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welcome to the first complaint I had about the metro screen... at least in the start menu you had a hiearchy of stuff that you could pin only what you wanted to see on the main start page... this right now seems to take anything that would of been a start menu group or item and make it a tile... which is annoying

I have a few toolkits that littearly install groups of a hundred or so tools into the start menu, organized in groups... in the metro start screen when I installed it felt like I just lost all ability to do anything with the screen because it was so full

Well in the future when your drivers are Windows 8 certified, they won't pin any shortcuts to the start screen, they'll all end up in the settings or all programs menu, and those drivers that may need a icon there, will only place the one you need not the other ones.

Well in the future when your drivers are Windows 8 certified, they won't pin any shortcuts to the start screen, they'll all end up in the settings or all programs menu, and those drivers that may need a icon there, will only place the one you need not the other ones.

oh comon, you know companies will want to put all their stuff in the front light it's just how some companies are

Well in the future when your drivers are Windows 8 certified, they won't pin any shortcuts to the start screen, they'll all end up in the settings or all programs menu, and those drivers that may need a icon there, will only place the one you need not the other ones.

Then I'll ask for the start screen in the future. Right now, give me my start menu back, MS!!

  • 2 weeks later...

Just wait a few more days and Classic Shell will be up and running on Windows 8, complete with the Start button and search even if MS doesn't restore the Start Menu:

rkph8.png

Just wait a few more days and Classic Shell will be up and running on Windows 8, complete with the Start button and search even if MS doesn't restore the Start Menu:

rkph8.png

This looks better to use with a mouse...but hell no, there's no way i'm going to use that horrible looking thing.

This looks better to use with a mouse...but hell no, there's no way i'm going to use that horrible looking thing.

^ wow, that is so awesome. It totally goes with the philosophy of Windows 8 "alive and connected".

NOT!

Then you two must also be really hating the Windows 7 Start menu as on it, the Start menu is the only launcher available. Or you might be using alternative third party launchers :x or keep all the programs installed your computer pinned to the Taskbar. :p Or you using cmd.exe /Explorer.exe to launch all of your programs. :p :p

Just wait a few more days and Classic Shell will be up and running on Windows 8, complete with the Start button and search even if MS doesn't restore the Start Menu:

rkph8.png

Looks like dog vomit to me (but to each their own!), but i would think a lot of users would gain functionality with this.

If there is not auto pinning how else you would access it? It is logical Microsoft did this however i suggest every time you install application and gets pinned you pin it to taskbar or create shortcut to desktop and remove from Metro. I would suggest removing uninstallling everything from Metro except for Desktop Pin. I guess you will have to live with Metro being loaded after you login but that's about it, you should be able to stay on Desktop if you create all shortcuts you need. As far as search goes well it will take you to metro but you could browse to it rather. Search in Windows 8 is useless anyway. Don't use live account to login to Windows 8 but create local account. Last thing is that i would trust Microsoft to login using live account to my PC. No thanks.

Well you ony pin the stuff you need fast access to, same as pinning to the start menu, except the start screen can pin a whole lot more. And for the rest, there the all apps buttons at the bottom of the start screen.

And how is search in win8 useless? It works excellently and instantly, and it separates settings from apps unlike win 7.

As for the live account, it is a local account it just means you use the same password as live and you automatically get signed in to live services, and it synchronizes backgrounds, themes and settings across computers. What's not to trus?

  • Like 1

Well you ony pin the stuff you need fast access to, same as pinning to the start menu, except the start screen can pin a whole lot more. And for the rest, there the all apps buttons at the bottom of the start screen.

This. I used to think the Start Screen was the equivalent of 'All Programs', but without folders. It's not, and it's not supposed to be used that way. It's the equivalent of the first menu that pops up in the Win7 Start menu, where you can pin applications you access frequently. The list of 'all programs' is still available and categorized the same way as the folders are in Windows 7. You can remove/unpin stuff you don't need (like readme's and uninstallers) from the start screen, and they will still be available in the 'All Programs' list.

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    • Removed the blue and underline as you did not post a link. This would also  be considered spamming.
    • Why it's almost impossible to produce a smartphone in the United States by Hamid Ganji If you look at the back of some Apple products, you can see the famous phrase “Designed by Apple in California, Assembled in China.” This phrase appears on products from one of the largest smartphone brands in the United States. These products are designed in the U.S., but their manufacturing takes place in China, India, Vietnam, or even Brazil. But why can’t Apple, as one of the largest American tech companies, produce its iPhones on U.S. soil? The idea for this topic came to me after the Trump Foundation launched a smartphone called the T1 and claimed that it was designed and built with American values in mind. However, this claim did not last long, as it was revealed that Trump’s phone was actually a rebranded HTC U24 Pro, with only a gold case and minor internal component changes. You see? Even a phone that is supposed to represent American values is manufactured in China. With a gross domestic product (GDP) exceeding $32 trillion, the United States is currently the world’s largest economy, while China ranks second with around $20 trillion. On the other hand, the United States is by a wide margin the global leader in various technological fields, and American companies spend hundreds of billions of dollars annually on research and development. From Apple and Google to Microsoft, Lockheed Martin, Boeing, and others, American tech and industrial giants lead their foreign competitors in many sectors. The United States also has no shortage of smartphone brands. Apple, Google, and Motorola are among the major brands in the smartphone market, collectively holding a significant share. However, the vast majority of their products are manufactured outside the United States. So why is it that the world’s largest economy, home to the most advanced technology companies and industrial powers, cannot produce a smartphone on its own soil? Let’s explore this question together. Even threats to impose tariffs won’t work After Trump entered the White House as the 47th President of the United States, his administration adopted strict tariff policies. One of these policies was the imposition of a 25% tariff on smartphones manufactured outside the United States. Trump said he “had a little problem” with Apple CEO Tim Cook over producing smartphones outside the U.S. So he thought that threatening a 25% tax on imported phones might force Apple to bring manufacturing back to the United States. “I have long ago informed Tim Cook of Apple that I expect their iPhones that will be sold in the United States of America will be manufactured and built in the United States, not India, or anyplace else,” Trump wrote on Truth Social. Image via The White House Although Apple currently manufactures some of the iPhone’s chips in the United States with TSMC's help, it still shows no willingness to shift full iPhone production to the country. At the time, renowned Apple supply chain analyst Ming-Chi Kuo wrote on X, “In terms of profitability, it’s way better for Apple to take the hit of a 25% tariff on iPhones sold in the US market than to move iPhone assembly lines back to the US.” However, manufacturing a smartphone in the United States is not as easy as it might seem, and many technical and economic barriers are involved. The lack of necessary manufacturing hubs There is a clear reason why many companies prefer to manufacture their products in China. China has established itself as the main global manufacturing hub for international companies, and over the past few decades, large contract manufacturers have emerged there, allowing companies like Apple to outsource production. One such example is Foxconn, which also manufactures some Apple products in India. Building the infrastructure required to produce smartphones in the United States would require tens of billions of dollars in new investment. Factories would need to be built, essential manufacturing equipment would have to be installed, and, most importantly, a skilled workforce capable of operating these systems would need to be recruited and trained. The United States currently lacks the core infrastructure needed to manufacture smartphones, and for this reason, many companies prefer to outsource production to Chinese contractors rather than spend tens of billions of dollars to build that infrastructure, which is significantly more economically efficient. Additionally, building such infrastructure in the United States could take up to a decade, ultimately leading to a significant increase in the product's final price for consumers. Shortage of trained labor in the U.S. compared to China Decades of serving as a global manufacturing hub have allowed China to build a massive talent pool in the production sector that is almost unmatched worldwide. Today, if a company chooses to manufacture its products in China, it can be confident that the workers involved in production have years of experience in their respective roles and are capable of producing high-quality goods with minimal errors. Even if we assume that tens of billions of dollars were invested in building smartphone manufacturing infrastructure in the United States, finding skilled workers would remain highly challenging. Apple CEO Tim Cook visiting the iPhone 6 assembly line in China in 2014. Image: Tim Cook on X In a 2015 interview on CBS’s 60 Minutes, Tim Cook said the main reason Apple isn’t producing in the US is a lack of skills. "China put an enormous focus on manufacturing, in what you and I would call vocational kind of skills. The US over time began to stop having as many vocational kinds of skills. I mean you could take every tool and die maker in the United States and probably put them in the room that we're currently sitting in. In China you would have to have multiple football fields,” Cook said. Also, in 2017, at the Fortune Global Forum in Guangzhou, Cook once again emphasized the importance of highly skilled Chinese workers. “China has moved into very advanced manufacturing, so you find in China the intersection of craftsman kind of skill, and sophisticated robotics and the computer science world. That intersection, which is very rare to find anywhere, that kind of skill, is very important to our business because of the precision and quality level that we like. The thing that most people focus on if they’re a foreigner coming to China is the size of the market, and obviously, it’s the biggest market in the world in so many areas. But for us, the number one attraction is the quality of the people,” Apple CEO said. Higher labor costs in the United States Producing almost any product in the United States is more expensive than in many other countries, and one of the main reasons is the higher cost of labor in the U.S. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, median weekly earnings of full-time workers in the United States were $1,235 in the first quarter of 2026. Meanwhile, the average annual salary in China's private sector in 2025 was RMB 71,590 (US$9,961). In many parts of the world, the weekly wage of an American worker is equivalent to several months of income. Another important factor to consider is that in the United States, the workforce capable of working on a smartphone assembly line is highly specialized and therefore commands higher-than-average wages. According to an estimate by Bank of America, producing an iPhone in the U.S. is technically possible, but “iPhone cost can increase 25% purely on higher labor cost in the U.S.” However, this 25% increase applies only if final assembly is performed in the United States while components are still sourced from China or elsewhere. In this case, the price of a base iPhone would rise from $799 to around $1,000. But in another scenario, if Apple were to produce the required components for the iPhone within the United States, production costs could increase by more than 90%. Trump’s dream for a “Made in the USA” iPhone might never come true In a free-market capitalist economy, one of the primary responsibilities of any CEO is to maximize profit. Using Apple as an example, Tim Cook’s role is to maximize the company’s profits so that it can fund research and development for new products and invest in areas such as artificial intelligence, while also keeping shareholders satisfied. Therefore, it is entirely understandable that Apple would choose not to bring its manufacturing back to the United States and instead keep production in countries where labor is cheaper, and products can be manufactured at a lower cost, thereby maximizing its profit margins. What is your opinion about manufacturing smartphones in the United States? If you are an American citizen, would you be willing to pay hundreds of dollars more for a smartphone made domestically in the USA? Let us know in the comments.
    • Cheers everyone for the replies. It's been very useful. 👍
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