Windows 7 tempting a Mac user

[rawr_boy81]

I'm pretty much in a ho-hum situation right now with my Mac; the Office 2008 for Mac suite from Microsoft is very average (behind Windows), iWork '10 seems to be turning out to be yet another great disappointment (no bibliography functions, crappy templates), long standing performance issues relating to video cards, the limited range of hardware and accessories (I don't want iPod to be the only choice) and a terrible media player at that with the third party ones either being buggy or bad ports from the *NIX world, and the development tool (XCode) is a pain in the bum to use.

I look at the Windows world and I see Windows 7, Office 2010, Live Essentials, Visual Studio 2010 and I am really tempting to the Windows world once I have finished university at the end of this year to use my student ID one last time to purchase Office 2010, the development tools and so on.

Are there any other Mac to Windows converts, specifically to Windows 7, who can give me some heads up on their experience? I've pretty much gotten to the end of my tether with Mac's at the moment and the constant let down and lack of focus by Apple who seem to be more concerned about every widget and device instead of improving their Mac operating system. I look at the massive improvements in the Windows world, the sexiness of the laptops, the improved features, spec, reliability when coupled with Windows make them far more tempting than Macs.

[Papz]

I'm pretty much in a ho-hum situation right now with my Mac; the Office 2008 for Mac suite from Microsoft is very average (behind Windows), iWork '10 seems to be turning out to be yet another great disappointment (no bibliography functions, crappy templates), long standing performance issues relating to video cards, the limited range of hardware and accessories (I don't want iPod to be the only choice) and a terrible media player at that with the third party ones either being buggy or bad ports from the *NIX world, and the development tool (XCode) is a pain in the bum to use.

I look at the Windows world and I see Windows 7, Office 2010, Live Essentials, Visual Studio 2010 and I am really tempting to the Windows world once I have finished university at the end of this year to use my student ID one last time to purchase Office 2010, the development tools and so on.

Are there any other Mac to Windows converts, specifically to Windows 7, who can give me some heads up on their experience? I've pretty much gotten to the end of my tether with Mac's at the moment and the constant let down and lack of focus by Apple who seem to be more concerned about every widget and device instead of improving their Mac operating system. I look at the massive improvements in the Windows world, the sexiness of the laptops, the improved features, spec, reliability when coupled with Windows make them far more tempting than Macs.

yep i converted back to 7.

best switch i did. iwork and office for mac ****ed me off....

[S.U.]

But i like Mac way better than any version of windows :)

[saturnslullaby]

Indirectly - I'm a long time PC user but am impartial over the PC vs Mac thing. I bought my GF a Macbook Pro last fall - just before Windows 7 was realeased to Technet. Since the install of Windows 7 on one of my notebooks, she tends to use that more than the Mac. I just asked her why and she said "because it's here..." :blink: - i looked at her again and asked "no really, why not use the Mac?" her reply in all it's simplicity "because i like it better...!"

She then proceeded to kick one of her heel slippers at me nearly taking off my head and stormed out and said "if you don't want me using it - i'll just go back to my Mac!!" :blink:

Thanks a lot OP and Mac... you just got me in **** :angry: !!

No really though - after explaining why i was asking all she pretty much said is that it "seems" faster and that Windows is more familiar and easier to use for her. The Mac was a friggin fashion accessory to all her other stuff and she openly admits to it. She wasn't really mad, we just play that way.

So there you have it.

[0nyX]

IThe Mac was a friggin fashion accessory to all her other stuff and she openly admits to it.

Yeap.These are some wise words your gf said.

Nothing more to add.

[zagor]

I'm pretty much in a ho-hum situation right now with my Mac; the Office 2008 for Mac suite from Microsoft is very average (behind Windows), iWork '10 seems to be turning out to be yet another great disappointment (no bibliography functions, crappy templates), long standing performance issues relating to video cards, the limited range of hardware and accessories (I don't want iPod to be the only choice) and a terrible media player at that with the third party ones either being buggy or bad ports from the *NIX world, and the development tool (XCode) is a pain in the bum to use.

I look at the Windows world and I see Windows 7, Office 2010, Live Essentials, Visual Studio 2010 and I am really tempting to the Windows world once I have finished university at the end of this year to use my student ID one last time to purchase Office 2010, the development tools and so on.

Are there any other Mac to Windows converts, specifically to Windows 7, who can give me some heads up on their experience? I've pretty much gotten to the end of my tether with Mac's at the moment and the constant let down and lack of focus by Apple who seem to be more concerned about every widget and device instead of improving their Mac operating system. I look at the massive improvements in the Windows world, the sexiness of the laptops, the improved features, spec, reliability when coupled with Windows make them far more tempting than Macs.

I can not say I am a convert. I have both a macbook pro and couple of thinkpads from lenovo. The only reason why I bought mac, in the first place, was I hated vista a lot. When windows 7 RC came out, I set it up on one of my computers. Then, I bought several copies :-) After windows 7, and after a couple of months, I rarely find myself using my macbook pro.

[zhangm Supervisor]

I think that the entire pool of user experiences is so diverse that the only effective way for you to know how you'll like Windows 7 is to try it out yourself.

I suppose the RC download may not be available anymore, but Microsoft does typically offer Enterprise trials for corporate users to download and test. These trials usually expire after a few months, but it is certainly long enough to get a feel for how things work, how well your hardware and software are supported, and how well the OS meshes with your user habits. I believe you can still get ahold of the Office 2010 Beta, and since you're involved in academia, you can probably get access to VS 2010 via the Dreamspark website. Just be aware that many people have at least some trouble switching to Windows 7 (from XP, Vista, and OS X), since the interface is different. I didn't fully switch myself after downloading the Beta - it took several weeks before I finally got comfortable with the new-ish interface. There are many things that aren't even obvious, including the new keyboard shortcuts, Jumplists, the click-and-drag method of bringing up menus... Anyway, if you're willing to explore the interface and new ways of doing tasks, you'll probably find the experience positive. Ironically, you may have an easier time switching than many XP users, since you may not have such an ingrained concept of how Windows should be.

I don't really recommend going out and playing with Windows 7 on a store machine. Those come loaded with bloatware and trialware, and generally provide a poor user experience out of the box.

[rawr_boy81]

yep i converted back to 7.

best switch i did. iwork and office for mac ****ed me off....

Just wondering - why did you move? was it Windows Vista? board with Windows? for me I moved to Mac around Windows XP/2000 because of the lack of features for 'power users' but having seen the inclusion of PowerShell: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_PowerShell That is what I call a sexy shell :) That was the main pulling power - the fact that I could 'get down and dirty' when I wanted to and yet have all the creature comforts of the 'real world' when I had to get some work done.

But i like Mac way better than any version of windows :)

I used to be in the same situation when I used 10.x back in my PowerPC days but it has pretty much been a downward spiral since. My iMac for example, if I start compressing more than 4 videos at a time my CPU temperature goes up very quickly and the fan doesn't kick in until too late - result? the whole thing seizes up and I'm forced to do a hard reset. Is it a hardware fault? nope, it is a known flaw in the design - thanks to Apple and its thin fetish. Then there is the issue of my MacBook where the fan fires up when trying to record a video using QuickTime - recording uncompressed video. I was expecting it to be able to handle such a simple job without needing to fire up the fans, after all, its only a series of jpeg images plus uncompressed audio. So the big question is either selling the iMac and MacBook now and get a beefy laptop.

Indirectly - I'm a long time PC user but am impartial over the PC vs Mac thing. I bought my GF a Macbook Pro last fall - just before Windows 7 was realeased to Technet. Since the install of Windows 7 on one of my notebooks, she tends to use that more than the Mac. I just asked her why and she said "because it's here..." :blink: - i looked at her again and asked "no really, why not use the Mac?" her reply in all it's simplicity "because i like it better...!"

She then proceeded to kick one of her heel slippers at me nearly taking off my head and stormed out and said "if you don't want me using it - i'll just go back to my Mac!!" :blink:

Thanks a lot OP and Mac... you just got me in **** :angry: !!

No really though - after explaining why i was asking all she pretty much said is that it "seems" faster and that Windows is more familiar and easier to use for her. The Mac was a friggin fashion accessory to all her other stuff and she openly admits to it. She wasn't really mad, we just play that way.

So there you have it.

For me was always the power of having a UNIX under the hood and a nice GUI ontop of it - but now that Microsoft has included PowerShell with Windows 7 (along with fixing up the problems with Windows Vista) which quite frankly is awesome, the last reason to hanging onto a Mac. I'm tempted to sell my iMac and MacBook (still have AppleCare left on it)it but I am cautiously going to head down the road tomorrow to use a laptop for a variety of vendors - give Windows 7 a go with applications.

Yeap.These are some wise words your gf said.

Nothing more to add.

I've seen alot of people drawn into the "Mac Fashion Statement" until they realise how fashion does get things done.

I can not say I am a convert. I have both a macbook pro and couple of thinkpads from lenovo. The only reason why I bought mac, in the first place, was I hated vista a lot. When windows 7 RC came out, I set it up on one of my computers. Then, I bought several copies :-) After windows 7, and after a couple of months, I rarely find myself using my macbook pro.

I bought a PC for a small period of time from Lenovo but Windows Vista put me off so much that I too a resale hit and ran back to Mac OS X - the thing I am worried about is a repeat of the same saga hence my ride into town tomorrow to have a good use of Windows 7 laptop to make up my verdict.

I think that the entire pool of user experiences is so diverse that the only effective way for you to know how you'll like Windows 7 is to try it out yourself.

Yeap, that is what I'm going to do - unfortunately for me the Mac I have wouldn't give it a fair comparison given the Intel GMA X3100 GPU that is inside it and unfortunately I don't have a copy of Windows 7 on hand to try out.

I suppose the RC download may not be available anymore, but Microsoft does typically offer Enterprise trials for corporate users to download and test. These trials usually expire after a few months, but it is certainly long enough to get a feel for how things work, how well your hardware and software are supported, and how well the OS meshes with your user habits. I believe you can still get ahold of the Office 2010 Beta, and since you're involved in academia, you can probably get access to VS 2010 via the Dreamspark website. Just be aware that many people have at least some trouble switching to Windows 7 (from XP, Vista, and OS X), since the interface is different. I didn't fully switch myself after downloading the Beta - it took several weeks before I finally got comfortable with the new-ish interface. There are many things that aren't even obvious, including the new keyboard shortcuts, Jumplists, the click-and-drag method of bringing up menus... Anyway, if you're willing to explore the interface and new ways of doing tasks, you'll probably find the experience positive. Ironically, you may have an easier time switching than many XP users, since you may not have such an ingrained concept of how Windows should be.

I've fiddled around with the Windows 7 interface and it is definitely a big leap ahead as far as usability and consistency. I've found unfortunately that Mac OS X has been going backwards for the past three releases with things becoming more and more buggy - not just third party software but built in components as well.

I don't really recommend going out and playing with Windows 7 on a store machine. Those come loaded with bloatware and trialware, and generally provide a poor user experience out of the box.

True, but even the ones in the store are really snappy and fast. Once my iPod Touch comes back from the repairs I'm going to sell that along with the iMac and MacBook - then get a Creative mp3 player and possibly one of the HP laptops - possibly pavilion dv8 entertainment - maybe get a netbook for when I am at university due to the size of the notebook or possibly a Dell although I'd love to hear feedback what their current notebooks are like - specifically Studio and Studio XPS.

[0nyX]

I've seen alot of people drawn into the "Mac Fashion Statement" until they realise how fashion does get things done.

Just clarifying some things so i wont be misunderstood.

I meant that i aknowledge that most people will buy mac's because they are trendy and they want to be in fashion.Doesnt mean that i support this.

The reality is that some years ago it was a lot more easier to complete some tasks in OSX and it required less steps from the userand that is why it became popular.However in my opinion things have changed now and with Windows 7 you can perform tasks more easily with fewer clicks and in more minimalistic and less bloated environment mostly due to Superbar and the way it handles open windows and programs.

[rawr_boy81]

Just clarifying some things so i wont be misunderstood.

I meant that i aknowledge that most people will buy mac's because they are trendy and they want to be in fashion.Doesnt mean that i support this.

True.

The reality is that some years ago it was a lot more easier to complete some tasks in OSX and it required less steps from the userand that is why it became popular.However in my opinion things have changed now and with Windows 7 you can perform tasks more easily with fewer clicks and in more minimalistic and less bloated environment mostly due to Superbar and the way it handles open windows and programs.

The improvements in Windows 7 definitely have addressed the problems I had with Windows in the past and have added the features that drew me to Mac OS X in the first place - I've 'obtained' a copy of Windows 7 to trial out on my MacBook - the look and feel is the main thing and it'll be interesting to see how well it out performs on the same machine as Mac OS X.

[Owen W Veteran]

True.

The improvements in Windows 7 definitely have addressed the problems I had with Windows in the past and have added the features that drew me to Mac OS X in the first place - I've 'obtained' a copy of Windows 7 to trial out on my MacBook - the look and feel is the main thing and it'll be interesting to see how well it out performs on the same machine as Mac OS X.

Hopefully it'll blow your mind :)

I've had it for over a year now, and I'm finding new handy little tricks every day, it's great :)

[fix-this!]

all i can add is windows 7 is amazing. ive been running the final for along time now and haven't noticed any slow downs, bsod and really have no need to format "fresh install" right now until i buy a new hdd. im all for apple, but alot of their products are eye candy IMO.

[Yusuf M. Veteran]

Windows 7 is a wonderful OS. Microsoft has done a good job with it. I've always used Windows as my main OS at home; however, I have used Mac OS X (and previous versions) at school/work. It's decent but I'm way too used to Windows, and I won't bore you with why I think it's better. I can say that it runs good and I think you'll enjoy using it. Plus, it's quite easy to use so getting used to it shouldn't be an issue. (Y)

[master2k27]

glad more are coming back to the good side , enjoy your stay

[REM2000]

The two os's are so close in terms of features and usability it really only comes down to personal preferences. Personally i prefer using a mac than windows, however i use windows at work 95% of the time and the mac 5%, at home it's the other way around (photo's, media, surfing email etc.) is all done on the mac, i only have a windows pc for some old games i used to play.

[andrew_f]

I tried readopting Windows and lasted for a few weeks and whilst Windows 7 is a good OS I personally still much prefer Snow Leopard. I would say go ahead and try running a partition in Boot Camp and see how you go.

I don't want this to be seen as flame bait, or any thing like that - but in my opinion Windows 7 is making up for a lacklustre previous release, but I think OS X is better quality right now. Maybe with Windows 8 it will overtake it, if Apple don't do anything with it.

I would argue against them not concentrating on the Mac side of things. Apple have pretty predictable product lifespans and there's due to be new MacBook Pros, Mac Pros and potentially MacBook Air's soon - plus 10.6.3 is coming (although that's just a minor update) and 10.7 is on the roadmap... I think it's fair to say things haven't stagnated but instead it's just been the Mac's 'quiet' period (Also, they just released Aperture 3 today - which is a big deal for certain Mac creative types).

Let us know what you decide to do, whichever way suits you best is the best way :)

[master2k27]

its very hard for people who are used to something to come back, i think windows 7 is a much better and simpler OS to use

[rawr_boy81]

I tried readopting Windows and lasted for a few weeks and whilst Windows 7 is a good OS I personally still much prefer Snow Leopard. I would say go ahead and try running a partition in Boot Camp and see how you go.

I don't want this to be seen as flame bait, or any thing like that - but in my opinion Windows 7 is making up for a lacklustre previous release, but I think OS X is better quality right now. Maybe with Windows 8 it will overtake it, if Apple don't do anything with it.

I would argue against them not concentrating on the Mac side of things. Apple have pretty predictable product lifespans and there's due to be new MacBook Pros, Mac Pros and potentially MacBook Air's soon - plus 10.6.3 is coming (although that's just a minor update) and 10.7 is on the roadmap... I think it's fair to say things haven't stagnated but instead it's just been the Mac's 'quiet' period (Also, they just released Aperture 3 today - which is a big deal for certain Mac creative types).

Let us know what you decide to do, whichever way suits you best is the best way :)

I'm going to think the issue over before making a decision although if I do move it won't be until USB 3.0 is available from the big vendors and supported by Windows 7 - I saw a laptop down the road from ASUS with USB 3.0 but I'd sooner wait till wide spread adoption. At that time I'll be able to compare Windows 8 to Mac OS X 10.7 which will hopefully translate a hardware refresh by Apple and both operating systems taking greater advantage of the merged technologies. For Windows there will be IE 9 which will take advantage of DirectWrite/Direct2D, hopefully it'll also mean more components of Windows moved to the new API's and more components are accelerated.

[Mike415]

I think the only thing holding Win7 back is hardware related which is on its way. (Multitouch trackpads)

Basically in my opinion the superbar is leaps ahead of OSX's dock. Overall the only time I see OSX as being possibly more productive is with Expose AND the multitouch trackpad/mouse command command to bring it up on the new macs. Otherwise OSX is just a pain to use with its dock. For example I have a regular trackpad on my laptop and superbar works very well with it, but I also have the equivalent of Expose loaded for Win+Z. I never use "Expose" because its more work to use the keyboard as wella s finding the window I want rather than move the mouse to bring up the wanted window which is separated by application whether it be minimized or not.

Maybe there is some huge thing Im missing when I use OSX, but as far as I can tell Windows is much more productive in terms of workflow.

The multitouch trackpad comes with negatives for me though because I find it often doesnt move the mouse how I want it to when i use it. Or sometimes it wont notice that my thumb is sitting there not as a gesture, but rather just to click. Also clicking often moves the mouse when I do it on the new macs and I miss click.

[Rudy]

Personally I can't stand using Windows...I have to almost everyday (at work) but I always make sure I don't have to at home :)

I'm surprised you mentioned Xcode being "not as good" as VS. I personally LOVE using Xcode (it took a bit to get used to it, it's not like most IDEs, but it's WAY better)

[zagor]

I think the only thing holding Win7 back is hardware related which is on its way. (Multitouch trackpads)

Basically in my opinion the superbar is leaps ahead of OSX's dock. Overall the only time I see OSX as being possibly more productive is with Expose AND the multitouch trackpad/mouse command command to bring it up on the new macs. Otherwise OSX is just a pain to use with its dock. For example I have a regular trackpad on my laptop and superbar works very well with it, but I also have the equivalent of Expose loaded for Win+Z. I never use "Expose" because its more work to use the keyboard as wella s finding the window I want rather than move the mouse to bring up the wanted window which is separated by application whether it be minimized or not.

Maybe there is some huge thing Im missing when I use OSX, but as far as I can tell Windows is much more productive in terms of workflow.

The multitouch trackpad comes with negatives for me though because I find it often doesnt move the mouse how I want it to when i use it. Or sometimes it wont notice that my thumb is sitting there not as a gesture, but rather just to click. Also clicking often moves the mouse when I do it on the new macs and I miss click.

if the only thing that is holding you back is a multitouch touchpad, you can just get a lenovo thinkpad. It has multitouch touchpad and it is an awesome business notebook. They are extremely well built.

[Mike415]

if the only thing that is holding you back is a multitouch touchpad, you can just get a lenovo thinkpad. It has multitouch touchpad and it is an awesome business notebook. They are extremely well built.

Im already on Windows. :)

LOVE IT

[rawr_boy81]

Personally I can't stand using Windows...I have to almost everyday (at work) but I always make sure I don't have to at home :)

I'm surprised you mentioned Xcode being "not as good" as VS. I personally LOVE using Xcode (it took a bit to get used to it, it's not like most IDEs, but it's WAY better).

I guess I just have to get used to XCode - I'm more used to the way Visual Studio does things; what would you suggest as a good book to learn the ropes? I just find the idea of interface builder and IE being separate as rather confusing.

[jesseinsf]

I'm pretty much in a ho-hum situation right now with my Mac; the Office 2008 for Mac suite from Microsoft is very average (behind Windows), iWork '10 seems to be turning out to be yet another great disappointment (no bibliography functions, crappy templates), long standing performance issues relating to video cards, the limited range of hardware and accessories (I don't want iPod to be the only choice) and a terrible media player at that with the third party ones either being buggy or bad ports from the *NIX world, and the development tool (XCode) is a pain in the bum to use.

I look at the Windows world and I see Windows 7, Office 2010, Live Essentials, Visual Studio 2010 and I am really tempting to the Windows world once I have finished university at the end of this year to use my student ID one last time to purchase Office 2010, the development tools and so on.

Are there any other Mac to Windows converts, specifically to Windows 7, who can give me some heads up on their experience? I've pretty much gotten to the end of my tether with Mac's at the moment and the constant let down and lack of focus by Apple who seem to be more concerned about every widget and device instead of improving their Mac operating system. I look at the massive improvements in the Windows world, the sexiness of the laptops, the improved features, spec, reliability when coupled with Windows make them far more tempting than Macs.

Mac people use Mac for a few reasons. First is: they have no choice, second is because it's a fashion accessory, third is: they were raised with it and fourth is: they don't feel comfortable thinking that they are not different, fifth is : they don't like viruses.

Windows 7 is great, I really enjoy it, but if I were you I would think wisely on this and don't read to much of these posts because it will just be overwhelming and will confuse anyone's purchase decision. Good Luck

[Jebadiah]

I suggest trying Win7 out on a Virtual Machine on your Mac first. See what you can do with it and what it can do for you, then shift or use both.