ssd SSD Purchase - Advice needed please

[Midnight Mick]

I'd like to make the jump to a SSD and after having read up on it a bit & reading some reviews I've come away more confused than before!

I currently have 3 questions:

1. Is it true that a sata 3 SSD is backward compatible with a sata 2 motherboard (obviously there will be a speed difference).
   
2. Reliability - Which drive offers the best. I originally looked into the OZC Agility 3 but read several times about them being a bit flakey (unsure if true hence the question, so am also looking at the intel 520 series but am open to alternatives.
   
3. Trim - is it enable by default on Windows 7 (clean install)?
   

Current system specs:

Operating system: Windows 7 Professional 64bit

Motherboard: MSI P35 Neo-F

CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600

Memory: 2 x 2gb (ddr2)

I look forward to your replies.

[devHead]

1. You should have no issues hooking a SATA 3 SSD to your SATA 2 connector, just like you said it won't be as fast as on a SATA 3 board.

2. I've found that Intel SSDs are very good for reliability. I've had mine for about a year now, and it's solid as a rock. My younger brother just bought an intel 256 GB drive and is very pleased with it.

3. Trim was enabled by default in my installation in Windows 7 and, of course, defragmenting was automatically turned off, along with SuperFetch. Such services are not needed on a SSD.

Enjoy! You'll be amazed at how fast your boot is and installation of Windows. I don't have a terribly fast machine, but installing Windows 7 64-bit from a Jumpdrive to my SSD took all of 10 minutes.

[playXray]

1) Completely true.

2) Not sure but the current gen drives are supposed to be much better than the old (pre SATA III) ones.

3) Yes, on a clean install. Not sure about upgrade (but that's only for wimps anyway).

[Xerax]

3) Yes, well It was for mine. And you'll be amazed at how fast everything boots. My Windows 8 boots from cold in under 3 seconds.

[Chicane-UK Veteran]

I run a Crucial C300 on a SATA2 motherboard and it's absolutely fine. Go for it.. you won't regret it. The speed improvement is astonishing and whenever you go back to mechanical disks, you think something is broken!! :)

[neoraptor]

1. Not much of a difference for everyday usage between sata3 and sata2

2. Most new ssds are reliable - just upgrade the firmware to the latest one. I have ocz vertex 2 and 3

3. When you connect the ssd win7 will make the appropriate changes - disable defrag, enable trim etc...

[ShiFteDReaLitY]

If there is a firmware upgrade, do it before you install windows on it etc. Most SSD's are reliable now, the OCZ Agility 3 is a good choice esp considering it's price. The reason most people have issues with the OCZ isthe Sandforce controller. I have a Corsair ForceGT and previously had a OCZ Agility 2 and have not had any issues with sandforce based drives. But if the "flakyness" people have reported bothers you get a non sandforced based SSD. Crucial, Samsung,some OCZ drives as well etc.

Also SATA 3 SSD are compatible with SATA 2 u will just be capped at SATA 2 speeds.

[Fourjays Veteran]

I've also been looking at upgrading to an SSD soon (my HDD feels like a major bottleneck on my Core i5 machine - loads of drive thrashing while the CPU sits there doing not very much) and have the same concerns regards reliability - there seem to be a lot of issues with Sandforce SSDs. How would you perform a firmware update on a new SSD pre-Windows?

Also, does anyone have any experience with the Seagate Momentus XT "hybrid" drives? Are they as close to an SSD as claimed or is an SSD the best bet?

[IceBreakerG]

1. Is it true that a sata 3 SSD is backward compatible with a sata 2 motherboard (obviously there will be a speed difference).

Yes this is true. The only difference is the speed decrease.

2. Reliability - Which drive offers the best. I originally looked into the OZC Agility 3 but read several times about them being a bit flakey (unsure if true hence the question, so am also looking at the intel 520 series but am open to alternatives.

I just put a 240GB OCZ Agility 3 in my MacBook Pro a few weeks ago. So far it's been very stable. No crashes or hiccups because of the drive. It's also very very fast (it's my first SSD, so I guess any of them would be really fast lol). I don't have any experience with other drives, but this one has been good for me. I'm also dual booting Windows 7 Ultimate in bootcamp as well, and both Windows 7 and OS X boot up in about 10secs or less.

3. Trim - is it enable by default on Windows 7 (clean install)?

Yes, Trim is enabled by default on Windows 7. For some reason, defrag wasn't on my machine (it was scheduled, but I'm not sure if it ever ran). Whenever you get your drive, I'd recommend using SSD Life to monitor the health of your drive. Hope this info helps.

[Jason S. Global Moderator]

I've also been looking at upgrading to an SSD soon (my HDD feels like a major bottleneck on my Core i5 machine - loads of drive thrashing while the CPU sits there doing not very much) and have the same concerns regards reliability - there seem to be a lot of issues with Sandforce SSDs. How would you perform a firmware update on a new SSD pre-Windows?

Also, does anyone have any experience with the Seagate Momentus XT "hybrid" drives? Are they as close to an SSD as claimed or is an SSD the best bet?

the concerns about reliability are generally nonsense. Intel had firmware reliability last year just like OCZ did. those issues are fixed. do not worry anymore. just buy what you like.

you can perform a firmware update by simply connecting the SSD to an unused SATA slot and boot w/ their DOS-based updater. I, however, tend to just install windows, then immediately flash w/i windows. it's easier and faster.

ive read a bit about the Momentus. They seem to be really good for caching frequently-used programs. i dont believe, however, that you'll get the same copy/read/write performance from day-to-day operations.

[ShiFteDReaLitY]

I've also been looking at upgrading to an SSD soon (my HDD feels like a major bottleneck on my Core i5 machine - loads of drive thrashing while the CPU sits there doing not very much) and have the same concerns regards reliability - there seem to be a lot of issues with Sandforce SSDs. How would you perform a firmware update on a new SSD pre-Windows?

Also, does anyone have any experience with the Seagate Momentus XT "hybrid" drives? Are they as close to an SSD as claimed or is an SSD the best bet?

You just plug in the SSD before you swap your old one and flash the firmware.

They aren't going to be as fast as a SSD they just help with booting really. As in the review after 3 boots, it starts the computer pretty quickly. Here is a review to help better:

http://www.hardwares...HDD-Review/1474

[Fourjays Veteran]

the concerns about reliability are generally nonsense. Intel had firmware reliability last year just like OCZ did. those issues are fixed. do not worry anymore. just buy what you like.

you can perform a firmware update by simply connecting the SSD to an unused SATA slot and boot w/ their DOS-based updater. I, however, tend to just install windows, then immediately flash w/i windows. it's easier and faster.

ive read a bit about the Momentus. They seem to be really good for caching frequently-used programs. i dont believe, however, that you'll get the same copy/read/write performance from day-to-day operations.

You just plug in the SSD before you swap your old one and flash the firmware.

They aren't going to be as fast as a SSD they just help with booting really. As in the review after 3 boots, it starts the computer pretty quickly. Here is a review to help better:

http://www.hardwares...HDD-Review/1474

Thanks, you've put my mind at ease about it. :thumbup:

[ShiFteDReaLitY]

Just a comparison for some people wondering standard HDD vs a Sata 3 SSD. Keep in mind 4k reads is important for a windows boot drive a lot of the files are small random files. Comparing a Seagate 2tb (2 platter) and a 90GB Corsair Force GT.

[patseguin Global Moderator]

I use Corsair SSD's in my new builds and find them to be the best. Trim is enabled by default provided that you are in AHCI mode in your BIOS and you load the proper drivers while installing Windows.

[ViperAFK]

I've also been looking at upgrading to an SSD soon (my HDD feels like a major bottleneck on my Core i5 machine - loads of drive thrashing while the CPU sits there doing not very much) and have the same concerns regards reliability - there seem to be a lot of issues with Sandforce SSDs. How would you perform a firmware update on a new SSD pre-Windows?

Also, does anyone have any experience with the Seagate Momentus XT "hybrid" drives? Are they as close to an SSD as claimed or is an SSD the best bet?

I haven't used one of those drives (and I don't know how close of a comparison this is), but I have a somewhat similar setup with intel smart response. Win7 is installed on my regular 320gb hdd, and I'm using my older 64 gb vertex 2 as a cache for it. In most cases it feels just as fast as when I previously had windows just installed on the vertex 2. All my programs still open super fast, and boot is a good 10-15 seconds. Windows is immediately responsive and loaded on login.

I like this solution because:

I get a larger drive for my os install, and if I ever need to I can just drop in a new ssd for the cache drive.

You don't need a very expensive SSD for it, 20-64 gigs.

[NoUserName]

Just a comparison for some people wondering standard HDD vs a Sata 3 SSD. Keep in mind 4k reads is important for a windows boot drive a lot of the files are small random files. Comparing a Seagate 2tb (2 platter) and a 90GB Corsair Force GT.

how exactly did you got this test and result because i installed the same application and can not get it to work.

[UseLess]

With regard to reliability, what I have read so far: With all the major "reliable" brands (OCZ, Intel, Crucial, Corsair), they are still susceptible to random failure. I would STRONGLY suggest mirroring anything you cant afford to lose to a mechanical drive.

I also seem to find people sometimes suffer from repeated failure. If an SSD dies twice for you on the same system either change to a different manufacturer, or swap to a mechanical drive.

Basically, dont pick up a cheap knockoff SSD - shell out what you can for a quality brand - sacrifice size before quality.

[BillyJack]

Basically, dont pick up a cheap knockoff SSD - shell out what you can for a quality brand - sacrifice size before quality.

I agree with this. Spend the money for a good SSD or it is pointless.

[Darrian]

I would recommend avoiding Corsair. Maybe it was just once in a while thing, but the drive I had was crap. Rather than releasing a firmware update to fix it they recalled the drive and no longer make it and provide no support for it. Of course this conveniently happened after it was too late to RMA it. Anyway, I have a Samsung now and so far it's been fantastic, so I'd highly recommend that. I don't have experience with any other brands since the price is prohibitive of getting a bunch of drives.

[stevember]

I would recommend avoiding Corsair. Maybe it was just once in a while thing, but the drive I had was crap. Rather than releasing a firmware update to fix it they recalled the drive and no longer make it and provide no support for it. Of course this conveniently happened after it was too late to RMA it. Anyway, I have a Samsung now and so far it's been fantastic, so I'd highly recommend that. I don't have experience with any other brands since the price is prohibitive of getting a bunch of drives.

You shouldn't judge a company when they admit a mistake and recall the product, obviously just updating the firmware was not an option otherwise they would have done that.

[TEX4S]

3) Yes, well It was for mine. And you'll be amazed at how fast everything boots. My Windows 8 boots from cold in under 3 seconds.

Video ?? - I would have to see your computer go from off to desktop in less than 3 seconds, otherwise Im calling BS

[MalwaresUcksbaDly]

Why pay for speed only to choke it with a known bottleneck?

[Kelxin]

Video ?? - I would have to see your computer go from off to desktop in less than 3 seconds, otherwise Im calling BS

Eh, mine does that in Windows 7, its really not that hard with the new Sata 3 SSD's that are pushing over 500 MB/s

Below is the Intel 520 120 GB Sata 3, fast as hell, 5 year warranty and not too expensive.

http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0383871

[+InsaneNutter MVC]

I purchased a 120GB Corsair Force 3 SSD just before Christmas, its honestly amazing compared to 2x 7200rpm drives in raid 0.

Read speed is quoted at: 550 MB/s and write speed at: 510 MB/s.

From power on to desktop Windows 7 boots and is usable in about 10-15 seconds, at least 5 seconds of that is on the POST screen. Photoshop CS5 loads up in 3-4 seconds, if that!

I would highly recommend it to anyone, most worth while upgrade i have ever done to a PC :)

[Ace]

the concerns about reliability are generally nonsense.

Intel's SSDs are a lot more reliable than anything OCZ makes...

http://www.behardwar...ns-rates-5.html

Personally, the only SSDs I would consider are these ones...

Intel 320 Series, Samsung 830, Crucial M4, Plextor M3 Pro, Intel 520 Series

Intel had firmware reliability last year just like OCZ did. Those issues are fixed.

The issues may be fixed, but look at how long OCZ took to fix them compared to Intel (and other companies like Crucial and Samsung). The BSOD issue dragged on for months and OCZ didn't have a clue what was causing it (just look at their support forums during this time).

This SSD thread on the Overclock.net forums has more details...

Reliability issues

Now why are SandForce drives not good imo you ask? Well, look up all the issues people have had with them, look at the issues people still get with their SandForce drive even after the new firmware "fix" which amazingly took so long for then to get in the first place! It took over 6 months for SandForce and other manufacturers to get the "fix." Even now that there is the new release of firmware out there are still users who get random freezing, stuttering and shut downs that can't be explained. Hopefully if you do decide to go the SandForce route you don't get issues, which chances are lower now, but some people still do.

Now look at other manufacturers, it took other manufacturers like Crucial w/ Micron about a month to fix their BSoD issue @5200hrs. Look at Samsung, they had a issue with their new firmware where the drive would disappear after flashing it, but a few days later they released a new version that fixes that issue.

I don't know about you but I would not want to spend my hard earned money on something they isn't reliable when I can get something that is more reliable and has better support than other products out there.