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Multiplayer sure wont be AS GOOD as it could be, since there is a singleplayer.

Why not?

DICE has the time and money to take their time, coding single player will take as long as it needs to take its not going to take time away from working on multiplayer, id even bet that they have staff split between the single and multiplayer aspects of the game separately.

Yeah multiplayer and singleplayer will be being developed alongside each other with two separate teams. DICE are big enough to handle both and they've been developing the battlefield series for years, so it won't suffer.

The only reason people think it will suffer is because of call of duty and their dev cycle for the series.

Why so many people want single player? one of the reasons I love so much Battlefield, Mafia and Max Payne is that they all focus on what they're good at. Over the years I've seen so many games trying to overreach and ending up with either boring singleplayer experiences or sucky MP plagued with empty servers. Really, there's just so little games that can do both alright (off the top of my head, Quake 2 and the original Fear after "Combat" was released) it makes me wish developers just stick to their main idea.

Hey, if both SP and MP end up being amazing, all the merrier! but it's quite a risk.

All the time, resources and money could be put towards multiplayer. Why not merge both teams and have them work on multiplayer? I mean if you guys want a single player and don't mind that multiplayer won't have AS MUCH work put towards it, fine. But don't say having a singleplayer doesn't effect it, cause it does.

All the time, resources and money could be put towards multiplayer. Why not merge both teams and have them work on multiplayer? I mean if you guys want a single player and don't mind that multiplayer won't have AS MUCH work put towards it, fine. But don't say having a singleplayer doesn't effect it, cause it does.

No actually it doesn't.

look at MoH. multiplayer and singleplayer where effectively two different games, they didn't even share art assets.

I'm very much into Multiplayer aspects, BC2 at the moment. But I still love smashing the single player campaigns, and I do think they have gotten extremely good recently. I loved all of the single player campaigns in BC2, MoH and Black Ops.

Although I did think MoH was the best and BO the weakest.

All the time, resources and money could be put towards multiplayer. Why not merge both teams and have them work on multiplayer? I mean if you guys want a single player and don't mind that multiplayer won't have AS MUCH work put towards it, fine. But don't say having a singleplayer doesn't effect it, cause it does.

You don't know that for sure. It would make sense for DICE to have a team for SP and a team for MP. And you're totally right with your last statement. Often times, MP maps are based on SP maps so having a SP campaign has positive benefits.

I'm all for having a MP-only Battlefield 3 if it means a better MP experience but let's not be too selfish here. Instead, let's take comfort in the fact that the game will be heavily MP-oriented and that their focus is to provide an amazing online experience. As I said before, I see the SP campaign as an added bonus.

No actually it doesn't.

look at MoH. multiplayer and singleplayer where effectively two different games, they didn't even share art assets.

Well that's not an efficient way of making a game. And all those guys making the singleplayer could have worked on multiplayer. Maybe it would have turned out better. :laugh:

Let's just say dice has 100 people making battlefield 3. 50 working on multiplayer and 50 working on singleplayer. Wouldn't you think multiplayer could be better if all 100 were working on it? Sure maybe some guys wouldn't be necessary, so they could be replaced with people who would be necessary.

You don't know that for sure. It would make sense for DICE to have a team for SP and a team for MP. And you're totally right with your last statement. Often times, MP maps are based on SP maps so having a SP campaign has positive benefits.

I'm all for having a MP-only Battlefield 3 if it means a better MP experience but let's not be too selfish here. Instead, let's take comfort in the fact that the game will be heavily MP-oriented and that their focus is to provide an amazing online experience. As I said before, I see the SP campaign as an added bonus.

That's true I dont KNOW for sure. I'm not saying BF3 will have bad multiplayer either. I'm sure it will be amazing. I just think it could be even more amazing, if there was no time spent on singleplayer.

All the time, resources and money could be put towards multiplayer. Why not merge both teams and have them work on multiplayer? I mean if you guys want a single player and don't mind that multiplayer won't have AS MUCH work put towards it, fine. But don't say having a singleplayer doesn't effect it, cause it does.

No it doesn't. You're thinking they are pulling resources from multiplayer to work on singleplayer. They aren't. They have a separate team, whom would, probably, otherwise be working on other projects. They already have the necessary time, money and resources for multiplayer. Adding more doesn't mean it's going to be better. In fact adding more would probably hinder it's development, as the old saying goes: Too many chefs spoil the broth.

All the time, resources and money could be put towards multiplayer. Why not merge both teams and have them work on multiplayer? I mean if you guys want a single player and don't mind that multiplayer won't have AS MUCH work put towards it, fine. But don't say having a singleplayer doesn't effect it, cause it does.

If they have two separate teams working on it, it's not like one team is getting short changed and the other benefits. What logic is there in merging the two teams to make the multiplayer? Do you honestly think having a 120-person team instead of a 60-person team is going to make the multiplayer even better? DICE has employees that have concentrated on the singleplayer in the previous Bad Company games -- it would make no sense to have them now work on the multiplayer aspect of the game. Having a singleplayer doesn't change the multiplayer. What do you think they're going to be lacking by not having the singleplayer team working on multiplayer?

Well that's not an efficient way of making a game. And all those guys making the singleplayer could have worked on multiplayer. Maybe it would have turned out better. :laugh:

Let's just say dice has 100 people making battlefield 3. 50 working on multiplayer and 50 working on singleplayer. Wouldn't you think multiplayer could be better if all 100 were working on it? Sure maybe some guys wouldn't be necessary, so they could be replaced with people who would be necessary.

That's true I dont KNOW for sure. I'm not saying BF3 will have bad multiplayer either. I'm sure it will be amazing. I just think it could be even more amazing, if there was no time spent on singleplayer.

More people working on something doesn't make it better, in fact often it can make it worse. more chefs and all that.

No it doesn't. You're thinking they are pulling resources from multiplayer to work on singleplayer. They aren't. They have a separate team, whom would, probably, otherwise be working on other projects. They already have the necessary time, money and resources for multiplayer. Adding more doesn't mean it's going to be better. In fact adding more would probably hinder it's development, as the old saying goes: Too many chefs spoil the broth.

No, I know they have a separate team. But the people making the levels for singleplayer could make maps for multiplayer instead. People making models and textures that won't be seen in multiplayer could be spent making models and textures for multiplayer. People creating the scripts and animations for single player could be making them for multiplayer instead.

How many maps do you expect them to make, two people cant work on the same map as any changes one makes wont get copied over to the map the other is making. There isnt a strict time limit to these things so there is no need for loads of people to be doing the same job.

How many maps do you expect them to make, two people cant work on the same map as any changes one makes wont get copied over to the map the other is making. There isnt a strict time limit to these things so there is no need for loads of people to be doing the same job.

I have no expectations on the number of maps. I'm saying that there could be MORE if they weren't doing them for singleplayer.

No, I know they have a separate team. But the people making the levels for singleplayer could make maps for multiplayer instead. People making models and textures that won't be seen in multiplayer could be spent making models and textures for multiplayer. People creating the scripts and animations for single player could be making them for multiplayer instead.

You think there aren't people doing that in the multiplayer team? You think having more people will inherently make that portion of the game better?

I have no expectations on the number of maps. I'm saying that there could be MORE if they weren't doing them for singleplayer.

As already stated they arent working to time constraints, they have already planned out how many multiplayer maps they are going to make, they dont just keep making things till they run out of time, having more people wont get things done any better.

You think there aren't people doing that in the multiplayer team? You think having more people will inherently make that portion of the game better?

I know that there are. Yes. Because their time could be spent on making multiplayer better. If they all switched to multiplayer and suddenly the game was ready to be released earlier, then great, or maybe they could have added more to it.

I'm sorry if I sound illogical I just don't understand why no one sees my point. :pinch:

As already stated they arent working to time constraints, they have already planned out how many multiplayer maps they are going to make, they dont just keep making things till they run out of time, having more people wont get things done any better.

Ok. Let's say they planned 5 maps. Then they decided to scrap singleplayer and move them to multiplayer. Wouldn't you think we could get MORE maps?

I know that there are. Yes. Because their time could be spent on making multiplayer better. If they all switched to multiplayer and suddenly the game was ready to be released earlier, then great, or maybe they could have added more to it.

I'm sorry if I sound illogical I just don't understand why no one sees my point. :pinch:

Ok. Let's say they planned 5 maps. Then they decided to scrap singleplayer and move them to multiplayer. Wouldn't you think we could get MORE maps?

because only so many people can work on the code at one point.

because the multiplayer can only have so many art assets.

because they can only test and balance so many multiplayer maps before launch, no matter how many people that make them.

because the SP team, don't do multiplayer, they do SP. they would be useless for MP.

because lot of people buy games for SP to and then get into the MP.

Ok. Let's say they planned 5 maps. Then they decided to scrap singleplayer and move them to multiplayer. Wouldn't you think we could get MORE maps?

no

Sorry thatguyandrew1992, but I don't think you have a shred of a clue what you're talking about. Budgeting developer workflow is much more complicated than taking a team of 100 and splitting things even. It's not that simple. Art assets and animations, things like that can be swapped interchangably. I think you'd have to read more into an atypical development process rather than give an argument devoid of any critical thinking.

The argument, by the way, is pretty silly to begin with. To a certain point, more people working on something does NOT equal more quality and replayability.

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    • Again, this is an irrelevant attempt to attack the messenger. The truth does not require any justification.
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    • Why it's almost impossible to produce a smartphone in the United States by Hamid Ganji If you look at the back of some Apple products, you can see the famous phrase “Designed by Apple in California, Assembled in China.” This phrase appears on products from one of the largest smartphone brands in the United States. These products are designed in the U.S., but their manufacturing takes place in China, India, Vietnam, or even Brazil. But why can’t Apple, as one of the largest American tech companies, produce its iPhones on U.S. soil? The idea for this topic came to me after the Trump Foundation launched a smartphone called the T1 and claimed that it was designed and built with American values in mind. However, this claim did not last long, as it was revealed that Trump’s phone was actually a rebranded HTC U24 Pro, with only a gold case and minor internal component changes. You see? Even a phone that is supposed to represent American values is manufactured in China. With a gross domestic product (GDP) exceeding $32 trillion, the United States is currently the world’s largest economy, while China ranks second with around $20 trillion. On the other hand, the United States is by a wide margin the global leader in various technological fields, and American companies spend hundreds of billions of dollars annually on research and development. From Apple and Google to Microsoft, Lockheed Martin, Boeing, and others, American tech and industrial giants lead their foreign competitors in many sectors. The United States also has no shortage of smartphone brands. Apple, Google, and Motorola are among the major brands in the smartphone market, collectively holding a significant share. However, the vast majority of their products are manufactured outside the United States. So why is it that the world’s largest economy, home to the most advanced technology companies and industrial powers, cannot produce a smartphone on its own soil? Let’s explore this question together. Even threats to impose tariffs won’t work After Trump entered the White House as the 47th President of the United States, his administration adopted strict tariff policies. One of these policies was the imposition of a 25% tariff on smartphones manufactured outside the United States. Trump said he “had a little problem” with Apple CEO Tim Cook over producing smartphones outside the U.S. So he thought that threatening a 25% tax on imported phones might force Apple to bring manufacturing back to the United States. “I have long ago informed Tim Cook of Apple that I expect their iPhones that will be sold in the United States of America will be manufactured and built in the United States, not India, or anyplace else,” Trump wrote on Truth Social. Image via The White House Although Apple currently manufactures some of the iPhone’s chips in the United States with TSMC's help, it still shows no willingness to shift full iPhone production to the country. At the time, renowned Apple supply chain analyst Ming-Chi Kuo wrote on X, “In terms of profitability, it’s way better for Apple to take the hit of a 25% tariff on iPhones sold in the US market than to move iPhone assembly lines back to the US.” However, manufacturing a smartphone in the United States is not as easy as it might seem, and many technical and economic barriers are involved. The lack of necessary manufacturing hubs There is a clear reason why many companies prefer to manufacture their products in China. China has established itself as the main global manufacturing hub for international companies, and over the past few decades, large contract manufacturers have emerged there, allowing companies like Apple to outsource production. One such example is Foxconn, which also manufactures some Apple products in India. Building the infrastructure required to produce smartphones in the United States would require tens of billions of dollars in new investment. Factories would need to be built, essential manufacturing equipment would have to be installed, and, most importantly, a skilled workforce capable of operating these systems would need to be recruited and trained. The United States currently lacks the core infrastructure needed to manufacture smartphones, and for this reason, many companies prefer to outsource production to Chinese contractors rather than spend tens of billions of dollars to build that infrastructure, which is significantly more economically efficient. Additionally, building such infrastructure in the United States could take up to a decade, ultimately leading to a significant increase in the product's final price for consumers. Shortage of trained labor in the U.S. compared to China Decades of serving as a global manufacturing hub have allowed China to build a massive talent pool in the production sector that is almost unmatched worldwide. Today, if a company chooses to manufacture its products in China, it can be confident that the workers involved in production have years of experience in their respective roles and are capable of producing high-quality goods with minimal errors. Even if we assume that tens of billions of dollars were invested in building smartphone manufacturing infrastructure in the United States, finding skilled workers would remain highly challenging. Apple CEO Tim Cook visiting the iPhone 6 assembly line in China in 2014. Image: Tim Cook on X In a 2015 interview on CBS’s 60 Minutes, Tim Cook said the main reason Apple isn’t producing in the US is a lack of skills. "China put an enormous focus on manufacturing, in what you and I would call vocational kind of skills. The US over time began to stop having as many vocational kinds of skills. I mean you could take every tool and die maker in the United States and probably put them in the room that we're currently sitting in. In China you would have to have multiple football fields,” Cook said. Also, in 2017, at the Fortune Global Forum in Guangzhou, Cook once again emphasized the importance of highly skilled Chinese workers. “China has moved into very advanced manufacturing, so you find in China the intersection of craftsman kind of skill, and sophisticated robotics and the computer science world. That intersection, which is very rare to find anywhere, that kind of skill, is very important to our business because of the precision and quality level that we like. The thing that most people focus on if they’re a foreigner coming to China is the size of the market, and obviously, it’s the biggest market in the world in so many areas. But for us, the number one attraction is the quality of the people,” Apple CEO said. Higher labor costs in the United States Producing almost any product in the United States is more expensive than in many other countries, and one of the main reasons is the higher cost of labor in the U.S. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, median weekly earnings of full-time workers in the United States were $1,235 in the first quarter of 2026. Meanwhile, the average annual salary in China's private sector in 2025 was RMB 71,590 (US$9,961). In many parts of the world, the weekly wage of an American worker is equivalent to several months of income. Another important factor to consider is that in the United States, the workforce capable of working on a smartphone assembly line is highly specialized and therefore commands higher-than-average wages. According to an estimate by Bank of America, producing an iPhone in the U.S. is technically possible, but “iPhone cost can increase 25% purely on higher labor cost in the U.S.” However, this 25% increase applies only if final assembly is performed in the United States while components are still sourced from China or elsewhere. In this case, the price of a base iPhone would rise from $799 to around $1,000. But in another scenario, if Apple were to produce the required components for the iPhone within the United States, production costs could increase by more than 90%. Trump’s dream for a “Made in the USA” iPhone might never come true In a free-market capitalist economy, one of the primary responsibilities of any CEO is to maximize profit. Using Apple as an example, Tim Cook’s role is to maximize the company’s profits so that it can fund research and development for new products and invest in areas such as artificial intelligence, while also keeping shareholders satisfied. 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