Windows 8 is the first OS that made me downgrade

[msr714]

I'm not a fanboy, but I've always been quick to adopt new versions of Windows, and I've also run whatever pre-release/beta versions Microsoft has put out. (I even liked Vista.) With Windows 8, I've been with it since the Developer Preview, and have run every available publicly released version. The other day I installed the RTM Windows 8 Enterprise. Windows 8 has a lot to recommend it, but I'm sorry, I've come to the conclusion that I just can't get used to the Frankenstein feel of the o.s. I use a desktop and a monitor without touch capabilities, and it feels like Windows 8 was made for touch-capable devices rather than the traditional laptop or desktop. Windows 7, on the other hand, feels perfectly tailored to the desktop, with no jarring incoherent distractions to deal with. It's sad to have to say it because I'd really like to like Windows 8, but Windows 7 is just so much a better fit for me.

[xWhiplash]

Windows 8 is the first OS that made me think about buying a tablet/convertible ultrabook. Also Windows 8 is the first OS that made me think about using multiple monitors. I've also been using Windows since 3.11 and I don't think it's a mess, it's different and rough around the edges.... but It doesn't impact my desktop experience and work. Not everyone is the same, if you don't like it fine, if you like it fine as well, but there's no need to think your way is correct and everyone else is just a hater or a fanboy who doesn't agree.

I agree that if Windows 8 makes your life difficult, we should have every right to keep using Windows 7. But when we complain that it breaks our work flow, we are accused of not doing things properly. Or to do *this* instead. If I learn how to do *this* instead of *that* to the point where it becomes a habit, it will break my workflow at work where I cannot do *this* on an XP machine.

However, how can you not agree that this OS is a mess? Why are there two control panels? Why are some things metro and some things aero on the desktop (Volume control - Aero. Network Connections - Metro)?

[BajiRav]

No. Back when I tried WIndows 8 you had to RIGHT CLICK at the bottom left. Not Left Click - Control Panel. Who (besides us from experience) will try to right click?

How many regular people use things in the Win-X menu? computer management etc.? most people don't even know about those things.

Why are there two control panels?

One of them is optimized for touch input. Not hard to figure out.

Why is the volume mini window aero, but the network view takes 100% of my vertical view to just display one connection?

How do you display more than one connection when there is a need? Not hard to figure out.

This OS is completely horrible on the desktop. It is so inconsistent it is not even funny.

So Windows 7 must be horrible because it is equally inconsistent on the desktop.

Back when I tried it, I had to basically have my mouse at the very bottom left corner in order for the little start screen icon to appear. What happened to the same clickable area as in Windows 7? If you are going to make invisible menus, you need to make it a large hover/click area instead of just 10 pixels. Also, if my mouse moves just outside the charms bar, it would disappear. Is there a way to make it stay there until I close it? If I am not used to a mouse sensitivity setting, it takes me several tries to click an icon in the charms bar because it disappears when I accidentally move my mouse over too far.

Is lack of a start button seriously such a big deal for you?

sorry for the bolds but didn't want to do the quote/end-quote dance.

[xWhiplash]

sorry for the bolds but didn't want to do the quote/end-quote dance.

- So us admins are getting the shaft just because Joe never used Computer Management?

- So why do I need the second Control Panel on my desktop....I said the OS was inconsistent ON THE DESKTOP

- On Windows 7, when you have more than one connection, the window expands from 100 pixels height to lets say 400 pixels height if there are 9 connections or so. You did not know it did this?

- What? Windows 7 is inconsistent on the desktop? The desktop is ALL THERE IS on Windows 7. How can something be inconsistent with itself? I do not see Metro UI elements in Windows 7 unless I am in a program, and that is not the OS that is doing that. HOW is Windows 7 the same as Windows 8 in terms of inconsistencies? That argument does NOT make any sense.

- Yes. There are no visual cues as to where the Start Screen hover/click box is located. Invisible menus and especially invisible cues are HORRIBLE.

[George P Global Moderator]

However, how can you not agree that this OS is a mess? Why are there two control panels? Why are some things metro and some things aero on the desktop (Volume control - Aero. Network Connections - Metro)?

Why does it exactly matter if there's two control panels? You can't really use the desktop one that well with touch, a new touch first one needed to be done, so they did it. Besides, going with your way of thinking the control panel in Windows 7 is already a mess. Why are some stuff contained in the main window while other stuff shows up in a popup dialog window? And fwiw the volume control has a metro control as well, it's in the settings pane right above the power button.

[kaotic]

I've been using the OS for about a week and it's really solid. At first it's a little awkward, but after like five to ten minutes of figuring out everything it didn't take me long to get comfortable with the operating system. I currently have neowin open, editing in photoshop (creating gifs) and i'm using handbreak and i'm not having a problem managing any of it. I really like the Metro apps and I can't wait to see what will be developed when the OS goes live. I'm seriously thinking of picking up a Surface when they're released.

The only thing that annoys me is that the Zune software doesn't work with the OS. I can't upload songs to my Zune right now (have to use another computer).

[BajiRav]

- So us admins are getting the shaft just because Joe never used Computer Management?

- So why do I need the second Control Panel on my desktop....I said the OS was inconsistent ON THE DESKTOP

- On Windows 7, when you have more than one connection, the window expands from 100 pixels height to lets say 400 pixels height if there are 9 connections or so. You did not know it did this?

- What? Windows 7 is inconsistent on the desktop? The desktop is ALL THERE IS on Windows 7. How can something be inconsistent with itself? I do not see Metro UI elements in Windows 7 unless I am in a program, and that is not the OS that is doing that. HOW is Windows 7 the same as Windows 8 in terms of inconsistencies? That argument does NOT make any sense.

- Yes. There are no visual cues as to where the Start Screen hover/click box is located. Invisible menus and especially invisible cues are HORRIBLE.

If you are really a sysadmin (apparently everyone here is when it comes to new Windows so I am skeptical), Windows 8 actually makes it easier to get to computer management.

If you don't need it - don't use it. This is like me whining about presence of admin tools - why do I need it when I am not a sys admin?

Yeah I know it but how do you enable such a UI for touch alongwith kbm?

Windows 7 inconsistent : Yes, icon inconsistencies, some things are only possible from a menubar eventhough it is hidden by default in explorer. Some explorer views only appear in Libraries. Libraries don't work as valid locations in many programs, taskbar is a mess when it goes multi-row, show/hide desktop is unreliable,

This doesn't mean I suddenly hate Windows 7. I still think it is a great OS for what it is. I didn't suddenly discover its faults either, these are things I stumble upon when using it on a regular basis (the Library views happened yesterday for example).

The only thing that annoys me is that the Zune software doesn't work with the OS. I can't upload songs to my Zune right now (have to use another computer).

Zune works fine with Windows Phone in the RP, may be the Zune driver is old?

[kaotic]

Zune works fine with Windows Phone in the RP, may be the Zune driver is old?

I downloaded the latest software from Microsoft's site but it didn't help. The program crashes when I try to launch it and I've tried compatibility mode.

[siah1214]

- So us admins are getting the shaft just because Joe never used Computer Management?

Oh my God you have to right click instead of left??? Oh the drama and the horror your life is so hard!

Just be glad they added it in there (wasn't there in Dev preview)

- Yes. There are no visual cues as to where the Start Screen hover/click box is located. Invisible menus and especially invisible cues are HORRIBLE.

Yes there are, they're called the "corner of your screen". If you can't figure that out, well, good luck using any computer.

Again, it sounds like a lot of user error and people not wanting to change. Fine. Stick with Windows 7 and stop moaning while the rest of us move into the next generation.

[BajiRav]

I downloaded the latest software from Microsoft's site but it didn't help. The program crashes when I try to launch it and I've tried compatibility mode.

Hmm weird. I didn't have to download anything. I upgraded to Windows 8 RP from Windows 7. Zune was installed on Windows 7 and continued to work after upgrade.

[Stoffel]

Now that the power menu is popping up again in the tread, don't you wish they updated the look of that a bit more?

It looks like it comes right out of Win2000.

Love the options, but hate how it looks

[Woelfel]

Using RP, two 40", yea, look at all the space I'm "wasting" /s.

So, please tell me how Windows 8 is unusable again. I just keep finding this hilarious how people say it's bad. Seriously? Besides the start button/menu and going directly to desktop, what can u NOT do in windows 8 that u can in Windows 7?

Edit: I feel like I'm taking crazy pills with people saying its bad.

[siah1214]

And the most nonsensical response of the year award goes to...

nice try, but most of the screen used are websites, not windows 8. for example, look at the windows 8 app itself which takes up half the screen and displays little info with alot of white space.

clever attempt though.

[Woelfel]

nice try, but most of the screen used are websites, not windows 8. for example, look at the windows 8 app itself which takes up half the screen and displays little info with alot of white space.

clever attempt though.

Seriously, what the hell do u even mean?

[neo1911]

Yes, Windows 8 suxx, hate it, too inconsistent. But...

I am still gonna use the crap out of it!!!

Here's hoping Microsoft don't price it out of Indian Market. If pricing is out of reach, most people here will pirate like there's no tomorrow.

PS: BOZ needs to take a chill pill and stop commenting on this thread for a while. :)

[FloatingFatMan]

Yes, Windows 8 suxx, hate it, too inconsistent. But...

I am still gonna use the crap out of it!!!

Here's hoping Microsoft don't price it out of Indian Market. If pricing is out of reach, most people here will pirate like there's no tomorrow.

PS: BOZ needs to take a chill pill and stop commenting on this thread for a while. :)

MS price things to what the local market can bear. Previous version have cost up to hundreds of USD, but only a fraction of that in poorer nations like India. W8 is going to cost 40 bucks for an upgrade version. That's probably cheaper than W7 cost in India, so do you really think they won't proportionally drop the price for you guys?

Besides... I don't consider a hundred or so over expensive when it's software I use every single day, for everything.

[CentralDogma]

Why does it exactly matter if there's two control panels? You can't really use the desktop one that well with touch, a new touch first one needed to be done, so they did it. Besides, going with your way of thinking the control panel in Windows 7 is already a mess. Why are some stuff contained in the main window while other stuff shows up in a popup dialog window? And fwiw the volume control has a metro control as well, it's in the settings pane right above the power button.

Because it showcases a failure of design. Rather than making a UI that worked well on both touch and M+K, they created one for both and just jammed them both into Windows 8.

Now, I haven?t had any great deal of time with Windows 8 and I don?t plan to until they release the trial version of Windows Server 2012, but from what reviews I?ve read, this is a persistent problem in Windows 8. Things like the Metro IE not getting bookmarks from desktop IE. From what I?ve heard, there was no real effort put into harmonize Metro and the desktop and they both just sit in their own worlds.

[George P Global Moderator]

I think MS is going to give us a new "zune client" once we get closer to the release of WP8 so don't expect any future Zune client updates etc. Though, now that I say that they could have a small prep-update for it before WP 7.8 goes out but I dunno.

[ahhell]

nice try, but most of the screen used are websites, not windows 8. for example, look at the windows 8 app itself which takes up half the screen and displays little info with alot of white space.

clever attempt though.

So Windows 8 is an app now.

Interesting.

:s

[Livin in a box]

Yes, Windows 8 has some nice performance enhancements. Yes, some of the Metro apps are nice. But as a whole, in my opinion (if I'm allowed one anymore) is that everything just seems like it was made for a tablet and not for a desktop computer. The Start button being missing isn't a huge problem for someone like me, and most people on this forum, but for people who aren't technically proficient it will be. I think a lot of people forget this market and that's where most of Windows' market share lies.

As for wasted space, of course if you have Internet Explorer open taking up the screen then you're not going to waste space are you, but when you're on the Start screen there is a bit of wasted space, nevermind the huge buttons that on a desktop are just silly. For tablets, they're great!

I know I won't be upgrading to it, but I may purchase a license come release and dual boot between it and Windows 7. There are some alright features like I mentioned previously but I couldn't use it as a main OS and, as a gamer, it would probably be the best idea for now.

[George P Global Moderator]

Because it showcases a failure of design. Rather than making a UI that worked well on both touch and M+K, they created one for both and just jammed them both into Windows 8.

Now, I haven?t had any great deal of time with Windows 8 and I don?t plan to until they release the trial version of Windows Server 2012, but from what reviews I?ve read, this is a persistent problem in Windows 8. Things like the Metro IE not getting bookmarks from desktop IE. From what I?ve heard, there was no real effort put into harmonize Metro and the desktop and they both just sit in their own worlds.

Sure there's problems, they don't take it all the way at this point and it's got to do with how young the winrt framework and APIs are. Saying they didn't try hard enough is silly I think. The start screen and the winrt framework itself are both basically a v1.0 product, it's going to be rough till they updating it more but that's not to say they didn't put any effort into it at all.

And I'd just like to add that I can use the metro control panel fine with a mouse, I don't see any issues with it.

[FloatingFatMan]

Because it showcases a failure of design. Rather than making a UI that worked well on both touch and M+K, they created one for both and just jammed them both into Windows 8.

I'm sorry, but for this at least, you're talking nonsense. The reason for the touch UI control panel is for those using the touch interface to have usable access to it. They old one is there for those using desktop, and because the touch version doesn't have all the same features (many aren't really needed).

If they didn't do this, those on tablets would have problems and then the complainers WOULD actually have a point.

Now, I haven?t had any great deal of time with Windows 8 and I don?t plan to until they release the trial version of Windows Server 2012, but from what reviews I?ve read, this is a persistent problem in Windows 8. Things like the Metro IE not getting bookmarks from desktop IE. From what I?ve heard, there was no real effort put into harmonize Metro and the desktop and they both just sit in their own worlds.

I don't use IE (mine keeps crashing in RP, probably due to Flash), so I can't confirm or deny this issue.

[.Neo]

Using RP, two 40", yea, look at all the space I'm "wasting" /s.

Summing up the fact you have two 40-inch screens adds little to your story really. On my 27-inch screen with a 2650 x 1440 resolution most Metro apps do waste away screen estate. Frequently there simply isn't enough content to fill the screen with. Not to mention many apps have a lot of empty space that isn't used for anything to begin with. Having everything full-screen or a limitation of two windows split 80/20 is pointless on larger screens. Am I able to do something as basic as this in Metro? (see screen shot)

[CentralDogma]

Sure there's problems, they don't take it all the way at this point and it's got to do with how young the winrt framework and APIs are. Saying they didn't try hard enough is silly I think. The start screen and the winrt framework itself are both basically a v1.0 product, it's going to be rough till they updating it more but that's not to say they didn't put any effort into it at all.

And I'd just like to add that I can use the metro control panel fine with a mouse, I don't see any issues with it.

I think it?s a fundamental issue, if Microsoft is touting this as a marrying of desktop and mobile and their solution is simply to duplicate functionality and tailor it to each. It?s not really solving the problem.

And correct me if I?m wrong, but there is functionality in the Metro control panel that?s not in the desktop control panel and vice versa.

I'm sorry, but for this at least, you're talking nonsense. The reason for the touch UI control panel is for those using the touch interface to have usable access to it. They old one is there for those using desktop, and because the touch version doesn't have all the same features (many aren't really needed).

If they didn't do this, those on tablets would have problems and then the complainers WOULD actually have a point.

And I agree, but why not share bookmarks? Why not share open tabs? Why did Microsoft make a second IE for Metro, rather than have different UIs for the same underlying program? Better yet, one UI that would satisfy both.

[efjay]

Summing up the fact you have two 40-inch screens adds little to your story really. On my 27-inch screen with a 2650 x 1440 resolution most Metro apps do waste away screen estate. Frequently there simply isn't enough content to fill the screen with. Not to mention many apps have a lot of empty space that isn't used for anything to begin with. Having everything full-screen or a limitation of two windows split 80/20 is pointless on larger screens. Am I able to do something as basic as this in Metro? (see screen shot)

But you dont like Metro or the Metro apps, so why use them at all when you can use the desktop and achieve what you want? The desktop allows you to have as many windows open as you want, and with all your programs on the taskbar or the desktop is there really a problem?