[official] HD DVD Confirmed News

[Boz]

I'm surprised they haven't cut the add on price in 1/2 since they cut the stand alone units price. It seems ridiculous that i can buy a standalone a30 for 199 when the add on is 180

Dude, $199 is regular for A30, I got it for like $179 at an official distributor (granted no 2 movies in the box) but I still got other 5 free ones. A3 is $129.

They really need to drop the add-on to $99.

[goji]

They really need to drop the add-on to $99.

Drop the unit to 75 and you'll see some units and media start to move. As a standalone unit, its not worth 99 USD, not after the sales last Christmas season.

[Boz]

Drop the unit to 75 and you'll see some units and media start to move. As a standalone unit, its not worth 99 USD, not after the sales last Christmas season.

The problem with the pricing is that I don't see how they would justify wireless adopter being at $99 and HD DVD drive being let's say $79. Even if Toshiba subsidized the drive I don't think Microsoft would go for it as it would cause complication for their other overall pricing schemes.

Now to be honest, I don't think that Xbox 360 will play influence at this moment.

If Toshiba really wants to end this war once and for all. They need to do the following:

1. Take the twin TL HD DVD disc, subsidize at least 1 hit day/date title from Universal and Paramount (good example is American Gangster) and not produce DVD disc but sell this hybrid for $20-$24 (this is how much new releases go for anyways for DVD).

2. Continue $120 through June 2008 and completely saturate the market with the new HD DVD players.

These 2 things alone would completely make the numbers look wack. Just imagine, American Gangster will probably sell in MILLIONS on DVD. That would equal million HD DVD discs. For people who have a dvd player and buy an HD DVD player, and put this same disc in would be a HUGE eye opener for a regular consumer when they would see the difference at their friend's house with the HD DVD player and the same disc.

Format war over.

I just don't know why they are not doing this.

Just look at it this way twin HD DVD discs are a winner for everyone.

Studio - takes the production of both versions, cuts the costs in 2, charges the same as for DVD but the depreciation value would go down slower and they continue to make more money over longer period of time.

Consumer - no need to rebuy their library, every new movie they buy is HD ready. Once they pick up an HD player they use the same disc to watch it in HD.

Win, win.

Edited January 19, 2008 by Boz

[giantpotato]

If Toshiba really wants to end this war once and for all. They need to do the following:

1. Take the twin TL HD DVD disc, subsidize at least 1 hit day/date title from Universal and Paramount (good example is American Gangster) and not produce DVD disc but sell this hybrid for $20-$24 (this is how much new releases go for anyways for DVD).

2. Continue $120 through June 2008 and completely saturate the market with the new HD DVD players.

These 2 things alone would completely make the numbers look wack. Just imagine, American Gangster will probably sell in MILLIONS on DVD. That would equal million HD DVD discs. For people who have a dvd player and buy an HD DVD player, and put this same disc in would be a HUGE eye opener for a regular consumer when they would see the difference at their friend's house with the HD DVD player and the same disc.

Format war over.

I just don't know why they are not doing this.

So your idea is to force consumers who want to buy a dvd to pay full price, and instead of getting a decent quality 9GB DVD, they'll be getting a crappily encoded 2 hour and 40 minute movie crammed onto only 4.5GB?

On top of that Toshiba will have to subsidize all these discs which no doubt cost more to produce than regular HD DVD's.

That would definately end the war alright.............By making Toshiba go bankrupt.

HD DVD is not going to win the war. Just face the facts.

~3.5 million Blu-Ray players sold. vs. ~750 000 HD DVD players

85% of those Blu-Ray players are PS3's and will be upgradeable to Profile 2.0

For the past year Blu-Ray discs have been selling 2:1

For the past week Blu-Ray discs have been selling 85:15

6 Major Studios are backing Blu-Ray vs. 2 for HD DVD

Blu-Ray has the support of more consumer electronics manufacturers.

[theyarecomingforyou]

If Toshiba really wants to end this war once and for all. They need to do the following:

1. Take the twin TL HD DVD disc, subsidize at least 1 hit day/date title from Universal and Paramount (good example is American Gangster) and not produce DVD disc but sell this hybrid for $20-$24 (this is how much new releases go for anyways for DVD).

2. Continue $120 through June 2008 and completely saturate the market with the new HD DVD players.

Or they could simply withdraw their product as it has less support from the major studios and consumers (the standalone players are twice as cheap and yet only managed to equal Blu-ray player sales). That way they don't waste money on a war that doesn't benefit the consumer and will likely end with them losing or ending up with a relatively small market share for the amount of investment they've put in. By coming to an arrangement with the Blu-ray group they could speed up adoption of hi-def and avoid losing a considerable amount of money.

I think it speaks volumes that even at a significantly lower price they haven't been able to take the lead. Consumers are obviously very price savvy but they are also aware that just because something is cheaper it doesn't necessary make it a better investment. I personally wouldn't buy a standalone HD-DVD or Blu-ray player, yet I would buy a combo or consider a PS3 (because it has other uses). Even if they maintain a lower price there is no indication that they would win the war, particularly with the PS3 working so effectively for the Blu-ray camp. The Blu-ray and HD-DVD groups should have come to an agreement that prevented this war, rather than spend money effectively trying to destroy the opposition - it's such a waste.

[Mathachew Veteran]

Or they could simply withdraw their product as it has less support from the major studios and consumers (the standalone players are twice as cheap and yet only managed to equal Blu-ray player sales). That way they don't waste money on a war that doesn't benefit the consumer and will likely end with them losing or ending up with a relatively small market share for the amount of investment they've put in. By coming to an arrangement with the Blu-ray group they could speed up adoption of hi-def and avoid losing a considerable amount of money.

I think it speaks volumes that even at a significantly lower price they haven't been able to take the lead. Consumers are obviously very price savvy but they are also aware that just because something is cheaper it doesn't necessary make it a better investment. I personally wouldn't buy a standalone HD-DVD or Blu-ray player, yet I would buy a combo or consider a PS3 (because it has other uses). Even if they maintain a lower price there is no indication that they would win the war, particularly with the PS3 working so effectively for the Blu-ray camp. The Blu-ray and HD-DVD groups should have come to an agreement that prevented this war, rather than spend money effectively trying to destroy the opposition - it's such a waste.

You say these things as if HD DVD Players have been super cheap for a long time. Last time I checked, it didn't become cheap no more than two months ago. Two whole months compared the near two years it's been around.

[Boz]

Matthachew, you are exactly right. They all whining how the cheap players didn't help when they were sold for cheap only twice and just a little bit ago. The fact is they overall increased the HD DVD player install base 100k+ units in just 3 days. If that's not crazy good then I don't know. But wait, now when the gloves are off, Toshiba is going for $106-$109 standard pricing for HD-A3. Can't wait to see the numbers of sold players as no sane person would pass on HD DVD and upconverting player over regular DVD player.

It's incredible how they start posting in this thread and start trolling almost immediately as soon as someone shows a scenario that ends the war overnight. Something that Blu-Ray is incapable of even in 2 or more years.

So your idea is to force consumers who want to buy a dvd to pay full price, and instead of getting a decent quality 9GB DVD, they'll be getting a crappily encoded 2 hour and 40 minute movie crammed onto only 4.5GB?

How you see this as forcing a consumer I have no idea. A consumer getting a hi-def version of the movie in addition to the regular DVD version for the same price is somehow forcing a consumer? LOL. That's so funny.

What I was talking about is the new TL twin disc standard that was approved. It carried 3 layers, full DVD layer + 2 x 17gb layer for the 35gb for HD content. If anything consumers get more for the money. The only problem is that it's not Blu-Ray, but I have no problems with that, I actually encourage it openly as Blu-Ray as a format is still unfinished and 3-4 times more expensive.

Wait Q1 numbers and I think we will be pleasantly surprised how many HD DVD players will be sold. $120 is DIRT CHEAP.

I'll say it again:

$100-$120 HD DVD players + twin DVD/HD DVD via triple layer instead of regular DVDs = FORMAT WAR end. The irony would be that the movies Blu couldn't get through studios they are missing would have to contain an HD DVD version LOL.. How funny would that be.

On top of that Toshiba will have to subsidize all these discs which no doubt cost more to produce than regular HD DVD's.

LOL, so Sony can do it and Toshiba can't? LOL.. Do you understand or you are probably refusing to accept the fact that almost ALL discs pressed on the market for Blu-Ray are done by Sony DADC (replication factory). They are subsidizing discs for ALL studios because all in all it's them and Cinram who can replicate proper BD50 discs. The code on the discs prove it. Each replication factory has the code imprinted on the disc it makes. I will look for the codes so you can check for yourself.

Secondly, Toshiba wouldn't have to subsidize as much as Blu-Ray simply because the same system is used to press HD DVDs as DVDs. There is not a lot of loss to begin with. Their yield rates on HD30 discs were 95%. Incredibly good. Sure they might lose something, a buck or two per disc but not more. 1 million discs fully subisdized at 3-4 bucks per disc cost of production is 4 million bucks. That's NOTHING when compared to billions Sony lost.

So yeah, no big deal to do that. I think that the only thing that's preventing Toshiba from doing that is the agreement with the Universal and Paramount internally and maybe unfinished testing for TL twin-disc to ensure their operation is flawless. Otherwise, it's game over if they do it. Over night we would have millions of DVD/HD DVD discs sold.

[Boz]

Or they could simply withdraw their product as it has less support from the major studios and consumers (the standalone players are twice as cheap and yet only managed to equal Blu-ray player sales). That way they don't waste money on a war that doesn't benefit the consumer and will likely end with them losing or ending up with a relatively small market share for the amount of investment they've put in. By coming to an arrangement with the Blu-ray group they could speed up adoption of hi-def and avoid losing a considerable amount of money.

Yes, and everything we've seen so far showed us that Blu-Ray benefits the consumer. Higher prices, relying only on a game console for some future proofing is SO mainstream consumer oriented. Having to rebuy all of the equipment to buy the movies with no transition ability at all. Oh wait, greedy corporations are supporiting a money sucking standard that was made to be dominant int he market by subsidizing EVERYTHING and buying corporate and retail support. I'm changing my mind right now. Blu-Ray must be clearly better then and clearly consumer oriented, cause you know, you are not really forced to buy Blu-ray at all, except for paying off retailers to stop carrying HD DVD and similar actions.

I think it speaks volumes that even at a significantly lower price they haven't been able to take the lead. Consumers are obviously very price savvy but they are also aware that just because something is cheaper it doesn't necessary make it a better investment. I personally wouldn't buy a standalone HD-DVD or Blu-ray player, yet I would buy a combo or consider a PS3 (because it has other uses). Even if they maintain a lower price there is no indication that they would win the war, particularly with the PS3 working so effectively for the Blu-ray camp. The Blu-ray and HD-DVD groups should have come to an agreement that prevented this war, rather than spend money effectively trying to destroy the opposition - it's such a waste.

You just keep saying that to yourself. $100 for a fully HD DVD player with amazing upconverting capability + over 400 titles in HD and more coming is certainly a stupid investment and buying an unfinished Blu-Ray format and paying $400+ for the player that they will most likely have to replace next year when Profile 2.0 titles start coming out and all this just because it has 20% more content is a smart investment. LOL. Talk about bias.

[giantpotato]

How you see this as forcing a consumer I have no idea. A consumer getting a hi-def version of the movie in addition to the regular DVD version for the same price is somehow forcing a consumer? LOL. That's so funny.

What I was talking about is the new TL twin disc standard that was approved. It carried 3 layers, full DVD layer + 2 x 17gb layer for the 35gb for HD content. If anything consumers get more for the money. The only problem is that it's not Blu-Ray, but I have no problems with that, I actually encourage it openly as Blu-Ray as a format is still unfinished and 3-4 times more expensive.

...

LOL, so Sony can do it and Toshiba can't? LOL.. Do you understand or you are probably refusing to accept the fact that almost ALL discs pressed on the market for Blu-Ray are done by Sony DADC (replication factory). They are subsidizing discs for ALL studios because all in all it's them and Cinram who can replicate proper BD50 discs. The code on the discs prove it. Each replication factory has the code imprinted on the disc it makes. I will look for the codes so you can check for yourself.

Secondly, Toshiba wouldn't have to subsidize as much as Blu-Ray simply because the same system is used to press HD DVDs as DVDs. There is not a lot of loss to begin with. Their yield rates on HD30 discs were 95%. Incredibly good. Sure they might lose something, a buck or two per disc but not more. 1 million discs fully subisdized at 3-4 bucks per disc cost of production is 4 million bucks. That's NOTHING when compared to billions Sony lost.

So yeah, no big deal to do that. I think that the only thing that's preventing Toshiba from doing that is the agreement with the Universal and Paramount internally and maybe unfinished testing for TL twin-disc to ensure their operation is flawless. Otherwise, it's game over if they do it. Over night we would have millions of DVD/HD DVD discs sold.

Regular DVD's are 2 layers, normal HD DVD's are 2 layers. 2 + 2 = 4. The Twin disc you talk about has 3 layers. That means a DVD layer is missing. That means you would have to cram a DVD movie into half the space it would normally take which would result in a much worse picture quality, especially for a movie that's 2hours and 40 minutes long.

You have no idea how much Twin discs yield rates or production costs are, so I hardly think you can make any real estimates to the cost of production.

Sony is finally breaking even/making a profit on their PS3's where Toshiba just keeps loosing more and more money on their players. Will they really spend millions of dollars per title just to get a HD DVD disc into millions of households who don't even have HD DVD players?

[KoL Veteran]

You just keep saying that to yourself. $100 for a fully HD DVD player with amazing upconverting capability + over 400 titles in HD and more coming is certainly a stupid investment and buying an unfinished Blu-Ray format and paying $400+ for the player that they will most likely have to replace next year when Profile 2.0 titles start coming out and all this just because it has 20% more content is a smart investment. LOL. Talk about bias.

Well I don't think is a stupid investment a $400 player than can play Blu-Ray movies, play games, media center, great upconverter, can be upgraded to profile 2.0 and a lot of titles and a lot more coming. You know what, that is what most people are doing.

[Boz]

Regular DVD's are 2 layers, normal HD DVD's are 2 layers. 2 + 2 = 4. The Twin disc you talk about has 3 layers. That means a DVD layer is missing. That means you would have to cram a DVD movie into half the space it would normally take which would result in a much worse picture quality, especially for a movie that's 2hours and 40 minutes long.

You have no idea how much Twin discs yield rates or production costs are, so I hardly think you can make any real estimates to the cost of production.

Sony is finally breaking even/making a profit on their PS3's where Toshiba just keeps loosing more and more money on their players. Will they really spend millions of dollars per title just to get a HD DVD disc into millions of households who don't even have HD DVD players?

Again, no.. the third layer on twin disc is supposed to be between 9-17 gb I'm not sure at this exact moment I have to locate the DVD forum specs they approved. Pioneer was also interested in testing this. So if these twin discs are introduced they will carry the whole DVD layer plus 2 HD layers. I believe that the disc had some limitations as a twin disc so it wouldn't offer full 51gb but something like 40-something.

Twin disc yield rates shouldn't be horrific but neither of us don't really know, so it might be acceptible. I'm inclined to think it is simply because everything so far, both combos and HD30 regular HD discs had high yield rates.

Sony is not breakin even on PS3. They are still losing money on each unit. They managed to get the costs of production to $400 but there's so much more involved beyond hardware, so you can pretty much bank of them losing still between $50-$100 per console. But this is totally irrelevant point as every reasonable person understands that PS3 is not the future of HD and Blu-Ray and that not every person, hell majority of people, doesn't want a game console for simple movie viewing. You and me yeah, I see that, most people, no. As I said, with DVD there were a billion player sold and only 130 million PS2s out of which 60-70 million alone was sold when the price hit $99. That should tell you something.

Also, the fact they are not losing billions anymore is good for them, but they still have a crap load of money to get back. Losing less means really nothing. You flaunt it as some kind of achievement really.

Do you have any idea how much money Toshiba can afford to lose to come even close to the amount Sony lost in this war so far. Don't be silly with your justifications.

Bottom line, cheap hardware WILL lead to mass adoption. More software doesn't really do nothing if you don't have people getting the hardware. We'll see how HD DVD player sales go but I'm very optimistic judging by early reports just based from this last week.

Well I don't think is a stupid investment a $400 player than can play Blu-Ray movies, play games, media center, great upconverter, can be upgraded to profile 2.0 and a lot of titles and a lot more coming. You know what, that is what most people are doing.

Most gamer and tech geeks yes. Hell I bought mine the second it came out and it's finally growing on me, but it ain't for it's Blu-Ray capability to be honest, it's a lot of other things. Mainstream consumer will buy $100 player over that no matter how bad you want them to see the "blu" light. :)

[giantpotato]

Again, no.. the third layer on twin disc is supposed to be between 9-17 gb I'm not sure at this exact moment I have to locate the DVD forum specs they approved. Pioneer was also interested in testing this. So if these twin discs are introduced they will carry the whole DVD layer plus 2 HD layers. I believe that the disc had some limitations as a twin disc so it wouldn't offer full 51gb but something like 40-something.

Twin disc yield rates shouldn't be horrific but neither of us don't really know, so it might be acceptible. I'm inclined to think it is simply because everything so far, both combos and HD30 regular HD discs had high yield rates.

Sony is not breakin even on PS3. They are still losing money on each unit. They managed to get the costs of production to $400 but there's so much more involved beyond hardware, so you can pretty much bank of them losing still between $50-$100 per console. But this is totally irrelevant point as every reasonable person understands that PS3 is not the future of HD and Blu-Ray and that not every person, hell majority of people, doesn't want a game console for simple movie viewing. You and me yeah, I see that, most people, no. As I said, with DVD there were a billion player sold and only 130 million PS2s out of which 60-70 million alone was sold when the price hit $99. That should tell you something.

Also, the fact they are not losing billions anymore is good for them, but they still have a crap load of money to get back. Losing less means really nothing. You flaunt it as some kind of achievement really.

Do you have any idea how much money Toshiba can afford to lose to come even close to the amount Sony lost in this war so far. Don't be silly with your justifications.

Bottom line, cheap hardware WILL lead to mass adoption. More software doesn't really do nothing if you don't have people getting the hardware. We'll see how HD DVD player sales go but I'm very optimistic judging by early reports just based from this last week.

Most gamer and tech geeks yes. Hell I bought mine the second it came out and it's finally growing on me, but it ain't for it's Blu-Ray capability to be honest, it's a lot of other things. Mainstream consumer will buy $100 player over that no matter how bad you want them to see the "blu" light. :)

I hate to break it to you but it's impossible for a single DVD layer to be 9-17GB. The point of having a DVD layer is so that it will be playable in regular DVD players. Therefore it would have to follow the exact same specifications as a regular DVD. A regular DVD can only hold 4.7GB per layer. There's no way to change that and have the disc still be playable in a regular DVD player. Virtually all commercial DVD's are dual-layered and 9GB.

You're right, Sony's probably not breaking even if you factor in all other costs associated with selling the PS3 Hardware. If you factor in the software sales though, I'm guessing they're making a healthy profit there, if you include games and movies. Losing significantly less money on hardware is definately an achievment at this point in the game. Being ahead on pretty much all fronts, while not taking a significant loss on each hardware sale. The fact is you and I don't know how much Toshiba can afford to lose, but it can't be a good thing to have millions of players less than the competition, with software sales dropping to new lows, and still be losing money on hardware sales. I just don't see how Toshiba could possibly pull ahead.

[DrCheese]

The "combo only" question has been asked on the AVS insider thread fairly recently..

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....42&page=154

There are some mummer's that the HD-DVD group tried to get studio's to do this but the studio's weren't keen on it, i.e they wasn't keen on any risk that could hurt DVD sales, the extra costs of making and then subsiding the discs, some issues with the production lines(It's much more complex) etc.

[Boz]

Toshiba to Air HD DVD Super Bowl Ad

Cupertino (CA) - During next week's Super Bowl, viewers will be treated to an HD DVD commercial, but won't see any mention of the competing Blu-ray format.

The ad will feature Toshiba's three lowest-priced players, the HD-A3, A30, and A35, and is the biggest advertising move for any high-def disc medium to date, reports Home Media Magazine.

According to industry reports, the 30-second TV spot is expected to run Toshiba nearly $3 million. It is a crucial move that Toshiba hopes will bring consumers to HD DVD instead of Blu-ray, which has a significant early lead in the format war.

Toshiba Corp. will feature HD DVD in a scheduled Super Bowl XLII ad during the Feb. 3 telecast from Glendale, Ariz.

Jodi Sally, VP of marketing for the Toshiba Digital A/V Group, confirmed the Japanese consumer electronics giant will run the 30-second ad as part of a marketing strategy intended to reinvigorate HD DVD.

She said the spot would highlight the HD-A3, HD-A30 and HD-A35 players, which Toshiba recently cut the retail prices.

"It has always been our strategy to reach HDTV owners, using advertising on football games as just one vehicle," Sally said. "If you recall, we had advertised on Sunday Night Football all season long." Last year, the HD DVD Promotion Group sent a tour bus to Miami for the Indianapolis Colts, Chicago Bears rain-soaked affair decked out with a mobile theater and sound system to showcase the HD DVD experience.

Widely considered the most important (and expensive) domestic marketing day on the TV calendar, high-def is playing a major role in the Super Bowl as the perennial media showcase not only will be telecast in HD but also represents a major marketing tool for sales of HDTV.

http://www.homemediamagazine.com/news/html...rticle_ID=11949

Edited January 28, 2008 by Boz

[Coldgunner]

one ad? in america?? like thats gonna recuperate worldwide sales...

[Boz]

one ad? in america?? like thats gonna recuperate worldwide sales...

You may want to read this:

This thread will be strictly moderated... any rule breakage including flames and trolling will be dealt with warns and restrictions

[Coldgunner]

You may want to read this:

Let me elaborate, I was commenting on toshibas marketing strategy, they are doing nothing new than what they did before. IF HD-DVD was successful in the US, then it'd be rather pointless with blu being so dominant elsewhere.

[draklin]

You may want to read this:

I believe his point was that one ad this late in the game that is only shown in the USA is not going to help HD DVD at all. To back up his point, I have seen at least 5 ads for BD this weekend, but yet I have no idea when I last saw a HD DVD ad. So it seems strange that they would spend so much money for a super bowl ad as it is only one ad and is easily missed. They should be all over the TV if they want to promote HD DVD.

[Boz]

<br>I believe his point was that one ad this late in the game that is only shown in the USA is not going to help HD DVD at all. To back up his point, I have seen at least 5 ads for BD this weekend, but yet I have no idea when I last saw a HD DVD ad. So it seems strange that they would spend so much money for a super bowl ad as it is only one ad and is easily missed. They should be all over the TV if they want to promote HD DVD.<br>

So let me get this straight, you think that over 100 million people watching with quite a few who just bought their new HDTVs, will not be intruiged with an ad on the biggest sports event in the US that provides HD players that they can watch hits like Mission Impossible 1,2,3, Matrix Collection, Batman Begins, Shrek, Bourne Movies, American Gangster and a lot more exclusively or at least until the end of this year for Warner titles for $100, $140 and $200? Yes, that makes a lot of sense :wacko:

It's a perfect marketing campaign kick off. Historically all major brands started off their new marketing campaigns at Super bowl events. This is why Audi and a few other big brands will introduce new revolutionary things with their commercials too.

With players being pretty much the price of regular DVD players but offering HD capability as well with already a pretty big catalog of titles (400+) not to mention some of biggest hits this year being HD DVD exclusive, I absolutely see this ad being a great kick off and come back.

Of course, Blu-ray crowd will continue saying it's over, it's too late, because they are mostly afraid that this might very well boost HD DVD sales significantly.

Do you know the real reason why Blu-Ray is not present on Super Bowl ads (official response is that they couldn't have made the decent ad in time :sleep: ?

With so much money being used to buy off studios, pay off retailers to stop carrying HD DVD, and paying media campaign that brought very little actual sales to Blu-Ray last year, they are running out of money. With Sony being deep in red financially with $7+ billion loss and Panasonic paying through the nose on Disney promotions they are running out of financial steam. Toshiba is just starting.

[+Troll Subscriber¹]

one ad? in america?? like thats gonna recuperate worldwide sales...

Perhaps it won't, but do you realize how many people watch the Super Bowl? And how many of those do so just for the commercials.

[Coldgunner]

snipped

its really too little too late. hd-dvd group had the option to do all this before but never tried it. The US was the only country that seemed to get any advertising whatsoever, last hd-dvd ad I saw was for transformers, and that was focused on the dvd version. BDA have obviously speculated so much money for long term gains. Once again you bring up rumoured payoffs without anything to back it up.

Also, its not sony funding the media campaign, BDA is a pretty big consortium of many rich companies.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

So let me get this straight, you think that over 100 million people watching with quite a few who just bought their new HDTVs, will not be intruiged with an ad on the biggest sports event in the US that provides HD players that they can watch hits like Mission Impossible 1,2,3, Matrix Collection, Batman Begins, Shrek, Bourne Movies, American Gangster and a lot more exclusively or at least until the end of this year for Warner titles for $100, $140 and $200? Yes, that makes a lot of sense :wacko:

It's a perfect marketing campaign kick off. Historically all major brands started off their new marketing campaigns at Super bowl events. This is why Audi and a few other big brands will introduce new revolutionary things with their commercials too.

With players being pretty much the price of regular DVD players but offering HD capability as well with already a pretty big catalog of titles (400+) not to mention some of biggest hits this year being HD DVD exclusive, I absolutely see this ad being a great kick off and come back.

Of course, Blu-ray crowd will continue saying it's over, it's too late, because they are mostly afraid that this might very well boost HD DVD sales significantly.

Do you know the real reason why Blu-Ray is not present on Super Bowl ads (official response is that they couldn't have made the decent ad in time :sleep: ?

With so much money being used to buy off studios, pay off retailers to stop carrying HD DVD, and paying media campaign that brought very little actual sales to Blu-Ray last year, they are running out of money. With Sony being deep in red financially with $7+ billion loss and Panasonic paying through the nose on Disney promotions they are running out of financial steam. Toshiba is just starting.

How do you determine who is "scared" and who are just buying into the statistics?

You must agree the sales figures show Blu Ray is winning.

This is like a football league with team A in 1st position and team B in 2nd with 5 games to go (a game worth 3 points), and team A having a 12 point lead.

Yes it's theoretically possible for team B to win, but it's a massive uphill battle.

Boz you speak about the comeback as if it's destined/certain to happen, just like others speak about the Blu Ray win like its destined/certain to happen - The only difference those in the later category have more proof to back their views - The proof being the sales figures and studio support.

You do realise Blu Ray would somehow really need to massively flop for HD-DVD to take over? Right now the sales and movie support are very one sided, that is a fact, not an opinion/piece of speculation.

The advertisement will be good for HD-DVD, but it's not going to be it's saviour in anyway IMO. Again the battle is worldwide, not state side only, and as I've always said, marketing HD-DVD worldwide has been a downfall for Toshiba.

[Coldgunner]

Perhaps it won't, but do you realize how many people watch the Super Bowl? And how many of those do so just for the commercials.

offtopic, but I detest how much the american sports coverage relies on advertising so much. There would be uproar if there were similar amounts of advertising on things like the Cricket, Rugby, Tennis, Football (Soccer) etc

[Boz]

its really too little too late.

The notion on anything being too late is absolutely silly. When a new technology is at 1.6% of market share over DVD which is intended to replace, and that for the most part separates the users to game console owners and some standalones, it is purely illogical to say that anything is over. We (consumers) haven't even started yet.

When you get to 50-60% of the market then you can say that having somewhat more content becomes relevant but even then it becomes obvious that the competing format would again not be abandoned.

It's wishful thinking by Blu-Ray fans that it's over. This is FAR from over. Universal and Paramount reaffirming their support for HD DVD, Toshiba launching massive marketing campaign and price cuts we are yet to see the progress with HD DVD.

I understand why HD DVD marketing was weak last year. They were waiting patiently and allowed Panasonic and Sony (major players for Blu-Ray) to shoot out their money on everything, knowing very well that 2008 would be a much more important year for mass adoption then 2007. Of course, Warner backstabbing made the plans problematic as they clearly didn't expect that, but they now know that their plan needs to be done more quickly.

Again, even as a talking point, it is enough that HD DVD gets Disney or Fox to go neutral by Q3 2008 and the market share for catalog goes back to pretty equal numbers. Sure, this is something that most Blu-Ray fans won't come to accept and will say it's impossible, but that's purely illogical thinking. Both Disney and Fox are businesses and if HD DVD group gives them incentives, just like BDA did, they will publish in it. There's no reason not too.

[Coldgunner]

The notion on anything being too late is absolutely silly. When a new technology is at 1.6% of market share over DVD which is intended to replace, and that for the most part separates the users to game console owners and some standalones, it is purely illogical to say that anything is over. We (consumers) haven't even started yet.

When you get to 50-60% of the market then you can say that having somewhat more content becomes relevant but even then it becomes obvious that the competing format would again not be abandoned.

It's wishful thinking by Blu-Ray fans that it's over. This is FAR from over.

Again, even as a talking point, it is enough that HD DVD gets Disney or Fox to go neutral by Q3 2008 and the market share for catalog goes back to pretty equal numbers. Sure, this is something that most Blu-Ray fans won't come to accept and will say it's impossible, but that's purely illogical thinking. Both Disney and Fox are businesses and if HD DVD group gives them incentives, just like BDA did, they will publish in it. There's no reason not too.

but when HD (BD) media has the market share of 60% over sd-dvd, HDDVD will be long time gone. its highly unlikely that fox or disney will move due to their decision to go blu based on the enhanced copy protections it offers.