I'm not impressed with Apples long term MacOS support on older hardware.


Recommended Posts

Is the experience the same to when you install/use Windows Vista on Intel 3rd gen? There are no Vista graphics drivers for 3rd gen and graphics acceleration is not available for the patched macOS on unsupported hardware...

The Intel HD 4000 supports Metal, so Mid 2012 Mac Air's / Pro's still get GPU acceleration on an unofficial Big Sur install's, so in general work great.

 

Anything earlier than a 2012 Mac is out of luck in that regard, unless its a model where the GPU could be upgraded.

 

I don't think you'd want to use Big Sur on anything without Metal support now.

For example the time for minimizing a Safari window as per the patcher read me:

  • Late 2012 13" MacBook Pro: <1 second
  • Early 2011 13" MacBook Pro: 13 seconds
  • Late 2009 13" MacBook: 23 seconds

@NinjaGinger yup Microsoft are doing this now also, at least for now anything that runs Windows 10 should also run Windows 11 perfectly fine with a modified installer. That's not to say some future update is going to give you issues though, its a bit of a gamble.

 

It does make me think about giving Linux a go on my Mac Air at some point, historically I've never really been a fan of the desktop environments. Although I do think they have improved a lot in more recent times, distros like Pop!_OS intrigue me.

On 24/10/2021 at 04:04, InsaneNutter said:

Does make me think about giving Linux a go on my Mac Air at some point, historically I've never really been a fan of the desktop environments. Although I do think they have improved a lot in more recent times, distros like Pop!_OS intrigue me.

My 2012 MacBook pro, my 2012 iMac and 2010 Mac pro works perfectly fine with big sur and have GPU acceleration so I will not be thinking in upgrade to Linux or any other OS for a long time.

  • 1 year later...

Hey @Warwagon look into OpenCore Legacy Patcher. Everything is working wonderfully for me - I have Ventura on a 2013 Mac Air, 2013 Mac Pro and 2014 Mini. The setup couldn’t be easier - pop a USB in, let it download the OS and write the USB, patch the USB, install it, then run the patch on the boot drive. I haven’t had an OTA break it yet but I certainly wouldn’t run it in a production business. I’ll let the corporate overlords buy them a new Mac so I can “scrap” the old one by taking it home with my boss’s permission. I thought it would be slow and buggy but it’s the opposite - the patched version generally runs smoother than the officially supported kit. 

On 27/01/2023 at 10:17, crankysysadmin said:

Hey @Warwagon look into OpenCore Legacy Patcher. Everything is working wonderfully for me - I have Ventura on a 2013 Mac Air, 2013 Mac Pro and 2014 Mini. The setup couldn’t be easier - pop a USB in, let it download the OS and write the USB, patch the USB, install it, then run the patch on the boot drive. I haven’t had an OTA break it yet but I certainly wouldn’t run it in a production business. I’ll let the corporate overlords buy them a new Mac so I can “scrap” the old one by taking it home with my boss’s permission. I thought it would be slow and buggy but it’s the opposite - the patched version generally runs smoother than the officially supported kit. 

Ya, I looked into that, but part of the problem is this AIO has a s*** AMD Radeon graphics that's unsupported. A newer version of Mac OS would run, but without graphics acceleration. I got the newest version of Mac OS running in a 2012 but it had intel graphics.

On 24/04/2021 at 14:12, Warwagon said:

This is what all the computers do. This doesn't count all the spare laptops I have downstairs  probably 20+ most are old and given from customers. I also have 2 all in one PC's unused downstairs not on my list. I think I hoard laptops from a child hood experience. Was at radio shack late 80's early  90's and wanted a laptop to program basic in the basement. Obviously they were prohibitively expensive at the time. I Think that's why I hold on to these! To have what i Never had as a child :D I still fire some of the old ones up and play some old games.

 

This is my office .. or at least part of it.  The two systems on the counters are my cloning workstations and workstations I plug hard drives into them and get files off them and or clone them and scan them for bad sectors. Those computers in the corner, some are just the case, some are the entire computer.

 

image.thumb.png.657937616128e13d4806516d1b0e3d2c.png

 

Theater PC
laptop which displays the security camera above my TV
Brix Pro -old couch computer, use for video chatting on my TV 
Couch computer - Main upstaris workstation on the couch.
Security Cam PC
Macbook Pro - Not used much
iMac - Not used much
HP Prodesk at sara's house- Emby server
Server - file server / emby server
Basement ProDesk workstation - my main workstation downstaris
Laptop at sara's house to work from her house.
Spare laptop in car. - in case my laptop at sara's house fails on me
Celeron NUC PC as my voice mail server

P5 133 - old gateway computer to mess with dos games and other stuff.

Chromebook I got for $5 at the it's $5 store. I never use it but I have it.

Don't take this wrong, but I have seen on msn.com where they post stories about things from the past that people hope never to return, and that checkerboard flooring is one of them! LOL

Have to admit, you do have a rather organized looking cluster mess there though!

On 27/01/2023 at 13:26, cork1958 said:

Don't take this wrong, but I have seen on msn.com where they post stories about things from the past that people hope never to return, and that checkerboard flooring is one of them! LOL

Have to admit, you do have a rather organized looking cluster mess there though!

organized chaos

Open Core Legacy Patcher for perhaps installing macOS Ventura on an unsupported Mac isn't all that if you're using or like to use Chromium based browsers.. first launch takes forever and a minute to load.. Vivaldi loads up a little bit faster than Google Chrome does, for whatever odd reason.

If you only use Firefox and/or Safari or Orion browser-- then you're fine. But if you have your life set up with Google... you'll have to have patience for the browser content to show.. the window frame loads quickly enough. It's such a little thing that made me downgrade to Monterey from Ventura just yesterday

  • Like 1
  • 6 months later...

You can, your have to hack it though.

 

https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/START.html

 

As others have stated, test out different versions or read on their site about which version still runs well on your hardware.

Edited by Justin-Goldberg
On 24/04/2021 at 20:12, Warwagon said:

This is what all the computers do. This doesn't count all the spare laptops I have downstairs  probably 20+ most are old and given from customers. I also have 2 all in one PC's unused downstairs not on my list. I think I hoard laptops from a child hood experience. Was at radio shack late 80's early  90's and wanted a laptop to program basic in the basement. Obviously they were prohibitively expensive at the time. I Think that's why I hold on to these! To have what i Never had as a child :D I still fire some of the old ones up and play some old games.

 

This is my office .. or at least part of it.  The two systems on the counters are my cloning workstations and workstations I plug hard drives into them and get files off them and or clone them and scan them for bad sectors. Those computers in the corner, some are just the case, some are the entire computer.

 

image.thumb.png.657937616128e13d4806516d1b0e3d2c.png

 

Theater PC
laptop which displays the security camera above my TV
Brix Pro -old couch computer, use for video chatting on my TV 
Couch computer - Main upstaris workstation on the couch.
Security Cam PC
Macbook Pro - Not used much
iMac - Not used much
HP Prodesk at sara's house- Emby server
Server - file server / emby server
Basement ProDesk workstation - my main workstation downstaris
Laptop at sara's house to work from her house.
Spare laptop in car. - in case my laptop at sara's house fails on me
Celeron NUC PC as my voice mail server

P5 133 - old gateway computer to mess with dos games and other stuff.

Chromebook I got for $5 at the it's $5 store. I never use it but I have it.

I do hope you're running most of it from solar ;)

On 08/08/2023 at 03:21, Dutchie64 said:

I do hope you're running most of it from solar ;)

Actually, most of what runs 24/7 I have the lowest Watt stuff I could find that still does the job. So during the summer in those months where the heat nor the AC runs the electric bill is usually around $60 per month.

  • 4 months later...
On 29/01/2023 at 20:18, allannyholm said:

Open Core Legacy Patcher for perhaps installing macOS Ventura on an unsupported Mac isn't all that if you're using or like to use Chromium based browsers..

 

On hardware older than 7 years, you can usually easily install Void Linux or GhostBSD.

GhostBSD with Rhythmbox is also very similar to macOS with iTunes:

OLZ2Lxc.png

For many things, GhostBSD is more user-friendly than macOS. It is also easy to install.

It has a lot of software and is more stable than macOS, and offers better integrity for your data than macOS.

  • 5 months later...
On 24/04/2021 at 09:44, Steve B said:

That said, I bought my second Mac.  M1 Mac mini. 16GB RAM, 1TB SSD.  I hope this will last and be supported long enough. Lol. 

I think that was Apple's goal. 😉

I have a 27-inch iMac (2017) that can't officially upgrade past macOS 13 Ventura, but there are ways around it, such as using the OpenCore Legacy Patcher. I am sure Apple are ever so keen for me to upgrade to a new iMac, but since those bright sparks decided to discontinue the 27-inch iMac they have nothing to offer that doesn't cost an absurd amount of money. I don't know why I'd want to downgrade from a 27-inch display to a 24-inch display with no useful I/O. So, I passed on that option and replaced the Fusion Drive in my current iMac with a Samsung SSD that works with an M.2 to PCIe adapter. I went to an Apple Authorized Service Provider and they did the upgrade.

Tim Cook's Apple is too busy rehashing the same iPhone every year, and developing frivolous products like the Vision Pro, to care about the Mac anymore. 🙂

On 24/04/2021 at 14:12, Warwagon said:

This is what all the computers do. This doesn't count all the spare laptops I have downstairs  probably 20+ most are old and given from customers. I also have 2 all in one PC's unused downstairs not on my list. I think I hoard laptops from a child hood experience. Was at radio shack late 80's early  90's and wanted a laptop to program basic in the basement. Obviously they were prohibitively expensive at the time. I Think that's why I hold on to these! To have what i Never had as a child :D I still fire some of the old ones up and play some old games.

 

This is my office .. or at least part of it.  The two systems on the counters are my cloning workstations and workstations I plug hard drives into them and get files off them and or clone them and scan them for bad sectors. Those computers in the corner, some are just the case, some are the entire computer.

 

image.thumb.png.657937616128e13d4806516d1b0e3d2c.png

 

Theater PC
laptop which displays the security camera above my TV
Brix Pro -old couch computer, use for video chatting on my TV 
Couch computer - Main upstaris workstation on the couch.
Security Cam PC
Macbook Pro - Not used much
iMac - Not used much
HP Prodesk at sara's house- Emby server
Server - file server / emby server
Basement ProDesk workstation - my main workstation downstaris
Laptop at sara's house to work from her house.
Spare laptop in car. - in case my laptop at sara's house fails on me
Celeron NUC PC as my voice mail server

P5 133 - old gateway computer to mess with dos games and other stuff.

Chromebook I got for $5 at the it's $5 store. I never use it but I have it.

GF stumbles into Warwagon's kitchen @ 2:37a feening for a snack after a long, exhausting evening of binge watching ITProTV. "*Sighs*...I can work with this..." she mutters quietly, so as not to disturb the slumbering lord of the manor. Delicately she picks the capacitors off a loose PCB before spreading peanut butter on its glistening green surface...

Edited by JustGeorge

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Posts

    • As I've been usually saying lately - we all can thank "AI" for this.
    • Friday Windows 11 preview builds are here. Insiders in the Experimental (formerly Dev) and Beta Channel can download builds 26300.8697 and 26220.8690. My Windows11 device on the Preview Channel just got 26220.8728. My guess is this build is a nightly update from 26220.8690.
    • Traffic has a surprisingly unexpected impact on your surroundings by Sayan Sen Image by Radik 2707 via Pexels A collaborative study by researchers from several Israeli institutions found that everyday pollution from traffic and industrial activity measurably changed the atmospheric electric field over the Tel Aviv metropolitan area, providing new evidence of how human activity can influence the lower atmosphere. The research was led by Dr. Roy Yaniv of the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and the Gertner Institute at Sheba Medical Center, Dr. Assaf Hochman of the Fredy & Nadine Herrmann Institute of Earth Sciences at the Hebrew University, and Prof. Yoav Yair of Reichman University. The study also involved Itay Froomer, a student from Hadera High School and the Israeli Museum of Medicine and Science (Technoda), who carried out the work as part of the Ministry of Education's 5-unit physics research track. The researchers focused on the atmospheric electric field under fair-weather conditions. Even in the absence of storms, a weak electric field naturally exists between Earth's surface and the atmosphere. One of the main ways scientists measure this field is through the Potential Gradient (PG), which is the inverse of the vertical component of the electric field. PG is a key part of the global electric circuit, a planet-wide system of electrical currents maintained by thunderstorms and electrified clouds around the world. Scientists have long known that the atmospheric electric field can be influenced by factors ranging from large-scale atmospheric processes to local weather conditions such as dust, fog and clouds. Human-made pollution is also known to play a role, but understanding exactly how urban emissions affect the electric field close to the ground has remained an area of ongoing research. To investigate this relationship, the team analyzed measurements from a newly installed electric field mill, an instrument used to continuously monitor the strength of the atmospheric electric field. The instrument was installed at the Center for Technological Education (Roter House) in Holon and became operational in August 2024. It was funded by Israel's Ministry of Education and the Holon municipality. The electric field mill forms part of a broader monitoring network that includes nearby meteorological stations and air-quality monitoring sites. This allowed researchers to compare electric field measurements with detailed weather data and pollution records to better understand what was driving changes in the Potential Gradient. The study focused on two major urban pollutants: fine particulate matter (PM2.5) and nitrogen oxides (NOx), both commonly produced by vehicle traffic and industrial activity. PM2.5 refers to microscopic airborne particles small enough to remain suspended in the atmosphere for extended periods, while NOx is a group of gases released during fuel combustion. Researchers examined daily, weekly and seasonal patterns in the atmospheric electric field and compared them with changes in pollutant concentrations. Their analysis revealed a clear relationship between NOx levels and changes in the Potential Gradient, particularly during morning and evening rush hours when traffic emissions were at their highest. “What we observe is a direct physical link between emission peaks and electrical variability,” explained Dr. Roy Yaniv. “NOx reduces atmospheric conductivity very quickly, so the electric field responds almost instantaneously during traffic rush hours.” Atmospheric conductivity describes how easily electrical charges move through the air. According to the researchers, nitrogen oxides rapidly alter this conductivity, causing a near-immediate response in the electric field. PM2.5, however, was associated with a delayed response. The researchers attributed this difference to the particles' longer atmospheric residence time, meaning they remain in the atmosphere for longer periods, as well as their different microphysical interactions with surrounding air and atmospheric components. The study also identified a pronounced "weekend effect." In Israel, traffic volumes and some industrial activity decline significantly on Fridays and Saturdays. During these periods, concentrations of both NOx and PM2.5 dropped, and corresponding changes were observed in the atmospheric electric field. “The weekend signal demonstrates just how sensitive the electric field is to changes in human activity,” the researchers noted. “When emissions decline, the electrical environment adjusts at once, providing a high-resolution indicator of urban atmospheric conditions.” The findings showed that pollution levels can influence not only the chemical composition of the atmosphere but also its electrical properties. Researchers said the results strengthened the case for using atmospheric electricity as an additional tool for environmental monitoring, particularly in densely populated urban areas where anthropogenic, or human-caused, influences are most pronounced. The study also pointed to potential public health applications. By combining air-quality measurements with observations of atmospheric electricity, researchers said they could gain a more complete picture of how urban atmospheric conditions change over time. “Integrating air-quality data with electric-field measurements gives us a clearer picture of how the lower atmosphere evolves moment by moment,” the researchers added. “It’s a framework that can support both scientific insight and practical environmental decision-making.” Beyond the scientific findings, the project highlighted a collaboration between universities, public institutions and secondary education. Researchers said the work demonstrated how students could take part in real-world environmental research while contributing to studies of air quality, atmospheric processes and their potential effects on society. Source: Hebrew University, ScienceDirect This article was generated with some help from AI and reviewed by an editor. Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, this material is used for the purpose of news reporting. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing
    • We aren't even at the all-star game and Microsoft is talking about an update that will most likely be released during the World Series if not after. A lot can happen in the world between now and the 2026 World Series, including the 2026 FIFA Cup. Tell me about it again after the FIFA Cup is concluded. That should allow plenty of time to prepare for it.
    • Great, tell me when I have a "Bad Pool Caller" elsewhere not in Windoze.
  • Recent Achievements

    • Week One Done
      AMV earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • One Month Later
      AMV earned a badge
      One Month Later
    • Collaborator
      ryansurfer98 went up a rank
      Collaborator
    • One Month Later
      Eurosoft10 earned a badge
      One Month Later
    • Week One Done
      Eurosoft10 earned a badge
      Week One Done
  • Popular Contributors

    1. 1
      +primortal
      542
    2. 2
      +Edouard
      186
    3. 3
      Michael Scrip
      77
    4. 4
      PsYcHoKiLLa
      77
    5. 5
      Steven P.
      71
  • Tell a friend

    Love Neowin? Tell a friend!