SQL on Mac OS X Server?

[mr_daemon]

  Quote

eeek! there is still the issue of getting his software to work with it! unless you want to spend a good weekend hacking the program, your ******.

Do you argue just for the sake of argument? If the software uses ODBC, there should be very little or no problem.

And unless I missed something, I don't beleive shodan (nice name by the way. I'm a system shock fan) stated how the software handled connections. Unless you are the one who programmed the software, you can't really tell.

I get this horrible feeling you are just looking for an excuse, an opening, some occasion to discredit the evn show and his Rational Backed Up Arguments , only for the sake of OS X not being used as a server... but that couldn't be right... right?

So, basically, unless you have knowledge of how his applications are programmed, I doubt your point is very valid. It is worth considering indeed, something to note, but not _the one and only_ truth.

Now, shodan, could you please provide us with more information about the applications that needs to be migrated? That would be alot more helpful. And can they be modified, if necessary?

Oh, and for the sake of information, I onced used MySQL as a storage database for Merak Mail Server through ODBC drivers. Basically, Merak didn't really care what database was on the other end, as long as it could use ODBC. But then again the queries were not very complicated. Insert records, modify records, delete records.

That was done for the purpose of administrating accounts using a web interface I had programmed for a small company. I did the developement on MySQL and they used it on something else, PostgreSQL, I Beleive. In any case my program was using a database abstraction layer I also wrote, so everything was good.

If I were you i'd test. You can most likely use other software platforms to perform the tests, so I'd recommend maybe setting up an extra windows box for the sake of doing things quickly, dump your data to sql and import it back into the other databases.

Edited May 24, 2004 by mr_da3m0n

[area91]

  mr_da3m0n said:

Do you argue just for the sake of argument? If the software uses ODBC, there should be very little or no problem.

And unless I missed something, I don't beleive shodan (nice name by the way. I'm a system shock fan) stated how the software handled connections. Unless you are the one who programmed the software, you can't really tell.

I get this horrible feeling you are just looking for an excuse, an opening, some occasion to discredit the evn show and his Rational Backed Up Arguments , only for the sake of OS X not being used as a server... but that couldn't be right... right?

So, basically, unless you have knowledge of how his applications are programmed, I doubt your point is very valid. It is worth considering indeed, something to note, but not _the one and only_ truth.

Now, shodan, could you please provide us with more information about the applications that needs to be migrated? That would be alot more helpful. And can they be modified, if necessary?

Oh, and for the sake of information, I onced used MySQL as a storage database for Merak Mail Server through ODBC drivers. Basically, Merak didn't really care what database was on the other end, as long as it could use ODBC. But then again the queries were not very complicated. Insert records, modify records, delete records.

That was done for the purpose of administrating accounts using a web interface I had programmed for a small company. I did the developement on MySQL and they used it on something else, PostgreSQL, I Beleive. In any case my program was using a database abstraction layer I also wrote, so everything was good.

If I were you i'd test. You can most likely use other software platforms to perform the tests, so I'd recommend maybe setting up an extra windows box for the sake of doing things quickly, dump your data to sql and import it back into the other databases.

Listen, whoever wrote the program that he uses would need to have built in that feature.

[mr_daemon]

  Quote

Listen, whoever wrote the program that he uses would need to have built in that feature.

What feature do you speak of?

You quoted my entire text an said that. I talked about more than one point here, could you be more precise? Because to be honest you are not making much sense.

[dougkinzinger]

  shodan said:

I'd like to change my Windows 2000 server in a Mac OS X one

Why??? For business purposes or to be "l33t"?

$1,000 says your boss doesn't think it's a good idea, nor will it save you money. Don't be foolish.

[area91]

  mr_da3m0n said:

What feature do you speak of?

You quoted my entire text an said that. I talked about more than one point here, could you be more precise? Because to be honest you are not making much sense.

Well, I can see you're a Linux fanboy.

The feature I referd to was being able to change the type database server. You would need to write that, and most developers wouldnt.

[area91]

  dougkinzinger said:

Why???  For business purposes or to be "l33t"?

$1,000 says your boss doesn't think it's a good idea, nor will it save you money.  Don't be foolish.

<removed>

[JadeWolf324]

sigh..area91 you just seem to hate macs. is there anything about them you do like?

[area91]

  JadeWolf324 said:

sigh..area91 you just seem to hate macs. is there anything about them you do like?

Ya, there are some things I like about Mac. I like how everything comes with the OS, and I like iLife apps. I also like the looks of some macs. Thats about it.

[JadeWolf324]

well arent those all things that windows cant/doesnt have?

windows PC's look bland (for the most part) unless u get urself a nice case.

iLife is only for apple...the apps are what make that so nice.

and Windows comes with...Windows Messenger and...paint.

[area91]

  JadeWolf324 said:

well arent those all things that windows cant/doesnt have?

windows PC's look bland (for the most part) unless u get urself a nice case.

iLife is only for apple...the apps are what make that so nice.

and Windows comes with...Windows Messenger and...paint.

They cant have them without being sued. Apple will be in that same position (acualty much, much worse, beacuse they do hardware) if they beacome the major computing company.

[mr_daemon]

  Quote

Well, I can see you're a Linux fanboy.

.... I actually yelled "what the f*ck?" really loudly in my basement when I read that.

How the hell does that relates?

  Quote

The feature I referd to was being able to change the type database server. You would need to write that, and most developers wouldnt.

You are just confusing. Isn't that what I said? Most software would use ODBC. Have you written than software? And I assume you know many developpers as well, and you can truely say "Oh yes, they don't." in which case I would promptly keep my trap shut, smile and nod. But you know...

You obviously _are_ just trying to say the opposite of what people who seem to be pro-mac say.

Geez, sometimes I wonder why I even bother...

I have the feeling that once again this thread will be gone to hell before I blink.

OH and also, you seem to ignore the many references to ODBC that has been made... I suggest you google it.

In any case, can we get this back on topic? We were talking about databases on OS X last time I checked

[neufuse Veteran]

all I have to say about this SQL Server to os x (unknown sql packadge) is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" because most likely you'll break it trying to fix it..

[JadeWolf324]

  mr_da3m0n said:

.... I actually yelled "what the f*ck?" really loudly in my basement when I read that.

How the hell does that relates?

go figure :wacko:

[area91]

  mr_da3m0n said:

.... I actually yelled "what the f*ck?" really loudly in my basement when I read that.

How the hell does that relates?

You are just confusing. Isn't that what I said? Most software would use ODBC. Have you written than software? And I assume you know many developpers as well, and you can truely say "Oh yes, they don't." in which case I would promptly keep my trap shut, smile and nod. But you know...

You obviously _are_ just trying to say the opposite of what people who seem to be pro-mac say.

Geez, sometimes I wonder why I even bother...

I have the feeling that once again this thread will be gone to hell before I blink.

OH and also, you seem to ignore the many references to ODBC that has been made... I suggest you google it.

In any case, can we get this back on topic? We were talking about databases on OS X last time I checked

I wont fight with you. I know when to walk away.

[azcodemonkey]

  area91 said:

Well, I can see you're a Linux fanboy.

The feature I referd to was being able to change the type database server. You would need to write that, and most developers wouldnt.

If the developer was worth his salt, he would have abstracted the business logic from the data completely. There should be little modification to a properly written program. A connection string shouldn't ever be hardcoded into an app, which would be what ties an app to a specific db. That would be something an amatuer would do. A simple configuration file, or registry setting could hold that information. If any developer thinks that's too much work, they should be fired.

@shodan - I must agree, however, that a move from SQL Server to something unknown is probably unwarranted. SQL Server can handle quite a load. You may want to contract a MSSQL DBA to come take a look at your tables, stored procs, etc.

How big has your company become? I've written software that leveraged a single MSSQL box that handled upwards of 2500 clients quite handily. Granted, I didn't do any of the DB design. It probably would have cut performance in half had I done the design. :D

[SFNE Freak]

  area91 said:

I wont fight with you. I know when to walk away.

I think ya don't. Otherwise there wouldn't be two (or more) multipage threads that consist of you vs. everybody else.

[shodan]

  the evn show said:

  Quote

That's why god invented import and export routines.  Oracle is the king of being a pain in the but to migrate away from (and even that's possible using CSV files and a few hours work).

Of course! :D

I'm at work now, and my idea of testing is to install postgresql on a windows machine, than rebuild one of my database.

I already have all the queries I need to do that, after that I'll simply export and import data from the old database to the new one. I think it should work.

  Quote

Now, shodan, could you please provide us with more information about the applications that needs to be migrated? That would be alot more helpful. And can they be modified, if necessary?

Well basically those are applications wrtten specifically for compiling taxes modules... (here in italy are pretty difficult to compile, and people goes to "special places" to have help). So, they use a new database every year, and does simple add, remove lines into the tables. The only thing i'm pretty sure is that they won't modify the application (if they need to) to suit my needs, because i don't have access to codes, and my company is not the only one who use them... so I just have to try. ;)

  Quote

If I were you i'd test. You can most likely use other software platforms to perform the tests, so I'd recommend maybe setting up an extra windows box for the sake of doing things quickly, dump your data to sql and import it back into the other databases.

Exactly was I was planning to do! :D

  Quote

How big has your company become? I've written software that leveraged a single MSSQL box that handled upwards of 2500 clients quite handily. Granted, I didn't do any of the DB design. It probably would have cut performance in half had I done the design.

Not that big at all!!!! :D

To be honest my idea was just a try... I mean, considering that I have to buy another server in any case, I just thought It would be cool to try and change it to OS X... maybe this way I can one day have Mac clients too.... ;)

Well, off to download PostgreSql for windows.... :woot:

[neufuse Veteran]

why oh why would you take a chance at messing up a working network and applications just to switch to another OS because you feel it should be? unless the upper level's want it I would never change anything that major... if you mess something up they could have your butt on a frying pan so fast...

[shodan]

  neufuse said:

why oh why would you take a chance at messing up a working network and applications just to switch to another OS because you feel it should be? unless the upper level's want it I would never change anything that major... if you mess something up they could have your butt on a frying pan so fast...

Well maybe because I dare, and only the brave may dare.... ;) I'm kidding.... :D

I think it's because I'd like to evolve... and I think this step should be an evolution... If I had tought, and my boss had thought, the way you suggest I would still have the old Novell network, instead a Windows 2000 Domain, don't you think? ;)

[neufuse Veteran]

  shodan said:

Well maybe because I dare, and only the brave may dare.... ;) I'm kidding.... :D

I think it's because I'd like to evolve... and I think this step should be an evolution... If I had tought, and my boss had thought, the way you suggest I would still have the old Novell network, instead a Windows 2000 Domain, don't you think? ;)

moving from novell to AD on windows is nothing, but moving propriatory applications that are designed for windows and the backend server (which the applicition may require it to be SQL server, not everyone codes in generic SQL, some depend a lot on the custom features of specific sql servers, ususally is the reason they picked the one they used to begin with is what features it supports) to another OS totaly is relatively very complex, can cause major problems and other things... the cost to even rewrite the software could go through the roof if it was made by a ISV (independent software vendor)... sometimes you have to consider a lot more factors then just what platform it runs on...

[shodan]

  neufuse said:

moving from novell to AD on windows is nothing, but moving propriatory applications that are designed for windows and the backend server (which the applicition may require it to be SQL server, not everyone codes in generic SQL, some depend a lot on the custom features of specific sql servers, ususally is the reason they picked the one they used to begin with is what features it supports) to another OS totaly is relatively very complex, can cause major problems and other things... the cost to even rewrite the software could go through the roof if it was made by a ISV (independent software vendor)... sometimes you have to consider a lot more factors then just what platform it runs on...

Of course, you're very right!

In fact I intend to do it only if it's "painless"... no rewrite of any part of the code, no change of any applications.

For what I've tried so far this is impossible :(.

Too bad even the query I have to create a database use different standars (eg. mySQL wants an instruction terminated by ; MSSQL don't... ).

I think my efforts will be vain.... well, at least I've tried...

[neufuse Veteran]

I guess it's better to of tried and learned then to of never tried at all :p