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Google explains why it stopped Acer's Aliyun smartphone launch


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#1 +techbeck

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 16:09

Quote

Earlier today there was some strange drama as Acer abruptly cancelled the launch of a smartphone. The phone was running the Aliyun OS, which is created by Alibaba and which Google says is actually a "non-compatible [version] of Android." At the time, Acer said that Google had "expressed concerns" about the launch, and now Google has come forward to explain its side of the story in a statement:

Compatibility is at the heart of the Android ecosystem and ensures a consistent experience for developers, manufacturers and consumers. Non-compatible versions of Android, like Aliyun, weaken the ecosystem. All members of the Open Handset Alliance have committed to building one Android platform and to not ship non-compatible Android devices. This does not however, keep OHA members from participating in competing ecosystems.

This is the first time in recent memory (if ever) that we've seen membership in the OHA actually have repercussions. To date, it has appeared to be a feel-good consortium of companies that ostensibly contribute to Android. However, now we see that membership has meaning beyond feel-good PR, and Google is not being shy about stopping fragmentation where it can within the Android ecosystem. Amazon is not a member of the OHA, by the way, and therefore there's nothing to stop it from creating its own Android variant that powers the Kindle Fire.

The situation is a bit murky, as the extent to which the Aliyun OS uses technologies from Android is a little unclear. When it announced the OS a year ago, Alibaba took pains to point out that the Android app compatibility feature came from its own work, not the "Dalvik" virtual machine from Android: "The cloud OS is the result of three years of development and uses AliCloud's self-developed distributed file system and virtual machine; the cloud OS is also fully compatible with Android-based applications." In a statement to the WSJ today, however, Alibaba stepped back from those claims, saying that "Aliyun OS is not part of the Android ecosystem so of course Aliyun OS is not and does not have to be compatible with Android." Alibaba reiterated that sentiment in a statement to The Verge, "Aliyun OS is built on open-source Linux and is not part of the Android ecosystem."

Whatever the technical or political justifications, canceling a phone launch while journalists are en-route is a fairly serious flub and both Google and Acer will need to spend more time working out what happened here. Google may yet have to resort to such heavy-handed tactics again to help keep Android fragmentation in check, but as Amazon has shown, some companies don't need Google's cooperation to take advantage of the OS it created.

Update: Andy Rubin has posted a fuller explanation of its stance on Android compatibility on the official Android blog, although he does not directly address this particular drama, Rubin does say that the OHA hopes to create a "virtuous cycle" of development for the platform and that each member of the OHA "contributes to and builds one Android ecosystem — not a bunch of incompatible versions."

Update 2: Andy Rubin minced fewer words in his posting on Google+, where he flatly claims that Aliyun "incorporates the Android runtime and was apparently derived from Android."

http://www.theverge....-aliyun-android

Figured there was more to this story. Acer is a member of the OHA and as such, there are rules they need to follow. They signed an agreement with Google and Acer and Google are still talking and working through this.


#2 evo_spook

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 18:49

Update 2: Andy Rubin minced fewer words in his posting on Google+, where he flatly claims that Aliyun "incorporates the Android runtime and was apparently derived from Android."



Didn't seem to be a issue for Google when they was borrowing from Java

#3 Boz

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 18:59

View Posttechbeck, on 15 September 2012 - 16:09, said:

http://www.theverge....-aliyun-android

Figured there was more to this story. Acer is a member of the OHA and as such, there are rules they need to follow. They signed an agreement with Google and Acer and Google are still talking and working through this.

Yep.. here's the reason

"When it announced the OS a year ago, Alibaba took pains to point out that the Android app compatibility feature came from its own work, not the "Dalvik" virtual machine from Android:"

So you can't use Android name and create your own thing, especially when it's not using the same compatibility layers and virtual machine as stock Android.

Google is 200% right here.. This is why it's great that Google is the one developing Android.. so they can protect it from stuff like this.

#4 Jason Stillion

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 19:05

View Postevo_spook, on 15 September 2012 - 18:49, said:

Update 2: Andy Rubin minced fewer words in his posting on Google+, where he flatly claims that Aliyun "incorporates the Android runtime and was apparently derived from Android."



Didn't seem to be a issue for Google when they was borrowing from Java

You mean the total 15 lines?

They could of gone the Amazon route, took android, did there own independent marketplace and launch it.

#5 guru

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 19:12

View PostBoz, on 15 September 2012 - 18:59, said:

Yep.. here's the reason

"When it announced the OS a year ago, Alibaba took pains to point out that the Android app compatibility feature came from its own work, not the "Dalvik" virtual machine from Android:"

So you can't use Android name and create your own thing, especially when it's not using the same compatibility layers and virtual machine as stock Android.

Google is 200% right here.. This is why it's great that Google is the one developing Android.. so they can protect it from stuff like this.
so much being "open" then

#6 OP +techbeck

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 19:43

View Postguru, on 15 September 2012 - 19:12, said:


so much being "open" then

Huh? Google is open. Acer just made their own OS based off of Android. Something all members of the OHA agreed NOT to do. Amazon can get away with it because they are not a member of the OHA. However, OHA members can make WP8 phones and that is not a problem. Its just competing Android OS that the OHA forbids and that all members agreed to.

So if Acer wants to do their own thing, then they shouldn't of joined the OHA.

#7 guru

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 19:47

View Posttechbeck, on 15 September 2012 - 19:43, said:

Huh? Google is open. Acer just made their own OS based off of Android. Something all members of the OHA agreed NOT to do. Amazon can get away with it because they are not a member of the OHA.
Acer didnt make the OS. Alibaba did. Acer was just the hardware vendor. The phone that google got cancelled was never branded as an android phone.

#8 OP +techbeck

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 19:50

View Postguru, on 15 September 2012 - 19:47, said:


Acer didnt make the OS. Alibaba did. Acer was just the hardware vendor. The phone that google got cancelled was never branded as an android phone.

Doesn't matter. Acer was going to release a device based off of android and is still against what they agreed to. So Acer was violating their agreement with Google.

#9 +Vice

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 19:53

Acer needs better lawyers.

#10 OP +techbeck

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 19:57

View PostVice, on 15 September 2012 - 19:53, said:

Acer needs better lawyers.

Google and Acer are talking about this still. One says its not based off android, the other says it is. I'm sure we will here more about this.

#11 LogicalApex

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:21

View Postguru, on 15 September 2012 - 19:12, said:

so much being "open" then

Android has never been Open. This has always been nothing more than a marketing line from Google. This isn't the only time Google has crafted contracts that remove all the "open" features of Android from an OEM. They have always used their Google branded apps to tie the hands of their OEM partners. What I find the most comical about all of this is Google uses this pressure to twist OEM arms when it comes to what devices they release, but they never use it to ensure end users get updates all the while claiming they care about users and updates, among other things.

These contracts came to light in the trial between Google and Skyhook from before Motorola was purchased by Google. Google banned the use of Skyhook WiFi based AGPS system because it wouldn't allow Google to get user WiFi data.

http://searchenginel...-headache-77870

#12 GP007

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:27

View PostFrazell Thomas, on 15 September 2012 - 20:21, said:

Android has never been Open. This has always been nothing more than a marketing line from Google. This isn't the only time Google has crafted contracts that remove all the "open" features of Android from an OEM. They have always used their Google branded apps to tie the hands of their OEM partners. What I find the most comical about all of this is Google uses this pressure to twist OEM arms when it comes to what devices they release, but they never use it to ensure end users get updates all the while claiming they care about users and updates, among other things.

These contracts came to light in the trial between Google and Skyhook from before Motorola was purchased by Google. Google banned the use of Skyhook WiFi based AGPS system because it wouldn't allow Google to get user WiFi data.

http://searchenginel...-headache-77870

Uh oh, don't bring reason and facts into this, you crazy? /s

#13 OP +techbeck

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:32

View PostFrazell Thomas, on 15 September 2012 - 20:21, said:

Android has never been Open. This has always been nothing more than a marketing line from Google. This isn't the only time Google has crafted contracts that remove all the "open" features of Android from an OEM. They have always used their Google branded apps to tie the hands of their OEM partners. What I find the most comical about all of this is Google uses this pressure to twist OEM arms when it comes to what devices they release, but they never use it to ensure end users get updates all the while claiming they care about users and updates, among other things.

Google isnt forcing anyone to sign contracts. If Acer wanted to do their own thing with a different OS, then they should of did what Amazon did. And if companies do not like Google's terms and conditions, then they can do what Nokia did and go WP only.

#14 Coolicer

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:47

What I don't understand from this, how can Google talk about Aliyun fragmenting Android, when it's not compatible with and not branded as Android?

I don't care is it was derived from the Android code-base or the Linux kernel or Linux kernel whilst using Android-specific patches that live in the mainline tree now.
If it doesn't support Android, as Alibaba now claiming that its OS is not compatible with Android applications or its marketplace*, then there is no "fragmentation" of Android
assuming that the definition of "Android fragmentation" is the same as what all the tech blogs are always using.

But perhaps I'm overlooking something here.

(* I've read the part about their cloudservices being compatible with the Android framework, but now they've retracted that statement. So I assume it no longer is)

#15 LogicalApex

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:56

View Posttechbeck, on 15 September 2012 - 20:32, said:

Google isnt forcing anyone to sign contracts. If Acer wanted to do their own thing with a different OS, then they should of did what Amazon did. And if companies do not like Google's terms and conditions, then they can do what Nokia did and go WP only.

Actually they are, if they don't sign the contracts then they won't get Google Play (Android Market), Google Maps, Gmail, or a host of other apps. You can't really sell an Android phone without those apps.

Amazon is a strong exception because they have built an entire ecosystem outside of Google. Acer can't easily do the same thing and if they tried I'm sure Android users would shun them for not using Google's apps.

So don't pretend that the Google apps don't matter to Android users.