Ionium Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 Using a Rat 3 mouse, the scroll directions are inverted in Lion. Any way to fix it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nerd Rage Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 Top checkbox in the mouse pane of sys prefs. I thought that was a weird change/bug as well to switch scroll directions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southern Patriot Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 Well, it actually makes a lot of sense when using a touchpad, but I can see where it would be confusing when using a scroll wheel on a mouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliott Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 It's definitely a jarring change for most users, but one that makes a lot of sense when you actually use it in practice. The only problem I have with it is I wish I could turn it off for my Logitech mouse but keep it on for my trackpad. My brain really hates it on my Logitech but loves it on my Magic Trackpad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViperAFK Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 Well, it actually makes a lot of sense when using a touchpad, but I can see where it would be confusing when using a scroll wheel on a mouse. I don't see how it would make sense with a touchpad either, silly default. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomjol Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 I don't see how it would make sense with a touchpad either, silly default. To mimic scrolling on an iDevice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Neo Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 I don't see how it would make sense with a touchpad either, silly default. To mimic the behavior of iOS devices. Luckily it takes about ten seconds to change back to what you're used to, so no need for complaints. ccuk, Nicholas-c, instant.human and 1 other 4 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliott Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 I don't see how it would make sense with a touchpad either, silly default. On a touchpad, it feels similar to iOS depending on how your brain handles the situation. To me, it feels like I'm moving the content rather than moving the scrollbar, so inverted scrolling makes sense. John S., Southern Patriot, d4v1d05 and 1 other 4 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migo Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I think it depends on if the pointer is present. The pointer is supposed to be your finger analogue, so that kind of behaviour in Acrobat Reader or an image program where you click and grab makes sense. If Lion behaves in the same way then I think it'd be good, if it doesn't, then it'll be confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evo0o Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 To make the scroll directions different on the mice is just plain... wrong, for lack of a better word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyX Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 It makes no sense to enable it by default with mice peripherals. Shame on Apple for this. With a trackpad, it?s awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Neo Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 It makes no sense to enable it by default with mice peripherals. Shame on Apple for this. With a trackpad, it?s awesome. Yeah shame on Apple for taking ten seconds of your extremely valuable time to uncheck a checkbox. Damn them to hell I say! dead.cell, Elliott and Nicholas-c 3 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miuku. Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Yeah shame on Apple for taking ten seconds of your extremely valuable time to uncheck a checkbox. Damn them to hell I say! 10 seconds? What are you, cooking while doing it? :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Neo Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 10 seconds? What are you, cooking while doing it? :p I took 7 seconds into account some need to complain about it here on Neowin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliott Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I took 7 seconds into account some need to complain about it here on Neowin. :rofl: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyX Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Yeah shame on Apple for taking ten seconds of your extremely valuable time to uncheck a checkbox. Damn them to hell I say! Yeah, and they could have checked "invert colors on screen" while we're at it. It takes 10 seconds to fix. Why they haven't included the checkbox in the little assistant that runs when Lion is booted for the first time is beyond me. ccuk, Gocom, Chlorpromazine and 2 others 5 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajputwarrior Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 i don't like the "natural scrolling" either via touchpad. on a multi touch device it makes sense because you are actually "touching" the content, unlike the trackpad. Tamilboy86 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Neo Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Yeah, and they could have checked "invert colors on screen" while we're at it. It takes 10 seconds to fix. Because those two things are totally on the same level: Every single Mac shipping with a Magic Mouse and/or (Magic) Trackpad versus the amount of Macs shipping to the visually impaired. You really thought that one through huh? Why they haven't included the checkbox in the little assistant that runs when Lion is booted for the first time is beyond me. Why you are actually complaining about something that can be changed with hardly any effort on your part at all is beyond me. What you're suggesting will save you two clicks. Yup, that's actually what you're upset about: Not being able to save two clicks once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
articuno1au Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Sure it's easy to fix, but it shouldn't happen. How hard would it be for them to notify users of the change? Also how hard would it be to include 2 separate conditions, one setting for mouse, another for trackpads >.> Either way, kinda random.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vip Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 I knew about the change, I followed the beta threads here at Neowin ... I knew there was a way to fix it, I just couldn't find it again in the thread, until this was made! And thank you for making this thread. Scrolling backwards was driving me nuts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Neo Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Sure it's easy to fix, but it shouldn't happen. Personally I like the change on both the Magic Trackpad and Magic Mouse, so whether it shouldn't happen or should is personal. Also how hard would it be to include 2 separate conditions, one setting for mouse, another for trackpads >.> Because the Magic Mouse with its multi-touch sensitive surface is a mouse as well. Next to that we all know how Apple loves providing build-in conditions for third-party hardware. :laugh: That's the only thing I can agree on here: When plugging in a third-party mouse Mac OS X should detect this and change the preference on-the-fly. However, we all know that Apple doesn't take into account hardware made by third-parties they provide as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
articuno1au Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Personally I like the change on both the Magic Trackpad and Magic Mouse, so whether it shouldn't happen or should is personal. It's really not. It's a change in one of the most basic computer functions for reasons that aren't easily apparent to the average user. I do agree that it's opinion based whether it's good, but the change isn't something that should happen without notification >.< (The point being, regardless of whether the change is good or not, it's a base function that oughtn't be changed without notification) Because the Magic Mouse with its multi-touch sensitive surface is a mouse as well. Next to that we all know how Apple loves providing build-in conditions for third-party hardware. :laugh: That's the only thing I can agree on here: When plugging in a third-party mouse Mac OS X should detect this and change the preference on-the-fly. Yeah, how many mice do you think the average person uses with their computer? >.< Turn it on for the mouse and it will work with your touch mice :p It shouldn't matter if it's first or third party. PEDANTIC MUCH!? Seriously :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyX Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Because those two things are totally on the same level: Every single Mac shipping with a Magic Mouse and/or (Magic) Trackpad versus the amount of Macs shipping to the visually impaired. You really thought that one through huh? Maybe when you have a Magic Mouse, it makes sense because it?s a touch-surface. But if you use some other 3rd-party mouse (like me), it doesn?t. Simply put, it?s a stupid decision. Having inverted colors on my screen would be as annoying as inverted scrollbars are here. Think about it, changing how we scroll is a big thing in 2011. People are scrolling up and down every 5 seconds nowadays. So every 5 seconds it either screws up your experience, or it makes it wonderful. Why you and others are actually complaining about something that can be changed with hardly any effort on your part at all is beyond me. What you're suggesting will save you two clicks. Yup, that's actually what you're upset about: Not being able to save two clicks once. It?s not the fact that it takes effort or not. It?s the fact that right away, they?re presenting something that can totally change your experience for the better or the worse. Newcomers to the Mac world will go like "Macs are sh*t, they don?t even scroll correctly" and they won?t even think about trying it further more. You and I know where to find the option, they will have to look around. Just admit that having a little checkbox below the video to revert it back would be perfect? Hell, they?re not even saying "you can go through System Preferences > Mouse > Inverted Scrolling and revert it if you don?t want". To me, they?re almost forcing us to use our Macs this way. Tamilboy86 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Neo Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Maybe when you have a Magic Mouse, it makes sense because it?s a touch-surface. But if you use some other 3rd-party mouse (like me), it doesn?t. Simply put, it?s a stupid decision. Having inverted colors on my screen would be as annoying as inverted scrollbars are here. Think about it, changing how we scroll is a big thing in 2011. People are scrolling up and down every 5 seconds nowadays. So every 5 seconds it either screws up your experience, or it makes it wonderful. Except every single Mac, ships with either a (Magic) Trackpad or Magic Mouse. With the exception of the Mac mini of course, and even those a frequently ordered in combination with Apple's peripherals. Hence why it's on by default. Whether you want to accept this or not it's about the fast majority. I'm not debating with you whether it makes sense or not in combination with what piece of hardware. I'm saying it's extremely easy to toggle scroll directions already which brings us to the next point: It?s not the fact that it takes effort or not. It?s the fact that right away, they?re presenting something that can totally change your experience for the better or the worse. Newcomers to the Mac world will go like "Macs are sh*t, they don?t even scroll correctly" and they won?t even think about trying it further more. You and I know where to find the option, they will have to look around.Just admit that having a little checkbox below the video to revert it back would be perfect? Hell, they?re not even saying "you can go through System Preferences > Mouse > Inverted Scrolling and revert it if you don?t want". To me, they?re almost forcing us to use our Macs this way. When extrapolating your logic Apple should just incorporate System Preferences as a whole into Setup Assistant and guide you through every single last preference pane. Because you feel you should have quick access to scroll directions others might feel they need quick access to localized formats, or general security, or printers and scanners, or date & time etc. This won't stop at Mr. PyX or a certain group of people wanting something. And does't the Setup Assistant already tells you other Trackpad/Mouse options can be set after setting up your Mac? PS You really need to quit the whole "just admit this" / "just admit that" thing when someone doesn't share your opinion regarding the subject. There's no admitting to anything here, just debating your opinion vs mine. iUserX 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
instant.human Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 I... I really don't see a problem here. :unsure: So Apple implemented an option that is easily reversible. This, like many other changes, are aimed towards people that came from iOS, that get a Mac that is shipped with either a Magic Trackpad, a Magic Mouse or has a Trackpad built in. On these devices, that inverted scrolling makes much more sense and feels way more natural, not only because it does anyways but because these people scrolled that way for years with their iOS devices. Tech savvy users, and you don't even need to be Neowin-tech-savvy but have a general understanding of how preferences work, can easily disable inverted scrolling if they didn't get used to it after 2 minutes and even if they did not find the option on their own, they would probably google. Now, you can say "if I have to google it, it's badly implemented" but no, it's not. Apple always, and I agree that that's not the best thing in the world but they do it so deal with it, expects users to use one of their own peripherals. And, actually, it's not that stupid at all: All Macs are shipped with them. Well, on all of these devices it makes perfect sense. And as I said, if you didn't get used to it after two minutes, you simply go where you change preferences and change it back... No problem here, really. I, personally, love it. .Neo 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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