CVG: First party devs instrumental in making PS4 what it is

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Sony's big shtick at its PS4 press event was this impression that the new console is a "super-charged PC" built with developer feedback in mind. Guerrilla reveals to CVG that - as a first-party studio - it was part of the consultation process and had a sizeable input in the final system specs."This was the first time we did this with PlayStation, where you get the entire group of core developers together and consistently give very deep, profound feedback on everything system-related, and that's really awesome," ter Heide said.

"The guys who made it are no longer in an ivory tower in Tokyo, [the development has been] shared with us and not just with us, but with Evolution, Santa Monica, Naughty Dog, everybody and together we've built the machine.

"I think because it's so embedded in the work that we do, we who make games on a daily basis, it's a gamer's machine. That's the end result of it. I think Mark Cerny said at one point [in the PS4 conference] that it's a machine by gamers, for gamers, and I really think that's the essence of it. They've made sure that all the focus is just on how we can make the games as good as possible."The console's power is only one aspect of the PlayStation 4 that Guerrilla helped design. The new controller, the DualShock 4, was also the result of a collaboration between Guerrilla and other development teams. Each team told Sony exactly what it was looking for from Sony in terms of the genres they were most familiar with working on.

Evolution Studios offered feedback on the motion control aspects with racing games in mind, while Guerrilla asked for the controller to be more suited to FPS gaming. "It's a great controller for an FPS," ter Heide says.

"We've been having these discussions about putting a headset jack in there because everybody should be able to go online and have a chat, and they put it in there and it's awesome. It sounds like a lot of really simple features that we've put in there but they make all the difference because it's in one comprehensive package."For example, there are little tweaks to the indentation on the sticks, where you have your thumbs on them, we've slightly raised them so there's a little bit more precision. They're slight changes but they make a huge difference."

Hulst agrees: "I think it's a big step forward from what we have [on PS3]. It feels incredibly accurate, in your hands it feels solid, it feels really high quality with the materials that have been used, it feels like you're in control and particularly with that feeling of being a Shadow Marshal, this big hero guy with extra capabilities, it's very suitable. And like we said earlier, we've been feeding back on what it should be for so long that I think we have what we wanted to have. It's very suitable for Killzone."

While talking to the two, one thing is clear - Sony has turned to Guerrilla to be a key software provider for both home console and handheld, as well as its new approach to peer-developed hardware.

"The number of hours of feedback we've given on [the controller] to get it exactly to what we want - with the outward curving triggers, the indentations - and from all these different studios doing the same thing, it's a lot of detailed stuff, making games but also making hardware for games," Hulst says.

"And that's great, because since we've worked on it so long and given feedback on it, that's the reason we're quite confident today as a group of developers, because we know where it was and the path it's taken so we know that once it's in the hands of users, of people who love core gaming experiences, that it'll work well."

Source: http://www.computerandvideogames.com/393510/killzone-shadow-fall-preview-ps4/?page=2#top_banner

[spaceelf]

The irony is Sony is one of the most notable failures on getting their current IP up to date on PC (dx11 and such) so they'll be coming from behind on building better quality assets.

[soniqstylz]

The irony is Sony is one of the most notable failures on getting their current IP up to date on PC (dx11 and such) so they'll be coming from behind on building better quality assets.

Well, considering the PS4 won't support DX, I'm confused as to how this relates.

[spaceelf]

Well, considering the PS4 won't support DX, I'm confused as to how this relates.

...wow

They're still releasing games that look like last gen console games. Those assets could certainly be shoved right onto the PS4, but it'd look terrible. Where if you shoved assets from Battlefield 3s PC ver onto it, they'd look pretty damn good.

Not really sure how that needed an explanation, but whatever works.

[soniqstylz]

...wow

They're still releasing games that still look like last gen console games. Those assets could certainly be shoved right onto the PS4, but it'd look terrible. Where if you shoved assets from Battlefield 3s PC ver onto it, they'd look pretty damn good.

Not really sure how that needed an explanation, but whatever works.

Completely different dev studios. Naughty Dog, Sucker Punch, Polyphony, Guerilla, Media Molecule -- none of those are making PC games. And only one or two SOE PC games outside of PSN ports make it anywhere near a PS3 (DC Universe and Free Realms).

So, again, not sure how this relates to PS4.

[spaceelf]

Completely different dev studios. Naughty Dog, Sucker Punch, Polyphony, Guerilla, Media Molecule -- none of those are making PC games. And only one or two SOE PC games outside of PSN ports make it anywhere near a PS3 (DC Universe and Free Realms).

So, again, not sure how this relates to PS4.

The dev studios make the game the publisher pays for. They obviously didn't pay for decent assets.

And although the PS3 would be a difficult proposition for an MMO that wasn't built with it in mind, the PS4 is capable of any of them.

See Planetside 2. It should be better than it is...it is not.

Completely different dev studios. Naughty Dog, Sucker Punch, Polyphony, Guerilla, Media Molecule -- none of those are making PC games. And only one or two SOE PC games outside of PSN ports make it anywhere near a PS3 (DC Universe and Free Realms).

So, again, not sure how this relates to PS4.

Also none of that refutes my point, since all of those studios were building lower quality assets that can't be easily used in the newer consoles.

[TheLegendOfMart]

I'm confused why lower quality assets matter on the new consoles?

It's unlikely they will re-use old graphics engines and in the process of either updating or coding new graphics engines they will recreate assets?

I think its far more likely that they have high resolution/quality assets and downscaled from there, GT5 for example all the "premium" cars were created at higher than PS3 capable detail ready for next gen.

As for Planetside 2 its a f2p MMO, the graphics are low enough so that people with crap PCs can also get in on the act, the whole point is to be compatible and playable on as many PCs as possible to rake in microtransaction money, hence why it doesn't look next gen.

[spaceelf]

It will take longer to create better assets for studios who aren't already doing it.

The dev pipeline isn't something you can just flip a switch with, your engines have to be ready for it, graphics teams, shader programmers, etc. It takes time. Of course, they've had time to learn it, but that wouldn't be an issue if their teams were ready for it in advance.

As for Planetside 2 its a f2p MMO, the graphics are low enough so that people with crap PCs can also get in on the act, the whole point is to be compatible and playable on as many PCs as possible to rake in microtransaction money, hence why it doesn't look next gen.

You can have dx9 and dx11 engines and make everyone happy. Many devs do! And people with crap PCs can still get in on the act!

[HawkMan]

I'm confused why lower quality assets matter on the new consoles?

It's unlikely they will re-use old graphics engines and in the process of either updating or coding new graphics engines they will recreate assets?

I think its far more likely that they have high resolution/quality assets and downscaled from there, GT5 for example all the "premium" cars were created at higher than PS3 capable detail ready for next gen.

As for Planetside 2 its a f2p MMO, the graphics are low enough so that people with crap PCs can also get in on the act, the whole point is to be compatible and playable on as many PCs as possible to rake in microtransaction money, hence why it doesn't look next gen.

Unlikely they will reuse old engines and assets ...

is this your first new console launch ? you can't be serious.

and the GT5 premium cars where created at the detil level the PS3 could handle. for a limited number of cars. whenever in 2020 they release GT6 for the PS4 they won't reuse any high detail GT5 models, they will remake everything.

As for Planestide, ummm, it's called LOD. it's heavily employed in games allowing gamers with low end computers to play the game at crap graphics will players with new computers can play with awesome settings.

[TheLegendOfMart]

No need to be so condescending like you are the font of all knowledge, getting real tired of your attitude.

I meant reusing old engines in the sense that they are hardly going to just leave the engine as is and put a game out using PS3 assets.

The GT5 premium cars were created at the detail level that SURPASSES the PS3, they were downscaled for use on the PS3.

A few more interesting quotes have emerged from the GT5 article in the latest ?PlayStation: The Official Magazine (UK)?. According to Kazunori Yamauchi, Polyphony Digital has essentially future-proofed the game?s 200+ ?Premium Cars?:

?The level of precision we?ve achieved [in GT5] is actually more suited to the next generation of machines. The detail that goes into a premium model [has] gone beyond the level of the current PlayStation.?

As for PS2, what I said was poorly worded, my point was they have to make the game run on a massive variation of power and specs.

[HawkMan]

what level they created the car models at is pure marketing speak. anyone who does 3D modeling especially for games can tell you that.

you don't create models with more details than you need, especially not on mechanical stuff like cars, since you can't do automatic poly reduction on them without horrible deformations. So making models at a higher detail level than you need means one thing. you wasted time and thousands of dollars making a useless model you can't use, as the lower level model has to be made from "scratch" anyway.

What they mean is that they scanned a point cloud that's far more detailed than they need, or they crafted a high res "skeleton"/proxy car model from photos to use as references when building the actual game model.

Neither of those models are at all suitable to be used in a game, next gen or future gen, they're to high poly for it, and more importantly in this case, they're not built to be game models and don't have the "mechanics".

or to put it simply, they lied. they do that. all of them. besides, they use the premium models in the game so obviously that's not really true either. it was just a scapegoat for them instead of saying "It would cost to much to create high res models of all the cars"

As for

I meant reusing old engines in the sense that they are hardly going to just leave the engine as is and put a game out using PS3 assets.

you must have forgotten the PS3 and 360 launch, that was EXACTLY what happened last time, and it'll happen again. You won't see a true next gen platform game until months down the road, and even then they'll be Next gen lite, there may be a couple of first or "second" party exceptions, but in general... new console launches are generally very dissapointing in this regard. the xbox has the advantage of directX so it might adapt "next gen" faster, but in general it's gonna be a while. it doesn't get exciting until after 6-12 months.