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NVIDIA: "No Longer Possible" for Consoles to Better PC Graphics

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#61 George P

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 19:11

4k isn't going to take hold anytime soon, to think it'll be the norm for gaming or even video in the next few years is wishful thinking.    Sure people could go out and get 4k TVs and at best what they'll have is upscaled 1080p video.   There's a lot that has to happen for 4k to take hold and costs have to come down quite a bit, but for that to happen people have to go and buy new TVs which I don't see people rushing out to do.  1080p will be the majority format for quite some time IMO.   By the time 4k is used more and has started to get real traction in the market then we'll already be talking about the next-next gen consoles already I bet.




#62 Andre S.

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 19:13

That's not what people are advocating. Rather, it should follow the smartphone / tablet approach whereby new models are released each year and are compatible with existing games. You don't have to upgrade but those that do get better performance. It simply isn't excusable to have consoles that are only updated every eight years when technology is moving at breakneck speed.

Smartphone technology is evolving at a breakneck speed, but high-power CPUs/GPUs are not. Haswell is barely an upgrade over Ivy Bridge which was barely an upgrade over Sandy Bridge. Even older CPUs still perform decently in recent games. DirectX hasn't seen a major revision in 4 years now, and none is planned. There are many advantages for consumers and developers to a stable platform. If 1080p60 can become standard on the next-gen consoles (which should be the case), I don't see any reason for new consoles for a long time. As I see things, we'll be playing these two consoles for at least as long as we did the current generation.



#63 OP theyarecomingforyou

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 19:35

Smartphone technology is evolving at a breakneck speed, but high-power CPUs/GPUs are not. Haswell is barely an upgrade over Ivy Bridge which was barely an upgrade over Sandy Bridge. Even older CPUs still perform decently in recent games.

Yes, but next year we have Haswell-E processors with eight-cores, DDR4 support and SATA Express. GPUs are evolving at a much faster pace, with new models every year from both nVidia and AMD. Display technology being pushed for mobiles, tablets and TVs means that 4K will soon be available at a sensible price. Storage has been evolving especially quickly, with the introduction of SSDs.  The point is that consoles should be updated to support the latest improvements in technology, just like PCs, tablets and phones are.

 

In fact that's exactly why Valve is working on Steam Machines. People should be able to buy a budget model to get in or pay extra for the top of the range model. The balance that consoles currently strike just isn't right.



#64 spenser.d

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 19:51

 

 

In fact that's exactly why Valve is working on Steam Machines. People should be able to buy a budget model to get in or pay extra for the top of the range model. The balance that consoles currently strike just isn't right.

 

No, the balance is just fine, you just don't like it so you're saying it's not right.

 

Steam Machines are likely to cater to people that already use Steam, which compared to the chunk of gamers that play on consoles without playing on Steam, is miniscule.



#65 Andre S.

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 19:54

Yes, but next year we have Haswell-E processors with eight-cores, DDR4 support and SATA Express. GPUs are evolving at a much faster pace, with new models every year from both nVidia and AMD. Display technology being pushed for mobiles, tablets and TVs means that 4K will soon be available at a sensible price. Storage has been evolving especially quickly, with the introduction of SSDs.  The point is that consoles should be updated to support the latest improvements in technology, just like PCs, tablets and phones are.

 

In fact that's exactly why Valve is working on Steam Machines. People should be able to buy a budget model to get in or pay extra for the top of the range model. The balance that consoles currently strike just isn't right.

As a PC gamer I can certainly relate to that, I wouldn't use anything but the latest gen. That said, there's tremendous value for consumers in a relatively low-cost box that is guaranteed to give you all the greatest games for many years to come at a perfectly decent level of visual fidelity, and I think with 1080p60 it should be hard to convince people to spend money for better. A lot of people won't even see the difference with current-gen (as iconoclast as that sounds to us techies).

 

And on the other hand for developers, when you deal with many different hardware configurations you tend to aim for the lowest common denominator, this is why even now games don't look dramatically different on PCs than they do on the 2005 Xbox 360; all the same animations, models, shaders, rendering techniques, you get higher res, higher framerate, perhaps crisper textures, that's about it. The same reality goes on in the smartphone world, why I should I target the latest Android when I can target an older version and be compatible with everything? So it's more complex than just new hardware = better games. 

 

That said I'm as eager as anyone to see how SteamOS will succeed and potentially change the living room gaming landscape.



#66 alwaysonacoffebreak

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 03:28

Smartphone technology is evolving at a breakneck speed, but high-power CPUs/GPUs are not. Haswell is barely an upgrade over Ivy Bridge which was barely an upgrade over Sandy Bridge. Even older CPUs still perform decently in recent games. DirectX hasn't seen a major revision in 4 years now, and none is planned. There are many advantages for consumers and developers to a stable platform. If 1080p60 can become standard on the next-gen consoles (which should be the case), I don't see any reason for new consoles for a long time. As I see things, we'll be playing these two consoles for at least as long as we did the current generation.

 

Uhm only thing that smartphones evolve that quickly is thanks to Intel/AMD where they can learn from. The arch of the ARM hasn't changed much (it has changed, sure, but not by much) lately they are just doing the same thing that AMD is doing right now, throw more cores and bigger speeds at it. While dekstop CPU's do change, Bulldozer was a totally new arch from the beginning what everyone laughed about since it's single-threaded performance was too low but now when practically the same thing is in both consoles AMD CPU's will actually reap from it and single-threaded performance will be soon something in the past for gaming.

 

I have my PS4 pre-ordered and I do hope you're right about the lasting of it. Here's for another 7-8 years. 

 

Also on third page you were talking about Kaveri and it's power compared to graphics while I tried to mean Kaveri will bring support for GDDR5 as main memory (As an replacement for DDR3) on the desktop ;) You can dismiss ddr4 at this point since like with every ddr memory it'll first make its way to servers and it will be expensive for dekstop, just because Intel has support for it doesn't mean it'll be mainstream around the corner.