• 0

How to build an operaing system ?


Question

Recommended Posts

  • 0
BTW, i forgot to tell you that i have winme with winxp , is that a reason for making my autoexec.bat full of lines instead of being empty ?

and if the answer is yes , does it mean that winME needs dos to boot ?

585126315[/snapback]

Are they both installed on the same drive? ME doesn't run on DOS, and autoexec.bat isn't necessarilly a sign that DOS is installed on your machine...

  • 0

I'm sorry, I've never written an operating system, so I can't help you much.

Somehow, I get the impression that you have not been clued to a key fact about operating systems: they are difficult. You don't just sit down and write one in an afternoon. Remember, Bill Gates is a billionaire, just because people would rather buy his product that pretended to be an operating system, instead of writing their own.

That being said, the next best thing would be to look at the code for an existing operating system. Companies like Microsoft have lots of lawyers to stop your doing that, so your only choice is to look at the code for a non-proprietary operating system. I know of a great free one, which is Linux. Linux has been written in literally dozens of different versions, most of them have the open source right there for you to look at, and you can download one for yourself here: http://www.linuxiso.org/.

Good luck! And if you get as rich as Bill Gates, remember us old friends back here at Neowin, will you?

  • 0
Are they both installed on the same drive? ME doesn't run on DOS, and autoexec.bat isn't necessarilly a sign that DOS is installed on your machine...

585129123[/snapback]

sorry to be an ass in the matter but youll find that windows ME is actually running on top of the win9x kernel which infact runs ontop of dos! all microsodft did was inhibit the ability to access realmode dos in windows ME the link below shows how to enable the option to access realmode dos, even though micorosft inhibits the use of realmode dos it does not remove the fact that windows me is based on the 9x kernel and in fact runs upon dos.

http://www.geocities.com/mfd4life_2000/

sorry to be an ass it just bugs me when people have been missinformed

  • 0
I'm sorry, I've never written an operating system, so I can't help you much.

Somehow, I get the impression that you have not been clued to a key fact about operating systems: they are difficult. You don't just sit down and write one in an afternoon. Remember, Bill Gates is a billionaire, just because people would rather buy his product that pretended to be an operating system, instead of writing their own.

That being said, the next best thing would be to look at the code for an existing operating system. Companies like Microsoft have lots of lawyers to stop your doing that, so your only choice is to look at the code for a non-proprietary operating system. I know of a great free one, which is Linux. Linux has been written in literally dozens of different versions, most of them have the open source right there for you to look at, and you can download one for yourself here: http://www.linuxiso.org/.

Good luck! And if you get as rich as Bill Gates, remember us old friends back here at Neowin, will you?

585129262[/snapback]

if we let microsoft to do everything that will be shame on us, do you know why .. cause microsoft want to be the best to control us ( make us pay what it wants ) , when windows xp came in egypt (just released) , its price was 3500 L.E. also office 4000 L.E. ( now did you c , you are going to buy it even it is very expensive )

also can anybody tell me how linux is released, and microsoft didn't do anything with it's "LAWYERS" ?

  • 0
sorry to be an ass in the matter but youll find that windows ME is actually running on top of the win9x kernel which infact runs ontop of dos! all microsodft did was inhibit the ability to access realmode dos in windows ME the link below shows how to enable the option to access realmode dos, even though micorosft inhibits the use of realmode dos it does not remove the fact that windows me is based on the 9x kernel and in fact runs upon dos.

http://www.geocities.com/mfd4life_2000/

sorry to be an ass it just bugs me when people have been missinformed

585130562[/snapback]

The 9x kernel does not run in real mode DOS as it is far too slow and restrictive. Windows 9x (actually starting with Windows 3.0) runs in 386 enhanced mode, and the CPU is switched to 32 bit protected mode. DOS isn't a 32 bit OS; once win.com starts and switches the CPU, it takes over.

Grab any A+ technician's book and it will tell you this. Microsoft says ME doesn't run on DOS, the A+ exam says ME doesn't run on DOS, and my intellect says ME doesn't run on DOS. I find it very hard to believe otherwise.

  • 0

i know dos isnt a 32bit os, but it does lie beneath windows me just as it did with windows 98, a clean install on a newly dformatted drive and the hack mentioned above shows that it is there, i dont care what the manuals say, hell i have the cisco it essentials 1&2 qualifications myself and i know what the book says, its just that little hack shows that the option for real mode dos was just covered over, it is still there much the same as it is in windows 98 just less prominent and covered over.

just to make it clear ... i was only trying to point out that while windows me appears on the serface a new os it was basically builds onward from win98se not a new line of operating system and most deffinatly not nt based, wasnt directed all at you, was just saying that the real dos mode is still availabale, its just covered over, that dos is still there and functional with a winme install as it is with a windows 98 install.

  • 0
if we let microsoft to do everything that will be shame on us, do you know why .. cause microsoft want to be the best to control us ( make us pay what it wants ) , when windows xp came in egypt (just released) , its price was 3500 L.E. also office 4000 L.E. ( now did you c , you are going to buy it even it is very expensive )

also can anybody tell me how linux is released, and microsoft didn't do anything with it's "LAWYERS" ?

585132380[/snapback]

Linux has nothing to do with WindowOS, it was started by Linus Torvalds as his uni project which was based on Unix OS.

If you want to learn to how to program an OS, you have to learn the basic OS concepts, such as Memory (VM etc), file system, I/O, Concurrency control etc. If you're really serious about this, I suggest you get

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/013...6222672-4032058

  • 0

BTW, about the programs and games compitability with Microsoft OS or Linux OS, i think most of users try to love linux but the problem is most of released programs don't support Linux OS and so they leave this wonderful OS, i don't know why Linux developers don't upgrade Linux to support all software which need microsoft OS , ( like windows XP , when you click on exe file then choose compatibility with 95,98,ME... etc) , if that happen i will use linux immediatly cause i see that OS is more stable and faster .... i hve tried linux red hat and mandrake ....

also i want to know how i could do this feature if i did an OS , i mean to know the logic or the enigne of how to make my OS supports programs which need EX: Microsoft OS ?

  • 0

You seem to have an extremly naive view of operating systems and lack any understanding of economies in general. I hope you are learning a lot from this thread and suggest reading books on both OS (in which many of your questions will be answered) and on business (learn why Windows isn't free and Linux not popular in the mainstream).

also can anybody tell me how linux is released, and microsoft didn't do anything with it's "LAWYERS" ?

585132380[/snapback]

Linux releases are available for download from many many websites and some retail stores have copies on CD available. There are hundreds of different 'distributions', each uses the same Linux operating system but customizes the install package to include different applications. I do not understand why are you asking about Microsoft's lawyers in regard to a different company releasing software. Linux is a competing operating system, but is legal (forgetting about the SCO nonsense).

Windows XP is expensive because it has taken years of development and cost more than $2 billion to produce it. Microsoft does not intend on indivdual consumers purchasing full versions, they make their money mostly from selling to other businesses (which have a lot of money to spend) and licensing to pc manufacturers. If you're computer does not come with WinXP (which all do today) then you can purchase a $100 upgrade. Which is a very reasonable price.

Microsoft is creating a new version of Windows XP (called starter edition) for other countries who cannot afford the regularly priced version. MS is also lowering the price of WinXP in many countries where consumers/businesses cannot possibly afford the higher prices solution. It is also available at a severly reduced discount to univerisites and students.

Microsoft is not controlling you. If you do not wish to purchase their products, then don't. You can use Linux or Solaris for free or purchase a Mac computer (which are more expensive). Some will argue that those systems and their office products are not as good as Microsoft's. It is *NOT* MS's fault that competing products are not satisfactory to you.

--- Operating Systems ---

I do not mean to offend you, but based on the level of questions you are asking it does not seem possible that you are going to be able to write your own OS. There are many many aspects to consider.

As for making an operating system 100% comptabile with Windows is a lot of work. The reason why Windows is so large is because they cannot remove the old files and features to assure that older programs will still work with the newer versions. But to make any program written for Windows to work in Linux you need to rewrite the entire Windows API (system calls) and there are already a few open source projects working on this with little success. You also have to consider that some programs rely on the NTFS file system and millions of other qwerks Windows has. Such as the file size of DLLs, the way Windows occupies memory and Window's scheduling system. Linux users that wish to run Windows programs use virtual machine software to run Windows on-top of Linux. This is the only method to assure complete comptability. Compiled Linux and Windows can also run a variety of processors, which is another problem. Even though you are running the same operating system they may be running on different processor architetures.

Windows XP is programmed in about 70% C and 30% assembly language. You can see for yourself how Linux is programmed, its source code is freely available.

i think most of users try to love linux but the problem is most of released programs don't support Linux OS and so they leave this wonderful OS

Biased? Yes, programs written for Windows cannot directly run on Linux. Several projects and companies have attempted to create 'comptability modes' as you have suggest with limited success. It is a very complex task. You are also wrongfully asuming everyone wants to use Linux... I for one do not. It is a cool operating system but not everyone would enjoy using it. Windows is very easy to use, designed for the average user, and has a smooth user interface... Linux is not as easy to use and is not standardized but fully customizable. There are many different window environments users can run which are not necessarily compatible with each other.

Edited by KayMan2K
  • 0

Well KayMan2K, I'm also going to have to correct you on something =)

There are already viable methods of running Windows programs in Linux. Wine and Cadega (an offspring of Wine) are the major methods and they do it pretty well. They also don't use a virtual machine or emulation, instead they have an (almost) complete implementation of the Windows subsystem that allows Windows programs to run with their native compilation. To give an example of how well it works, Cedage now supports Half-Life 2 (and obviously it runs at an acceptable speed to make it playable). That's not something that can be achieved through emulation. On a side note, there are also similar ways of running Linux/UNIX applications on Windows, such as cygwin, mingw32, and Microsoft's very own Windows Services for UNIX.

  • 0
You seem to have an extremly naive view of operating systems and lack any understanding of economies in general.  I hope you are learning a lot from this thread and suggest reading books on both OS (in which many of your questions will be answered) and on business (learn why Windows isn't free and Linux not popular in the mainstream).

585134304[/snapback]

and so i opened that thread to learn more about OSs but not about economics ( um in the faculty of commerce , also i have tested my first commercial product of "RoboMatic X1" ver 1.0.0.0 with success ), i think you misunderstand the post which you get form it the quote , i was replying to other person about "Lawyers" as he said .... etc

I do not mean to offend you, but based on the level of questions you are asking it does not seem possible that you are going to be able to write your own OS.  There are many many aspects to consider.

585134304[/snapback]

You are free to say what ever you want, thats your opinion and about making my OS i'm really serious , and to prove that .... i will prepare my self to learn the essentials to build OS in that holiday from the links which posted in that thread ....

also id like to show you my work ......

I started the project "RoboMatic X1" since 2001 it is not like as any AI chatbots, it can also control your computer and make a different jobs for you ( and so i called it "RoboMatic X1 Operating System Assistant" )

that software was programmed completly using VB, here is my screen shots of the next version (1.5) but its still beta ...

I opened that thread cause i want RoboMatic X1 as a system ;)

that screen shot will be as Windows XP "welcome screen" :D

http://www.infradrive.com/adv/beta_1.5_1.jpg

that screen shot will be as the main interface of my OS

http://www.infradrive.com/adv/beta_1.5_2.jpg

and that will gonna be the help of my OS

http://www.infradrive.com/adv/beta_1.5_3.jpg

thats the media player of my OS ( under construction , i will remove WMP dll anyway )

http://www.infradrive.com/adv/beta_1.5_4.jpg

and that will be the control panel of my OS :D

http://www.infradrive.com/adv/beta_1.5_5.jpg

that's a book of our small experience in programming RoboMatic X1

http://www.infradrive.com/adv/beta_1.5_6.jpg

that will be history or you can call it a "chat log" as messenger plus :D

http://www.infradrive.com/adv/beta_1.5_7.jpg

all of that is already made but in VB.Net and my crew is ready to spend another 3 years to convert this project to an OS ....

i really thanks every one give me his experience, and i'm ready to put his name in the credits ( i want to put in special thanks "Neowin.net Members" , if you don't mind moderators ;) )

Don't you all want to be like Microsoft , Linux Developers !!!

  • 0

Interesting app, although I don't really like the look. It's too cluttered and has too many colors going on. How's that going to turn into an operating system though?

And why would Linux dev's want to be like Microsoft? They work on Linux because they like to, not because they want a profit. It's something people work on in their free time.

  • 0
And why would Linux dev's want to be like Microsoft?  They work on Linux because they like to, not because they want a profit.  It's something people work on in their free time.

585135702[/snapback]

yes u right , and so am i ..... but i was just thinking as "some" people think from that way

  • 0
yes u right , and so am i ..... but i was just thinking as "some" people think from that way

585135724[/snapback]

Not really. Linux is an operating system where anyone can add to it. It's not closed source like Windows where it's driven by commercial apps.

  • 0

Also, it would be incredibly difficult to go from a VB app to a complete operating system. Have you though about how you're going to get the GUI actually up? Are you going to use X11 and build up on that? Not to mention how you're going to do everything prior to a GUI?

I too have an interest in operating systems, and was going to read up on some books for it over my winter break, and perhaps start on something resembling an operating system over the summer.

  • 0
BTW, about the programs and games compitability with Microsoft OS or Linux OS, i think most of users try to love linux but the problem is most of released programs don't support Linux OS and so they leave this wonderful OS, i don't know why Linux developers don't upgrade Linux to support all software which need microsoft OS , ( like windows XP , when you click on  exe file then choose compatibility with 95,98,ME... etc) , if that happen i will use linux immediatly cause i see that OS is more stable and faster .... i hve tried linux red hat and mandrake ....

Uh, well, you see....Linux is written, as others have pointed out, by volunteers, hobbyists, and a handful of drone-like individuals who commit to it full time because they believe in it so fiercely. And the very difficulty you cite is evidence of just how good these people are.

Consider: Say if you were a games designer. You want people to buy your game, so you want the most people to be able to run it. So, you design it mainly for the platform that the most people have. And through a series of historical accidents, that OS that most people run is Windows. These software developers code for Windows first, and then maybe "fringe markets" like Macintosh if they think of it. Hardware developers, manufacturing printers, scanners, etc., do likewise: they write their drivers for Windows, maybe Macintosh!

You mention that you're in it to learn programming, not economics...and I'm with you on that! IF ONLY we could keep the economics out of it! But we have to live with it. So, a professional software company, say they spent $50,000 to develop a game to run on Windows, and they expect to sell $5,000,000. worth to Windows users. Now, to port it to Linux, they have to pay those programmers another $50,000. to produce that, and then only, maybe, 100 people might buy it? Or, they can just move on to the next game, which they can sell again to Windows users.

Linux can still run many of the same programs, but Linux developers have to either do it on a simulater (like Wine) or "hack" a driver for the hardware as best they can...for those who aren't rich enough to do nothing but code Linux all day, this means they do it in between shifts at full-time jobs, classes at school, whatever.

Have you heard of the singing frog? It cannot sing well, but the miracle is that it can sing at all! <--an old joke to illustrate the point.

Now, think about the future. The home "micro" computer has only been a common appliance in most homes since the 1980's. A whole generation is just now living in the prime of their buying years, whom have "grown up on computers". Given another generation, and it's only logical that people will be more clued-in to computers, and it's highly unlikely that they will continue to pay outrageous prices for something they can get higher quality for free (or very little money, as there's no law against selling Linux). The bigger Linux market would cause more software developers to take notice of these "fringe markets", which may not be so much on the fringe for very much longer. Also, if I were selling commercial software, I would see more money to be made from the cutomer who got their OS for free, and has more money to spend on my fancy doo-dads, rather than the customer who's spending all they can spare on the OS itself.

The point to all this rambling is to be patient with Linux, as it's at the forefront of a revolution. And for that matter, be patient with the world's computer users, most of whom are still uncomfortable touching a keyboard, and to whom computers are still new, intimidating pieces of equipment.

Incidentally, today, (just for the exercise! this isn't for release!) I just wrote a simulation of Conway's game of Life on my Linux, that uses the "curses" library which I'm currently learning. Have you played with cullular automata, yet? Automata, fractal generaters, games of Go, Serpinski triangles and sponges, Sim City games...these are fascinating to watch and play with, and as you watch them, you learn things that apply to economics (AND computer evolution), that you didn't know it was possible to learn!

Anyway, I hope you're still encouraged. I admire your spirit! And look how far you've come already! I bet nobody in Egypt thought of writing an operating system 20 years ago...

  • 0

Instead of building a complete OS, why don't you start small and build a shell for Windows. What you see when you're using XP to load apps and browse the file system is the Explorer shell. You could get your shell to look exactly as the screens you posted with less effort. Writing a full-blown OS just isn't feasible, especially since you seem to want Windows compatibility.

Never the less, check out OS News' website and forum. There are some knowledgeable people and info on projects that you could use as a guide. Also, look for books on operating system architecture, the ones by Tanenbaum.

  • 0

This thread is hilarious.I think someone who fails to comprehend Windows is just a tad overambitious to make an OS. Assembly language is what you need to know to program the beginnings of an OS. You need to learn about interrupts, registers, things like "mov" and "jmp", and how to handle lots of other things that seem to be too complex for you to be able to do.

  • 0
Well KayMan2K, I'm also going to have to correct you on something =)

I am fully aware of Wine (didn't know about the other project) and the general method of simulating Windows API calls to have the program run natively. I thought I had acknowledged this in my post, sorry if I had left it out. This method is exciting and making great progress, but it is limited. It cannot run every program that Windows XP can run. A lot of programs for Windows are poorly written and some even rely on the errors and problems with Windows. The only current way to fully reproduce the environment is to be using a virtual machine. So, I wasn't saying that it is not possible to run Windows programs natively in Linux... just that it is very very very hard to write software which can run ALL programs on Linux.

Thank you for pointing out that the reverse is true for running Linux programs on Windows. It is easier to port Linux system calls and X11 to Windows than vice versa becuase it is an open source project.

and so i opened that thread to learn more about OSs but not about economics ( um in the faculty of commerce , also i have tested my first commercial product of "RoboMatic X1" ver 1.0.0.0 with success ), i think you misunderstand the post which you get form it the quote , i was replying to other person about "Lawyers" as he said .... etc

Quite possible, I think I misunderstood the Laywers reference.

Thank your for sharing the details of your project and the reason why you are interested in developing an OS. Your best bet is too purchase a book about operating systems and another on X86 assembly language and read it cover to cover. If you are seriously interested in learning more about operating systems.

Also, I believe you are grossly underestimating how long it will take and how much work is needed to write an interactive graphical OS. It will take you more than three years.... be prepared.

You are free to say what ever you want, thats your opinion and about making my OS i'm really serious , and to prove that .... i will prepare my self to learn the essentials to build OS in that holiday from the links which posted in that thread ....

Again, thank you for sharing the details of your project. I am not doubting your commitment to the project. But you will need to spend several years (not just a holiday) learning the essentials to build an OS (based on your current knowledge of computers).

The VB program you wrote is cool, but you would need to write your OS in assembly language C. Both are very different and much more difficult languages than VB. You need to write keyboard handlers, memory management, video drivers, process schedulers, process synchronization, the network stack at every level (do you even know all of the levels of networking?).... basically you need to understand how a computer works at the very basic hardware level. You will not be able to use command like "Form.Show" but rather write the thousands of lines of code behind that simple command.

Operating systems are developed by thousands of people over many many years. You will probably not reach the level of sophistication you need in an OS to port your application.

Well, I think at this point it has been beaten to death that this is too much work for you and your friends.. even over a three year period. But at a more fundamental question... why make this its own OS? As suggested, just make this a shell for either Windows or Linux. I am trying to understand what possible benefit you see to making this into an OS. Other than fun and personal learning experience.. there is no benefit.

  • 0
This thread is hilarious.I think someone who fails to comprehend Windows is just a tad overambitious to make an OS. Assembly language is what you need to know to program the beginnings of an OS. You need to learn about interrupts, registers, things like "mov" and "jmp", and how to handle lots of other things that seem to be too complex for you to be able to do.

585136329[/snapback]

Uhhh, I've never seen an OS hand coded in assembly unless it was in a embedded system

This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Posts

    • In the way that you framed it incorrectly. You wrote: "The constant need to close all browser sessions and wait for a new version to install" There's no "constant need to close all browser sessions". That's factually incorrect. The browser downloads its updates in the background and installs them when you open it again. Silently. And there's no "wait for a new version to install", updates are small and take 2-3 extra seconds AT MOST, if any. If you have an SSD, there's zero extra time. Also, every mainstream browser operates this way. Firefox, the FOSS go-to browser, the default on almost every Linux distro, does exactly the same. Also, you don't need to constantly restart Edge for updates to install, you can completely ignore them and it doesn't even ask you to handle them, it's all silent and automatic. So I don't understand what else do you want.
    • DuRoBo Krono Review: Portable E-Ink reader with great ideas that need a bit of improvement by Taras Buria Phone-sized e-readers are gaining traction these days, with more people treating them as a getaway device to cure phone addiction (or at least they are trying to) or having a more pocket-friendly reader that is easier to carry and hold. The market now has plenty of such readers to choose from, and DuRoBo is the latest addition, a new player that offers a more interesting approach to the idea. The Krono is a $279 e-reader with an interesting twist, which tries to make the device more fun and ergonomic. Here is my review. Disclaimer: DuRoBo provided the review sample without any editorial input or pre-approval. The Krono comes in a phone-sized box with pink accents. Inside, you get the device itself, a short user manual, and a USB cable. The cable is a bit old-fashioned, Type-A to Type-C, which is a bit disappointing. Hot take: I would rather have no cable in the box rather than another Type-A cable that gets immediately thrown into my box full of similar cables I never use. The Krono also has no charger in the box, as it relies on accessories you already own, which is fine with me. Here are the specs: Dimensions 154 x 80 x 9.0 mm or 6.06" x 3.15" x 0.35" 173 g or 6.10 oz Materials Black or White plastic Display 6.13-inch E-Ink Carta 1200, 1,648 x 824 pixels, 300 ppi Touch-capacitive. Dual-tone frontlight. Processor 8-core Qualcomm Snapdragon 690 (QTI SM6350) 2 performance cores at 2.07 GHz 4 efficiency cores at 1.71 GHz Memory 6 GB Storage 128GB, non-expandable ~104GB available out-of-the-box Operating system Android 15 with a custom launcher Connectivity Wi-Fi and Bluetooth Battery 3,950 mAh battery Buttons and port USB Type-C port Power button, Volume button, Smart Dial Breathing Lights Audio Mono Speaker and Dual microphones In the box The Krono, a Type-A to Type-C cable, user manual Price $279 on Amazon First impressions Right off the bat, no, this is not a phone replacement. Do not approach this device thinking it can serve you as a dumb phone to cure your TikTok addiction. In addition to the fact that the Krono has no cellular connectivity, I strongly believe that no amount of extra devices can fix your phone addiction until you put some serious effort into it. The Krono is a phone-sized e-reader, a companion for your phone dedicated to reading without distractions. The DuRoBo Krono is made of plastic with a very fine texture. It is hardly premium, but I also cannot say it feels cheap. The device is also a bit thick, quite dense, and well-built without rattling or cracking. You get to choose between two colors: white and black. The front has quite thick bezels, which is hardly surprising for an e-ink device. These things use front light, with LEDs usually placed on the screen perimeter. While I do not mind thicker bezels, the notably larger chin cheapens the look a little. What I mind is a notable seam between the display and the main case, which, after just two days of use, collected plenty of dust and specks. The back of the Krono is what makes the device stand out. There is a cylinder (DuRoBo calls it the Axis) embedded in the back of the reader, housing three elements: a power button on the right edge, a Smart Dial on the left edge, and "Breathing Lights" on the back. An etched DuRoBo logo sits below the cylinder, and it is the only piece of branding you can find on the device. Overall, the design and materials are very unassuming, but the cylinder with additional control elements certainly elevates the look and makes it more interesting. Other physical elements include two microphones (one on the top edge and one on the bottom edge), a USB Type-C port, a volume rocker, and a single mono speaker. There is no fingerprint reader, so if you want to protect your device, a PIN is your only option. The official TPU case is not the most premium-looking Display The Krono has a 6.1-inch E-Ink Carta 1200 touchscreen display with a resolution of 1,648 x 824 pixels (300 ppi). The display is front-lit, and you can adjust the brightness and temperature from cool to warm. Unfortunately, the Krono lacks automatic brightness and temperature adjustments, and you cannot set a custom schedule for the frontlight. However, you can set it to always enable frontlight so that you can see what is happening on the screen when turning it on in a dark environment. On the bright side (get it?), the front light can get extremely dim so that the screen is barely readable in a pitch-dark room. The front light is also uniform across the screen, with no noticeable temperature gradients. I am very susceptible to uneven front light, and it is very easy for me to notice it, but the Krono is doing a very good job in this area. I also like that the edge shadow is not very prominent and barely visible in the black variant. E-Ink Carta 1200 is not the newest generation (there are Carta 1250 and 1300), but it is still a good display. It supports three modes: Clarity, Speed, and Quality. In Clarity mode, text is very sharp and easy to read, but you trade that for more ghosting, a slower refresh rate, and more artifacts when the display changes images. Speed mode, as the name suggests, boosts refresh rate and reduces ghosting, but fine print and text become more jagged. Finally, Quality mode is only available in Android apps. It has the lowest refresh rate, but in return, you get much better visuals, improved gradients, and more. Like brightness and temperature, you can toggle modes from the control center. It is available when swiping from the top-right corner of the screen (the top-left is for notifications). I also like that the Krono can work as a desk clock when not in use. It has a bunch of screensavers, including horizontal clocks with time, date, and current battery level. The screen refreshes once per minute, and battery drain is extremely low (not even 1% in 24 hours). It is a great use of the technology, and another thing I wish more e-ink devices featured. Smart Dial The Smart Dial is Krono's main party trick. It sits on the left side of the device and serves multiple purposes. You can twist or press it to perform various actions, depending on the current use case scenario. When reading books, twisting the dial flips through pages, and pressing it refreshes the screen. On the home screen, the dial adjusts the brightness, and holding the dial pressed launches voice note recording. Finally, a quick double press launches the DuRoBo AI chatbot. While the dial scroll is not notched, it is very smooth and has haptic feedback that confirms your actions, which feels very nice. As a long-term Apple Watch user, I love the idea behind the dial. It feels very natural and oddly satisfying to use, especially with that subtle haptic feedback. I never liked flipping pages with touch input, and I strongly believe each e-reader should come with some sort of physical controls for turning pages. The Krono has both volume buttons (which also work as page turners) and the dial, so you are free to use whichever you prefer. With that said, the dial is not perfect. For one, it sticks out of the case way too far for my liking, raising concerns about durability and longevity when carrying the Krono around in a pocket (it is a pocket-sized device after all). Also, it has too much wobble, which cheapens the experience and makes it feel a bit flimsy and unsecured. While there are two plastic guards on the Krono's case, they are way too small for any kind of protection. I also think DuRoBo should let users customize dial actions (the only available customization is scroll direction), particularly for long and double presses. Not everyone needs voice notes, and DuRoBo AI does not work without an active internet connection, leaving the long press essentially useless when offline. I do not mind these features, and I genuinely think they are useful, but I would rather have the ability to toggle between screen modes, turn the frontlight on/off, or launch my favorite app. I also agree with people on Reddit asking developers to let users adjust the dial sensitivity. I hope this is something DuRoBo can implement with a software update to make the experience more personalized (it is a Smart Dial, after all) and incentivize users to fiddle with the Dial more often. The Dial is a fantastic idea, so please, guys, improve it a little. As for ergonomics, they are mostly fine, but the dial's position may feel a little awkward and way too high. When I use a phone or a phone-sized gadget, I tend to rest one of its corners on my palm for a more secure grip. With the Krono, such a grip is impossible because you cannot reach the dial even with big hands. You have to lower the reader a bit and hold it like a bottle without any extra support for the bottom edge. Such a grip is not necessarily uncomfortable (the Krono is also light enough for it), but it requires a bit of muscle retraining. Sometimes, I do not bother with the dial and hold the Krono like my phone, flipping through pages with volume buttons, as they are perfectly positioned for my right-hand thumb. Interestingly, when testing the Krono, I would often find myself thinking that a roller embedded in the long plastic cylinder on the back of the device would have been a much more comfortable solution. There is a free idea for you, guys. Software The Krono runs Android 15 with a very minimal launcher on top. The home screen presents you with a list of apps, a scrollable list of widgets, and your user profile. Widgets can display time, calendar, or recent books for quick access. You can also add or remove apps from the home screen to keep the most useful stuff around without tapping "Apps." I like this minimalistic approach; it looks clean, easy to understand, and light. I understand that some may find the list of all apps way too clean, but fortunately, DuRoBo lets you switch to traditional icons. The reader also has a bunch of preinstalled apps: Read: The default app for reading. Browser: A Chromium-based browser. Files: A simple file manager. Music: A simple music player. Spark: A voice recorder with transcription support and AI summarization DuRoBo AI: A built-in AI chatbot. Transfer: An app for file transfer over Wi-Fi. If that is not enough, there is the Google Play Store, where you can download all the extra apps you need, alternative readers, podcast apps, chatbots, and more. DuRoBo is not trying to give you an all-in-one device. The standard software experience is quite minimal, which makes it easy to approach and learn. The standard reader supports EPUB, EPUB3, AZW3, MOBI, PDF, TXT, DOC, and DOCX, which is more than enough to let you read most books without third-party software. As for customizing the reading experience, you can select one of five built-in fonts, adjust size and thickness, adjust margins and spacing (only three variants for each), change text alignment and direction, toggle the reading status bar, and switch to dark mode. There is also text-to-speech, which utilizes Android's default TTS tech. While I like the simplistic approach, I cannot help but feel DuRoBo could have made the built-in reader a bit more customizable. However, I am not going to bog down on this, as you can always install any other reader you prefer using the Play Store or by sideloading an APK. Getting books to the Krono is very simple. Given that the device is an Android smartphone without cellular connectivity, you can transfer files via a USB Type-C cable, download them using the built-in browser, share them over Bluetooth, or use cloud storage. My favorite was the built-in Transfer app. It is simple, reliable, and very well-designed. I was surprised by how well-designed the web portal is. It is fast, pretty, and properly categorized. Well done! Once you have your books loaded, you can highlight or underline text, add annotations, bookmark pages, check the table of contents, and ask AI about the selected text. Unfortunately, the Krono has no built-in vocabulary, but again, that is something a third-party reader could fix. Overall, the built-in reader is light and snappy, with just the minimum amount of features for a regular user to enjoy reading books. The Krono has no built-in reading tracking, so stat nerds will have to look for third-party reading apps. However, you can set a daily reading goal, and the reader will notify you when you reach it (for example, one hour). You can also set a reminder to read at a certain time, and when the time comes, the Krono will light up its back LEDs and unlock itself to nudge you. Other than that, the rear LEDs do nothing, not even showing charging progress, which is an unfortunate misopportunity if you ask me. Quirks aside, Krono's Android runs quite snappily and bug-free. Early reviews of the Krono criticized its Android 13-based software quite a lot, but now, the reader runs Android 15, and its software has fixed plenty of initial complaints. I never experienced any issues with built-in apps. AI attempts The DuRoBo Krono comes with a built-in AI chatbot. There is no information on what model powers this thing, but the system says it was "trained by Google." You can launch the bot from the app list or by double-pressing the dial. It works just like any other chatbot, and you can ask it anything by typing or using voice input. The AI saves your chats, and you can rename, export, or delete them. DuRoBo AI requires an active internet connection, and it does not work offline. Its reach and capabilities are also limited. You can only chat in the app and use it in the reader app as a makeshift vocabulary. However, the implementation is kinda awkward. You can only send a selected portion of text to AI without giving it any requests or instructions. I highlighted the word "dumb," and it apologized to me for not being useful. You also cannot ask follow-up questions or send the generated response to a separate chat. The chatbot is also slow, even with fast Wi-Fi, making the overall experience quite frustrating, which makes me again wish for the ability to remap the double press to something else. Spark, the standard voice recording app, also uses AI for note summarization and transcribing. Neither feature works offline, unfortunately. Spark records notes up to 30 minutes using Krono's dual microphones, and you can rename or export notes. Transcription quality is decent, and the speed is alright, but you can find much better solutions in the Google Play Store. What I like about Spark is that transcribed notes are not locked, and you can always type more to elaborate on your ideas, which is handy. Overall, I like that the Krono is not shoving AI down my throat, but to be honest, there is really not that much to shove. AI features here feel raw and need improvements to be more useful. Battery Life Like most E-Ink readers, the Krono has fantastic battery life. Even with a clock as a screensaver, its standby power consumption is incredibly low. And when in use, you can get weeks of reading on a single charge. Without the front light, my unit never sipped more than one or two percent of battery during a one-hour reading session. It was nice to see plenty of battery-related settings. You can limit charging at 80% to protect battery health long-term, check the number of charging cycles, manufacturing/first-time use date, battery health, and the maximum capacity. Additionally, the Krono lets you select what hardware remains enabled when sleeping. This lets you keep Wi-Fi and Bluetooth on (say, if you want to receive notifications, for some reason) and keep audio playing when locked. Turning these features off effectively eliminates any standby battery drain. I left my Krono sitting for 24 hours with a clock screensaver on, and it did not drop a single percent. The pretty big 3,950 mAh battery justifies the device's thickness and ensures you do not have to charge it for long periods. Speaking of charging, it is capped at only 10W, which is a bit disappointing, as getting such a big battery to 100% takes a notably long time in the era of super-fast charging smartphones. DuRoBo Moodi The Moodi is a standalone, optional accessory for your Krono. It is a wireless remote with two customizable buttons that you can use to flip pages, control media, or scroll webpages. The accessory connects via Bluetooth. Despite having a built-in rechargeable battery, it is extremely light. While the Moodi's shape and form factor is not what I would call particularly ergonomic, it is not uncomfortable to hold and use. The Moodi comes with six removable magnetic buttons with various smiley faces. Buttons sit securely, and they have nice-feeling, albeit a little loud, clicks. It is a cute touch that adds a little more fun and character to the device. There is also an accented power button and a single status LED. The latter displays charging status and connection mode. The Moodi supports three modes: Reading: Buttons work as volume buttons, allowing you to flip pages in the built-in reader or other apps that support page turning with volume buttons. Media: Buttons work as skip forward/backward, which is useful when listening to audiobooks, podcasts, or music. Scroll: The third mode lets you scroll pages in the web browser or any other application The Krono properly detects the Moodi and presents you with an on-screen guide when you connect it for the first time (it also displays the battery level). However, you can only change modes by holding both buttons for a few seconds. It is also worth noting that the Moodi works with other devices. I connected it to my iPhone and it let me adjust volume or control media playback. Sadly, the scroll did not work, so you cannot use it to waste time scrolling TikToks. Overall, the Moodi is a cute little accessory, which I can recommend for those who read a lot. It is very useful for remote page flipping when you do not want to burden your hands by holding the Krono all the time. I only wish DuRoBo included a lanyard for the built-in loop. As for the battery life, after using the Moodi for a few days, I only managed to drop several percent of its 90 mAh battery. Despite the small size, it is rated for weeks of use, which is pretty impressive. At $35.99, I cannot say the Moodi is a must-have accessory, but I see the appeal. I prefer using the Krono with its Smart Dial, as I rarely read for more than 40-60 minutes in one sitting. However, if you have a stand and like reading for long periods, the Moodi is the right thing to have. It is a bit more expensive than regular page flippers on Amazon, but it is on par with similar products from Kobo or BOOX. Plus, it has a little more fun to it with removable buttons and better integration into the Krono. Conclusion At the end of the day, DuRoBo Krono is a nice pocket-sized e-reader. Its software focuses on the main things without trying to be everything at once. The smart dial idea is unique and great, and I wish more manufacturers had something similar in their devices. The display is also good, with an even frontlight and "always-on" support. I did not notice any deal-breaking issues with the Krono. However, you can feel that the idea needs some improvements, such as a slightly stiffer dial in a more ergonomic location, perhaps a little more premium materials, and better software customization. I hope the company won't give up on the idea and improve the dial and ergonomics in the second generation. Buy DuRoBo Krono Black - $279.99 on Amazon Buy DuRoBo Krono White - $279.99 on Amazon Buy DuRoBo Moodi - $35.99 on Amazon As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.
    • In what way is any of what I said incorrect? To install an update you need to close all browser instances, upping it from once a month to once a fortnight is an inconvenience for users. Particularly when updates don't offer functionality that users want (notably copilot). Security updates should come as they are needed, not on a release schedule
    • Dopamine 3.0.6 by Razvan Serea Dopamine is an awesome free audio player which tries to make organizing and listening to music as simple and pretty as possible. Dopamine has been designed for Windows 7, Windows 8.x and Windows 10 and plays mp3, ogg vorbis, flac, wma and m4a/aac music formats quite well. The best part? It's created by long-time Neowin member, Raphaël Godart. If you’re looking for a music player to handle a large music collection, you should definitely give Dopamine a try. Dopamine 3.0.6 changelog: Fixed Manually edited album covers are overwritten on the next collection refresh Fixed AppImage package not working on modern GNU/Linux distributions Deleting song from playlist sometimes fails Playback controls only work when clicking on upper half of the buttons It's unclear that files must be tagged with an external ReplayGain scanner (for example rsgain) before normalization can take effect. Change to Artist or Album tags is not reflected in the song list view nor in the Now Playing information ReplayGain issues Smart playlist filters ignore text containing accents or other special characters Some MP3 files trigger an "MPEG header not found" error due to a too-narrow initial MPEG header scan range Changed Updated the Vietnamese translation Download: Dopamine 3.0.6 | 122.0 MB (Open Source) Links: Home Page | Forum Discussion | Screenshot | Other OSes Get alerted to all of our Software updates on Twitter at @NeowinSoftware
  • Recent Achievements

    • One Month Later
      AndreaB earned a badge
      One Month Later
    • One Month Later
      agatameier earned a badge
      One Month Later
    • Week One Done
      agatameier earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • Week One Done
      ssd21345 earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • Contributor
      MarkHughes4096 went up a rank
      Contributor
  • Popular Contributors

    1. 1
      +primortal
      518
    2. 2
      +Edouard
      195
    3. 3
      PsYcHoKiLLa
      147
    4. 4
      ATLien_0
      96
    5. 5
      Steven P.
      76
  • Tell a friend

    Love Neowin? Tell a friend!