34 replies to this topic

[+Chicane-UK]

I shared an interesting piece on the BBC News a few days ago, prior to the iPhone 5 launch and it's interesting to see that sort of momentum has carried on.

This piece from CNet is an interesting read:

http://news.cnet.com...-shark-in-2011/

Despite the more inflammatory title, they do remain complimentary of Apple and say that they have essentially become victims of their own success.. but also that the magic did really leave the building when Steve Jobs passed away. Which I think just about anyone who followed technology with interest, knew was going to be the case.

[Anaron]

I think the main reason behind the success of Apple in the past was Steve Jobs. He was the visionary and he knew which risks to take. Once he passed away, it feels like some of the creative and risk-taking energy left Apple. It's no surprise that a lot of people that follow this kind of thing feel that the iPhone 5 isn't as "good" as they expected it to be (at least in terms of hardware). On Neowin, I've seen a lot of posts about people considering the Nokia Lumia 820/920.

I wonder if Apple will release a slightly updated version of the iPhone 5 in 2013 or jump straight to iPhone 6.

[Osiris]

Look I could be wrong, but I think Steve just had a great ethos of design and out of the box functionality combined with understanding the value of marketing and hype. I don't think Apple lost any creativity when Steve departed, truth is the only real time they innovate is when they launch a new product line which they haven't done in some time. Yes the ipod/iphone has invariably evolved but all the ilines havent greatly innovated in quite a while and why would they? It would be irrresponsible of them to greatly vary the design or functionality when they know the majority of people even if they are not awe struct by the new iphone will still upgrade to it.

The iTV or whatever they are rumoured to be doing in that space is where their next innovation will be. The iphone will continue to evolve but I don't think were going to see any great change in design and any new functionality they can squeeze in (cost vis space) will be things the competitors have already showcased, wireless charging, NFC etc.

[nekkidtruth]

Osiris, on 15 September 2012 - 08:07, said:

Look I could be wrong, but I think Steve just had a great ethos of design and out of the box functionality combined with understanding the value of marketing and hype. I don't think Apple lost any creativity when Steve departed, truth is the only real time they innovate is when they launch a new product line which they haven't done in some time. Yes the ipod/iphone has invariably evolved but all the ilines havent greatly innovated in quite a while and why would they? It would be irrresponsible of them to greatly vary the design or functionality when they know the majority of people even if they are not awe struct by the new iphone will still upgrade to it.

The iTV or whatever they are rumoured to be doing in that space is where their next innovation will be. The iphone will continue to evolve but I don't think were going to see any great change in design and any new functionality they can squeeze in (cost vis space) will be things the competitors have already showcased, wireless charging, NFC etc.

And eventually they'll end up in the same position as RIM. They were stagnant for years due to their success (mainly with the enterprise userbase, later with consumers) and they ended up backing themselves into a corner. I think RIM will come out of this relatively in tact, but they've lost a lot along the way. Apple may very well follow this same road at this rate.

[moloko]

Steve Jobs WAS Apple. Now Apple will try to coast as long as they can. 2 or 3 more years on the current products. Then it will become more fragmented. Stock will slowly go down again. Another will rise.

[TheLegendOfMart]

I'm not Apples biggest fan, but if it ain't broke don't fix it.

They have more money than they know what to do with, iPhone 4 and 4S sells hand over fist.

They give the iPhone what it needed, faster cpu, better camera/lense, faster wifi, faster data connection, bigger 16:9 screen, nearly every part/feature of the 4S has been improved.

If you REALLY sit down and think, realistically, how is Apple going to revolutionise the iPhone?

[Reverend Spam]

TheLegendOfMart, on 15 September 2012 - 08:44, said:

If you REALLY sit down and think, realistically, how is Apple going to revolutionise the iPhone?

If we knew that, we would have a better company than Steve Jobs did. :-p

[amnesia-]

I don't think the hardware is the problem. It's the software. Look at the iOS. Same old icons, ugly gradients, horrible skeuomorphic design of the default apps. They could have completely redesigned the iOS in a year. But they didn't. Why? What are they thinking? And what is Scott Forstall doing? Playing games at work or what? iOS feels (and is) archaic. It's inconsistent. iOS 6 has Facebook and Twitter buttons in the notification drawer. Why not give us the option to replace those two buttons with, let's say, a wi-fi switch? The multitasking bar still shows only 4 icons. Why? It was stupid when the iPhone 4 came out, but now, when the iPhone 5 has a taller screen, it's completely retarded. When you activate the multitasking bar, the rest of the screen is unusable anyway. So why not put there at least 8 icons (two rows)?



I have spend around 400 euros for apps and games in a little more than a year. To me, it would make sense to stay in the Apple's ecosystem. But I won't. Because of the "same old, same old" iOS.

EDIT: The picture above was taken from this article: http://www.macorg.ne...ould-look-like/

[+Majesticmerc]

I don't think it's Apple's fault really. They make great hardware, they really do, but the problem is that there's now a certain expectation of how the iPhone should be. Look at what's happening to Windows 8. Whether or not the changes are good or bad is a debate that could go on until the end of time, but the fact is that Microsoft have been reluctant to change the Windows UI paradigm for exactly that reason. People don't like jarring changes, and if Apple were to "revolutionise" the iPhone again, I think the fallout would be worse than what it is now.

As much as Apple would love to be the continuous revolutionary, the fact is that they've become "the standard" now, much the same way that Windows is the "standard OS", and there are expectations of stability linked to that. I think the original BBC article said it best:

Quote

To use a car analogy, six years ago the iPhone was like a sexy new flagship model from BMW or Porsche. Today it's a Toyota Camry. Safe, reliable, boring. The car your mom drives. The car that's so popular that its maker doesn't dare mess with the formula.

That all said, I think next time the iPhone is due for a refresh, they'll have learned from this and we'll see something much better

[majortom1981]

Majesticmerc, on 15 September 2012 - 12:13, said:

I don't think it's Apple's fault really. They make great hardware, they really do, but the problem is that there's now a certain expectation of how the iPhone should be. Look at what's happening to Windows 8. Whether or not the changes are good or bad is a debate that could go on until the end of time, but the fact is that Microsoft have been reluctant to change the Windows UI paradigm for exactly that reason. People don't like jarring changes, and if Apple were to "revolutionise" the iPhone again, I think the fallout would be worse than what it is now.

As much as Apple would love to be the continuous revolutionary, the fact is that they've become "the standard" now, much the same way that Windows is the "standard OS", and there are expectations of stability linked to that. I think the original BBC article said it best:



That all said, I think next time the iPhone is due for a refresh, they'll have learned from this and we'll see something much better

Microsoft DID make a huge change though. From windows 6.5 to windows 7 was a gigantic change. If microsoft was able to do it apple can as well. My problem is I have a iphone 4s and the ONLY feature i do not get is the longer screen. I just updated to ios 6. my camera specs are the same. I get the siri updates , the turn by turn and map updates. All other features not related to the screen. Eventually normal people will catch on that they dont have to upgrade to the next iphone to get a lot of the new features. Then what will apple do?

[+Vice]

Anaron, on 15 September 2012 - 07:58, said:

I think the main reason behind the success of Apple in the past was Steve Jobs. He was the visionary and he knew which risks to take. Once he passed away, it feels like some of the creative and risk-taking energy left Apple. It's no surprise that a lot of people that follow this kind of thing feel that the iPhone 5 isn't as "good" as they expected it to be (at least in terms of hardware). On Neowin, I've seen a lot of posts about people considering the Nokia Lumia 820/920.

I wonder if Apple will release a slightly updated version of the iPhone 5 in 2013 or jump straight to iPhone 6.

Steve knew about the iPhone 5 and signed off on it before he passed away. According to his biography they always have 2 generations of product planned out while the current version is released. He passed just after the iPhone 4S launch so based on this he would have fully known about the iPhone 5 and I'd expect he knew some of what the next iPhone after this one would be too.

Also there were leaks earlier in the year about how Steve and other execs were discussing increasing the iPhones screen size and decided to go with only a vertical increase and not horizontal, Steve knew about this as he was included in those discussions, that was all part of the leak too.

When you look at the iPhone 4 to iPhone 4S, is that really any more amazing than iPhone 4S to iPhone 5? with this new version they've actually modified the external design of the phone more than the iPhone 4S did but people are saying this phone the iPhone 5 is the result of Steve not being there as a visionary? Under his watch the iPhone 4S happened and the iPhone 3GS which was externally identical to the iPhone 3G.

I think the iPhone 5's hardware is decent, the larger screen is nice and although I didn't like the back at first it has grown on me. But I'm still not buying it because for me the issue isn't the hardware so much as it is the software. I feel iOS is not moving fast enough in the direction I want. As I said in the iOS 6 thread, I want full multitasking not this luke-warm set of background API's that developers can only run specific features through like streaming audio and voip calls and I also want application expose so we can actually see previews of the apps we may want to switch between instead of just the app icon.

[+Majesticmerc]

majortom1981, on 15 September 2012 - 12:22, said:

Microsoft DID make a huge change though. From windows 6.5 to windows 7 was a gigantic change. If microsoft was able to do it apple can as well. My problem is I have a iphone 4s and the ONLY feature i do not get is the longer screen. I just updated to ios 6. my camera specs are the same. I get the siri updates , the turn by turn and map updates. All other features not related to the screen. Eventually normal people will catch on that they dont have to upgrade to the next iphone to get a lot of the new features. Then what will apple do?

That was my point, Microsoft were able to make those changes in the mobile space because by the time WP7 rolled around, they were basically out of the game, and small enough players to mess with their stuff to try and get a better product. With Windows 8 on the desktop though, there's outcry from a significant proportion of the userbase that they've "changed too much" or "made it harder to use". Apple doesn't want to risk it's market share on complaints like that, especially when the smartphone market is so volatile. If people don't like the new iPhone, most won't have a problem with dropping Apple and going and picking up an Android or Windows Phone device.

Anaron, on 15 September 2012 - 07:58, said:

On Neowin, I've seen a lot of posts about people considering the Nokia Lumia 820/920.

That's probably because most of the Lumia discussions on Neowin are basically just great big circlejerks .

[n_K]

majortom1981, on 15 September 2012 - 12:22, said:

Eventually normal people will catch on that they dont have to upgrade to the next iphone to get a lot of the new features. Then what will apple do?

They'll make updates available only for the current and last-year models and make the older models run even slower with even more battery drain?

[+sc302]

Young people want new and exciting, older people want stability, and old people want things to stay the same. I am in the stability phase, I really don't give a rats ass about new interface...it doesn't have to look good, it just has to work flawlessly. When you make severe changes, you often skimp on the stability (Me and vista...ok vista is somewhat stable but it has issues....windows 8 is a complete redesign, much like ME and vista...ME was supposed to be what xp was where the removed the DOS os but they couldn't completely do it and left a bastardized OS) I expect a ton of issues. Apple is used to making small changes, they have been on osx for 10+ years, when is osxi coming out? Of course iphone5 is following suit to that model, don't fix what isn't broken. I am sure that you are going to see that the apple UI for ios isn't going to change all that much for a long time.

[Somnus]

majortom1981, on 15 September 2012 - 12:22, said:

I just updated to ios 6.

How did you upgrade to iOS6? Isn't it still beta?