

sviola said,

Well, that is your opinion. According to Engadget, it it a device on its own level. Rivaling the iPhone in design.


Yes, its my opinion and to me it looks like crap... i never said it as a fact...

guru said,

huh.even fanboys of Apple and Android are liking the design

So?? if they like it should I?? Its my personal opinion and i didn't feel like its a phone for me... I have not tried it but I am sure to try it out and who knows I might like it.

still1 said,
seriously the N9 looks like crap.... is that the best they could make?? i was a big fan of Nokia few years ago and Samsung was never in my book but now Samsung makes very good products

i guess you don't like beautiful designs

still1 said,
seriously the N9 looks like crap.... is that the best they could make?? i was a big fan of Nokia few years ago and Samsung was never in my book but now Samsung makes very good products

I'm not keen on the design either, at least not in the pictures.

still1 said,
seriously the N9 looks like crap.... is that the best they could make?? i was a big fan of Nokia few years ago and Samsung was never in my book but now Samsung makes very good products
well the only reason i agree is because its PINK! a black or grey model is necessary

sviola said,

Well, that is your opinion. According to Engadget, it it a device on its own level. Rivaling the iPhone in design.

That is exactly its limitation: it has a small screen as the iPhone. I would prefer a 4.3" one.

Nokia was able to rule the world without the US market with Symbian before the iphone. If they had kept Symbian relevant the US market would still be irrelevant to them. Their success is in no way dependent on being in the US market, though it would obviously be a plus. Also with only att showing any real interest in WP7 Nokia has no choice but to go with Europe first.

One thing that can help is advertising. No MS advertising the platform, because no one outside the tech world gives a flying **** about the platform. No, it has to be OEM and carrier advertising on specific pieces of hardware. This is what brought Android out into the mainstream (Verizon/Moto Droid commercials)

Supposedly MS has cut deals with all their major OEMs since Mango to advertise their Windows Phones more prominently, I hope this is true, and that we start seeing this ad push as the new wave of devices comes out

Sraf said,
One thing that can help is advertising. No MS advertising the platform, because no one outside the tech world gives a flying **** about the platform. No, it has to be OEM and carrier advertising on specific pieces of hardware. This is what brought Android out into the mainstream (Verizon/Moto Droid commercials)

Supposedly MS has cut deals with all their major OEMs since Mango to advertise their Windows Phones more prominently, I hope this is true, and that we start seeing this ad push as the new wave of devices comes out

QFT. Verizon, T-Mobile, Sprint, AT&T all advertise the crap out of Android. Apple advertises the crap out of iPhone. No advertisements for WP7 and people wonder why it isn't doing so well... hmmm...

MS has always held back when it comes to advertisements other than their XBox. They do a little bit of advertising when a new OS comes out but that is about it.

N800 (N9) + WP7 is the first legitimate challenger to iPhone. Android phones with the exception SGS2 seem wannabe compared to the design of N9 and the sophistication of WP7. That doesnt mean it'll sell. Microsoft doesnt have an ecosytem of Apple/Google (Apps,Books,Music,Movies,TV shows,Google, Google Maps....)

N800 seems to be the phone to buy if you wanted the best phone on the market.

guru said,
N800 (N9) + WP7 is the first legitimate challenger to iPhone. Android phones with the exception SGS2 seem wannabe compared to the design of N9 and the sophistication of WP7. That doesnt mean it'll sell. Microsoft doesnt have an ecosytem of Apple/Google (Apps,Books,Music,Movies,TV shows,Google, Google Maps....)

N800 seems to be the phone to buy if you wanted the best phone on the market.

Really?? No ecosystem?

Apps - Last I heard, there were around 30,000. They're reaching milestones faster than Android and iPhone.
Books - Ok, I'll give you that one. They recently discontinued their book service (maybe to release a new one? Not sure...).
Music - Zune is easily the best music player I've ever used. Its an iPod, Shazzam, and Pandora all rolled up into one. And the desktop app is 10x easier to use than iTunes.
Movies - Yeah, they have that. You can rent or buy movies right from the Marketplace. And outside of the mobile world XBox does movies
TV - Got that through XBox too with partnerships with Comcast, Verizon, Hulu, and much more.
Google - Bing
Maps - Bing maps. Yeah the nav sucks on the WP7, but that should change with Nokia. The infrastructure is there and they have some real inovation with the indoor maps and local scout.

Realistically they have some work to do to bring it all together, but that's the expectation of WP8. See you in Oct 2012.

shamburg said,

Really?? No ecosystem?

Apps - Last I heard, there were around 30,000. They're reaching milestones faster than Android and iPhone.
Books - Ok, I'll give you that one. They recently discontinued their book service (maybe to release a new one? Not sure...).
Music - Zune is easily the best music player I've ever used. Its an iPod, Shazzam, and Pandora all rolled up into one. And the desktop app is 10x easier to use than iTunes.
Movies - Yeah, they have that. You can rent or buy movies right from the Marketplace. And outside of the mobile world XBox does movies
TV - Got that through XBox too with partnerships with Comcast, Verizon, Hulu, and much more.
Google - Bing
Maps - Bing maps. Yeah the nav sucks on the WP7, but that should change with Nokia. The infrastructure is there and they have some real inovation with the indoor maps and local scout.

Realistically they have some work to do to bring it all together, but that's the expectation of WP8. See you in Oct 2012.

use the kindle app for books, microsoft doesn't need to own all the consumable media sources to be sucessful, kindle runs a better bookstore than MS ever had a shot at

efjay said,

Why exactly?

Because the reason Nokia was falling to stregnthen Symbian as competitive ecosystem and weren't doing wonders with MeeGo. In essence, they dropped the ball on software.

Had they gone Android, they would have put all their usual amazing work into the hardware just to release into a highly competitive market with the same laggy OS and fragmented platform as everyone else. Then they would have to continue doing OS optimizations to try to get the device to perform as smooth as possible and skin it to make it "unique".

With Windows Phone 7, Nokia puts their effort in what they do best, hardware. As well as, bring whatever software and services they want to bring and further develop those. Microsoft handles what they do best, software. Now Nokia doesn't have to worry about the experience being smooth and consistant because it is by design.

Edited by wixostrix, Oct 24 2011, 6:48pm :

sexypepperoni said,
There is no saving WP7. Nokia should have gone Android.

And become another faceless OEM, no thanks!!

At least with the access Nokia has to WP7 they can improve it substantially and that WILL filter down to other OEM devices.

But then again you just troll in every WP7 news story and spout the same bull****.

wixostrix said,

Because the reason Nokia was falling to stregnthen Symbian as competitive ecosystem and weren't doing wonders with MeeGo. In essence, they dropped the ball on software.

Had they gone Android, they would have put all their usual amazing work into the hardware just to release into a highly competitive market with the same laggy OS and fragmented platform as everyone else. Then they would have to continue doing OS optimizations to try to get the device to perform as smooth as possible and skin it to make it "unique".

With Windows Phone 7, Nokia puts their effort in what they do best, hardware. As well as, bring whatever software and services they want to bring and further develop those. Microsoft handles what they do best, software. Now Nokia doesn't have to worry about the experience being smooth and consistant because it is by design.

No need to convince me, own a WP7 already. My question was for the poster to expound on why Nokia should have gone android, but you have explained very well the disadvantages that decision would have brought.

sexypepperoni said,
There is no saving WP7. Nokia should have gone Android.

ya right they should go with the laggy os even with dual core processor
im a aaa nndd roi iii d and im laggy os

subcld said,

ya right they should go with the laggy os even with dual core processor
im a aaa nndd roi iii d and im laggy os

The amount of comments I see saying that android lags makes me feel really lucky. I might go back to the carphone warehouse and shake the saleswoman's hand for selling me a lag-free even with a dual core processor sgs2.

neo158 said,

And become another faceless OEM, no thanks!!

At least with the access Nokia has to WP7 they can improve it substantially and that WILL filter down to other OEM devices.

But then again you just troll in every WP7 news story and spout the same bull****.

How is anyone in the Android market a faceless OEM? HTC uses Android and they have a great UI with Sense also Samsung has TouchWiz which with BOTH have their quirks are very nice. While I dislike some SonyErickson phones the UI they designed for Android again was beautiful and not very hard to use either. I'm not going to bash WP7 I've used it I still prefer Android over it though.

I think Nokia did what they needed to do I'll admit I think they should of gone with BOTH however most people buy Nokia for the beautiful hardware they produce and I have every bit of respect for the designs that have been shown for WP7 for what they are doing. I still think they should of gone both ways to keep in the market a bit more. But saying OEM's are faceless with Android is very wrong each has a strong point each has a flaw as well but faceless they are not.

subcld said,

ya right they should go with the laggy os even with dual core processor
im a aaa nndd roi iii d and im laggy os

I would like to see this lag you are speaking about.....My SGS2 runs pretty much flawlessly and with zero lag. Sure there are "laggy" versions of Android phones but look at some of the specs on those phones or even the UI overlays on them which in most part is the cause for a lot of that issue. HTC's Sense while it is very nice DOES lag at times this is not an Android issue it's a Sense issue. Samsungs TouchWiz lags at times but then again this is not a Android issue it's a TouchWiz issue on LOW END Phones where they optimize for higher end versions and do not take the time to do otherwise.

Muhammad Farrukh said,

Because WP7 > Android. Period

Is today opposite day and I forgot to get the memo? It seems like you are trying to say Android is better than WP7 based on who you replied to, but what you said was WP7 is greater than Android.

Joey S said,

The public disagree with you

No they really don't, they just don't know about them or they get persuaded away from buying them. 9 out of 10 people I show my phone to are very impressed when they see what it can do and how it works. The majority of them want it after seeing it.

wixostrix said,

No they really don't, they just don't know about them or they get persuaded away from buying them. 9 out of 10 people I show my phone to are very impressed when they see what it can do and how it works. The majority of them want it after seeing it.

9 out of 10 people, huh? I wonder how many people you show your phone to. Maybe 10? And you can tell about the opinion of the majority of the public. Love your statistic work. You could win a noble prize for that.

morrizz said,

9 out of 10 people, huh? I wonder how many people you show your phone to. Maybe 10? And you can tell about the opinion of the majority of the public. Love your statistic work. You could win a noble prize for that.

First of all, I wasn't claiming to do any statistical work, I just made an estimate based on how people respond when I show them my phone. Rarely does anyone say they dislike it. I've showed a lot more people than 10. Because of my recommendation 7 of my friends and family now have Windows Phones and love them. I know several more people who owns one, and many more who want one as their next phone. So suck it!

The worry at the moment is that Nokia has stated that they will only sell devices in “select markets” at first. Which rumors in the industry are suggesting would exclude the US at launch.

They need to go big or go home IMHO. WP7 may be my next phone OS when I upgrade next year. I need to see some good hardware though, first.

If they do not launch in the US as the rumors suggest, could be a tough sell as by the time the hardware gets here it could be old news.

bdsams said,
If they do not launch in the US as the rumors suggest, could be a tough sell as by the time the hardware gets here it could be old news.

If a phone is "old news" in 2-3 months it's probably not a very good product.

bdsams said,
If they do not launch in the US as the rumors suggest, could be a tough sell as by the time the hardware gets here it could be old news.

Nokia is likely to be showing off their international (non-US) devices at Nokia world. They've said time after time that Nokia would release at least one device in 2011, looks like there will be more, and would begin shipping in volume early 2012.

We will be lucky to see US devices at Nokia World, but I'm not getting my hopes up. Nokia's brand is not nearly as irrelevant overseas as it is in the States. It is here where they need to do the most work and the reason they will be having a US focused ad campaign and product branding. I follow Windows Phone new very closely and in turn I see a lot of Nokia related news. There is absolutely no indication that we will be any US Nokia devices this year.