127 replies to this topic 2 votes

[carmatic]

PGHammer, on 28 November 2012 - 04:31, said:

I've kiboshed this on two other *tech* sites - now it's Neowin's turn.

They are referring specifically to Broadwell, which is the upcoming replacement to Atom/Cedar Trail/Clover Trail. Atom ships only in BGA packaging today.

The ONLY reference to Broadwell in the mainstream space is if - and ONLY if - devices supplant desktops as the mainstream; as it is, the earliest THAT would happen is late second half of 2015 (according to the leaked roadmap from Intel RoC).

Broadwell is, in fact, based on Haswell; however, it is NOT the planned *desktop* version of the technology! The desktop version is Lynx Point, and will succeed Ivy Bridge (*tock* - remember, Ivy Bridge itself is a *tick*)

There will also be a Haswell-EX (the successor to Sandy Bridge-E as well as XEON based on SB-E) and will be in LGA2011 or a successor socket thereof.

It is NOT known (or even speculated) whether Lynx Point will require a new socket.

once again, people need to read this reply ...
Broadwell is, in fact, based on Haswell; however, it is NOT the planned *desktop* version of the technology! The desktop version is Lynx Point, and will succeed Ivy Bridge
It is NOT known (or even speculated) whether Lynx Point will require a new socket.

[n_K]

Luis Mazza, on 28 November 2012 - 19:24, said:

You have too little knowledge of how things work in business. Maybe you're not even 18, for god's sake. But if you're, please give up.

Humm? I have little knowledge...? Let's go back to where you said intel would hapially change to BGA only and pass the cost savings on to you (makes ZERO sense from a business perspective)

Luis Mazza, on 27 November 2012 - 22:05, said:

If you look back, upgrading a processor is not that beneficial anymore, because to achieve real performance gains, you actually have to change everything: from motherboard, to RAM and storage.

Also, I think the cost will go down significantly.

Just lol.

[yowanvista]

carmatic, on 28 November 2012 - 20:03, said:

once again, people need to read this reply ...
Broadwell is, in fact, based on Haswell; however, it is NOT the planned *desktop* version of the technology! The desktop version is Lynx Point, and will succeed Ivy Bridge
It is NOT known (or even speculated) whether Lynx Point will require a new socket.

Lynx Point is the upcoming Intel 8-Series chipset for LGA1150 and not a "desktop version of Haswell". It's just like Ivy Bridge and its respective Intel 7-series "Panther Point" chipset.

From ZDNet:

Quote

I have now independent confirmation from a PC building OEM, who declined to be named, along with two motherboard makers, that Intel has briefed them of the switch from LGA to BGA for Broadwell architecture processors, which are expected to make an appearance next year.

http://www.zdnet.com...pus-7000008024/

[Mordkanin]

neufuse, on 28 November 2012 - 15:41, said:

and could you imagine 1000+ BGA solder points on a high wattage processor? those things *can* get hot. at least laptop lines are designed to be cooler to prevent this due to clock throttleing and other methods.... at least with LGA you can pop it out and see a bend hook and say yeah my socket is shot... BGA can fracture from heat changes over time

I can. I design power supplies with very high power dissipation. Certainly more than some puny computer gives off. I've also worked extensively with LED packagers that are forced to use water cooling in their most modest power systems. (Industrial processes needing UV lighting). These are guys that bond dies to heatsinks directly and then wirebond directly from chip to their power busses. Cool stuff (But not literally....)

A BGA build that fails was designed with poor CTE matching, insufficient cooling, or a defect after reflow (Which should have been caught in automatic xray inspect). Period. (And in the event of *failed* cooling, the design can detect this, and prevent physical failure)

[n_K]

"I design power supplies with very high power dissipation"
So already you're classing intel producing a CPU for the 'average joe' with making an enterprise product.
That's like saying a $400 PC out of bestbuy has the same reliability as a very high end spec enterprise server running mission critical software - they're not even in the same league.

[Luis Mazza]

n_K, on 28 November 2012 - 20:04, said:

Humm? I have little knowledge...? Let's go back to where you said intel would hapially change to BGA only and pass the cost savings on to you (makes ZERO sense from a business perspective)


Just lol.

Why don't you send Intel your wonderful business arguments, so those idiots can start making real calculations, huh? You're so much better...

[Wakers]

http://www.maximumpc...ted_sockets2012

Oh look, the rumour was garbage just like every sensible person knew!

[Xerxes]

I can understand why others are upset but personally I'm not too bothered. The way I upgrade my PC this decision does not affect me at all really, as when I buy a new PC I try to get a really good CPU that will last me some time. I then upgrade the GPU, RAM, HDD etc over time to keep it going but always leave the CPU alone. When it gets to the point the CPU is holding the PC back is time for a new machine. Might not be the most effective method of doing it but has worked for me just fine