AutoPatcher not installing all Windows Updates

[Opteron185]

Hello all,

I just ran AutoPatcher on a Windows XP SP2 machine and had all of the possible updates checked. However, after the install, the following updates were remaining:

(KB896423), (KB890830), (KB890046), (KB931768), (KB929399), (KB929969), (KB924496), (KB922819), (KB922582), (KB920683), (KB914388), (KB911280), (KB913580), (KB911562), (KB911927), (KB910437), (KB905749), (KB900725), (KB905414), (KB902400), (KB893756), (KB899587), (KB894391), (KB890859)

Has anybody else experienced this problem or know why were they not installed?

Thank you

[+theblazingangel MVC]

perhaps they were not initially available because you needed to install an updated component first... try installing them (again...)

[PsiMoon314]

Hi Opteron185,

Did Autopatcher complete to the end and let you exit or restart the PC normally, or did it reboot the part way through the update process without being prompted?

Kind Regards

Simon

[Opteron185]

It seemed to work properly the entire way through. It appears as though all the patches are installed, but they still show up as necessary on Windows Update. I see all the patches as being installed if I look under Add/Remove programs. It just seems like Windows Update isn't detecting the patches correctly.

I don't know if AutoPatcher does something special to make Windows Update sense that updates are installed? I wouldn't think that it would have to because AutoPatcher basically just runs the full installs of each patch, correct?

It just seems bizarre to me. I want to make sure that there aren't any bugs in AutoPatcher before I use it on a whole bunch of machines that I'm supposed to update at a school district. I ran it on my test machine, and the behavior I mentioned is what I noticed.

Hi Opteron185,

Did Autopatcher complete to the end and let you exit or restart the PC normally, or did it reboot the part way through the update process without being prompted?

Kind Regards

Simon

[Angelico_Payne]

perhaps they were not initially available because you needed to install an updated component first... try installing them (again...)

Are u telling us blaze that we have to run AP twice on clean windows?

[+theblazingangel MVC]

well yes, sometimes, for example wmp11 modules are only available after installing the wmp11 component itself! there are several things like this, including wmp10 updates int he wmp10 addon pack, and .net framework updates

[Angelico_Payne]

Thats not acceptable... i mean i understand its probably unavoidable but srill unacceptable.

If I nlite the patches to xp setup files, will they be installed all in that case or do I have to follow some procedure and order in which to integrate these files?

[+theblazingangel MVC]

i'm not sure i follow, are you asking whether you would have to do that with nlite itself, or are you asking about running autopatcher after using an nlited setup disk?

in the latter case, if wmp11 for example was installed via nlite, then wmp11 updates would be available on the first run of autopatcher afterwards.

hiding updates until a component is installed is unavoidable because, for example, we include both IE6 and IE7 updates in the AutoPatcher XP release, if both sets of updates are immediately available to the user through the selection window, the user either might possibly install an update they really shouldn't have and mess up their system, or would have a load of updates in the list that refuse to install and would totally confuse them.

we've always done it this way, just more so with the 5.6 releases because detection has improved so much.

[Angelico_Payne]

Sorry about poor explanation it was pretty late over here so i garbled out...

I ment when I nlite all the patches that are the part of AP package :

1. Will they all be applied to setup files, or do I still have to use AP after to install additional updates. E.G. will both WM11 and Wm11 updates be nlited or only WM11, and i have to use AP to apply these WM11 patches post install of windows?

2.Is there a way i can integrate all patches that are part of AP package, and if yes, do i have to follow certain order... e.g. first integrating WM11 before integrating WM11 updates?

[+theblazingangel MVC]

i have no idea, i've never used nlite myself, however since your grabbing all of the files from the autopatcher installation directly, theres a good chance nlite will slipstream everything, but i can't garanty it because i've never done it

[Angelico_Payne]

I guess I have a new adventure ahead of me ^^ :) I will report in result and also publish all related info of any use.

I think this is a future, and possibly a way to reduce AP size from this day foward, offcourse if it is easy and foolproof...

[PsiMoon314]

Hi,

Well getting back to the thread title, I to am also seeing strange installation issues with AP XP 5.6. :crazy:

This includes instances where large numbers of patches are showing up on Windows Update but are marked as installed in AP XP 5.6

I am also seeing instances where items do appear to be correctly installed but are showing up in AP XP 5.6 as NOT installed.

Where do we go from here?

I have information available which might help to debug this however I am not sure what might be useful to the developers or what they need to help resolve this?

For example I have a QFECHECK dump of all of the hotfixes which are marked as needing re-installation, the log files from all of the hotfix installers and a list of what Windows Update has listed as needing installation.

So guys where do we go from here?

The one thought I have is the installation order may be different / wrong and needs to be corrected.

How does AP XP 5.6 control the order of the items selected for installation?

Kind Regards

Simon

[+theblazingangel MVC]

a bunch of info that may help...

---

from my own experience, after completing the releases and running the latest one on my own system just a little while before i uploaded them, the following updates re-downloaded via automatic updates (i wrote them down): KB931768, KB923694, KB925398, KB926255, KB928255.

i did notice an installation problem with one old but recently added hotfix on the family pc afterwards, and someone else has also reported this and believes it's because i used the /overwriteoem swithc rather than /o, this will be fixed in the next release (goes and checks that it's in the todo list... which it is).

----

the installation order from my perspective should be exactly the same as all previous releases. the only possibility is if raptor changed something in the application itself, either through a bug, or maybe installing updates not collectively by the ReleaseDate property (replaces old priority property), but in groups depending on ReleaseDate of parent modules.

However, i don't see why installation order should cause an issue.

personally i suspect that it's perhaps to do with windows update v7 and a new hotfix related to it.

----

detection of installed hotfixes has certainly changed. previously we used registry detection. now were using hopefully much more reliable file based detection.

every windows update should install a .cat file into C:\WINDOWS\system32\CatRoot\{F750E6C3-38EE-11D1-85E5-00C04FC295EE}.

detection for updates looks for the relevant .cat file, checks it's MD5 hash, and if it's a match, detection passes (the update is already installed).

one reason for using this new form of detection is to, for example, tell the difference between KB904706 v1 and KB904706 v2. each version will install a .cat file with a different MD5 hash.

if you want to verify detection for yourself: go to the folder mentioned above, get the MD5 hash of the .cat file relating to the update your querying, open the relevant module .apm file, check the path (should be windows:\system32\CatRoot\{F750E6C3-38EE-11D1-85E5-00C04FC295EE}, or perhaps system32:\CatRoot\{F750E6C3-38EE-11D1-85E5-00C04FC295EE}), check the filename, and check the MD5 hash.

if it's just the MD5 that is wrong, then perhaps thats a bug and you have a newer version of the patch.

----

i do want to resolve this. the most likely cause though could be to do with the windows update v7, or a problem with the windows update database.

edit: oops, i wrote all the above thinking it was to do with updates re-appearing on windows update, perhaps that was another thread, still, perhaps some of it may help somehow...

[PsiMoon314]

Hi Blaze,

Installation order is clearly part of this issue as running AP 5.6 XP a second time shows additional updates or updates that did not install correctly the first time around.

A quick glance shows that some of these are this are related to IE7 or WMP11 so we need to check the installation order to see if WMP11 and IE7 are installed first prior to their respective updates and hotfixes.

I don't remember this being an issue with AP 5.1 so I believe something has changed with the installation order of the items selected.

I am now showing 22 items (20 critical, 2 optional) on Windows Update (not Microsoft Update) that need to be installed.

Some of these are new items are not in AP XP 5.6 however many of them are clearly the ones which QFECHECK is flagging as needs reinstalling.

QFECHECK would appear to be flagging the bad hotfix installs so what ever QFECHECK checks for hotfix installation is clearly what WU also checks. AP XP 5.6 is showing these items as installed, so .CAT files and MD5SUM's not withstanding something is wrong.

Can AP XP 5.6 do both .CAT file and Registry checks when checking hotfix installs or is it one or the other?

I am thinking that if I add old style registry checks back into the the failed .APM files, as a test, this might show something. If this would then allow AP XP 5.6 to reinstall the broken hotfixes on a second installation round this would at last be a workaround.

It may be that all of these hotfixes are installed correctly but if QFECHECK and WU disagree this needs to be resolved as it was not an issue with AP 5.1.

One thought that may help would be to check the AP code to see if AP 5.6 checks for pending reboots before ANY installs are done. If it doesn't then checking this and forcing a reboot if required might be a good idea to ensure the OS is in a consistent state before starting.

I also wonder if any junk left in the %TEMP% folder might be causing issues?

As a suggestion why not post the "To-Do" list for the next version of AP XP 5.6 in a sticky closed thread so we don't all end up re-inventing the wheel! :)

Will report further when I have more info ...

Kind Regards

Simon

[+theblazingangel MVC]

okay, i'm getting a little confused about where the issue lies, whether its: with autopatcher not installing updates that were checked, but installing them the second time around; updates reappearing on windows update that autopatcher thinks are installed; or both.

the first post suggests that it's the first thing - autopatcher is run on a clean system, and on a second run some updates didn't install. now, some updates are only available in the selection screen when a certain version of a component is installed (happens with wmp and ie updates). for example, if you install ie7 with autopatcher, the next time you run autopatcher, ie6 updates will be hidden and ie7 updates displayed.

however, that explanation only covers one of the updates listed in the first post.

what confuses me even more is the fact that two of the updates mentioned in the first post (KB890046 and KB924496) were removed in previous autopatcher releases. so perhaps the original posters problem is the same as PsiMoon314's and is to do with windows update showing updates that should already be installed.

now, your problem @PsiMoon314, windows update re-listing updates that should be installed already. well first of all, the first part of your last post (about wmp11 and ie7 updates), can be explained as above, wmp11 and ie7 updates are hidden until there respective updated components are installed.

the second part (about windows update) is harder to explain. i haven't got a list of updates from you but if we look at the updates listed in the first post and assume it's the same issue, a lot of those updates were included in autopatcher a long time before this new release. now, autopatcher thinks these updates are installed and windows update doesn't, correct? well this is certainly odd. now, autopatcher has included many of these updates before, autopatcher using both registry and .cat file detection has thought previously and does think currently that they're installed. windows update has always previously thought they were installed. now, what has changed in the new release, well, autopatcher has and so has it's detection but yet it still thinks these updates are still installed and so theres no change there. windows update has also changed, and it thinks a load of these updates are not installed.

the conclusion that i draw is that it's not a problem with autopatcher at all, but with the new version of windows update. one or a combination of the following: windows update v7; KB927891 v3 which accompanies it; or msxml v6.0 sp1.

[PsiMoon314]

Hi Blaze,

Well the issues with IE7 and WMP11 hotfixes can be put to one side for the moment if they are really hidden until IE7 and WMP11 are installed.

This seems to be a change from AP 5.1 but I can live with it for now or I can customize my copy to fix this.

The issue is that AP XP 5.6 thinks that a whole bunch of updates are installed correctly when QFECHECK and WU say they are not.

I will attach screen-shots and log files tomorrow when I have a few moments to spare. I have QFECHECK, Hotfix installer and other logs which might show something.

I guess one or more of those three new updates could be responsible however it's difficult to tell what order things are installed by AP 5.6 so it might be difficult to find out which one is causing the problem.

The problem is bad that hotfix installs are performed because AP XP 5.6 is marking them as installed when they are not.

I would be useful to find out how QFECHECK determines that a hotfix is really installed or the install was broken.

I will do some checking to find out.

Kind Regards

Simon

PS Found it - http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?...;NoWebContent=1

[SevenYearBitch]

I hope you guys can help me. I'm having problems adjusting to the new Autopatcher XP. I just started using it about five months ago and until now had not a single problem. Now I'm having nothing but problems.

I, too, am encountering the same thing as someone earlier - I'll tick the boxes for the critical updates, it appears to install them, then gives me the click on finish, then reboot procedure. I reboot, then restart AP so I can try to move onto the next install (I'm trying one at a time at this point) and again, it shows that I haven't installed the previous ones.

Another case in point is that I will deselect everything, then go back and click to install IE7. It'll say it should take about three minutes, but takes only about 10 seconds, finishes, I click to finish and reboot. After rebooting, I load IE and check the version and it's still showing version 6. I checked the iexplore.exe file itself for version number and it shows version 6.something

Did I do anything wrong along the way? Prior to running the latest AutoPatcher, I uninstalled the previous stuff as directed. I'm at wit's end here. I would like to have the critical updates I missed from not updating my system for three months while waiting for the new Auto Patcher, but I'm really in need of a holiday (vacation) after all this.

Please advise,

kitty, aka SevenYearBitch ("kitty" already was taken, darnit)

[+theblazingangel MVC]

^ your problem maybe something else entirely:

4) Installation wizzes by in about 10 seconds but nothing installs

Likely cause: you have non-alphanumeric characters in your Windows username! I.E. only user names with numbers, letters and possibly spaces will work!

Note, altering your username in Windows User Accounts will, i believe, simply change what's displayed, not what is used behind the scenes! You should be able to change it properly via the admin tool 'computer management', or else create a new user account.

[Almost_UpToDate]

I am having a similar experience. I run Autopatcher and install the 22 updates it has selected. This seems to run normally and at the end I do the re-boot. If I run Autopatcher again it selects the same 22 updates. I have now run Autopatcher 3 times and it still says I need to install 22 updates. The updates in question are:

KB923191, KB922819, KB921434, KB923980, KB924270, KB923694, KB926255, KB929969, KB928843, KB924667, KB926436, KB927779, KB923723, KB927802, KB928255, KB918118, KB925902, KB931784, KB932168, KB930178, KB931261, KB931768.

How do I see if they are installed or not?

I don?t know if it makes any difference but I have not installed IE 7 or WMP 11.

Thanks for any information and thanks for Autopatcher.

Almost

[SevenYearBitch]

^ your problem maybe something else entirely:

Nopers. I always make sure to have user names/IDs simple, strictly alpha, all lower case.

I tried uninstalling AP then re-installing it again, this time installing only the core first. I never even got to installing the additional parts, as I ran right back into the same problem.

After firing up AP, it would default to those same two critical update patches - nothing else. Okay, go with the flow, I think. Reboot. Fire up AP again. Errrr! Nope. Defaults back to the same two critical updates, as though they never installed. I un-tick those and try IE 7.

Same thing happens - acts like it is installing, says it'll take about 3 minutes to install, the progress bar moves appropriately to about 1/5 or so of the way, then speeds quickly to the end, says voila, all is good, time to reboot. I reboot, open a browser window, check version and Errrr! Still version 6.something

Story short: AP isn't working for me. I know I downloaded the correct version - Windows XP SP2, old-school 32 bit version. If this helps any, I somehow already have Media Player 11 installed. I found that after checking the version of it, following errored install of MP 10. Why that was included, I don't know, as I had to have installed MP 11 through a previous version of AP.

Soooooo... what to do now?

[SevenYearBitch]

Just for grins n' giggles, I tried uninstalling AP, then reinstalling again. I also tried logging in under Administrator, just to be sure that nothing can be attributed to my personalised login (admin privies and all, just different name) and I ran AP from there. Nope. Same exact thing.

Is it possible that there still are traces of the old AP that are disallowing the new one to "take over?" I don't see how, but then I'm not as familiar with things any more since I switched to XP. I held out for years and went straight from Win 98se to XP, so the whole accounts/networking thing is even now still a bit of a mystery. That's one reason I logged in under "Administrator" this time, but still nothing installs.

Anyone?