Can`t get rid of pagefile?

By cammy
in Microsoft (Windows)

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cammy

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Hey guys, i bought 8GB of ram recently, and read that because i have so much ram i can eliminate the page file and run vista directly from the RAM.

So i set my pagefile to 0.

However when i use a defrag tool it detects a huge Pagefile which is obviously in relation to the 8GB of ram.

Can anyone tell me how to get rid of the pagefile?

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https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/702028-cant-get-rid-of-pagefile/
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C++

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So i set my pagefile to 0.

Does that mean you set the maximum size to 0MB, or used the No paging file option like you're supposed to?

If you want to delete the old paging file you should be able to easily do it from Safe Mode. May have to uncheck Hide protected operating system files from Folder and Search Options.

Keep in mind that Windows will still use an at least 2MB paging file no matter what, otherwise it can't function properly.

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andy2004

Posted
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Its an interesting thing the old page file. The way windows uses the page file is ingenious moving stuff from main memory to disk when its not needed then loading it back into memory when it is needed. However for windows systems structured with larger amounts of memory (4gb +) its really not needed. I came across a similar problem having upgraded to 8GB ram myself. Sadly you cant disable the page file because the way windows is written it will still want to move stuff from memory to disk page file. I just set my page file to 8gb because I kept getting an error in the event viewer that windows couldnt create the page file when it was set to less than the physical amount of memory. Hopefully in future windows microsoft will wake up to the fact of falling prices of memory and systems with 4gb/8gb as default amount of ram. There really is no need for the page file anymore.

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+allan MVC

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  • MVC
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However for windows systems structured with larger amounts of memory (4gb +) its really not needed................... There really is no need for the page file anymore.

1) You are mistaken. Windows OS's do require paging.

2) Virtual memory is a benefit for ALL systems - PC's, mainframes, client/server, et. al. How can having the computer think you have more memory than you actually do - and then being able to access and utilize that virtualized ram - be anything but a plus???

3) You should not have to set the PF to 8Gb - that's just a waste of disk space. Simply set it do "Windows Managed.

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andy2004

Posted
Posted

1)Currently yes they require paging i am talking about future windows development. Get rid of the page file and leave everything in memory and change windows recommended specs to 4GB ram minimum

2)where is the benefit of moving stuff in and out of ram ? if you have a large amount of ram available to windows why oh why move it out of ram to a physical moving disc ? if you leave everything in ram then surely things get executed quicker ? if you want to execute something in the page file you cant you have to move it to memory first. In the early days when 512mb ram was common then fair enough I can understand the need for a pagefile but these days there is no need for it.

3) if i dont set it to 8gb then vista complains in the event viewer as follows (even if i set it to windows managed)

memorynd3.jpg

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andy2004

Posted
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_file

Virtual memory has been a feature of Microsoft Windows since Windows 3.0 in 1990. Microsoft introduced virtual memory in response to the failures of Windows 1.0 and Windows 2.0, attempting to slash resource requirements for the operating system

Forward to 2008 and hardware/resources in a modern computer are in abundance. Back in 1990 4GB ram was a distant dream so to was 64bit computing. The only use for the page file these days is when the system has to write a crash dump.

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Raa

Posted
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Don't remove the page file. IT IS REQUIRED for use. Windows will page items to the cache, regardless of whether you have 1gb or 10gb of ram. If you don't like having a huge file, set it to something small (256-512mb)

You might still get errors by doing this though. And it's recommended just to let Windows manage it. (More space, but no errors)

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bob_c_b

Posted
Posted
1) You are mistaken. Windows OS's do require paging.

2) Virtual memory is a benefit for ALL systems - PC's, mainframes, client/server, et. al. How can having the computer think you have more memory than you actually do - and then being able to access and utilize that virtualized ram - be anything but a plus???

3) You should not have to set the PF to 8Gb - that's just a waste of disk space. Simply set it do "Windows Managed.

Well said!

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TheKindred

Posted
Posted
1) You are mistaken. Windows OS's do require paging.

2) Virtual memory is a benefit for ALL systems - PC's, mainframes, client/server, et. al. How can having the computer think you have more memory than you actually do - and then being able to access and utilize that virtualized ram - be anything but a plus???

3) You should not have to set the PF to 8Gb - that's just a waste of disk space. Simply set it do "Windows Managed.

Just wanted to add that your page file does not need to be larger than 1.5 times the amount of Physical RAM installed. Unless of course you have exorbent amounts of RAM like this fellow does, then allan is right it is just a waste of disk space. I also recommend the page file not being on the drive the OS is installed on if possible, or which ever of your drives is the fastest.

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andy2004

Posted
Posted
Wow, you quoted wiki as a source... One that any idiot can edit...

true which is why i never use it only for external links and references

Howstuffworks however cant be edited

http://computer.howstuffworks.com/virtual-memory.htm

And also microsoft themselves say here : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/889654

"...However, as the amount of RAM in a computer increases, the need for a page file decreases...."

However who would be bored enough to edit a wiki on paging file ? i suppose there are some sad people out there with nothing better to do hey .....

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

Decreases does not equal removed.

Yes with 4-8 GB of ram you don't need much of a pagefile, 1.5 ish gigs should be enough. But not now nor in future version of windows or other OS' will the pagefile be redunant, not untill computer and operating system architecture is changed radically from what we hae today and we have quantum computers or somethign anyway.

even with that much ram, moving stuff to pageile isn't a performance reduction, in act it only increases performance. keepign stuff in ram when it doesn't need to be however is.

Granted the question is why you have so much ram 4 and epecially 8 gigs of ram is only really needed if you do 3D modelling/rendering, video edition or huge photo editing. And in these cases these apps will on occasion requrie large amounts o ram, for example when rendering, then the rendering app will request most of the memory on the system, and everything else will be moved to the pagefile. untill the rendering is done, then they'll be moved bak to ram as needed.

Unless you actually use any such apps you'll never need that much ram. though some games claim to need 4 gig's to run optimally, that has more to do with lazy/inefficient programming not an actual need for so much resources. 2 gig is more than enough for any system today even if you do 3D modelling/rendering/video editing/heavy photoshopping.

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devHead

Posted
Posted
Unless you actually use any such apps you'll never need that much ram. though some games claim to need 4 gig's to run optimally, that has more to do with lazy/inefficient programming not an actual need for so much resources. 2 gig is more than enough for any system today even if you do 3D modelling/rendering/video editing/heavy photoshopping.

Thank you HawkMan, I have to agree; putting 8 GB of memory in a computer unless you have a specific need for it is overkill, even if RAM is supercheap. Even with Vista 64-bit, 4 GB is way more than you'll ever need.

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andy2004

Posted
Posted
Thank you HawkMan, I have to agree; putting 8 GB of memory in a computer unless you have a specific need for it is overkill, even if RAM is supercheap. Even with Vista 64-bit, 4 GB is way more than you'll ever need.

Yes i do have a specific need for 8 but even 4 on 64bit is not overkill. Typical example is battlefield2 which i found the game alone use to take up to 2gb (this is with all details set to high) and vista itself when doing nothing sat idle for me on 64bit would use 1.5gb doing not alot. So thats 3.5gb already there. Another application for me which uses alot is itunes. Before now Ive found itunes using 2GB ram with every single piece of album art loaded (80GB library with 12000+ songs). So if im using itunes and photoshop which can use stupid amounts of ram you see 4GB on 64bit is not overkill infact I would say its a minimum amount required. I agree though if your sat using facebook all day then 32bit os with 2gb ram is plenty.

Hawkman out of interest why do you think moving stuff to pagefile isn't a performance reduction, in act it only increases performance. Think about it for a second if your moving stuff in and out of ram your moving from a non moving medium (ram) to a moving component. If a computer system is constantly moving stuff in and out of ram (due to lack of physical memory) then you get whats known as thrashing and the system performance decreases FACT. However if you have large amounts of physical memory and the system writes very little to disk pagefile then your hard drive isnt being slowed down by things in memory being moved to hard drive. Unless you were referring to not having the pagefile on the same drive as windows in that case yeah its different.

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

You don't NEED 4 GB on 64 bit.

I've been running 2GB on 64 for a long time, since XP x64 and then on Vista at RTM.

And I do heavy photoshopping, video editing and most importanlty I do 3D modellign and rendering.

and ram isn't where things clog up. With photoshop 2GB is enough unless you work on ridiculously large images.

And I think you need to research what are ACTUAL facts and what you think are facts, hearing trashign doesn't necessarily mean a slowdown of the system it just means the system is shifting data in and out of ram, it doesn't mean the system is slow.

However trashign can be a symptom of a slow system. and then yes, the system will be slow while you have trashing, but then trashign is a result of other faults in yoru system ausing unecessary trashing. Regular data moves in and out of pagefile however isn't a cause of slowdowns, that's just a background task being done while the omputer does other things.

or example when you start rendering, the app won't magically use all yoru ram at once, but it'll inform the OS it's going to be needing it, so the OS start shifting stuff out of RAM while the 3D app does it's thing and starts filling up ram with it's own stuff.

and of course, in the case of photoshop the Pagefile is so essential photoshop uses it's own pagefile.

As for Battlefield, funny Battlefield2 and 2142 runs just fine for me at high settings and 2 gigs of ram. And as I said, games are notoriusly bad prgrammed and bad at resource handling especially Coputer games. Games have a bad habit of filling up ram and never taking away stuff that's not needed untill it's full, at wich point they'll either Crash, start trashing, or slow down as they unwillingly realize they have to empty old stuff. There's a very few games that will do this job good enoguh and actively clean up.

The only games that really need lots of ram are high graphis quality MMO's (that's not WoW) such as EQ or Vanguard. where you have high res character textures and model data that'sunique for hundreds of characters in you vicinity, and new character enter your "active" areas all the time, while other ones ocnstantly leave. These are games where no mater how much ram you have, they will require pagefile. and for the record, Vanguard being one of the toughest most demanding games out there, It ran just fine with textures at Ultra on 2GB of ram. It ran a lot better after they got aroud to cleaning up their memory management code, butbefore that it ran bad for peopel with 4 and 8 gigs of ram too.

You live under the mistaken belif that havign lots of ram and putting everything in ram is the best and fastest option, wich just isn't true. Having lots of ram ould even slow down inding the data you do have in ram. And remember there's reason computers have L1 and L2 cache, and then ram, and not just humnogous and really fast L1 cache's.

Grand Master

Linkinfamous

Posted
Posted
You don't NEED 4 GB on 64 bit.

Running a 64-bit OS at less than 4gb is a mixed bag.

On one hand, some applications can take advantage of x86-64, and all the benefits that come with that (64-bit instructions, more registers, etc.) But on the other hand, there is inherently more overhead in the OS and all running applications, effectively giving you less memory than if you had a 32-bit OS, and some (generally negligible, though) performance penalty for running 32-bit processes.

Grand Master

CPressland

Posted
Posted

Well, My PC has 8GB of RAM, I've got Windows Managing my PageFile.

I don't really need all this memory but it is nice to have around, for example when I'm running 5 or more Virtual Machines at the same time, but over all it was a "Because I can situation" and Crysis x64 DOES use 6GB of memory so the way I see it is thats just less ware and tare on my hard drives.

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