[UK] TV License Needed?

[Rob Veteran]

Also, not sure if this is true but someone told me that if you have locks on your room, you'd have to buy another license for that room...surely that's not true, is it?

It's one of those grey areas - I think it stems from the difficulty in defining what's a 'self-contained studio flat' and what's a room within a flat etc. I researched it recently and though I can't immediately find the information to hand, my understanding is that what you say is true, however it's something that is unlikely to be challenged if a license exists for the wider property.

[saxondale.]

Wow, that's ridiculous. Surely there's no way of them knowing without actually having to come and check right?

[Richard Hammond]

All depends what you want to do with it, if you can prove that its not tuned in to BBC channels when the inspector comes around and you have no intention of watching it you dont need a licence.

I dont have a TV and im sick of getting threatening letters, i shouldnt have to prove my innocence they should have to prove my guilt which they cant do as you dont have any legal obligation to let them into your property.

TV Licencing and their inspectors are bullies nothing more.

[Mike]

usually a lock on a door implies a separate address, if it has a separate address you'll need a separate license, otherwise i dont think you do

All depends what you want to do with it, if you can prove that its not tuned in to BBC channels when the inspector comes around and you have no intention of watching it you dont need a licence.

I dont have a TV and im sick of getting threatening letters, i shouldnt have to prove my innocence they should have to prove my guilt which they cant do as you dont have any legal obligation to let them into your property.

TV Licencing and their inspectors are bullies nothing more.

you do know you can just tell them you dont have a tv and they'll stop?

[Rob Veteran]

Wow, that's ridiculous. Surely there's no way of them knowing without actually having to come and check right?

It's a technicality. But yes, without them checking they wouldn't know, and if the wider property has a license they'll never check.

TV Licensing website suggests that it's fundamentally done on tenancies - a shared tenancy suggests one license being required, separate tenancies suggesting multiple licenses are required.

[former1]

**** DA POLICE! (jks jks :p)

But in all honesty if you won't be watching TV with it - then don't get a licence!

[+Nik Louch Subscriber²]

Locks on an internal door do imply certain laws relating to insurance, lease and so on. Basically, with a lock in the door, you are renting an individual room. Without them, it's a joint renting of a whole property.

I would ASSUME, then, that if the door has locks - it is seen as a separate lease, and not communal as far as TV licensing goes, so separate licenses.

BUT, ok look - I agree that it's the law to have a license. But I can tell you these few FACTS:

1) Between 1997 and 2001 I NEVER had a license. Some of that time was in student halls - and I never got a letter.

2) Between 2001 and 2005 I never had a license. I owned my own properties, and got dozens of "To the Occupier" "this is our final correspondence" letters. Nobody ever came knocking.

3) Detector van is a lie!

4) However, a lot of universities and owners of halls are now allowing licensing people more access so the chances of getting caught are higher.

End of the day - here is how I'd play it out.

1) See what channels you get first - this may make the whole issue moot.

2) Talk to the others, if you want TV yourself and they don't it's your call on getting the license.

3) If ANY of them bring in any TV-capable hardware (whether they use it or not) sting them for their share - or simply make it known that YOUR license does not cover them (see above "separate rooms" paragraph).

4) If you feel like it - don't get a license until your first few "Occupier" letters.

[+M2Ys4U Subscriber¹]

Pay quarterly, by direct Debit, and cancel it when you leave the property. No point in paying for the whole year if you're not there for 12 months ;)

[Rob Veteran]

Locks on an internal door do imply certain laws relating to insurance, lease and so on. Basically, with a lock in the door, you are renting an individual room. Without them, it's a joint renting of a whole property.

I would ASSUME, then, that if the door has locks - it is seen as a separate lease, and not communal as far as TV licensing goes, so separate licenses.

BUT, ok look - I agree that it's the law to have a license. But I can tell you these few FACTS:

1) Between 1997 and 2001 I NEVER had a license. Some of that time was in student halls - and I never got a letter.

2) Between 2001 and 2005 I never had a license. I owned my own properties, and got dozens of "To the Occupier" "this is our final correspondence" letters. Nobody ever came knocking.

3) Detector van is a lie!

4) However, a lot of universities and owners of halls are now allowing licensing people more access so the chances of getting caught are higher.

End of the day - here is how I'd play it out.

1) See what channels you get first - this may make the whole issue moot.

2) Talk to the others, if you want TV yourself and they don't it's your call on getting the license.

3) If ANY of them bring in any TV-capable hardware (whether they use it or not) sting them for their share - or simply make it known that YOUR license does not cover them (see above "separate rooms" paragraph).

4) If you feel like it - don't get a license until your first few "Occupier" letters.

Broadly accurate information from my experience :) Though I can say I did have someone visit after a load of letters - perfectly pleasant chap and I did have a license that had seemingly not been properly entered into their system, so after a quick phonecall he went away.

Pay quarterly, by direct Debit, and cancel it when you leave the property. No point in paying for the whole year if you're not there for 12 months ;)

See here - you can claim for a refund and cancel it legitimately.

[Richard Hammond]

you do know you can just tell them you dont have a tv and they'll stop?

It doesnt work like that, its like me committing crime, the police coming to my door and me saying "wasnt me, i dont do that type of crime", they will want to come in, inspect my whole house, interrogate me. I dont care for bullies, if they wont take me off the list i wont let them in my door, simple as.

[saxondale.]

i'll definitely check what channels i can get and i'll probably use it until i get a few letters through.

[ozulus]

I was reading this interesting thing and I wanted to ask, are you talking about cable TV or UHF kind of way TV... sorry for the off topic question.

[+Nik Louch Subscriber²]

It doesnt work like that, its like me committing crime, the police coming to my door and me saying "wasnt me, i dont do that type of crime", they will want to come in, inspect my whole house, interrogate me. I dont care for bullies, if they wont take me off the list i wont let them in my door, simple as.

Acutally it's nothing like that. They are not allowed to "assume" you have a TV, nor are they allowed to point the finger. This is why their letters are cleverly worded. They seem threatening, but actually they are ASKING if you have a license.

They have no right of entry USUALLY. They would need a warrant for that - and that costs them money to file. Moreover, it takes a LOT of letters before anyone turns up.

However, it's NOT expensive, and now I am a more adult and law abiding citizen, I actually support the license. I see that not having advert breaks in episodes of BBC dramas is worth ?140 to me!

ozulus: Any hardware capable of receiving a TV signal. So not the set top box, but ANY television. LCD, Plasma, CRT - freeview, sky or whatever.

Heck, if you have a computer, no TV card, but output it to a VCR. Iit still counts.

[shadowmatt]

Why is it the right thing to do??

Because its worth paying for the BBC. Apart from great shows like the Office, Mighty Boosh, Dragons Den, Red Dwarf, Top Gear and all the other top shows people like we get a great news channel that does not bow to advertisers, great radio stations and the BBC really does support new British talent.

If you have grown up in the UK the shows you grew up with were probably made by the BBC.

What is the alternative. The BBC would go like iTV, Sky or most other channels. More adverts than programs, dumbing down lowest common denominator content, premium phone lines and reality TV. They do not promote new UK talent or new UK shows (Sky 1 tries and fails now and again). The news is unbias and doesn't bow to sponsors whims, the BBC doesnt pull a story because an advertiser would pull out if they did.

You also get the iPlayer and website and the BBC usually keeps upto date with new tech. What you probably dont get is that outside the UK the BBC website shows adverts, the programs are on subscription based channels and there is no iPlayer.

Basically the BBC is a great British institution, something to be proud of and something definitely worth paying for given its positive impact on the country.

Imagine a UK with only SKY/Cable. Their big things at the moment, streaming every episode of Startrek the Next Generation and overcharging for football.

Edited September 5, 2008 by shadowmatt

[ozulus]

how many times you have to renew it per item? Or you only need 1 license per household?

[Soldiers33]

so u hav to pay the license even if u just use ur pc?

[+M2Ys4U Subscriber¹]

how many times you have to renew it per item? Or you only need 1 license per household?

Yes, one license per household. If you're in halls of residence, per room, plus common room.

You can pay weekly, monthly, quarterly and yearly.

so u hav to pay the license even if u just use ur pc?

if it's capable of receiving a TV signal.

[Richard Hammond]

Acutally it's nothing like that. They are not allowed to "assume" you have a TV, nor are they allowed to point the finger. This is why their letters are cleverly worded. They seem threatening, but actually they are ASKING if you have a license.

They have no right of entry USUALLY. They would need a warrant for that - and that costs them money to file. Moreover, it takes a LOT of letters before anyone turns up.

However, it's NOT expensive, and now I am a more adult and law abiding citizen, I actually support the license. I see that not having advert breaks in episodes of BBC dramas is worth ?140 to me!

ozulus: Any hardware capable of receiving a TV signal. So not the set top box, but ANY television. LCD, Plasma, CRT - freeview, sky or whatever.

Heck, if you have a computer, no TV card, but output it to a VCR. Iit still counts.

Fair enough but i still dont put up with bullies, ive seen videos on youtube of inspectors being rude and even trying to hit people, it IS expensive if you dont believe what you get on TV is worth it, which is why i dont have a TV, i have an LCD TV but it doesnt have an integrated tuner and i dont have any settop boxes i just use Blu-Ray and consoles on it.

Because its worth paying for the BBC. Apart from great shows like the Office, Mighty Boosh, Dragons Den, Red Dwarf, Top Gear and all the other top shows people like we get a great news channel that does not bow to advertisers, great radio stations and the BBC really does support new British talent.

If you have grown up in the UK the shows you grew up with were probably made by the BBC.

What is the alternative. The BBC would go like iTV, Sky or most other channels. More adverts than programs, dumbing down lowest common denominator content, premium phone lines and reality TV. They do not promote new UK talent or new UK shows (Sky 1 tries and fails now and again). The news is unbias and doesn't bow to sponsors whims, the BBC doesnt pull a story because an advertiser would pull out if they did.

You also get the iPlayer and website and the BBC usually keeps upto date with new tech. What you probably dont get is that outside the UK the BBC website shows adverts, the programs are on subscription based channels and there is no iPlayer.

Basically the BBC is a great British institution, something to be proud of and something definitely worth paying for given its positive impact on the country.

Imagine a UK with only SKY/Cable. Their big things at the moment, streaming every episode of Startrek the Next Generation and overcharging for football.

Its not worth paying BBC anything, all the TV shows they put out are getting shorter and shorter, like Top Gear previous series have been 10+ episodes, then later series came down to 10 episodes, then the latest series has been 6 episodes, i can watch equivalent shows on ITV, Ch4 and Five without having to pay for a TV Licence, ok so they are plastered with adverts but if i dont enjoy a show at least im not paying for the privilege.

[ozulus]

Oh ok that's not that bad then. We don't pay in here for public TV, at least directly. Government funds them, so we pay with our taxes and they still have a bit of adds.

[+Nik Louch Subscriber²]

Shadowmatt: Well said!

[Septimus]

Generally if the house has a TV, and you say you only watch your laptop's TV in the communal area, you could get away with it.

As soon as you watch it behind a lockable door, which is addressable to you, within say the house or student halls, you need a license. Stupid rule, but that is how it works.

[Syntax_Error]

First year of uni I was in halls and can't remember if I had a license. Second year I was in a house and we got caught by the TV licensing inspectors who said we may go to court. We paid there and then and nothing else was said about it.

You know it's sod's law that they will come knocking if you don't. Also I think it might be a grey area when it comes to a TV "just" plugged into a DVD/console and not used for TV - it's capable therefore you need one.

The best thing to do is when you move in to ring the TV licensing number (don't tell them where you live) and ask where they stand on the matter.

[Stonkwell Bogtrotter]

ozulus: Any hardware capable of receiving a TV signal. So not the set top box, but ANY television. LCD, Plasma, CRT - freeview, sky or whatever.

Heck, if you have a computer, no TV card, but output it to a VCR. Iit still counts.

Why oh why do people keep saying "if it is capable of receiving"??? That is rubbish.

I have a TV. It is "capable" of receiving signals, "IF" I PLUG an aerial/Sky/cable box into it. However, as there is no aerial or Sky, or cable connected to it, and I use it to play games on I do NOT need a licence. Simple as that.

I have a VCR. It is "capable" of receiving signals, "IF" I PLUG an aerial/Sky/cable box into it. However, as there is no aerial or Sky, or cable connected to it, and I only watch videos I do NOT need a licence. Simple as that.

I have a computer. It is "capable" of receiving signals, "IF" I PLUG an aerial/Sky/cable box into it. However, as there is no aerial or Sky, or cable connected to it, and I use it only for the internet I do NOT need a licence.

Being "capable" of recieving TV is completely different to recieving "Television broadcast programmes".

The TVL have done a very good job of convincing people that they "need" a licence just because they "own" a TV/VCR/DVD etc.

You do not.

You only need a licence if you are Quote; "using television receiving equipment to watch or record broadcast programmes" <----thier words not mine. I see those same words on every single letter I get from TVL on a monthly basis.

As for letting the cronies from Capita in, you do not have to. They cannot force thier way into your property despite what they may say. They need a warrent.

[whitebread]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but.... why do you need a license to have a TV in the UK? :blink:

[shadowmatt]

Its not worth paying BBC anything, all the TV shows they put out are getting shorter and shorter, like Top Gear previous series have been 10+ episodes, then later series came down to 10 episodes, then the latest series has been 6 episodes, i can watch equivalent shows on ITV, Ch4 and Five without having to pay for a TV Licence, ok so they are plastered with adverts but if i dont enjoy a show at least im not paying for the privilege.

So you dont listen to the radio, use iPlayer or ever watch a BBC program. The BBC usually does make short series, they dont go down the american route of 20+ episodes a series, never had. It keeps things fresh if you ask me, although I wish there were more Red Dwarf.

Comparing Top Gear to the Channel 5 5th Gear, which a is blatant rip off with old Top Gear presenters. ITV hardly shows TV shows anymore, its all these bingo shows and phone ins trying to take your cash, what they do show is usually underfunded rubbish. Channel 4 is a site setup by the IBA Independent Broadcasting Authority to provide an alternative to the mainstream, which it does well, cant knock it. Channel 5 started rubbish, got slightly better but usually shows shows from america, its stolen from other channels or History/Discovery channel shows that have been re voiced with a british accent.

Walking With Dinosaurs / Blue Planet / All the other Great BBC Documentaries OR revoiced American Documentaries?

Top Gear or a Top Gear rip off that wouldn't exist without top gear.

You would have probably have to have paid to watch the Olympics + other sports (although SKY has stolen most of them)

You see without the BBC we would have encountered a situation like most europe countries were facing. The imported shows were eclipsing their home grown shows, as a result there was a lack of new talent and investment and laws had to be brought into place to guarantee that a % of shows were actually homegrown.