Sorry, Americans, No UMD passport program for you :(

[Colin McGregor]

Luckily I own approximately zero PSP games, or else I could potentially see this as maybe being a bad thing. With that said, I also have to point out the fact this is not the first time systems have been released without backwards capability for their predecessors. So I really do not see this as being such a big deal as some are making it out to be. Also if you own the digital versions of any PSP games, they will work.

Normally sony includes backwards compat for a month or two then removes it like they did with ps3. They don't exclude it off the jump. Nintendo offers backwards compat and MS does with the 360 so where does it happen?

It's a big deal for those who were expecting it. They announced the UMD Passport program back in November. Of course most consumers would assume they plan to do it worldwide.

Did they say it will be available in the US? If not then why are people mad? Cause it was assumed. You know what they say about assuming right?

[Glassed Silver]

Normally sony includes backwards compat for a month or two then removes it like they did with ps3. They don't exclude it off the jump. Nintendo offers backwards compat and MS does with the 360 so where does it happen?

[...]

Wii: http://www.geek.com/...games-20110817/

360: And the Xbox classic titles playable on the 360 are also limited.

Also: No GBA support with the 3DS (Nintendo).

And many consoles before that, too.

Glassed Silver:mac

[Amodin]

Really kind of matches Sony's direction.... (NSFW)

[Xilo]

More and more glad I had to cancel preorder.

I'll just wait till CFW is available.

[Boxster17]

I'm sort of in the same boat as DirtyLarry here, I could honsetly care less about backwards compatibility myself. My PS3 is a lanch consoles and I think I've booted up maybe 3 PS2 games on it and none in the past 3-4 years at least. Well I know graphics aren't everything I did find that most games looked pretty crummy, and never bothered with them from there on out. Then again the reason I bought a new system was to play new games, not my old ones I already have played through several times before.

Also just to clarify, Sony never announced this for North American from what I can remember. I clearly remember it being announced for Japan, but if someone can show me a story where they promised it for the other regions feel free. Otherwise yeah it sucks they're not bringing it here, but then again it was never announced for this region. In fact most articles I read explicity stated nothing had been announced for any other regions.

[Hedon]

Did they say it will be available in the US? If not then why are people mad? Cause it was assumed. You know what they say about assuming right?

Most consumers assume that when buying a product that they would get the same product. Not a stripped down version.

360: And the Xbox classic titles playable on the 360 are also limited.

True. Only about 500 of the 800 Xbox 1 titles are BC on the Xbox 360. The other 300 had little to no demand (or sales for that matter) to be made compatible.

[Jason S. Global Moderator]

from what ive read, the PSP titles compatible w/ the Vita are going to be remade to work w/ the dual analog sticks, and upscaled to fit the screen. that's why there's only 250 titles on the initial compatibility list.

[AbandonedTrolley]

Most consumers assume that when buying a product that they would get the same product. Not a stripped down version.

True. Only about 500 of the 800 Xbox 1 titles are BC on the Xbox 360. The other 300 had little to no demand (or sales for that matter) to be made compatible.

The product is the same though, it can still do what you are buying it for and there is nothing to say that it won't come along at a later date.

A similar thing has happened with the iPhone 4S here in the UK, Siri was made out to be this amazing assistant that could find you shops to order food and get you directions. We saw the same press release as the US, yet when it got here it could do neither of those functions (currently) So yeah just because it has been announced in one territory doesn't mean it will hit all at the same time.

[Glassed Silver]

The product is the same though, it can still do what you are buying it for and there is nothing to say that it won't come along at a later date.

A similar thing has happened with the iPhone 4S here in the UK, Siri was made out to be this amazing assistant that could find you shops to order food and get you directions. We saw the same press release as the US, yet when it got here it could do neither of those functions (currently) So yeah just because it has been announced in one territory doesn't mean it will hit all at the same time.

There's a huge difference though:

Siri is marketed as a beta product.

Is the Vita called a beta product, too? No.

And who are you to say what people buy something for?

I bet that a quite a few of gamers expect a console to play the current gen games and the prior gen games. (or as in "should have", expecting them to definitely have it, is beyond what happened)

Glassed Silver:mac

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

There's a huge difference though:

Siri is marketed as a beta product.

Is the Vita called a beta product, too? No.

And who are you to say what people buy something for?

I bet that a quite a few of gamers expect a console to play the current gen games and the prior gen games. (or as in "should have", expecting them to definitely have it, is beyond what happened)

Glassed Silver:mac

Well with that kind of thinking everyone in this topic stands on the same ground. Swings and roundabouts, people buy things for different reasons, but it's quite logical to think the MAIN reason people will buy a vita will be for vita games. Not many people can afford to pay ?200+ JUST to play PSP games on a new devices. Yes, however, of course there will be people wanting to do that ALONG with using the vita for it's new and main functionality.

[Glassed Silver]

Well with that kind of thinking everyone in this topic stands on the same ground. Swings and roundabouts, people buy things for different reasons, but it's quite logical to think the MAIN reason people will buy a vita will be for vita games. Not many people can afford to pay ?200+ JUST to play PSP games on a new devices. Yes, however, of course there will be people wanting to do that ALONG with using the vita for it's new and main functionality.

"Reasons to get x over y" lists are lists for a reason.

It's not like there is just one reason why you buy something.

Of cause you know that, but it quite moots a bit the argument that nobody will buy the Vita because of the lack of PSP functionality.

Of cause not, nobody claims to do so.

I'm merely pointing out that there is probably a fair share of people who would love to use it OR at least have it (and are willing to pay those extra bucks should there be added costs) for the peace of mind to have a backup device for playing PSP games, should their PSP ever die.

I look at it a little bit like knowing that virtual machines make me less dependent on keeping old PCs around to play retro games...

Do I still have my old PCs? Yes, apart from one. Will they work forever? Hmm... They might make it as long as I need them, then again, maybe not!

Yes, of cause not everyone care about that functionality.

Not everyone likes retro gaming for example.

Yes, gamers come in every color and fashion, that makes it a great community, but I guess asking for a feature that is obviously THERE, just not making it to your country, is not WAY too much.

It can't be that hard. And if it is (licensing-wise) then let's hope for a vibrant CFW community!

That's why I adore sensible hackers. They actually improve gear where licensing or business decisions block your way. (Y)

Glassed Silver:mac

[Open Minded]

I read the title in Team America's "Kim Jong Il" voice.

[Boxster17]

Yes, gamers come in every color and fashion, that makes it a great community, but I guess asking for a feature that is obviously THERE, just not making it to your country, is not WAY too much.

It can't be that hard. And if it is (licensing-wise) then let's hope for a vibrant CFW community!

The thing is that feature was never 'there' for the US, people were assuming it was. Yes it is there for Japan, but when it's not announced for other regions why assume we would get it at all? I subscribe to Netflix in Canada, do I get everything the US subcribers get? No, I don't. In fact I don't even think I get half the movies/shows that they do. Different regions will get different things, and obviously certain people value backwards compatibility more than others. Though if your main reason for buying a Vita is to play PSP games then maybe you should be rethinking your purchase. Quick grammar side note, but it should be "of course" not "of cause".

[DirtyLarry Veteran]

EDIT - Nevermind.

[Hedon]

The product is the same though, it can still do what you are buying it for and there is nothing to say that it won't come along at a later date.

A similar thing has happened with the iPhone 4S here in the UK, Siri was made out to be this amazing assistant that could find you shops to order food and get you directions. We saw the same press release as the US, yet when it got here it could do neither of those functions (currently) So yeah just because it has been announced in one territory doesn't mean it will hit all at the same time.

I am the consumer though. That is not my problem.

[AbandonedTrolley]

I am the consumer though. That is not my problem.

and at no point as an American consumer have you been told you will be able to use the UMD passport system from launch or at all, your assumption is not Sonys problem.

[Vice]

Bought a game on your 1st generation iPod Touch? What do you know still works on your 5th generation iPhone or 2nd generation iPad.

Bought a UMD for your PSP? haha **** you peasant, pay again. :devil:

Even nintendo allowed you to keep playing your gameboy original games on the Nintendo DS up until they removed the physical slot. The gameboy original came out in 1989 people. 1989. And although they have now ended support for those games you can still play a DS Original game (that came out at the same time as the original PSP I might add) in a current Nintendo 3DS or DS XL or DSi

Sony is a joke. A bad one. I'm still annoyed about them taking away PS2 game compatibility on the PS3.

[AbandonedTrolley]

Bought a game on your 1st generation iPod Touch? What do you know still works on your 5th generation iPhone or 2nd generation iPad.

Bought a UMD for your PSP? haha **** you peasant, pay again. :devil:

Not really the same, that's like complaining that your N64 cartridges don't work on the Wii. Totally different method of media so why should it work?

[Vice]

Not really the same, that's like complaining that your N64 cartridges don't work on the Wii. Totally different method of media so why should it work?

Read my ammended post. Nintendo supported Gameboy Original games up until the DSi came out. And even then the 3DS still plays original DS games that came out same time as the original PSP.

Also the Wii plays Gamecube games. Even has a door to plug in a Gamecube controller. Where is the PS3's PS2 compatibility? oh right.

[AbandonedTrolley]

Read my ammended post. Nintendo supported Gameboy Original games up until the DSi came out. And even then the 3DS still plays original DS games that came out same time as the original PSP.

Also the Wii plays Gamecube games. Even has a door to plug in a Gamecube controller. Where is the PS3's PS2 compatibility? oh right.

But putting in a whole UMD drive just for backwards compatibility is pointless and a cost that most people wouldn't want to be paying for. Hence they came up with the passport system, I don't however agree with them charging for it.

I also agree that Sony should never have taken out the PS2 compatibility either, but again if they claimed the hardware revision was to keep costs down then so be it. If you kept your PS2 games, chances are you kept your PS2. I think it pretty much proves that it was a hardware issue with the fact that they haven't removed PS1 emulation as that is totally software.

[Vice]

But putting in a whole UMD drive just for backwards compatibility is pointless and a cost that most people wouldn't want to be paying for. Hence they came up with the passport system, I don't however agree with them charging for it.

I also agree that Sony should never have taken out the PS2 compatibility either, but again if they claimed the hardware revision was to keep costs down then so be it. If you kept your PS2 games, chances are you kept your PS2. I think it pretty much proves that it was a hardware issue with the fact that they haven't removed PS1 emulation as that is totally software.

They needn't include a whole UMD. Just allow the passport system like they do in Japan. Simple. Apple let you buy an App and have it available on up to 5 separate devices at the same time. Buy once move across different devices. iPad, iPhone, iPod Touch. Sony would do good to follow that example.

And another thing if you already have an app on your Mac that you bought for example lets say you walked in to a shop and bought a copy of iLife a physical boxed retail copy. When you install that on your Mac it appears in the App Store as something you've purchased and gets all the same perks as if you bought it through the App Store. Another example is Steam on the PC. Buy a PC game enter the serial in to steam and it is then downloadable through Steam. Many games support this like Mafia II, Call of Duty and Unreal Tournament 3.

Sony need to get it that if they force people to continually re-buy stuff to have it in different formats it will just push them to piracy and then they'll lose them forever. If it isn't DRM hassling the consumer it is unfair lock-ins and double standards. They expect us (westerners) to buy their products but they always give their home market the Japanese a much better experience than we do by launching there first (sometimes months ahead of the west) having region locks for good games released only in Japan and then this Passport situation.

I had a PS2, I currently own a PS3. I won't be buying a PSP Vita. Once bitten twice shy.

[Hedon]

and at no point as an American consumer have you been told you will be able to use the UMD passport system from launch or at all, your assumption is not Sonys problem.

Let me reiterate...I am the consumer. They are offering a product with UMD backwards compatibility for one region with the purchase of a $250 handheld. For $250, I DO NOT get this feature. Are you understanding that, or no?

[Glassed Silver]

They needn't include a whole UMD. Just allow the passport system like they do in Japan. Simple. Apple let you buy an App and have it available on up to 5 separate devices at the same time. Buy once move across different devices. iPad, iPhone, iPod Touch. Sony would do good to follow that example.

And another thing if you already have an app on your Mac that you bought for example lets say you walked in to a shop and bought a copy of iLife a physical boxed retail copy. When you install that on your Mac it appears in the App Store as something you've purchased and gets all the same perks as if you bought it through the App Store. Another example is Steam on the PC. Buy a PC game enter the serial in to steam and it is then downloadable through Steam. Many games support this like Mafia II, Call of Duty and Unreal Tournament 3.

Sony need to get it that if they force people to continually re-buy stuff to have it in different formats it will just push them to piracy and then they'll lose them forever. If it isn't DRM hassling the consumer it is unfair lock-ins and double standards. They expect us (westerners) to buy their products but they always give their home market the Japanese a much better experience than we do by launching there first (sometimes months ahead of the west) having region locks for good games released only in Japan and then this Passport situation.

I had a PS2, I currently own a PS3. I won't be buying a PSP Vita. Once bitten twice shy.

Gaming philosophy-wise, I want to marry you!

THANK. YOU. MAN!

Let me reiterate...I am the consumer. They are offering a product with UMD backwards compatibility for one region with the purchase of a $250 handheld. For $250, I DO NOT get this feature. Are you understanding that, or no?

Yes, but apparently he expects consumers to swallow it.

Because we're free to buy it or not.

Well, yes, they (Sony) are free to do business with me. Why should they care about my opinion? Geez...

Glassed Silver:mac

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Read my ammended post. Nintendo supported Gameboy Original games up until the DSi came out. And even then the 3DS still plays original DS games that came out same time as the original PSP.

Also the Wii plays Gamecube games. Even has a door to plug in a Gamecube controller. Where is the PS3's PS2 compatibility? oh right.

Nintendo actually cut Gamecube support for the Wii in some of the newer models - http://www.afterdawn.com/news/article.cfm/2011/08/17/nintendo_unveils_slimmed_down_wii_with_no_gamecube_support

[Glassed Silver]

Nintendo actually cut Gamecube support for the Wii in some of the newer models - http://www.afterdawn...amecube_support

This is true.

I pointed this out earlier.

Someone (Vice) didn't pay close attention to the thread! :p

(no offense)

So yeah, they play the shady game now, too.

Nintendo used to be very solid, they weaken now imho, but at least they kept the support for GC for more than just a week weeks (*cough* PS3 *cough*)

Remember folks: Don't buy the Wii boxes where the Wii isn't depicted as standing! ;)

(if you care about GC games, controllers, vertical placement and such that is. :) )

Full Wii boxes:

Cripple Wii boxes:

Glassed Silver:mac

Edited February 10, 2012 by Glassed Silver