Why a shutdown in Windows 8 / 10 is not a restart.


Recommended Posts

 

Ever since the dawn of the personal computer when a computer would act funny or miss-behave people would just turn the computer off (Sometimes for minutes or hours, when in fact the amount of time you leave it off makes no difference unless the issue is heat related) and turn it back on.

Starting with Windows 8, Microsoft wanted to make “Windows” Boot faster when you press the power button to turn it on (The time between pressing the power button and arriving at the desktop). To accomplish this they created “Fast startup”.

Fast startup is a shutdown + Hibernation Hybrid. First, let’s talk about what hibernation is and how it works.

Hibernation allows you to turn the computer completely off (even unplug it if you wish) and when you turn it back on, you are right back where you left off including all the applications you had open.

How does all this voodoo work? For hibernation to work, windows looks at how much Ram (memory) you have in your computer.

It then creates a file on your hard drive called HIBERFIL.SYS. Back in the days of Windows 2000 and Windows ME, this file was the exact same size as the amount of ram your computer has so if you had 2GB of ram you would of had a 2GB hiberfil.sys file. In Windows 7 they set the file size to 75% and in Windows 8 the file size is smaller yet, due to not hibernating user data during shutdown.

When you tell your computer to hibernate, it takes the contents of your ram and dumps it into the HIBERFIL.SYS file. Then the computer shuts off.

When you turn the computer back on, the reverse happens. It takes the contents of HIBERFIL.SYS and puts it back into ram and your computer is now booted. One reason this is faster is that typical spinning hard drives are much faster at large single files than thousands of small files.

Now that you know how hibernation works, let’s take a look at how fast startup works. The fast startup works by not hibernating the entire system but just the core functions, such as the kernel (the lowest level of the system), system drivers (software that tells your devices how to operate), and a few others.
.
When you turn your computer off in Windows 8 and Windows 10, it first closes all your applications, then it logs off and dumps the system files listed above into the HIBERFIL.SYS file and your machine shuts off.

When you turn the machine back on, it will start faster because half of the boot process is transferred directly back into ram, in the exact state it was in before the shutdown, problems and all.

This is also why when you select restart instead of shut down it feels like your system takes longer to startup. When you select restart nothing is hibernated and the system has to start everything from scratch.

Hopefully, you can see now why turning your computer off and back on in Windows 8 and Windows 10 is pretty worthless for solving any sort of problems and why it’s much better to select restart.

The issue I have with Fast Startup is that they told the average user NONE of this. How is the average person supposed to know that turning the computer off and back on won't solve their problem? After all, the process looks the same and it worked just fine in Windows 3.1, Windows 95, 98,ME, XP, Vista and Windows 7.

One customer was running Windows 8 and was having problems accessing their email. They were trying to open their email program but nothing was happening. I asked them if they restarted their computer and they told me yes, they turned the computer off 3 times and it still won't work. So I walked them through selecting "Restart" instead of "Shutdown" and after the "restart," their email opened up first try.

Hello,

 

I have upgraded all of my computers to SSDs for at least their boot drives over the years, and find that booting from a powered down state to the logon screen to be fast enough that I disable the hibernation and suspend features of the operating system. 

 

One small bonus to this is that I gain the space back previously used by the HIBERFIL.SYS file on the boot drive (which can be considerable on workstations with 64-96GB of RAM), but the major reason I do this is to avoid incompatibilities with the computer's device drivers that sometimes do not handle the transitions between the different power/suspend states very well.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

  • Like 2

Huh not something that I knew :)

 

Personally, being the family "IT guy", if someone has an issue, I always suggest a restart.  More than likely, the issue that they're having is something they want to try again ad see if it's been resolved so I haven't come across that "feature". 

 

Personally, given how little power is used during hibernation, most of the machines that I use frequently aren't ever shut down, they're either restarted or hibernated. 

 

MS should remove the other options from the power menu and keep just restart or hibernate. 

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:23, dipsylalapo said:

Huh not something that I knew :)

 

Personally, being the family "IT guy", if someone has an issue, I always suggest a restart.  More than likely, the issue that they're having is something they want to try again ad see if it's been resolved so I haven't come across that "feature". 

 

Personally, given how little power is used during hibernation, most of the machines that I use frequently aren't ever shut down, they're either restarted or hibernated. 

 

MS should remove the other options from the power menu and keep just restart or hibernate. 

Expand  

What about cases where you'd want a full shutdown (storm, machine move, hardware maint.)?

  On 04/09/2018 at 17:48, warwagon said:

It then creates a file on your hard drive called HIBERFIL.SYS. This file is the exact same size as the amount of ram your computer has.

Expand  

this is wrong.

on all my systems, where I leave hibernation enabled, the hiberfil.sys file is always much smaller than the amout of RAM in the system.

 

 -andy-

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:26, Squirrelington said:

What about cases where you'd want a full shutdown (storm, machine move, hardware maint.)?

Expand  

Fair points! I stand corrected!

  • Like 1
  On 06/09/2018 at 12:26, Squirrelington said:

What about cases where you'd want a full shutdown (storm, machine move, hardware maint.)?

Expand  

Hibernation is a full shut down. Sleep would not be, but Hibernation is. With Hibernation the computer is OFF!

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:27, AndyMutz said:

this is wrong.

on all my systems, where I leave hibernation enabled, the hiberfil.sys file is always much smaller than the amout of RAM in the system.

 

 -andy-

Expand  

I'll edit it. The size probably changes as to how much ram you are are using. After looking it up it appears that in windows 2000 the file was the entire size, but I guess it expands and contracts with other versions of windows.

  • Like 2
  On 06/09/2018 at 12:37, warwagon said:

Hibernation is a full shut down. Sleep would not be, but Hibernation is. With Hibernation the computer is OFF!

Expand  

So you could in theory disconnect from the power and move the machine etc. 

 

How would a machine deal with a hardware upgrade in hibernation?

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:39, dipsylalapo said:

So you could in theory disconnect from the power and move the machine etc. 

 

How would a machine deal with a hardware upgrade in hibernation?

Expand  

Yes, you can disconnect the power and move the computer. I'm curious, did you read the part where I explained how hibernation worked? lol

Always hated hibernation as most every machine I've ever owned, or worked on, had issues when resuming. One of the first things I always used to do was disable that crap! I'll either use sleep or turn the computer off when done. Have never left computers on, even over night! I'm on a different one or 2 every day anyway.

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:41, warwagon said:

Yes, you can disconnect the power and move the computer. I'm curious, did you read the part where I explained how hibernation worked? lol

Expand  

Just re-iterating what you said :rofl: 

 

What about hardware upgrades?

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:55, dipsylalapo said:

Just re-iterating what you said :rofl: 

 

What about hardware upgrades?

Expand  

My guess would be yes. Because most people wouldn't know they are in a hybrid state and would always turn the computer off to upgrade their hardware.

 

That being said, if you want to clone a Windows 8 or 10 hard drive with true image, it will bomb out almost instantly if you just turn the computer off, pull the drive in and clone on another machine. If you are pulling the drive, either turn hibernation off, or restart and when the computer starts to come back on turn it off and then pull the drive.

Was doing remote support with someone who was having issues with their usb printer printing. It would print but it would take a few mins. Looked at the system boot time and it was 8/16/2018. I asked him when the last time he restarted it was (which obviously was 8/16/2018) he said "I just turned it on today" So I had to explain to him the difference between a shutdown and restart.

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:26, Squirrelington said:

What about cases where you'd want a full shutdown (storm, machine move, hardware maint.)?

Expand  

Win 10 - I had a game where it crashed and the sound was "stuck". Powered down, powered back up, stuck sound came back.
It wasn't until I did a "restart" no longer hearing the stuck sound.

Hello,

 

On Windows 10 (and perhaps earlier), you can adjust the size of the hibernation file so it is a percentage of RAM (as low as 40%).  For more information open an elevated Command Prompt (filename: CMD.EXE) and type in "POWERCFG /HIBERNATE ?" (without the quotes) and press Enter to see all of the options and their associated values.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

 

  On 06/09/2018 at 12:27, AndyMutz said:

this is wrong.

on all my systems, where I leave hibernation enabled, the hiberfil.sys file is always much smaller than the amout of RAM in the system.

 

 -andy-

Expand  

 

  • +Warwagon unlocked this topic

When first connecting to someone's computer for "Any" issue, I first open CMD and run  systeminfo to look at the "System boot time". If "Fast startup" is enabled the date will not change each time the computer is turned on and off, only when the computer is restarted.

 

Here is an example. My basement workstation has fast startup enabled and I JUST booted it up today 1/24/2022 at 3:30pm. Lets look at the system boot time. Even though I just turned it on, the machine hasn't actually been restarted since 1/18/2022.

 

image.png.fd9dbcdc9ce8875f0247c6d7f8aa3fd5.png

 

There have been times when the "System boot time" has been MONTHS ago!

I always initiate from an elevated command prompt powercfg -h off enter, reboot.  

 

The hiberfil.sys is notorious for corruption.

  • Like 3
  On 24/01/2022 at 21:40, xrobwx71 said:

I always initiate from an elevated command prompt powercfg -h off enter, reboot.  

 

The hiberfil.sys is notorious for corruption.

Expand  

This! I do that too on "Most" of my machines.

  On 24/01/2022 at 21:34, warwagon said:

When first connecting to someone's computer for "Any" issue, I first open CMD and run  systeminfo to look at the "System boot time". If "Fast startup" is enabled the date will not change each time the computer is turned on and off, only when the computer is restarted.

 

Here is an example. My basement workstation has fast startup enabled and I JUST booted it up today 1/24/2022 at 3:30pm. Lets look at the system boot time. Even though I just turned it on, the machine hasn't actually been restarted since 1/18/2022.

 

image.png.fd9dbcdc9ce8875f0247c6d7f8aa3fd5.png

 

There have been times when the "System boot time" has been MONTHS ago!

Expand  

Same. I find this commonly has caused issues for people with laptops who take it back/forth to the office, especially when group policy is involved, drive mappings, and the sort.

 

This is also why I don't even ask if people have restarted their computer anymore, mostly because they'll say yes when they've simply shut it down, assuming that restart and shutdown still mean the same thing. Anyway, disabling Fast Boot often times resolves those recurring issues.

  • Like 2
  On 24/01/2022 at 21:40, xrobwx71 said:

I always initiate from an elevated command prompt powercfg -h off enter, reboot.  

 

The hiberfil.sys is notorious for corruption.

Expand  

I do the same for every new install of Windows 8 and newer versions

 

This is what I use: powercfg /hibernate off

 

I did not know that h would do the same thing...

First thing I do with a system with a SSD is go into the power options and disable fast startup. I can live with a couple extra seconds and avoid the headaches when I have to pull data off a dead PC. Fast startup is a sloppy hack, IMO. 

 

Microsoft has 3 decades of OS development experience. They know how to make a good OS. Its time to stop cutting them slack.

 

And no, I can't do better and no I don't code. That's what the brainiacs of this multi-billion dollar company are supposed to be for.

Edited by JustGeorge
  On 26/01/2022 at 00:58, aioraito said:

I do the same for every new install of Windows 8 and newer versions

 

This is what I use: powercfg /hibernate off

 

I did not know that h would do the same thing...

Expand  

-h not just h. But yes, it does.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Posts

    • Google Chrome's new AI summarizes store reviews for you by Pradeep Viswanathan We frequently encounter various e-commerce websites while Browse online. Before placing an order, it’s common to look up reviews on Google to verify the site's legitimacy and product quality. Now, Google aims to streamline this process directly through the Chrome browser. For users in the US, Google Chrome now offers store reviews to improve your online shopping experience. Google is using Google Shopping data and other popular review websites to offer helpful insights. Here's how this feature works: When you visit an e-commerce website on Google Chrome, you can click the icon to the left of the web address. Google Chrome will then display an AI-generated summary of reviews. The summary will have details about customer service, product quality, shipping, pricing, and returns. On a related note, Google today announced the expansion of AI Mode to Google Search users in the UK. AI Mode is Google's AI-powered search experience, similar to Microsoft Bing's Copilot Search. While it may not be helpful for simple queries like asking for the weather or navigation queries, it will be helpful for more complex, multi-part questions and follow-ups. Google's AI Mode is built on a custom version of the Gemini 2.5 model, Google's flagship multi-modal AI model. The Google team wrote the following regarding the new AI Mode in Google Search: The new AI Mode will appear as a tab on the Google Search results page and is also available on mobile in the Google app for Android and iOS.
    • It was a matter of time. Anthropic must've been bleeding a lot of money with it.
    • OBS Studio 31.1.2 by Razvan Serea OBS Studio is software designed for capturing, compositing, encoding, recording, and streaming video content, efficiently. It is the re-write of the widely used Open Broadcaster Software, to allow even more features and multi-platform support. OBS Studio supports multiple sources, including media files, games, web pages, application windows, webcams, your desktop, microphone and more. OBS Studio Features: High performance real time video/audio capturing and mixing, with unlimited scenes you can switch between seamlessly via custom transitions. Live streaming to Twitch, YouTube, Periscope, Mixer, GoodGame, DailyMotion, Hitbox, VK and any other RTMP server Filters for video sources such as image masking, color correction, chroma/color keying, and more. x264, H.264 and AAC for your live streams and video recordings Intel Quick Sync Video (QSV) and NVIDIA NVENC support Intuitive audio mixer with per-source filters such as noise gate, noise suppression, and gain. Take full control with VST plugin support. GPU-based game capture for high performance game streaming Unlimited number of scenes and sources Number of different and customizable transitions for when you switch between scenes Hotkeys for almost any action such as start or stop your stream or recording, push-to-talk, fast mute of any audio source, show or hide any video source, switch between scenes,and much more Live preview of any changes on your scenes and sources using Studio Mode before pushing them to your stream where your viewers will see those changes DirectShow capture device support (webcams, capture cards, etc) Powerful and easy to use configuration options. Add new Sources, duplicate existing ones, and adjust their properties effortlessly. Streamlined Settings panel for quickly configuring your broadcasts and recordings. Switch between different profiles with ease. Light and dark themes available to fit your environment. …and many other features. For free. At all. OBS Studio 31.1.2 hotfix changes: Fixed an issue in OBS Studio 31.1.0 and 31.1.1 causing Multitrack Video to set the Maximum Video Tracks to 10 if the user had set it to "Auto" [dsaedtler] Fixed an issue in OBS Studio 31.1.0 and 31.1.1 causing Browser Source hardware acceleration to fail in the Flatpak version [reitowo/tytan652] Fixed an issue in OBS Studio 31.1.0 and 31.1.1 where progress bars were styled incorrectly [Warchamp7] Fixed an issue in OBS Studio 31.1.0 and 31.1.1 where spacing around scrollbars was incorrect [Warchamp7] Fixed an issue in OBS Studio 31.1.0 and 31.1.1 where Decklink Output did not work [CyBeRoni] Fixed a freeze in OBS Studio 31.1.0 and 31.1.1 on Linux when using PipeWire capture with explicit sync [YaLTeR] Fixed an issue where Video Capture Devices on Linux could unexpectedly stop capturing video [JiangXsong] Fixed an issue with PipeWire capture on Linux where video filters could cause gamma shift [tytan652] This was done by reverting a fix for white-tinted PipeWire captures in 10-bit or 16-bit color formats, so that issue will return for now. Download: OBS Studio 31.1.2 | Portable | ARM64 | ~200.0 MB (Open Source) View: OBS Studio Homepage | Other Operating Systems | Screenshot Get alerted to all of our Software updates on Twitter at @NeowinSoftware
    • Sandboxie Plus 1.16.2 / Classic 5.71.2 by Razvan Serea Run programs in a sandbox to prevent malware from making permanent changes to your PC. Sandboxie allows you to run your browser, or any other program, so that all changes that result from the usage are kept in a sandbox environment, which can then be deleted later. Sandboxie is a sandbox-based isolation software for 32- and 64-bit Windows NT-based operating systems. It is being developed by David Xanatos since it became open source, before that it was developed by Sophos (which acquired it from Invincea, which acquired it earlier from the original author Ronen Tzur). It creates a sandbox-like isolated operating environment in which applications can be run or installed without permanently modifying the local or mapped drive. An isolated virtual environment allows controlled testing of untrusted programs and web surfing. Sandboxie is available in two flavors Plus and Classic. Both have the same core components, this means they have the same level of security and compatibility. What's different is the user interface the Plus build has a modern Qt based UI which supports all new features that have been added since the project went open source. The Classic build has the old no longer developed MFC based UI, hence it lacks support for modern features, these features can however still be used when manually configured in the Sandboxie.ini. Sandboxie Plus 1.16.2 / Classic 5.71.2 changelog: Added added toggleable INI key validation to "Edit ini Section" #4915 (thanks offhub) added toggleable per-key tooltip support #4928 (thanks offhub) added option to use the new Qt Windows 11 style on SandMan #4927 (thanks LumitoLuma) Changed ImBox no longer updates container file timestamps when accessing an encrypted box volume Fixed fixed Windows 11 24H2 build 26100.4770 causes Firefox Portable 140.0.4 / 141.0 to stop responding upon starting it sandboxed #4920 fixed leak of encrypted sandbox key during password change (backported hardened ImBox from MajorPrivacy) CVE-2025-54422 fixed Firefox Nightly sandbox hook errors Removed removed obsolete Bullguard Internet Security template removed obsolete Bsecure CloudCare template removed obsolete CyberPatrol template Download: Sandboxie Plus (64-bit) | 23.6 MB (Open Source) Download: Sandboxie Classic (64-bit) | 3.0 MB Links: Sandboxie Website | GitHub | ARM64 | Screenshot Get alerted to all of our Software updates on Twitter at @NeowinSoftware
    • Indians never sing "I Think Indian" near giraffes.
  • Recent Achievements

    • Dedicated
      ataho31016 earned a badge
      Dedicated
    • First Post
      Gladiattore earned a badge
      First Post
    • Reacting Well
      Gladiattore earned a badge
      Reacting Well
    • Week One Done
      NeoWeen earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • One Month Later
      BA the Curmudgeon earned a badge
      One Month Later
  • Popular Contributors

    1. 1
      +primortal
      652
    2. 2
      ATLien_0
      261
    3. 3
      Xenon
      165
    4. 4
      neufuse
      142
    5. 5
      +FloatingFatMan
      107
  • Tell a friend

    Love Neowin? Tell a friend!