Diablo 3's Jay Wilson to Diablo 2 Creator "F***k that loser"

[Phantom Spaceman]

Diablo 3's Jay Wilson Tells Diablo 2 Designer, Fans To F*ck Off

Author: William Usher

published: 2012-08-20 07:18:33

When you make a masterpiece that gamers love and enjoy, the one thing that usually follows that masterpiece around are fanboys and admirers.Diablo II has a lot of fanboys and admirers. Diablo III was made by a different group of people and abandoned a lot of what made Diablo II a masterpiece. So when the Diablo II designer, David Brevik, echos comments made by the community on why people dislike Diablo III, the lead designer of Diablo III, Jay Wilson, said to ?F*ck that loser.?

Quick history lesson: Blizzard North designed Diablo I and Diablo II. They departed from Blizzard back in 2005 and eventually went to work onTorchlight. Blizzard South took over for development for Diablo III and bam, we have Real-Money Auction House: The Game.

Now here's where things get ugly. In an interview with Inc Gamers, Diablo IIdesigner David Brevik speaks truth. In fact, he speaks about the very thing that a lot of gamers feel are wrong with Diablo III, including the auction house, saying...

[blizzard South] made some decisions with the loot system that were very different than the way that we did it in Diablo 2 and I think that obviously the community has been upset with some of the decisions they made. Having all of your powers work off your main weapon and things like that, to having blues that are more powerful than yellows. Eventually the auction house and how that worked, even something as simple as when you equip an item and it?s bound to your character permanently would have totally changed the dynamic of the game.

The entire interview is superb. Absolutely superb. Brevik keeps it civil but poignant, making points and bringing out things that gamers have been complaining about and suggesting to Blizzard to fix on the forums since the release of Daiblo III.

And Mr. Hughston, the tone irritates you because it's your conscience feeling burdened by this little thing called ?Truth?. Don't worry, after you bask in the glory of greed long enough you'll get to a point where you'll be just like Bobby Kotick, a guy who regularly walks by homeless, legless children begging on street corners and he completely ignores them while saying to himself ?I have no conscience. I embrace the Dark Side.?

Despite Blizzard North not being a part of Diablo III's design, Brevik was actually happy about it. Why? Well, with Blizzard South taking over the reins it brought to light why people loved Blizzard North so much...

...it shows that the people that were involved in Diablo really did matter, and so I am happy that it has come to light that how talented that group was and how unique and special that group was. I am hoping that, as this happens very often in the industry, you see it with Call of Duty and things like that , when the people leave the game changes and it shows how critical people are in this industry.

The real kicker is that everything Brevik says is true and the criticisms have real-world reactions to them, specifically with the player drop-off rate, which was reported by several different independent firms at being close to 65%.Blizzard blamed the drop-off on a lack of end-game content, but I'm sorry, if you lose that many gamers within a two-month span and the general consensus amongst Diablo II fans and the lead designer is that your game is decent but heavily flawed, you need to come off your high-horse and realize that there are no long-term sales for a game like Diablo III unless you get to fixing.

I'd also like to point out that ARPGs and loot-grinding games don't need end-game content to keep players playing...heck, Borderlands, Torchlightand Diablo II are proof that as long as the loot is interesting and the grind is fun, gamers will keep lootin' and grindin'.

Of course, the other problem is the always-on DRM and the accompanying Real-Money Auction House -- both of which have caused Blizzard a number of legal problems in France, Germany and Korea -- and are the prime culprits for a lot of the outrage. That's not to mention all the other people who have had their accounts banned and their money usurped by shady Real-Money Auction House policies and still have no resolution to their problems.

Ultimately, I disagree with Jay Wilson. Despite selling 10 million copies on name alone and having a bunch of websites that don't really mean much anymore when it comes to representing the interest of the gaming community give your game high scores, there's still the reality that a lot of gamers aren't happy and everything that's wrong with the game stems from a problem Blizzard doesn't want to fix.

Jay Wilson saying to Brevik to ?F*ck that loser? is basically Wilson telling the entire Diablo III community to go ?F*ck off?. I'm also inclined to side a bit more with the guy who made Diablo a legendary name as opposed to the guy who helped bury that name under Real-Money Auction House: The Game.

http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Diablo-3-Jay-Wilson-Tells-Diablo-2-Designer-Fans-F-ck-Off-45895.html

[dead.cell]

What an ass.

[LOC Veteran]

Jay Wilson saying to Brevik to ?F*ck that loser? is basically Wilson telling the entire Diablo III community to go ?F*ck off?

Uh, no it's not. Also the constant use of Real Money Auction House: The Game in the "article" is funny as well. Personally I don't think any of us can understand how hard a game designer works on his or her game, especially for nearly a decade like with Diablo III. Jay Wilson seems like a very nice guy from the stuff I've seen (and especially with his appearances on the Jace Hall Show, he's perfectly fine making fun of himself AND his game, so whatever) and doesn't take criticism super seriously to the point of becoming jaded.

Regardless, Diablo II was an incredible game, 14 years ago. It still is an incredible game today don't get me wrong, but some of the design decisions Blizzard made with Diablo III were probably necessary due to the times and how different the climate is for PC games (and games in general). Not to mention, Blizzard is kinda Activision Blizzard now, and not just Blizzard North or Blizzard South like it was in 1998.

[Nagisan]

Jay Wilson seems like a very nice guy from the stuff I've seen (and especially with his appearances on the Jace Hall Show, he's perfectly fine making fun of himself AND his game, so whatever) and doesn't take criticism super seriously to the point of becoming jaded.

I don't think a "very nice guy" would say "F*%& that loser." just because someone criticized his game. Fact is, Jay Wilson did say it, and it goes to show who the game directory of D3 really is.

Also, if the changes to D3 (compared to D2) were needed due to the times, they wouldn't be changing so many systems so drastically with today's patch.

[Phouchg]

BLIZZARD CAN DO NO WRONG!

[ahhell]

Jay's comment sums up perfectly what has happened to Blizzard. They've turned into this horribly arrogant group of ****heads. I also think they made some of the worse possible decisions with D3. Online all the time to play a single player game? **** that.

I love when people use the "fastest selling game evar!!1!11 so it must be good" argument too. Just because it's popular doesn't automatically make it good.

Blizzard can shut down tomorrow for all I care. **** them.

[Shadrack]

You don't have to use the AH or the RMAH to enjoy Diablo 3. I've been able to get beat Hell difficulty (solo) without using the AH and just relying on drops and gambling at the craftsman.

I really enjoyed Diablo 1, 2, Torchlight and Diablo 3. One thing that really sticks out about Diablo 3 is the good balance of skills. The gameplay is really tight because of this. I find myself having to use all of my skills in concert in Diablo 3. Where as TL and Diablo 2 was more about character development, putting most of your eggs into one skill basket, and spamming that one skill all over the map.

Blizzard made some bad design decisions in Diablo 3. But David Brevik is kind of being an ass to his former employer with the whole interview. David should just be focused on releasing an awesome game that we are all looking forward to (I know I'm looking forward to it). Not beating the hate drums at Blizzard.

[Xilo]

I think he's just secretly jealous since D2 is a much better game.

[+DKAngel Subscriber²]

You don't have to use the AH or the RMAH to enjoy Diablo 3. I've been able to get beat Hell difficulty (solo) without using the AH and just relying on drops and gambling at the craftsman.

I really enjoyed Diablo 1, 2, Torchlight and Diablo 3. One thing that really sticks out about Diablo 3 is the good balance of skills. The gameplay is really tight because of this. I find myself having to use all of my skills in concert in Diablo 3. Where as TL and Diablo 2 was more about character development, putting most of your eggs into one skill basket, and spamming that one skill all over the map.

Blizzard made some bad design decisions in Diablo 3. But David Brevik is kind of being an ass to his former employer with the whole interview. David should just be focused on releasing an awesome game that we are all looking forward to (I know I'm looking forward to it). Not beating the hate drums at Blizzard.

and how are u finding inferno now? without using the ah?

[LaP]

Jay's comment sums up perfectly what has happened to Blizzard. They've turned into this horribly arrogant group of ****heads. I also think they made some of the worse possible decisions with D3. Online all the time to play a single player game? **** that.

I love when people use the "fastest selling game evar!!1!11 so it must be good" argument too. Just because it's popular doesn't automatically make it good.

Blizzard can shut down tomorrow for all I care. **** them.

But is the game really popular ? It sold a lot yes but popular not sure.

All the people i played WoW with bought Diablo 3 on launch. On launch day my Battle.net friends list (around 30 people) was full of people playing Diablo 3. Now i'm lucky if there's one playing Diablo 3. There always like betwen 5 and 10 playing WoW.

From what i can remember people played Diablo 2 for months.

If i really wanted to play Diablo 3 next weeked (i'm sure not with Guild Wars 2 coming out) i would have a really hard time finding someone to play with. Was not the case with Diablo2 even 1 year after the lauch.

Most people i speak with actually liked the game but nothing more. They played it for 2 or maybe 3 weeks then went to play something else. Almost everyone i know who played Torchlight and Diablo 3 can't really say Diablo 3 is A LOT better (technically it is specially since Torchlight did not have any multiplayers mode but when you consider the price difference ...).

Anyway Diablo 3 will definately not be the juggernaut Diablo 2. With Guild Wars 2 coming out next week, MoP next month and the countless of other games this fall including Torchlight 2 Diablo 3 might very well be forgotten quickly.

[margrave]

Nice drama to get Blizzards name on everyone's lips again,

brilliant marketing

[Shadrack]

and how are u finding inferno now? without using the ah?

Its a bit of a brick wall at the moment. I've almost beaten the first Act but if I come across a group of elites that make invulnerability bubbles or that damn frogs that move really fast I either have to lead them a part of the map and then bypass them or re-roll. The cost of dying is such that my funds get depleted and I have to go play another lower level character.

Hell I could get through undergeared and just use good strategy. Wizard has been much easier to solo through it (that venom hydra makes things pretty easy on Hell...). My Barbarian needed some help from a DH friend. Melee needs better gear I think because you have to take some hits.

I'm hoping that the patch makes it possible for me to beat Inferno without using the AH. But I talked it over with my friend that has been playing through on his DH and we decided to get a few items in the AH if we are still not feeling like we are progressing just to finish it up and be done with it already.

[ILikeTobacco]

Nice drama to get Blizzards name on everyone's lips again,

brilliant marketing

With the announced changes for todays patch, this wasnt needed. There will be plenty of drama.

[Shadrack]

Most people i speak with actually liked the game but nothing more. They played it for 2 or maybe 3 weeks then went to play something else. Almost everyone i know who played Torchlight and Diablo 3 can't really say Diablo 3 is A LOT better (technically it is specially since Torchlight did not have any multiplayers mode but when you consider the price difference ...).

That is true. People played D2 for months if not years, and that probably won't be the case for Diablo 3. But it wasn't the case for TorchLight and I doubt it will be the case for TorchLight 2 either. Still, D3, TL, and TL2 if you get weeks of playtime and can say you got at least 20+ hours, well thats on par with any good single player game out there. If you get at least 60 hours, then that is more playtime than a typically "good" single player game. I think I have about 200 hours from D3 so far. The different classes are differentiated enough to keep me interested in the game for now. The gear isn't all the interesting though. The gear was far more interesting in TL. There's nothing about gear to be excited about in D3. Hopefully it is a little better with the boost to Legendaries in the next patch. But I've only seen 1 legendary drop in all my playtime so I'm not going to get my hopes up.

[dead.cell]

Uh, no it's not. Also the constant use of Real Money Auction House: The Game in the "article" is funny as well. Personally I don't think any of us can understand how hard a game designer works on his or her game, especially for nearly a decade like with Diablo III. Jay Wilson seems like a very nice guy from the stuff I've seen (and especially with his appearances on the Jace Hall Show, he's perfectly fine making fun of himself AND his game, so whatever) and doesn't take criticism super seriously to the point of becoming jaded.

Regardless, Diablo II was an incredible game, 14 years ago. It still is an incredible game today don't get me wrong, but some of the design decisions Blizzard made with Diablo III were probably necessary due to the times and how different the climate is for PC games (and games in general). Not to mention, Blizzard is kinda Activision Blizzard now, and not just Blizzard North or Blizzard South like it was in 1998.

The development time for Diablo 3 always seems stretched. Blizzard North was the one working on the next sequel, before they were shut down in 2005. So maybe 6 years in actual development for what we have now?

That is true. People played D2 for months if not years, and that probably won't be the case for Diablo 3. But it wasn't the case for TorchLight and I doubt it will be the case for TorchLight 2 either. Still, D3, TL, and TL2 if you get weeks of playtime and can say you got at least 20+ hours, well thats on par with any good single player game out there. If you get at least 60 hours, then that is more playtime than a typically "good" single player game. I think I have about 200 hours from D3 so far. The different classes are differentiated enough to keep me interested in the game for now. The gear isn't all the interesting though. The gear was far more interesting in TL. There's nothing about gear to be excited about in D3. Hopefully it is a little better with the boost to Legendaries in the next patch. But I've only seen 1 legendary drop in all my playtime so I'm not going to get my hopes up.

It's funny how you say the gear isn't interesting, when this was one of the big things that made Diablo II awesome. The loot system in it was just incredible, and always sort of drew you into playing some more to see what kind of stuff you could get to drop again or later on. As for Torchlight 2, I've given it a go during the beta, and after having tried the starter edition of Diablo 3, I can safely say that I'm still looking forward to TL2. It's faster paced, the attacks appear to be more explosive, and it feels like I'm able to customize my character a lot better, as we were able to with D2. I guess to me, it feels like the true essence and sequel of Diablo 2. It's also leaps and bounds better than Torchlight, that comparing the two wouldn't be a fair comparison at all.

What happened to making awesome games and releasing them? :/

[Alladaskill17]

BLIZZARD CAN DO NO WRONG!

I'll see your sarcasm, and raise you: "The Auction is Blizz's 2nd greatest implementation in their games. Second only to the awesomeness that is Mists of Panda-land".

[Xilo]

Ever since Activision bought out Blizzard, Blizzard has gone downhill since it's now King Kotick running the place and all he cares about is $$$.

[kaotic]

all he cares about is $$$.

As does every single gaming company.

[LaP]

I'll see your sarcasm, and raise you: "The Auction is Blizz's 2nd greatest implementation in their games. Second only to the awesomeness that is Mists of Panda-land".

I think the pokemon game included with MoP is surely 3rd. Can't wait for pet battle it's gonna be epic. Who needs new contents when you get non combat pet battle ? gotta catch 'em all ...

[Xilo]

As does every single gaming company.

Every company exists to make money. The difference is how greedy they are. Kotick is known to be a money grubbing ****** and would charge you $100 for a game if he could get away with it. He's said this publicly before.

If you look at the Diablo 3 economics and how drops are and how effectiveness is tied to weapon damage, it's designed to get people to use the RMAH and thus making Blizzard money. Gold farmers cause inflation. This makes it harder for newer people to get the required gold to gear up. Item drops can be few and far between (I didn't get a single upgrade drop in Nightmare or Hell). Therefore the only way to progress is to farm for tons of money or be hopeful for upgrades. This can be very time consuming. Thus the RMAH becomes the only option to be able to realistically progress in the game. Not so much for Nightmare and Hell because you can find cheap stuff usually, but for Inferno, yeah...

[LaP]

As does every single gaming company.

There can't be $$$ without customers. Unless Blizz change their last 2-3 years policy they'll find that one day or another. Oh! it'll take time. Die hard blizzard fanboys (i used to be one and i'm still kinda one as i'm ashamed to admit i paid for MoP) are almost impossible to kill.

Blizzard used to be customers first, money second.

Then soon after Activision merged with Vivendi (almost like if Activision bought Vivendi since Kotick is the lead of the new company) they started to be money first, customers second (i have no problem with that).

Sadly Blizzard is more and more money only and we don't give a **** about customers. Anyone who play or played WoW on a regular basis know that.

I still like Blizzard games. But my love with the company died with faction change. I was playing on Mug'thol alliance side (Void guild server) when faction change was implemented. Mug'thol was a nice server with a pop ratio of 1.5 hordes for every alliance. People were pro there it was a really great server with lot of really good guilds and a sense of community.

Then Blizzard had the great idea to let people faction change to make money. All alliance went horde. The pop ratio went as bad as 10 hordes for every alliance. To make things worse WG was not balanced at all we were fighting 10 to 20 alliances against 200 hordes most of the time. Tenacity was not enough and we were not able to fight (CCed from 100% to 0% in less than a global CD). Could not do VoA at all.

I posted on Blizzard forum many times, tried to get in touch with them. Opened tickets. I did everything i could to let them know Mug'thol server had a problem (created by their own greed). The only thing i got was a big silence. I finnally had to pay 75$ to move my 3 main toons to another server.

A good company would have offered me free xfer. Blizzard would have offered me free xfer. But Blizzard is no more. It's now called Activision-Blizzard and is lead by former Activision CEO.

[Emn1ty]

I think he's just secretly jealous since D2 is a much better game.

I don't think the games are as different as people think. I think people are disappointed because they've gotten over the generic end-game of such genres, whereas with Diablo II they hadn't (and now play it for nostalgia). From two of the biggest Diablo II fans I know they say there is really nothing wrong with the game and all their biggest annoyances are getting fixed in the next patch. The one thing that will not be fixed is the poor endgame, which to be honest doesn't seem any different than Diablo II.

[Shadrack]

I don't think the games are as different as people think. I think people are disappointed because they've gotten over the generic end-game of such genres, whereas with Diablo II they hadn't (and now play it for nostalgia). From two of the biggest Diablo II fans I know they say there is really nothing wrong with the game and all their biggest annoyances are getting fixed in the next patch. The one thing that will not be fixed is the poor endgame, which to be honest doesn't seem any different than Diablo II.

The only difference in end game between D2 and D3 is that in D2, dying in HELL difficulty resulted in a loss of XP. This made is much harder IMO and therefore it took a lot longer to get to say you beat the game in its entirety. Even then, it was almost impossible for some to do because Diablo and Bail would be immune to cold damage and all you put points into was cold damage or something like that. D2 was just a lot less forgiving than D3 is because skill points were committed and you could screw yourself into a position so that you couldn't progress any further.

I think that the campaign is a lot funner on D3 than D2. The 2nd and 3rd Act in D2 were just...terrible. I hated those two acts so much. Especially Act 3. Got so tired of seeing the same tiles and the exact same fights over-and-over-and-over again. Diablo 2 is just getting more points for having high nostalgia.

But the items were more interesting in D2 and in TL. I really liked all the low level set pieces that I would come across. It was a real delight when I found something else in that set and leveled a character specifically to use my set items. They weren't needed, but it still made it fun for me.

[trag3dy]

Jay apologizes..

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6398870250

Is it sincere or just an "oh damn I got caught better do something about it" apology?

[LOC Veteran]

I'm pretty sure it's sincere. If you had the entire internet saying you suck as a developer because you ruined their game they were waiting a decade for blah blah etc etc, I'm pretty sure you'd get pretty ticked off as well. Maybe you'd be able to control yourself better and not say something on Twitter or Facebook like he did, but he did it. He's obviously passionate about his game(s) and cares about the people who work under him. If you watch the Jace Hall Show you'd see it, even if he's doing comedy stuff and making fun of himself (and his team).

Also, most of the community has accepted his apology by this point (if you go through that thread) and I'm sure by now Dave has as well. I'm sure they've spoken on the phone or something about it and everything is fine.