My car's dying

[Mouldy Punk]

Tried starting my car after work today and it wasn't having any of it. It made a really horrible clicking sound from the starter motor, so I figured it had just jammed. So we gave the car a bit of a shake, made no difference. We we're going to try and jump start it, but then we realised that nobody had the leads (duh) so then we bump started it. But because I was parked on a hill, facing upwards, we did it in reverse - which was an experience, it was quite a steep hill x)

So yeah, bump starting it worked ok and once it was started it was happy and got me home ok. At this point I'm still thinking it's probably the starter motor is fubared so I'll need to get a new one. Wrong.

When I got home, I jump started it from some battery jump-starter thing and it worked. Which means, the starter motor is just fine. So now I'm thinking it's probably that the battery isn't holding it's charge or the alternator isn't charging the battery...or both!

At first I didn't think it was the battery because when it was trying to start, it didn't make the sound of a starter motor failing because it has no power...where it kinda whirs and then dies. It just made a horrible clicking/grinding/"ARGH IM IN PAIN" kind of sound.

Anyone know how to tell if its the battery or alternator that's scuppered? The voltage across the battery is 11.5V - which seems pretty close to the 12V it should be? (I don't know what sort of margin for error you can have). But I tested that with a standard voltmeter, not when the battery was under any sort of load or anything.

[RAID 0]

Your battery might be putting out the right amount of volts, but that doesn't mean it's got the amps to turn the starter. Usually auto parts stores will do a battery draw test for free to see if it's your battery. From the sounds of it, I'd put my money on your battery needs to be replaced.

[Pilsbury]

I'd agree it sounds like the battery.

Without enough cranking power, you'll just hear a clicking noise

[Brandonlp89]

Well 11.5 is way too low. a batterys static charge with no load should be at 12.65 volts which means it is at 75% charge.2.1 volts per cell, 6 cell battery = 12.6v first to rule out the alternator, take your voltmeter on AC voltage and put it on the battery leads with the car running. if you have over .5 voltage, your diode trio is bad and an alternator is the problem. Not turn your voltmeter to DC volts with the car running and it should be putting out between 13 and 15 volts, if it is lower or higher zener doides or the alternator is worn out causing you to replace the alternator. As far as the battery, there is no way to truly check a battery accept under load. You need a load tester and put the battery under half the cold cranking amps for 15 seconds and it needs to stay above 9.6 volts or 10.2 volts if it is a ford. If it fails, the battery is bad. WHat it really sounds like to me though is a badly corroded battery cables, based on the info you have supplied, straight jumping it worked which rules out the starter and the starter solenoid.

A corroded battery cable would most likely be the source i would look at. it would cause the amperage to not be able to get to the starter and also the voltage cannot get from the alternator to the battery causing the low charge. Once the car is started, the car runs off of the alternator and the battery is just there to smooth out the voltage spikes so it runs fine once it is started., Try cleaning connections or checking voltage drop across the battery cables while cranking. Any other questions about it just write them or my email [email protected]

[jpcahn]

I agree with Brandon 100 percent. Check the reminals and the cables and make sure they are not corroded. Clean the battery and then jump it and drive it around to charge it and this might fix it.

[Max Veteran]

If the battery is capable, you can open up the cells using a screwdriver and top it up with distilled water to cover the electrodes. If its low of course.

[Brandonlp89]

To give you a little experience to justify my theory. I was driving around downtown chicago about 2 mothes ago and i parked my car in a garage, when i went to leave, my car would not start, just a clicking noise. I found someone to jump me and drove my car home just fine. when I got home i shut the car off and tried to start it again, same situation just the clicking, Next morning I came out to remove my battery so I could bench test it. When I took Off the terminals, there was so much corrosion because the shop that installed the battery did not put di-electric grease under the terminals. I cleaned the terminals with a little baking soda, water mix, put some di-electric grease under there and my car has been running fine since then!!

If the battery is capable, you can open up the cells using a screwdriver and top it up with distilled water to cover the electrodes. If its low of course.

Just filling the battery with distilled water will not fix a sulfated battery but if it is a dodge intrepid, then it is a common problem for the engine to overheat the battery and cause the acid level to lower so yes it is good in that case

[Mouldy Punk]

I charged the battery up overnight last night on a charger that is probably about as old as my car (20 years :p) and now the voltage across the battery is 13.3V - and the car will start fine off that battery now - does that pretty much rule out corroded connections? They didn't look particularly scummy when I took the batter out/put it back in.

I've got to leave for work in 15 minutes, so I'll give the alternator test a go when I get back, if it's still light. If not, I'm free all day tomorrow so should be able to do it then.

My dad was saying that it could simply be that my car wasn't get enough of a run around needed to charge the battery. Over the summer hols I haven't really done any long trips - just to work and back at the weekends (10 miles each way ish) and my other work place and back during the week (2 miles ish). So maybe simply charging the battery is going to be enough to keep it going until I do some longer journeys?

I haven't got a load tester to test the battery with properly, so I'll probably take it to an auto-electrician to test it tomorrow. If that comes back OK, its probably safe to assume it's the alternator that's screwed? Depending on the prices, I might get the auto-electrician to test that too, if not I'll try Brandon's test. If it's neither the alternator the battery...I'll be stumped.

[petroid]

Might be time to get a new battery! How old is the battery in the car?

[Mouldy Punk]

No idea, I've only had the car a year and a half ish. It doesn't have a date or anything on it either.

Anyhoo, after work (just got back) the battery's voltage is now 12.65V. Considering it was 13.3V at the start of the day, I'm not sure what to make from it. Either; 13.3V was too high, so its gone down to 12.65V, which is more normal and it'll be quite happy there OR the battery is losing its charge in a bad way and will continue to do so. My car isn't going anywhere until tomorrow, so I'll test the voltage again in the morning. If it's gone down overnight, is it fair to assume the battery's had it?

[Admiral Michael]

I would still get the battery checked. Just to rule it out.

[Pilsbury]

It takes at least 20 minutes of running to put the same charge back into a battery than to start the engine. So, a few miles a day will be doing it no good - and probably not doing the engine itself much good either...

[Brandonlp89]

Yeah but you have to consider that after a battery is charged, it holds a surface charge which is more than a static charge. This additional voltage dissapears as soon as you run the car, if it stays within .5 v of 12.65v you should be fine.

[Mouldy Punk]

It takes at least 20 minutes of running to put the same charge back into a battery than to start the engine. So, a few miles a day will be doing it no good - and probably not doing the engine itself much good either...

It takes me about 20 minutes to get into work (at the weekends) so it's only the weekday work journey's that short, and due to the credit crunch, I haven't been getting many shifts there (it's a restaurant) because it's been too quiet, so once or twice a week shouldn't do too much harm should it?

[Mouldy Punk]

I'm getting the alternator and battery tested today...for free! :D My dad's van is always failing its MOT/breaking (never buy a Vivaro people) and he always takes it to the same local garage each time - because my dad is such a good customer, the guy said he'd test my car for free.

[Mouldy Punk]

Sorry for the triple post, but it won't let me edit.

It turns out that the alternator was knackered, it wasn't pumping out any charge at all. So I bought a new one yesterday, fitted it today, and fingers crossed, that's the end of that!

[ozgeek]

That clicking sound almost always indicate a flat battery. Last month I was stuck in a car park and fortunately enough a service station with RACQ was across the road so they had ruled it to be a dead battery...got a new one and it is running great since...

at time of this post the car is in maintenance service :)