0sit0 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 You're on a Windows forum with the banner "Windows 8 Was Not My Idea." I doubt you'd go to Linux. You would think so but nope. I actually run a copy of Suse Linux on my Windows 8 / Hackintosh computer. While I do not use it frequently I do love to try everything (and that's why I'm in this so not Windows anymore forum :) ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisj1968 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 And then what? Microsoft has now two individual user sets to keep happy. Now doubling their work, and increasing support (and by extension, costs). That's never going to work to segregate users. I don't know why people keep suggesting this. It's not that hard to select the desktop tile upon wakeup, and it takes less than ten seconds to select desktop at boot if you wish. they have that now. think about it. they have 2 active UI's and everyone is complaining and fussing as it is. The European union at least gets a vote screen for their browser. I don't see Europeans fussing. Pulagatha 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 they have that now. think about it. they have 2 active UI's and everyone is complaining and fussing as it is. The European union at least gets a vote screen for their browser. I don't see Europeans fussing. They're not separate. They are part of the same system. You don't even have to use Metro apps if you don't want to. But to say they need separated is just stupid. There's no reason to make them separate. Doing that would only complicate things. DConnell 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisj1968 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 They're not separate. They are part of the same system. You don't even have to use Metro apps if you don't want to. But to say they need separated is just stupid. There's no reason to make them separate. Doing that would only complicate things. Dot, there is no reason why laptop users like me need both UI's. the modern UI is geared for tablet and mobile markets. Since July last year I maybe have used the modern UI on my fingers. the last 3 months.. zero times. they wasted a DVD to give us a 32bit and 64bit versions of the OS in the past. so it isn't THAT difficult. it's not a matter of "can they" as it is more perhaps what you deem they should do right? fLive and let live I always say. why put in the extra overhead (data) on the hard drive is a particular user doesn't want to? But enough of this because it's just a rehash of the age old argument of my dogs better then your dog.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Dot, there is no reason why laptop users like me need both UI's. the modern UI is geared for tablet and mobile markets. Since July last year I maybe have used the modern UI on my fingers. the last 3 months.. zero times. they wasted a DVD to give us a 32bit and 64bit versions of the OS in the past. so it isn't THAT difficult. it's not a matter of "can they" as it is more perhaps what you deem they should do right? fLive and let live I always say. why put in the extra overhead (data) on the hard drive is a particular user doesn't want to? But enough of this because it's just a rehash of the age old argument of my dogs better then your dog.. Of course there's a reason, you just don't want to admit to it. As I said above, it's not that hard to click into the desktop, and work there. The Start Screen is there to augment the UX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisj1968 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Of course there's a reason, you just don't want to admit to it. As I said above, it's not that hard to click into the desktop, and work there. The Start Screen is there to augment the UX. When I say sorry but I mean this... admit what? I think you made it perfectly clear you and I disagree. That's about all there is to admit and I'm NOT being sarcastic about that. You like Modern UI I like the desktop.. Pulagatha 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Dee Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Dee Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Good Lord! Using the editor is like using BS. I can't even copy and paste text from Word, whats the point here? Well, those are my ideas of how Windows 9 should work without being radical. I wanted to explain more, but the editor here is BS. Please whoever is working on back end, focusing simplicity, go use the Microsoft Answers forum and learn how a real editor interface works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian S. Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 When I say sorry but I mean this... admit what? I think you made it perfectly clear you and I disagree. That's about all there is to admit and I'm NOT being sarcastic about that. You like Modern UI I like the desktop.. You may have a preference for the desktop now, but probably not in the future. You like the desktop now, stay in the desktop but don't recommend Windows 7 over 8 just because of your personal preference or the learning curve. Teach those who want to learn and those who don't want to learn (how to use the Modern UI). Don't complain about it, it didn't make anything harder for desktop users (like me) but made touch tasks easier for those who prefer touch (also me). <snipped> That would create alot of inconsistency throughout the OS. The desktop needs a make over. Just add features to it Microsoft, multiple desktops make it happen (run each as a Modern UI app in the recent app bar). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Dee Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Its the new Start menu, it has nothing to do with environments. More of a better launch pad and ways of accessing common functions that are both touch and mouse input ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisj1968 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 You may have a preference for the desktop now, but probably not in the future. You like the desktop now, stay in the desktop but don't recommend Windows 7 over 8 just because of your personal preference or the learning curve. Teach those who want to learn and those who don't want to learn (how to use the Modern UI). Don't complain about it, it didn't make anything harder for desktop users (like me) but made touch tasks easier for those who prefer touch (also me). That would create alot of inconsistency throughout the OS. The desktop needs a make over. Just add features to it Microsoft, multiple desktops make it happen (run each as a Modern UI app in the recent app bar). no no please don't misunderstand. it is just the way I work. Photoshop Cloud services (CS) is strictly Desktop and that's where I do my post processing. to be honest take Photoshop CS for example. it would not work on modern UI. my finger is too fat to imitate a pointing device such as a Wacom tablet for working on problem edges or intricate work. other things it MIGHT work with but I guess as a photographer, I could speak for other photogs by saying modern UI simply has its places where it belongs and where it doesn't. But I'm not looking anymore at Windows 8.1 like Win 7. I've gotten over that. I guess we all have our ways of workflow? would that be a more... apt way of putting it? I want to be honest here. I always thought that the modern UI was a UI for the trendy's. A UI that MSFT developed to set itself out from the competition. A UI that people would run around to brag about that they are using and others are not. that was a false assumption. The Modern UI has it place where it belongs as long as the system (Tablet, Smartphone or touchscreen laptops) are concerned. I may have been mistaken. I'm old school. Big Time. I don't want to change and probably won't unless I deem something worth changing to. </honest speaking> Pulagatha 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osiris Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 There is a reason why they have a hidden UI as you call it. It makes all apps use the same principle as to not have lots of buttons everywhere to press, and not having to memorize where all the buttons are. Jensen Harris actually spoke about these, you can check it here: Thanks for sharing, that was awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 Microsofts biggest problem: education. I have friends that didn't like or understand Windows 8, but once I showed them how it's done they said after a few days they wouldn't go back to windows 7. If Microsoft made it clear from the start on what gestures to do and what to swipe, people wouldn't dislike windows 8 so much. Kind of like the intro video in the weather app on where to find stuff. I don't think that's there biggest problem. I think Desktop Apps and Metro Apps being side by side is. Whether they want to keep that way is up to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Live Veteran Posted February 19, 2014 Veteran Share Posted February 19, 2014 You just can't get me on board with Windows Modern UI apps. Let's start with pinning to the taskbar and some way to auto-start MUI apps. That may be enough. Windowing MUI apps in lieu of pinning ... just why bother? Just stick with Win32. Will devs scale to a Win32 scalable window and random apect or snap views? A well designed snap view is far superior to a resized Win32 app any day of the week in my book. I really didn't follow any of that... +virtorio 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 It's an interface for no one. Like I said above, users open up a browser to browse the web, not look at a dozen and some controls, menus, and links. The concept you have here is more than halfway cluttered with controls no one needs on their screen constantly. Well, I do think it's more enjoyable to keep everything situated in one bar as opposed to adding more UI. The address bar being the primary function could still be at the top of the display area. This was a mock up for a tablet/desktop app not strictly for Metro. And? In Windows 8, you only have to look for controls once. They're all in the same spot, no matter what app you're using. Once you memorize the hot corners (not hard to do), you're all set. People shouldn't have to look for the controls once. "Horizontal Scrolling is not what ninth/tenths of the internet is using." - Pulagatha And? This is not the structure most people are familiar with when it comes to using a program. Someone who has barely used a computer is going to find everything annoying. You could sit someone in front of Windows 7, and they'll be just as frustrated. For example, guess what they need to do to change the desktop wallpaper? If you guessed 'invoke a hidden menu', you'd be right. Someone who barely uses a computer is going to choose the easiest one to use. And yes the context menu is hidden, but the hidden context menu is still something as people are presented with in an interface that a designer would at least attempt to be avoid. It's no reason to make everything hidden. And again, I disagree. The sole purpose of an application is to display content. Content comes first. Always. Going back to your concept, there's two things my eyes are immediately drawn to, bookmarks and actual web content. I can tell you right now, I'm not in a browser to stare at bookmarks all day. You're limiting usage, by cluttering the screen. I think Usage comes first. The bookmarks icon is highlighted. It would slide in from the left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 And then what? Microsoft has now two individual user sets to keep happy. Now doubling their work, and increasing support (and by extension, costs). That's never going to work to segregate users. I don't know why people keep suggesting this. It's not that hard to select the desktop tile upon wakeup, and it takes less than ten seconds to select desktop at boot if you wish. I don't see it as a problem to keep both user sets happy by asking them which they prefer at Start Up. This way designers could focus on programs, while not having two constantly amend to different styles. If the Metro interface did follow the same paradigms as the desktop, I think you could make a "One" user interface for everyone. That would mean changing Metro. Would you rather have a Unified design for applications or would you like to keep Metro completely separate? You would think so but nope. I actually run a copy of Suse Linux on my Windows 8 / Hackintosh computer. While I do not use it frequently I do love to try everything (and that's why I'm in this so not Windows anymore forum :) ) I have not put OSX on my computer, but I've thought about it. A lot of the things I was asking for on Windows 8 showed up on OSX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 Of course there's a reason, you just don't want to admit to it. As I said above, it's not that hard to click into the desktop, and work there. The Start Screen is there to augment the UX. What is the reason? I mean if you can do everything you need to on one operating system or the other why should they need to be both presently available? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 Its the new Start menu, it has nothing to do with environments. More of a better launch pad and ways of accessing common functions that are both touch and mouse input ready. It makes me think, if there were one button within the interface to switch completely from Desktop to Metro it might be a solution that would accommodate everyone. Constantly switching back and forth from one to other seems annoying. It would be more preferable for everyone I think if upon Start Up the menu brought up two options (Desktop/Metro) to select from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 Thanks for sharing, that was awesome I didn't like some of the comments Jensen Harris makes in that video. I thought he seemed like he was bragging and rude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 It makes me think, if there were one button within the interface to switch completely from Desktop to Metro it might be a solution that would accommodate everyone. Constantly switching back and forth from one to other seems annoying. It would be more preferable for everyone I think if upon Start Up the menu brought up two options (Desktop/Metro) to select from. "Seems"? Then you haven't used Windows 8 at all, have you? It's no different than opening up the old Start Menu. Again your concept here leaves much to be desired in regards to a new menu system. The Metro Start Screen isn't taking the desktop away from you. Clicking into it for a few seconds isn't going to sink your productivity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 "Seems"? Then you haven't used Windows 8 at all, have you? It's no different than opening up the old Start Menu. Again your concept here leaves much to be desired in regards to a new menu system. The Metro Start Screen isn't taking the desktop away from you. Clicking into it for a few seconds isn't going to sink your productivity. Yes, I have. And I'm not really against the Start Screen. I think it could be used on the Desktop as well as Metro. I think having two different UI designs that provide the same functionality is pointless on "One" operating system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Yes, I have. And I'm not really against the Start Screen. I think it could be used on the Desktop as well as Metro. What? The Start Screen is already used on the desktop and Metro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 What? The Start Screen is already used on the desktop and Metro. I was talking about separating the Desktop/Metro App ecosystem that could be chosen at Start Up. I'd keep the Start Screen for desktop though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I was talking about separating the Desktop/Metro App ecosystem that could be chosen at Start Up. I'd keep the Start Screen for desktop though. That honestly makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulagatha Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 That honestly makes no sense. You're confused? By what? I would keep the Start Screen for Desktop Apps only. I think it could work as a information display (RSS Feed Headlines, Toggles, System Information.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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