Crap articles and moderators...

By lalalawawawa
in Site & Forum Issues

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Neowin aint what it was 9 - 10 years ago that's for sure. Maybe it's because I was younger, but I remember news stories being limited to actually new WORTHY stories. I also remember it being alot less strict, it seemed people called talk about more liberal things etc. I suppose this added strictness could come with the site getting bigger and having more responsibility though....

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Posted
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Naziitistic may no be the best way to put it lol, but it's the right direction. It seems now people get warnings and posts deleted allot more easily and the mods are generally more sensitive and less open minded. I don't particularly care, as I mainly come here when I need an answer to a question or just to browse areas of my interest and laugh at people getting worked up over posts etc., it's just something I have observed and you can't really single anything out as an example because it's happened so gradually over a wide space of time.

Also I understand you don't need a whole mountain of comments posted each saying an article has it's facts wrong, but surely you need a few people to post that it's wrong, otherwise people won't know it's wrong until Neowin gets round to changing it.

If your just stating the facts about an article, whether disproving it or not, this surely still counts as discussion, and can be discussed....

edit: don't get me wrong, i'm not hating, Neowin's still my favourite place for anything geek related

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Tzvi Friedman Veteran

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If your just stating the facts about an article, whether disproving it or not, this surely still counts as discussion, and can be discussed....

It's not about quantity, but quality. There's a difference between "This writer sux" and "I think the facts might be wrong because xyz" I'm pretty sure those aren't getting deleted. One sparks meaningful discussion/corrections, one wants attention.

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former1

Posted
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Tzvi I think what you're saying is completely incorrect, recently Neowin seems to be focussing on content over quality. In this thread you all seem to be ignoring the feedback your getting and just saying 'use the report button'. None of you have acknowledged that the quality has decreased in the past year or so, people seem to be writing ****ty articles just for the pay check.

There has to be some form of quality control in place as well as fact checking - so many articles recently have been incorrect / silly spelling errors. I'd point them out - but oh wait all the comments have been deleted? lol To be honest I'd go through and highlight them all but it's 2340 so .. night.

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Julius Caro

Posted
Posted

It's not about quantity, but quality. There's a difference between "This writer sux" and "I think the facts might be wrong because xyz" I'm pretty sure those aren't getting deleted. One sparks meaningful discussion/corrections, one wants attention.

That statement alone implies censorship without solid criteria. You just leave to the moderator to determine what's "meaningful discussion" and what's not. And with that criteria you're assuming that the quality of all the articles is good enough to warrant 'meaningful arguments', which is not the case.

And by the way, when people comment or point out typos, at least they can get replies. The report button is this obscure thing and the only way of knowing your message got through, is when the article is corrected. IF it's corrected.

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Tzvi Friedman Veteran

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Tzvi I think what you're saying is completely incorrect, recently Neowin seems to be focussing on content over quality. In this thread you all seem to be ignoring the feedback your getting and just saying 'use the report button'. None of you have acknowledged that the quality has decreased in the past year or so, people seem to be writing ****ty articles just for the pay check.

I'm pretty sure the topic of discussion is why we're deleting critical comments. The answer is that for most simple grammatical/misspell mistakes, the proper course of action is to use the report button. It is more effective, and keeps the comments section cleaner. If you think the writing is just horrible in general, I'm sorry to hear that. We're always trying to improve where we can.

There has to be some form of quality control in place as well as fact checking - so many articles recently have been incorrect / silly spelling errors. I'd point them out - but oh wait all the comments have been deleted? lol To be honest I'd go through and highlight them all but it's 2340 so .. night.

We won't catch everything. That's assumed. We actually depend a lot on the reports system to fix our own fails. We appreciate all the reasonable feedback from that tool, and we fix everything as quickly as possible. If you want the site to be better, use the tool and help us. We aren't perfect.

That statement alone implies censorship without solid criteria. You just leave to the moderator to determine what's "meaningful discussion" and what's not. And with that criteria you're assuming that the quality of all the articles is good enough to warrant 'meaningful arguments', which is not the case.

I'm not a moderator, so i can't comment on specifics, but it isn't random. There are definitely criteria, and the mod team is trusted to uphold certain standards of moderation. That's what they're hired for.

And by the way, when people comment or point out typos, at least they can get replies. The report button is this obscure thing and the only way of knowing your message got through, is when the article is corrected. IF it's corrected.

Well, isn't that the point? I hear what you're saying, recognition is nice, and maybe that's a feature we can implement down the line, but the response is almost always "fix'd". Is that what you would want?

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Owen W Veteran

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Posted

Tzvi I think what you're saying is completely incorrect, recently Neowin seems to be focussing on content over quality. In this thread you all seem to be ignoring the feedback your getting and just saying 'use the report button'. None of you have acknowledged that the quality has decreased in the past year or so, people seem to be writing ****ty articles just for the pay check.

There has to be some form of quality control in place as well as fact checking - so many articles recently have been incorrect / silly spelling errors. I'd point them out - but oh wait all the comments have been deleted? lol To be honest I'd go through and highlight them all but it's 2340 so .. night.

We definitely do not do this for the pay check. I can tell you that much. Please cite your "content over quality" - you can't make these kinds of rash accusations without backing it up. Edit: You know Engadget and Giz make mistakes too right? They're just caught faster because people a) Report them b) They have an entire team dedicated to this.

On the "ignoring feedback" topic you are incorrect here. We accepted your feedback, and have told you our procedures. I'm confused as to how we're ignoring it when we're telling you how to rectify the issue.

We won't catch everything. That's assumed. We actually depend a lot on the reports system to fix our own fails. We appreciate all the reasonable feedback from that tool, and we fix everything as quickly as possible. If you want the site to be better, use the tool and help us. We aren't perfect.

This. (Y)

Grand Master

Yusuf M. Veteran

Posted
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[...]

And by the way, when people comment or point out typos, at least they can get replies. The report button is this obscure thing and the only way of knowing your message got through, is when the article is corrected. IF it's corrected.

The comment section isn't the right place to mention any typos or other errors. In fact, it's not a good way to mention it at all. With the report system, there's an entire section dedicated to reported issues which can be seen by the staff to be handled accordingly.

Grand Master

Julius Caro

Posted
Posted

I anybody copy/pastes, we sic lyle on them

What about NOT copypasting, but trying to pass something as news when it was first reported by someone else, without giving proper source? I mean I REALLY doubt any news is copypasted, but there's the typical case of news spreading like wildfire all over the net that are way too random to have been discovered at the same time by different 'news sites' like neowin. Properly citing the source doesnt hurt

Grand Master

tomwarren Veteran

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I've been on both sides of the fence. The guys at Neowin do a good job and for no charge to you. I have posted comments (since I stepped down as admin) and some have been removed and yes it's frustrating for these to be removed as an ordinary member. I've also witnessed people bomb my stories at Neowin with stupid comments and that's even more annoying. No-one likes criticism but it's always best to take it on the chin and move along.

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Owen W Veteran

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  • Veteran
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What about NOT copypasting, but trying to pass something as news when it was first reported by someone else, without giving proper source? I mean I REALLY doubt any news is copypasted, but there's the typical case of news spreading like wildfire all over the net that are way too random to have been discovered at the same time by different 'news sites' like neowin. Properly citing the source doesnt hurt

We do cite the source, we just do it inline, many others do this, and it looks tidier.

I've been on both sides of the fence. The guys at Neowin do a good job and for no charge to you. I have posted comments (since I stepped down as admin) and some have been removed and yes it's frustrating for these to be removed as an ordinary member. I've also witnessed people bomb my stories at Neowin with stupid comments and that's even more annoying. No-one likes criticism but it's always best to take it on the chin and move along.

(Y)

Grand Master

Denis W. Veteran

Posted
  • Veteran
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What about NOT copypasting, but trying to pass something as news when it was first reported by someone else, without giving proper source? I mean I REALLY doubt any news is copypasted, but there's the typical case of news spreading like wildfire all over the net that are way too random to have been discovered at the same time by different 'news sites' like neowin. Properly citing the source doesnt hurt

There was this same discussion months ago about this topic:

https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/986524-please-neowin-start-linking-sources-properly/

My take is that some other sites place source links at the bottom, as what they actually write on their end is a small blurb (which more often than not tends to be sarcastic and humourous).

Veteran

nabz0r Veteran

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  • Veteran
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Agreed. I called a person a name ONCE a year or so back and I get a warning against me and my post edited/deleted. I see people doing it all the time and their posts are not removed at all.

There is a button called "Report" plus that mods here have real life too and can't be active 24/7 just to check every bad word on the forum. Most of the time when we delete, edit or warn users we get those reports from the users here in Neowin.

Next time report it and see what we do about it.

Grand Master

Andrew Lyle Global Moderator

Posted
  • Global Moderator
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To get on the point immediately, what's up with you guys lately deleting comments that suggest a news post / article is wrong / crap? We can't give feedback anymore?

EDIT: Also, why not add a dislike button too?

I don't think "Crappy article is crappy." stands as 'feedback', but more bashing the author. This only leads to further negative comments from other members.

If anyone has an issue with the author/article, just shoot them a PM and explain why. Stating "Crappy article is crappy." isn't exactly leaving us with much to work off of. I've received an email in the past where someone told me to "f-off" and that my "article sucked". I immediately replied once I read it and asked why, turns out the sender was 'under the influence' and apologized.

It's really easy to tell somebody they suck, or a company sucks, or a certain product sucks, but hardly anyone explains why.

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