Tobacco firms lose high court battle over plain packaging

[Nashy]

28 minutes ago, John. said:

You make some good points. In the UK, people with vape sticks are still subject to the same laws as smokers. Can't smoke inside, and only in bars/restaurants in dedicated spaces, so there's not much difference really. 

 

I used to smoke, and I now have a vape stick purely for money/health reasons, but you're right there is a vape culture that - especially in the USA - looks very annoying to be around. 

I'm also a vaper.  I don't have a stick, I'm one of those ###### who make the giant clouds.  However, it's really hard to get into a debate with anti vapers while other vapers are around.  They think that we should be able to do this everywhere, which is simply inconsiderate.  I vape in my home, and also in my work office (because I'm allowed to, and no one minds).  But if I'm out and about, I go and hang with the smokers.

Apparently me doing that doesn't help our cause or something dumb.  To me, filling a room with a white vapour, which most people have no idea about, it just rude.

[Nashy]

9 minutes ago, BinaryData said:

They'd make even more if they taxed marijuana production, and if they allowed the sale of hemp. I mean, hemp can replace a LOT. It's easier to grow, takes less time for a plant to reach maturity than a tree does. I mean, lumber production would still needed for building houses and what not. But so much more could be benefited from hemp.

I'm not going to get involved in the illegal drugs being legal debate, and why it's stupid that it's illegal.  I will however go for a cone and think about how stupid my state government is for looking to classify marijuana the same as heroin.  One positive is they just allowed it for medical purposes.  I can't see it being like the states, our backwards ass old politicians will likely only allow it in creams and sprays.  Sigh.

[FloatingFatMan]

33 minutes ago, Nashy said:

Apparently me doing that doesn't help our cause or something dumb.  To me, filling a room with a white vapour, which most people have no idea about, it just rude.

Thank you for being considerate. I wish more were!

[BinaryData]

1 hour ago, Nashy said:

I'm not going to get involved in the illegal drugs being legal debate, and why it's stupid that it's illegal.  I will however go for a cone and think about how stupid my state government is for looking to classify marijuana the same as heroin.  One positive is they just allowed it for medical purposes.  I can't see it being like the states, our backwards ass old politicians will likely only allow it in creams and sprays.  Sigh.

Uh... illegal drug? Oh you're an Aussie, that'd explain the illegal part. Marijuana is no more dangerous than pills you get through a pharmacy. That's illegal in all 50 states! Not to mention, Alcohol is a far more dangerous "drug". I forget that not everyone on Neowin isn't American. I'm talking about the United States in this instance. We tax cigarettes but if we taxed Hemp Production, we could make even more money. I'm betting that the world would also be a better place.

1 hour ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Thank you for being considerate. I wish more were!

Me too. I joke with friends that I'm going to walk around with a fish bowl on my head with a filter to avoid smokers. Sadly, I wish I could. I'm glad someones considerate. My co-workers all smoke outside the doors where we walk in, so we get good wiffs of it. When he first started here, he set off the smoke alarms in the Data Hall. That's how much he reeks, mind you, these alarms take a LOT to set off.

[Skiver Veteran]

2 hours ago, John. said:

You make some good points. In the UK, people with vape sticks are still subject to the same laws as smokers. Can't smoke inside, and only in bars/restaurants in dedicated spaces, so there's not much difference really. 

 

I used to smoke, and I now have a vape stick purely for money/health reasons, but you're right there is a vape culture that - especially in the USA - looks very annoying to be around. 

Whilst that might be true - I don't think a lot of people treat them the same. I've seen plenty people using them on public transport for instance or in a shopping centre. 

 

You just now need to make that final step and stop all together

[BinaryData]

1 minute ago, Skiver said:

Whilst that might be true - I don't think a lot of people treat them the same. I've seen plenty people using them on public transport for instance or in a shopping centre. 

 

You just now need to make that final step and stop all together

People think vaping is safer than smoking. It's not.  So, I agree.

[+John. Subscriber¹]

13 minutes ago, BinaryData said:

People think vaping is safer than smoking. It's not.  So, I agree.

When you say not any safer, what do you mean? 

 

NHS England say e cigarettes are 95% safer

 

 https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/454517/Ecigarettes_a_firm_foundation_for_evidence_based_policy_and_practice.pdf

[BinaryData]

39 minutes ago, John. said:

When you say not any safer, what do you mean? 

 

NHS England say e cigarettes are 95% safer

 

 https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/454517/Ecigarettes_a_firm_foundation_for_evidence_based_policy_and_practice.pdf

There have been a few studies in the states that have come to the conclusion that e-cigarettes cause "popcorn lungs", which iirc, is a form of cancer.

[+John. Subscriber¹]

53 minutes ago, BinaryData said:

There have been a few studies in the states that have come to the conclusion that e-cigarettes cause "popcorn lungs", which iirc, is a form of cancer.

I agree it's not as safe as not smoking either one altogether, but I think the general consensus is they're a lot safer than the thousands of chemicals you pump into you when you smoke a cigarette 

[BinaryData]

5 minutes ago, John. said:

I agree it's not as safe as not smoking either one altogether, but I think the general consensus is they're a lot safer than the thousands of chemicals you pump into you when you smoke a cigarette 

No no, it's JUST as bad.

 

http://www.lung.org/stop-smoking/smoking-facts/e-cigarettes-and-lung-health.html?referrer=https://www.google.com/

 

Quote

However, in initial lab tests conducted in 2009, the FDA found detectable levels of toxic cancer-causing chemicals—including an ingredient used in antifreeze—in two leading brands of e-cigarettes and 18 various cartridges. A review of studies found that levels of toxins in e-cigarette aerosol varied considerably within and between brands. A 2014 study found that aerosol from e-cigarettes with a higher voltage level contains more formaldehyde, another carcinogen with the potential to cause cancer. The findings are alarming, and the American Lung Association urgently calls for FDA oversight of these products.

Safer? I call ######!

[Nashy]

2 hours ago, BinaryData said:

There have been a few studies in the states that have come to the conclusion that e-cigarettes cause "popcorn lungs", which iirc, is a form of cancer.

You need to be careful with the information you take on board.  Government in the USA, especially California, are spewing out massive amounts of crap to stop these things from becoming the mainstream.  You will likely find more information for these than against.

They aren't just as bad by any stretch.

Popcorn lung was not a proven thing, some of the juices contain the same chemical that causes popcorn lung, so it's important to know what you are buying.  Unfortunately, instead of setting laws to stop those who market and sell things that are known carcinogens, they would rather stop it completely.

I choose to trust the Brits over the US, due to the fact that they are actively trying to stamp out cigarettes and don't have vested interests in keeping big tobacco alive.  You say they are taxed in the USA, that's correct.  But you think they are taxed enough to stop people?  Was it $7 a packet I read in here earlier?  They're round $20USD for 25 cigarettes here.

[FloatingFatMan]

Vaping may not be as bad for you as cigarettes, but that doesn't mean that it isn't BAD for you!  You're still inhaling a cocktail of chemicals at the end of the day, and your lungs aren't meant to take in anything except air!

[Jack W]

11 hours ago, Nashy said:

I'm also a vaper.  I don't have a stick, I'm one of those ###### who make the giant clouds.  However, it's really hard to get into a debate with anti vapers while other vapers are around.  They think that we should be able to do this everywhere, which is simply inconsiderate.  I vape in my home, and also in my work office (because I'm allowed to, and no one minds).  But if I'm out and about, I go and hang with the smokers.

Apparently me doing that doesn't help our cause or something dumb.  To me, filling a room with a white vapour, which most people have no idea about, it just rude.

I hate when I'm walking past a vaper, and they just create an entire cloud around you, in public. It is very, very inconsiderate and quite frankly, childish. I don't wish to breathe in what they breathe out, same goes for smokers.

[Nashy]

5 hours ago, Jack W said:

I hate when I'm walking past a vaper, and they just create an entire cloud around you, in public. It is very, very inconsiderate and quite frankly, childish. I don't wish to breathe in what they breathe out, same goes for smokers.

You're likely breathing in what we breath out even when you can't see it ;-)

 

But I get what you're saying.  A lot of vapers are very inconsiderate of other people, self centered even.  There is no need to be an douche just in spite of you wanting to show off your right to vape. 

[Dashel]

What other legal business has to put up with such childish nonsense?