For 7 years, VW software thwarted pollution regulations [Updated]

[DocM]

Oh. Brother....VW is in huge trouble in the US. 

It seems they had their diesel emissions system programmed to pass emissions standards when attached to testing gear, but once it was disconnected they were spewing at 40x the legal standards to get better performance. 

Their stock nosedive after it went public, and they're now subject to monsterous fines - in the $billions.

http://m.phys.org/news/2015-09-years-vw-software-thwarted-pollution.html

[peacemf]

I don't understand how they could do this without getting caught earlier on. I'm assuming it's software based, as hardware surely a mechanic will pick this up.

im guessing it will just be a fine and nothing else considering all corporations get away with this type of thing

[Rigby]

[Roger H. Veteran]

Its all software used to change the characteristics of the Engine while under certain testing conditions (Dyno and so forth). 

Crazy its been going on this long and nobody noticed but yeah, some heads gonna roll and some big fines gonna be levied!

[ITOps]

Regulation wise it would be best for the country for all software to be audited for automobiles.  Even F1 code to help insure the code is not giving drives unfair advantages during races, is not setup to bypass safety checks for the drivers sake and meet the strict F1 regulations.  Maybe a secure framework for cars as it has been proven over and over again that the car manufactures do not place security and following the rules as top priorities.

[DefyTheOutcome]

I don't understand how they could do this without getting caught earlier on. I'm assuming it's software based, as hardware surely a mechanic will pick this up.

im guessing it will just be a fine and nothing else considering all corporations get away with this type of thing

 

There are rumors of criminal investigations being prepared in the US and several countries including Germany.

Me, I cannot understand the lack of ethics for the software developers/management

Besides, it is not just 482000 cars in the US, it is 11 millions cars worldwide, in all the brands of the VW groups.

Ultimately, it is not just the fines but the damage to the images of the VW brands that are going to be devastating: Audi and Porsche namely, plus the stock exchange drop that will make German bankers and government very very very unhappy.

So, yes, heads will roll ...

 

[Tidosho]

Audi are likely already suffering after the massive widespread piston ring issue causing their engines to use too much oil. Putting that right as well as this new software issue is going to cost Volkswagen Audi Group (I can't abbreviate that because the swear filter gets it!) billions of dollars worldwide.

I'd avoid VW and Audi cars from now on, and that's a shame, because I love them.

[neufuse Veteran]

for once it's not something about GM in the USA on a massive scale..... I bet you everyone is cheating in some way or another be it very small or very large like potentially this

[Roger H. Veteran]

OH and it gets worse!

Volkswagen Admits 'Defeat Device' On 11 Million Engines Worldwide, Sets Aside $7.2B 

 

Noch einmal!:

Oh SNAP indeed!

http://jalopnik.com/volkswagen-admits-it-cheated-with-11-million-engines-s-1732283322

[neufuse Veteran]

OH and it gets worse!

Volkswagen Admits 'Defeat Device' On 11 Million Engines Worldwide, Sets Aside $7.2B 

 

Oh SNAP indeed!

http://jalopnik.com/volkswagen-admits-it-cheated-with-11-million-engines-s-1732283322

wow that was fast.... personally I always thought something felt odd about the VW TDI but thought that was just me

[MikeChipshop Member]

Oo ouch, but serves them right.

[Roger H. Veteran]

VW - VOW-DE lost another 20% on the German DAX

http://data.cnbc.com/quotes/VOW-DE

[peacemf]

wonder who else has been doing this...

because the vw group......what about mercedes/bmw/blah blah blah.......they all use similar parts......seems more likely others will be involved....

[+illumination Subscriber²]

wonder who else has been doing this...

because the vw group......what about mercedes/bmw/blah blah blah.......they all use similar parts......seems more likely others will be involved....

Possibly, but the article specifically mentions that the BMW X5 passed, so perhaps not.

 

WVU tested three cars in real-world conditions— a 2012 VW Jetta, a 2013 VW Passat and a BMW X5 SUV. The BMW passed, but the university found significantly higher emissions from the Volkswagens, according to the EPA.

[DocM]

The CEO is "endlessly sorry". Yeah, sorry they got caught. What slimes.

http://m.phys.org/news/2015-09-vw-ceo-endlessly-tarnishing-brand.html

[Mr. Gibs]

for once it's not something about GM in the USA on a massive scale..... I bet you everyone is cheating in some way or another be it very small or very large like potentially this

True. VW should have killed a bunch of people like GM and then they'd have only been fined $900 million!

Either way, glad to see the fine is actually a substantial amount and it is causing the company a lot of hurt. Maybe now they'll think twice before doing it again.

Edited September 22, 2015 by -Razorfold

[FunkyMike]

Dear Volkswagen: This Was Your Biggest Mistake

 

As we previously commented when it comes to justice, there are those companies that have been bailed out by the US Government, and then there is everyone else. Case in point, GM, which last Thursday was fined $900 million for covering up its faulty ignition switches that caused at least 124 deaths and hundreds of injuries.

And then there is Volkswagen, which earlier today took out a record charge of €6.5 billion, one which many think will be insufficient before all it set and done, following its own snafu involving manipulating emissions tests to make its cars appear "cleaner" than they were.

...

Yes, GM killed people, but Volkswagen killed the air!

While one can debate whose crime is greater, it is quite clear that the punitive damages so far are orders of magnitude apart.

Why? This is precisely what Volkswagen executives, many of whom will lose their jobs in the coming days, are scratching their heads over.

We would like to take this opportunity to explain to them "how it is done" in the US.

....

To summarize Volkswagen's biggest mistake: it was not poisoning the environment, it wasn't even getting caught. It was this:

 

Source: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-22/dear-volkswagen-was-your-biggest-mistake

[DefyTheOutcome]

The CEO is "endlessly sorry". Yeah, sorry they got caught. What slimes.

http://m.phys.org/news/2015-09-vw-ceo-endlessly-tarnishing-brand.html

Surprise! Volkswagen CEO Martin Winterkorn has (been) resigned from the company. I wonder who is going to be the brave, masochist, insane soul who is going to helm the company now and who will have to clean this whole mess.

Let's be blunt: trust in any of the VW group brands is gone: I am sure people who have VW cars are wondering if they are even going to sell them; suspicions is going high for all the other car manufacturers, since one cheated, what if the other cheated

The image of the German engineering excellence is tainted; $18B of company value is now thin air, German bankers and hedge fund managers are likely ###### because VW stocks were so reliable for their profits and some Forbes journalists have a sad diet of crows http://www.forbes.com/sites/kbrauer/2015/08/31/volkswagen-creatively-countering-its-carbon-footprint/

 

 

[Draconian Guppy]

Though they proved they had an emission detector algorythm I thought it wasn't proved what is was for?

[Macsen]

Though they proved they had an emission detector algorythm I thought it wasn't proved what is was for?

Nope, VW confessed it was to cheat emissions tests.

[TruckWEB]

I'd love to resign with a package like that....

http://fortune.com/2015/09/23/ceo-volkswagen-pension/

Winterkorn is due a pension of approximately $32 million.  He may also get a large severance package to go along with the payout depending on what the board decides.

[Draconian Guppy]

I'd love to resign with a package like that....

http://fortune.com/2015/09/23/ceo-volkswagen-pension/

Winterkorn is due a pension of approximately $32 million.  He may also get a large severance package to go along with the payout depending on what the board decides.

“As CEO I accept responsibility for the irregularities that have been found in diesel engines and have therefore requested the supervisory board to agree on terminating my function as CEO,” said Winterkorn. “I am doing this in the interests of the company even though I am not aware of any wrongdoing on my part.”

Bloomberg reported that he was Germany’s second 

Basically he quit to say "it's not my fault, show me teh monies!"

[DefyTheOutcome]

Found that on autoblog.com http://www.autoblog.com/2015/09/30/vw-diesel-fix-would-have-cost-335-per-vehicle/

Since the Volkswagen diesel kerfuffle began, Bosch, the world's largest auto supplier, has been hooked up to a bullhorn trying to make sure everyone knows its side of the story. Bosch supplied VW with the engine management testing software, including delivery and metering modules, that VW then used to skirt emissions laws in the US. Bosch told VW in 2007 that it was illegal to use the software in cars it planned to sell yet VW did it anyway, according to reports coming out in German newspapers Bild am Sonntag and Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung.

That first warning came two years after VW started developing the small-displacement diesel, around the time that the two men pushing its development, then-brand chief Wolfgang Bernhard and engineer Rudolf Krebs, were telling their superiors that the engine needed AdBlue urea injection to pass US emissions. VW cost controllers wouldn't approve the AdBlue solution because it would add 300 euros ($335 US) to the cost of the vehicle. Bernhard and Krebs left the same year that Bosch advised VW about the software, two years before the engine went into production.

That's when things get cloudy. A report in Automotive News says that when Martin Winterkorn took over in 2007 as head of the VW Group and brand, he asked Ulrich Hackenberg and Wolfgang Hatz to keep working on the engine, and "[the] engine then ended up in VW Group diesels" with that problematic software still intact. No one has yet pointed any fingers at this latter chain of command, but like a game of Clue, right now they're the professors in the library holding the candlesticks.

Warnings didn't only come from the supplier: Frankfurter says VW's initial investigation has found that an engineer issued thesame caution to the company in 2011. Neither Bosch nor VW would comment on the reports.

$335 x 482000 = $ 161,470,000 of profit compared to a fine that is going to be at least 10 times the value. Since when managers and cost controllers fail that hard at basic substraction????

[The Evil Overlord]

This is one of the main reasons I always look for  a mechanic garage, and not a main dealer with the latest diagnostic machines first, I usually only go to tier 2 once my local mechanic admits defeat and the car in question NEEDS to be hooked up to diagnostics
(In my case, it was usually a faulty lamda sensor on my Omega)

[Draconian Guppy]

meh... I bet they did this knowingly, how many vehicles did they sell, how much cashflow did they get, etc.