Windows 8 is the first OS that made me downgrade

[Stoffel]

Well said, fair point. But reading on threads like these makes me more curious about win 8.

I'll just wait for public release to try it out.

Why don't you download the release preview from the MS website right now.

Once the final version is for sale you can upgrade.

[fintechfooty]

Yo this is nothing but a rant about how you hate the UI. They gave the desktop as well for a reason. I just don't understand it. It's going to work, and to be honest everybody's going to have to get used to it. And you will! It's not that different. Yeah new start-screen, just press the Windows key. I didn't like it at first either, uninstalled the RC from my main PC. Then I went back to using my MBP. Then I realized that Windows 8 had best of both worlds (the elegance provided by Win8Metro, and the regular desktop). Then my experience changed and I wanted to learn from it.

So don't whine about it because it's staying, going to be in your nearest bestbuy for a while. :woot:

[c.grz]

Someone here mentioned that they weren't going to offer support for Windows 8.

I don't understand why one would do that. My job is to support what the customers use; like it or not. I'm not a big fan of Linux but because customers use it; I HAVE to learn to support it.

So if Windows 8 become a hit and everyone uses it; you still wont support it?

[giantpotato]

Settings seems a much logical place for it, to me. After all, you're setting the system to shut down.

For years people have been joking about how it's stupid that in Windows you need to click 'start' to stop your computer. They finally change it, and people say the new method is stupid. You can't please everyone.

[bandit_liberty_rumble]

For years people have been joking about how it's stupid that in Windows you need to click 'start' to stop your computer. They finally change it, and people say the new method is stupid. You can't please everyone.

Well, yeah. When you make changes to something that needed to be improved, that doesn't necessarily mean you've improved on it.

[.Neo]

I remember when the apple fans made fun of the start menu:

"Windows is stupid! You must press start to shut down the system" - followed by the troll face

Now the same kind of people complain it's gone.

As far as the Start screen goes it's largely Microsoft's own user base that's complaining. Nice try though.

[FalseAgent]

When it comes to technology, people don't know what they need. People didn't know that having a smartphone with location-based features could be useful until the iPhone came about.

Right now, we do not know if or not we actually need touch-based features everywhere. We will see. But if we land ourselves in a future where everything moves towards touch, Windows 8 will be at the center of that revolution, you can be assured of that.

[briangw]

I still don't get the whole shut down argument.

For power users there is still Alt-F4

The average user might not know this, but then again, once you show him where he can shut down his computer he will just do it that way without moaning like all the power users here and get on with his live

Win key + I brings that settings screen up too.

[Orange Battery]

Unfortunately I think MS have mucked this one up. They have made some great additions to Explorer, its almost usable now for a techie and there is extra customisation (although still not enough for a modern day OS).

MS let themselves down when they forced the new UI on everyone. Tablets and Desktops are totally different, you cant merge them, you shouldn't try. There should have been Win 8 for Tablets and Win 8 for desktops - simple but effective.

No business does well by giving everyone an average experience, well except MacDonald's.. Windows 8 is not the best OS for the desktop user because of tablets and is not the best OS for tablets because the desktop.

How can such a big company with so much experience make such a simple mistake?

Windows 9 needs to be worked on fast, I fear another ME or Vista - the OS is good but the public opinion is what will hurt.

[PC EliTiST]

One thing I really love on Win 8 RTM is the desktop theme. I truly like the squared, clean design.

A guy on Deviantart successfully ported the authentic Win8 RTM theme on Windows 7.

I currently use in dual boot both, Win 7 & Win 8 Pro, but when the licence of Win 8 is gonna expire, a simple format will occur.

Win 7 Premium :D http://i.minus.com/itO8LWU4hygY3.png The best deal for me. Win 7's flexibility with Win 8's nice desktop theme.

[Scorbing]

LiquidCrystalMeth[/color]' timestamp='1344521710' post='595075103']

iPads and actually tablets are toys for hipster douches and will die out long before laptops do.

You are wrong sir. Tablets are very useful in the business world. Me, for example, I have an iPad and I use it as a credit card machine, invoice printer and cash register. I go to my customer's house to do a service. Once I'm done, I make the invoice on Quick Sale Pro, print it or email it to them, and if I get paid with a credit card, I use Square and run that sucker through the iPad and I get paid. Then I tell the customer to sign the invoice and the credit card on the ipad using the Stylus pen and I'm done.

The battery on a tablet lasts longer than the battery on a laptop, not to mention that they are much more portable and that is why they are great for me people like me, who actually use it.

The iPad and Android tablets, again, are very useful for business.

[Jim K Global Moderator]

Funny, I think all these threads would be null and void if not for one thing....

Microsoft removing the start menu / giving the option to disable Metro (or whatever they call it now).

Like others have expressed in this and other threads, performance wise Win8 is on point. However, I just can not get past that inconsistencies of the UI and the, well for lack of a better word, fugliness of Metro.

If Microsoft hadn't removed the start menu and gave the option to remove Metro....I would upgrade in a heart beat (even at previous Windows upgrade prices). I will end up skipping this one and hope Microsoft see their error.

This is regarding desktop/notebook use (not tablets or touchscreens...neither of which I really want)

[Scorbing]

Funny, I think all these threads would be null and void if not for one thing....

Microsoft removing the start menu / giving the option to disable Metro (or whatever they call it now).

Like others have expressed in this and other threads, performance wise Win8 is on point. However, I just can not get past that inconsistencies of the UI and the, well for lack of a better word, fugliness of Metro.

If Microsoft hadn't removed the start menu and gave the option to remove Metro....I would upgrade in a heart beat (even at previous Windows upgrade prices). I will end up skipping this one and hope Microsoft see their error.

This is regarding desktop/notebook use (not tablets or touchscreens...neither of which I really want)

Windows 8 is NOT faster than Windows 7 at everything. After playing with it for more than 24 hours, I can tell you that, yes, IT IS faster booting and shutting down, but that's about it. The interface is confusing and ugly.

Again...This is a TABLET ONLY OS, this is not for a desktop. Sorry, but that's how I feel. You want Windows on a desktop then stick with Windows 7. I am sure Neo will agree.

[Ice_Blue]

Someone here mentioned that they weren't going to offer support for Windows 8.

I don't understand why one would do that. My job is to support what the customers use; like it or not. I'm not a big fan of Linux but because customers use it; I HAVE to learn to support it.

So if Windows 8 become a hit and everyone uses it; you still wont support it?

Never mind what other people think.

You have a duty to your clients.

Whether you choose to support their choice of OS, or whether you recommend an OS to them, your job will be to support them.

I'm sure you will do this to the best of your ability.

[Jim K Global Moderator]

Windows 8 is NOT faster than Windows 7 at everything. After playing with it for more than 24 hours, I can tell you that, yes, IT IS faster booting and shutting down, but that's about it. The interface is confusing and ugly.

Again...This is a TABLET ONLY OS, this is not for a desktop. Sorry, but that's how I feel. You want Windows on a desktop then stick with Windows 7. I am sure Neo will agree.

Well, yea, I agree which is what I said? Though, performance wise it is on point .. though I didn't mention it faster or slower than Win7. I never really dove into gaming since, as you pointed out, I just became frustrated at the inconsistancy in the UI. However, I would upgrade if Microsoft made Metro an option and brought back the Start Menu (even at previous Microsoft OS prices)

...so I think we agree?

[Scorbing]

Well, yea, I agree which is what I said? Though, performance wise it is on point .. though I didn't mention it faster or slower than Win7. I never really dove into gaming since, as you pointed out, I just became frustrated at the inconsistancy in the UI. However, I would upgrade if Microsoft made Metro an option and brought back the Start Menu (even at previous Microsoft OS prices)

...so I think we agree?

And I agree with you as well on this. If Microsoft would give the user the option to use Metro or the regular desktop UI - with Star Menu included - Then yes, by all means, I would upgrade in a heartbeat. The problem is just that, they want to stick the user with Metro and no start menu wether they like it or not and that my friend is not cool at all. That is VERY disrespectful.

[PGHammer]

I believe that the dramatically lowered price of Windows 8 compared to previous Windows releases is in part because of the tablet market, but also due to the huge backlash of current Windows users as a incentive to upgrade no matter what.

This gamble is a double edged sword, imho. If I recall correctly XP pro was ~300$ and OEM was ~100, With Vista and Windows 7 due to multitude of SKU's consumer versions were anywhere between 100$ and 400$. That is a huge price difference and Windows 8 will need to sell 3-5(not counting the upgrade price) copies for 1 copy of older versions of Windows. From what I was able to see, businesses will completely ignore Windows 8 and that is where Microsoft will be hurt the most. Consumers that already own a copy of Windows (XP, Vista or 7) will in large number(from the people I know and have tried 8 in betas and pre-releases, not a single one will make a transition to windows 8) avoid upgrading. That leaves only future tablet owners to make up for losses made on other fronts, but by looking at how well Windows phone is doing it is hard to expect anything better for Windows RT.

Considering how consumers including businesses and OEM partners feel about Windows 8 in it's current state, Microsoft's earnings from Windows 8 will be disappointing at the very best. Hopefully this will be a much needed cold shower or a slap in the face Microsoft needs after the arrogance of previous bad releases (ME and Vista) did not hurt their earnings.

I believe that the dramatically lowered price of Windows 8 compared to previous Windows releases is in part because of the tablet market, but also due to the huge backlash of current Windows users as a incentive to upgrade no matter what.

This gamble is a double edged sword, imho. If I recall correctly XP pro was ~300$ and OEM was ~100, With Vista and Windows 7 due to multitude of SKU's consumer versions were anywhere between 100$ and 400$. That is a huge price difference and Windows 8 will need to sell 3-5(not counting the upgrade price) copies for 1 copy of older versions of Windows. From what I was able to see, businesses will completely ignore Windows 8 and that is where Microsoft will be hurt the most. Consumers that already own a copy of Windows (XP, Vista or 7) will in large number(from the people I know and have tried 8 in betas and pre-releases, not a single one will make a transition to windows 8) avoid upgrading. That leaves only future tablet owners to make up for losses made on other fronts, but by looking at how well Windows phone is doing it is hard to expect anything better for Windows RT.

Considering how consumers including businesses and OEM partners feel about Windows 8 in it's current state, Microsoft's earnings from Windows 8 will be disappointing at the very best. Hopefully this will be a much needed cold shower or a slap in the face Microsoft needs after the arrogance of previous bad releases (ME and Vista) did not hurt their earnings.

Windows ME was not planned - it was something the IHVs insisted on because they didn't think that users were ready for an NT-based general-purpose/multipurpose OS (and that was despite Windows 2000 Professional being perfectly usable as such an OS - I, in fact, upgraded to it INSTEAD of either staying with 98SE or upgrading to ME). Only Vista was *bad* in that sense; however, that was again mostly the fault of IHVs (poor driver support and underwhelming GPU performance - especially in terms of laptops - Windows 7, in fact, changed little from Vista, but did correct both those Vista-specific issues, and is what the critics of 8's UI would rather use. so even Vista isn't a true failure). The complaints about Windows 8 are entirely anti-change. It's different, and, despite all the railing about things devolving into *meh* in computing, when it gets down to brass tacks, a lot of folks apparently LIKE (or would rather have) *meh*, because they don't want to learn anything new.

[Guest LiquidCrystalMeth]

Someone here mentioned that they weren't going to offer support for Windows 8.

I don't understand why one would do that. My job is to support what the customers use; like it or not. I'm not a big fan of Linux but because customers use it; I HAVE to learn to support it.

So if Windows 8 become a hit and everyone uses it; you still wont support it?

It was me that said that, and no i wont.

I simply wont be carrying the can for Microsofts stupidity, and wouldnt feel comfortable charging my customers to install software and support it, when that spftware is going to make them have rethink their approach to the gui, these are people who simply want to use the computer.

Simple as that.

And as i said, most people who i know who have seen the preview arent interested in switching anyway. People like to just be able to get onto their computer and just use it and secondly to have some semblence of comfort and continuity, none of which is offered by this monstrosity.

Just remains to be seen how long it takes Microsoft to realise the error, apologise and back peddle. I give it less than 6 months.

[Joni_78]

For years people have been joking about how it's stupid that in Windows you need to click 'start' to stop your computer. They finally change it, and people say the new method is stupid. You can't please everyone.

Where is the shutdown/reboot now?

[Dot Matrix]

And I agree with you as well on this. If Microsoft would give the user the option to use Metro or the regular desktop UI - with Star Menu included - Then yes, by all means, I would upgrade in a heartbeat. The problem is just that, they want to stick the user with Metro and no start menu wether they like it or not and that my friend is not cool at all. That is VERY disrespectful.

There were technical reasons to remove it. This cannot be said enough. It doesn't matter how much you think it should be there, it simply can't.

It was me that said that, and no i wont.

I simply wont be carrying the can for Microsofts stupidity, and wouldnt feel comfortable charging my customers to install software and support it, when that spftware is going to make them have rethink their approach to the gui, these are people who simply want to use the computer.

Simple as that.

And as i said, most people who i know who have seen the preview arent interested in switching anyway. People like to just be able to get onto their computer and just use it and secondly to have some semblence of comfort and continuity, none of which is offered by this monstrosity.

Just remains to be seen how long it takes Microsoft to realise the error, apologise and back peddle. I give it less than 6 months.

I hate to say it, but you come across as awfully spiteful. It's just an OS. Chill. Stay on Windows 7 then. Quit bitching about an OS no one is forcing you to use.

[Joni_78]

There were technical reasons to remove it. This cannot be said enough.

They should have released two different versions of Windows then. But I guess they wanted to unify WP, tablet and desktop so they got little blinded by that idea and didn't realize what happened to desktop usability.

[Dot Matrix]

They should have released two different versions of Windows then. But I guess they wanted to unify WP, tablet and desktop so they got little blinded by that idea and didn't realize what happened to desktop usability.

Why should they do that when it creates so much overhead? Windows 8 is about unifying the codebase, not tearing it apart further. There's no reason to fork the codebase anymore than it already is.

There isn't anything in Windows 8 destroying desktop useability.

[ZombieFly]

I'm so out of this thread.

you didn't really bring anything of any value to it anyway, your time is better spent elsewhere :)

[Joni_78]

I've spent the last hour trying to get into safe mode to install some unsigned drivers but nothing seems to work... Isn't it SHIFT+F8 anymore in RTM or did they remove the whole safe mode?

[notuptome2004]

I've spent the last hour trying to get into safe mode to install some unsigned drivers but nothing seems to work... Isn't it SHIFT+F8 anymore in RTM or did they remove the whole safe mode?

go in to the Metro control panel settings in Metro of course and go to general then go to the bottom go to of that tab area and go to advanced startup you will have more options to do things including i think to go in to safemode