62 posts in this topic

Posted

If the guard would have used his bare hands and failed, the freshman could have taken hold of the gun and could have caused havoc.

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Posted

If I was the cop I would of shot him too. He could of been on anything, I have seen it over here in my town where a guy high on god knows what attacked a police officer so the police officer struck him with his baton which is fair enough, the guy who was high, grabbed it, ripped it out of the officers hand and began to hit the officer with it so 8 other officers had to tackle him to the floor and put their knees on him to stop him getting up and it took another 15 minutes to cuff the man. He also got CS Sprayed too and that did basically nothing...

See that officer was lucky he had back-up and over here police don't carry guns apart from trained armed patrols like CO19 but the officer in this story did not have back-up so if he didn't have a gun he could be dead or seriously injured, heck if this kid was on bath salts he could of started eating the officers face, so yeah.

Also these people saying "shoot him in the leg hurr durr" have you ever heard of the femoral artery? if he got shot in the leg and it went through that without immediate medical care the guy is as good as dead and I am English and even I know you shoot for Center Mass because it is the largest part of any given human body which means you have a greater chance of disabling the person in question. Seriously comments like "shoot him in the shoulder/leg/arm/foot" are well... Borderline Peter Griffin stupid and let me tell you that is pretty dumb.

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Posted

It's shocking how many people seem unconcerned about this incident. This is yet another case where an unarmed individual was gunned down by police unnecessarily. In the UK police are able to successfully apprehend suspects without being armed and with minimal risk to themselves or the general public. Police officers should be deployed in pairs and should easily be able to take down an unarmed individual - if not then they disengage and radio in for backup. The US police system doesn't work - it's not fit for purpose. It was only recently that we saw an unarmed double amputee (missing an arm and a leg) with a mental condition in a wheelchair shot dead by a police officer.

It's sick that this is allowed to happen and nobody seems to bat an eyelid. What a reprehensible culture.

If I was the cop I would of shot him too. He could of been on anything, I have seen it over here in my town where a guy high on god knows what attacked a police officer so the police officer struck him with his baton which is fair enough, the guy who was high, grabbed it, ripped it out of the officers hand and began to hit the officer with it so 8 other officers had to tackle him to the floor and put their knees on him to stop him getting up and it took another 15 minutes to cuff the man. He also got CS Sprayed too and that did basically nothing...

So the suspect was taken in alive to face the justice system and the police officer was fine... yet you're supporting the US approach where people are simply gunned down because it's more convenient? Sure it's not nice for a police officer to be assaulted but neither is it for somebody to die as a result. People need to be afforded due process and shooting them dead is not due process.

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Posted

If I was the cop I would of shot him too. He could of been on anything

Being prior service USMC I would agree shooting first and asking questions later is safer for P.D, but if you see the pics of this guy he isn't buff by any standards. He could have easily had his partner behind him with his sidearm out and the cop in front pulls out his tazer and try to detain the suspect that way.

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Posted

So the suspect was taken in alive to face the justice system and the police officer was fine... yet you're supporting the US approach where people are simply gunned down because it's more convenient? Sure it's not nice for a police officer to be assaulted but neither is it for somebody to die as a result. People need to be afforded due process and shooting them dead is not due process.

I do to some degree but I don't support the US approach entirely and I would of preferred that he was brought in alive to face trial and due process BUT I agree with what the officer did to the extent of, this guy is on drugs and he is not calming down and I have seen the skinniest people drop the biggest guys and anyone is capable of anything at any given time, heck I know I am, I've been arrested (not charged and it only happened once, I lost someone and I was angry with myself but had a hard time controlling my emotions) because I've gotten so angry and if I was shot I wouldn't blame the officer for it, so yeah if the guy was detained that is great he can be charged with whatever and go before the courts but in this instance I do not blame the police officer for shooting him either because he could of been scared for his life.

Being prior service USMC I would agree shooting first and asking questions later is safer for P.D, but if you see the pics of this guy he isn't buff by any standards. He could have easily had his partner behind him with his sidearm out and the cop in front pulls out his Tazer and try to detain the suspect that way.

Like I said above, I have seen some stick insect guys drop some really big, well built men and yeah the guy could of been Tasered but I am not going to blame the police officer for his actions because I feel under the circumstances the officer had to make a call and he made one where someone died but the guy could of done ANYTHING to the police officer and at the time if he is attacking a police officer he could of been on his way to attack someone else or could of just beaten someone to death with a baseball bat and he burnt his clothes that and that is why he naked (I am not saying he did but anything is possible) you just don't know.

I am not saying in every case like this that an officer should shoot the man but people have to realize that they have to think FAST and make split second decisions, yeah it is easy to say Tazer him, spray him or use a baton after the fact but in the heat of the moment you go for what you feel is the most effective thing at the time of this happening. And you have to remember that officer will have to live for the rest of his life knowing he killed a young man who could of had so much potential in life and he took it away in the heat of the moment.

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Posted

I do to some degree but I don't support the US approach entirely and I would of preferred that he was brought in alive to face trial and due process BUT I agree with what the officer did to the extent of, this guy is on drugs and he is not calming down and I have seen the skinniest people drop the biggest guys and anyone is capable of anything at any given time

But that's exactly why you need a police system that works properly. If police work in pairs, wear stab-proof / bulletproof vests, are equipped with non-lethal weapons, have access to support, having training in psychology and unarmed combat and are taught how to deal with violent suspects then you can eliminate the need to use guns when dealing with unarmed suspects, as is the case in the UK. Further, when dealing with people off their head on drugs you need special training - pointing a gun at them and trying to use reason isn't going to work. People in the US are dying needlessly because the police system there is simply not resourced or trained to deal with situations properly, as well as a culture that supports an excessive use of force. I'm not defending the actions of the suspect here - he was clearly behaving in an unacceptable manner and his actions cost him his life. But he shouldn't have been killed and that is a clear and obvious failing of the justice system.

There was a video of another case where a man with a knife was running down the street in New York. In that police all ran after him, pointed guns and were shouting at him, while he seemed to be under the influence of drugs. The police lacked any coordination, any obvious command structure and they clearly hadn't been trained in basic psychology - it was pandemonium and unsurprisingly the guy ended up being shot about ten times and dying instantly. It's the same with police chases where you see a dozen police cars all speeding after a suspect - there's no strategy. I would say it's a joke but that's not appropriate when people are dying as a result of police incompetence (and by that I don't just mean the officers involved but the entire command structure).

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Posted

The man involved was a campus police officer. What exactly does that mean? Is he a real police officer or a security guard?

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Posted

The man involved was a campus police officer. What exactly does that mean? Is he a real police officer or a security guard?

At the University I attended we had campus police officers that were legitimate and trained officers with jurisdiction on and around campus. Their primary focus was the campus itself, and that's where their station was, but they had cruisers, sidearms, uniforms, and were required to complete the same training as everybody else. I think they probably just pulled people from the local city police to use as the campus police.

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Posted

he proly thought the naked guy was a zombie.... lots of those around lately....

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Posted

Really? why don't you try to stop these kind of people high on drug w/o using force. What you do if you don't have anything besides gun at that time? You want to stop him with bare hand alone?

When was the last time you faced someone under the influence of PCP/bath salts? I am not going to describe what I had to do in order to get out of his grip.

LETHAL FORCE.

Read my god damn post :p

I have no problem with officers knocking someone out, spraying them, etc. Shooting an unarmed person dead is beyond ridiculous, high or not.

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Posted

couldnt he have just shot him in the legs

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Posted

You really need to stop watching movies.

Did the officer forget that he could of shot the guy in the feet or arms or aimed for the shoulders. Eventually no matter what drugs hes on he won't have the ability to get up. Instead he went straight for the deadly shot......

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Posted

Campus officers shouldn't even be carrying guns, period. As far as I know in the UK for example not even regular police officers carry guns.

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Posted

Campus officers shouldn't even be carrying guns, period. As far as I know in the UK for example not even regular police officers carry guns.

The UK and the US are two entirely different countries. Just because something works in your country doesn't mean it works in another country.

Is it that hard of a concept for UKers to understand instead of preaching and belittling others to why everyone should be like them?

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Posted

The UK rest of modern society and the US are two entirely different countries entities. Just because something works in your country, doesn't mean it works in another country we'll support it.

Is it that hard of a concept for UKers foreigners to understand instead of preaching and belittling highlighting potential issues to others to why and claiming everyone should be like them adopt stances based on reason?

Fixed.

But on a serious note, there are some issues that have been highlighted with the American police force in the past. I believe concerns over being too quick to resort to violence, poor training in dealing with crisis situations etc. have all come up and been well documented.

Wasn't there a fad not long ago about videoing police officers doing rather dubious things?

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Posted

The UK and the US are two entirely different countries. Just because something works in your country doesn't mean it works in another country.

Is it that hard of a concept for UKers to understand instead of preaching and belittling others to why everyone should be like them?

If this had happened in the UK, nobody would be dead.

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Posted

probably bath salt.

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Posted

If this had happened in the UK, nobody would be dead.

How do you know the guy on bath salts wouldn't have killed the policemen?

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Posted

How do you know the guy on bath salts wouldn't have killed the policemen?

Because the policemen over there are actually trained and not retarded like most people here in america.

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Posted

Because the policemen over there are actually trained and not retarded like most people here in america.

Trained or not, you never know what a person on drugs is going to do or what they are capable of. Besides, this wasn't even a real cop. He was a campus officer.

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Posted

nevermind

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Posted

How do you know the guy on bath salts wouldn't have killed the policemen?

Police officers are trained to deal with strong, violent men. They carry tasers, pepper spray, batons, and usually work in at least pairs. They could send a riot cop with a shield. One rampaging man is nothing compared to a riot, even if he is high.

Guns aren't the answer to everything and there's something seriously warped with that opinion.

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Posted

Besides, this wasn't even a real cop. He was a campus officer.

Even more reason not to carry a gun.

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Posted

Besides, this wasn't even a real cop. He was a campus officer.

Campus officers are given the same training as city officers and are often pulled from the city department anyways.

Here in Austin, the community college campus officers also have jurisdiction throughout the entire city just as a regular police officer does. They can write citations and everything even when not directly on campus.

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Posted

It's shocking how many people seem unconcerned about this incident. This is yet another case where an unarmed individual was gunned down by police unnecessarily. In the UK police are able to successfully apprehend suspects without being armed and with minimal risk to themselves or the general public. Police officers should be deployed in pairs and should easily be able to take down an unarmed individual - if not then they disengage and radio in for backup. The US police system doesn't work - it's not fit for purpose. It was only recently that we saw an unarmed double amputee (missing an arm and a leg) with a mental condition in a wheelchair shot dead by a police officer.

It's sick that this is allowed to happen and nobody seems to bat an eyelid. What a reprehensible culture.

So the suspect was taken in alive to face the justice system and the police officer was fine... yet you're supporting the US approach where people are simply gunned down because it's more convenient? Sure it's not nice for a police officer to be assaulted but neither is it for somebody to die as a result. People need to be afforded due process and shooting them dead is not due process.

So "deploy them in pairs" when 8 cops cant even take down one person on PCP? You amaze me with some of your replies on this forum.

EDIT: Then again all of you overseas amaze me with your replies. You take every effort you can to bash the US in one way or another. I find it funny. Its almost like your jealous that you don't live here. We all know that's all it is anyways.

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