Editorial news calls quite a lot of people Idiots

[Nick H. Supervisor]

what do you mean a non-defined group?

I mean that the author didn't specifically pick people by name and say, "you're an idiot." He said that people (non-defined) that say that Windows 8 is the next Vista sound like idiots.

Anyway, we appear to be agreeing with one another. I don't know why I continue to look in this thread, the matter is as good as settled. We all just need to move on.

[Dot Matrix]

Please read the thread before replying. That's not even close to what we have been talking about for the majority of this thread.

No, but it's what started it.

[TheLegendOfMart]

Neowin isn't run by you, if they want to put up articles and editorials like this then that's up to you. If you really don;t like it, vote with your clicks and go somewhere else.

Yes you're not allowed to start forum threads calling people idiots but you don;t own the site either.

How do they expect people to abide by the rules of the forum if they can't do it themselves.

[Japlabot]

In case you haven't noticed, Neowin has become Trollwin on the front page in a desperate attempt to increase ad revenues by making bold and misleading titles. It's like all the Youtube videos that have a woman with big ###### as the thumbnail but no ###### to be seen in the video.

[shockz]

Only on Neowin could there be a 12 page thread about an editorial calling 8 haters idiots. Grow the **** up, there wasn't a specific reference to any member, but was a broad generalization of people who claim 8 is like vista. If you happen to fall into that category, no wonder you're butt hurt, but get over it. Take it as an opinion (hence the big editorial tag) and then take it or leave it.

[trag3dy]

Only on Neowin could there be a 12 page thread about an editorial calling 8 haters idiots. Grow the **** up, there wasn't a specific reference to any member, but was a broad generalization of people who claim 8 is like vista. If you happen to fall into that category, no wonder you're butt hurt, but get over it. Take it as an opinion (hence the big editorial tag) and then take it or leave it.

Yeah, I like discounting other peoples opinions because mine obviously matters more. We could just as easily say "stop being butt hurt people are taking issue with some guys childish rant". But that would just take us in a fun little circle of hypocrisy.

[TheLegendOfMart]

Only on Neowin could there be a 12 page thread about an editorial calling 8 haters idiots. Grow the **** up, there wasn't a specific reference to any member, but was a broad generalization of people who claim 8 is like vista. If you happen to fall into that category, no wonder you're butt hurt, but get over it. Take it as an opinion (hence the big editorial tag) and then take it or leave it.

Mate, if it was the other way round and a member of the forums had posted calling people idiots for whatever reason the thread wouldn't last long, why should we be held accountable for the rules we break when the staff don't, especially when they all jump to defend one of their own.

[shockz]

Yeah, I like discounting other peoples opinions because mine obviously matters more.

I really am not sure what you're talking about...

I've been around the block a few times here on Neowin, and you're never going to be able to please everyone. If the article was the exact opposite saying people were idiots for NOT saying it was like vista, there would be an outcry then too. The fact is, it's an editorial. Could Brad maybe have used a bit more tact? Debatable... it sets the tone, the mood for the article. But again, it doesn't negate the fact that it is an opinion piece. Not everyone is going to agree with it. That's when you move on. Bitching about it really isn't going to get you anywhere.

And lets be honest here... Neowin is a news outlit. They're going to use titles that grab attention. They want the hits, the ad revenue, the exposure. Just like any news site. As long as the information is accurate or clearly labeled an opinion piece... I'm not seeing the big issue here.

Mate, if it was the other way round and a member of the forums had posted calling people idiots for whatever reason the thread wouldn't last long, why should we be held accountable for the rules we break when the staff don't, especially when they all jump to defend one of their own.

Staff have a bit of leeway when it comes to the front page. That's how it's always been. They are aware of the rules far better than the average member and due to their commitment to the site and hard work they've done that's just how it is. Also he didn't refer to a member, he was making a broad statement to a specific group of people. Unless it's a hate/racist remark, no member would be moderated either. If they were... all the android/apple fanboys would be banned by now.

You also have to know the difference between trolling vs an opinion.

[Nick H. Supervisor]

Mate, if it was the other way round and a member of the forums had posted calling people idiots for whatever reason the thread wouldn't last long, why should we be held accountable for the rules we break when the staff don't, especially when they all jump to defend one of their own.

Because there are different rules governing posts on the website and posts in the forum. This thread has covered that bit. The article doesn't break any of the site's rules, but such a post in the forum may be considered a breach of the community rules.

[Dot Matrix]

Only on Neowin could there be a 12 page thread about an editorial calling 8 haters idiots. Grow the **** up, there wasn't a specific reference to any member, but was a broad generalization of people who claim 8 is like vista. If you happen to fall into that category, no wonder you're butt hurt, but get over it. Take it as an opinion (hence the big editorial tag) and then take it or leave it.

Did you even read the article? It was pointing to other blogs, not members.

[123456789A]

almost as though the editorial had an agenda.

I'm pretty sure every editorial has an agenda. This one was just a bit too much with the name calling.

[bdsams Veteran]

This is what I can't figure out, the 5 articles I linked to in my post, none of those authors complained about my post...if those folks would have been offended (you know, the people I linked too) I would have amended the article. Seeing as none of them mentioned a peep to me, we left the content as is.

[shockz]

Did you even read the article? It was pointing to other blogs, not members.

uh, yeah? A person still writes an article on a blog. What's your point?

[ILikeTobacco]

Hm. If someone said I looked like an idiot, for whatever reason, and I was still adamant they were wrong, I wouldn't be offended by it; instead, I would attempt to prove them wrong, with reason and logic. Maybe that's just me, though, but I wouldn't have found the term offensive.

There is a difference between the forums and news articles. As Scorpus explained, news articles are not governed by our Community Rules, whereas forum posts are. So this post of yours breaks our rules, whereas the editorial doesn't. Further, the editorial doesn't actually call anyone an idiot, like your post does, as has been pointed out.

According to a mods post here, it actually is specifically stating that if you say that 8 will be the next Vista, you are an idiot. The article says that if you think that, you are foolish and a mod has said here that if you are foolish, you are an idiot. You guys contradict each other quiet a bit on here while defending each other.

[Dot Matrix]

uh, yeah? A person still writes an article on a blog. What's your point?

This is what I can't figure out, the 5 articles I linked to in my post, none of those authors complained about my post...if those folks would have been offended (you know, the people I linked too) I would have amended the article. Seeing as none of them mentioned a peep to me, we left the content as is.

[shockz]

Yeah, still a bit confused on what you're getting at. He's referring to the group of people who wrote articles saying 8 is like Vista, not members. Isn't that what I said?

[phate]

Quite a lot of people ARE idiots....

[AJerman]

Hahaha, you guys are just like all the rest of the people in the world today. So easily offended by anything and need to be patted on the head. Who the **** cares what it says. Just like I would say the entire news section on this site is worthless so the fact that you're offended by it is funny.

Besides, the article author proves his inability to write comprehend a concept and respond without changing subject and over analyzing. Anyone who has said Windows 8 is the next Vista very simply means that it's going to be a great failure, just like Vista. The author of this article obviously couldn't comprehend the simplicity of this comment, and instead decided to compare it to the system stability and driver support in Vista, which was never a part of the discussion in the first place. It's a common tactic of those who have no real response to an argument. It looks like the reply probably started as a reply in the forum ranting and being upset because everyone picks on ole Windows 8, and for some reason the author thought we hadn't had enough Windows 8 sucks, Windows 8 is awesome posts on this site and decided we needed a news article about it.

So, as I was saying, the news section on this site is worthless and the fact that you'd be offended by it is funny. But is is an editorial, so grow a pair and deal with it. People are allowed to have opinions.

[Xoligy]

Oh yes they do...

No they dont the editor even says it...

I will make this very clear for everyone: Neowin will continue to use terms like "idiot" in reviews and editorials, where the use is justified in the article.

Brad's article justified the use of "idiot" by explaining why a person is foolish to believe Vista is like Windows 8. If he had called people "idiots" without any reason - eg. his article only included "people who think Vista is like Windows 8 are idiots" - then it would not have been approved.

The discussion in this thread has sparked literally no change in our methods of writing editorials, and internal article scrutiny.

The link between whether something is acceptable on the forums (as in abides by the Community Rules) and on news articles is irrelevant, as news articles are not governed by the Community Rules. We could very well post an article that says "**** you Samsung for your ****ty plastic crap Galaxy S III", but that would drive away members for obvious reasons and we would lose money. Same would happen were we to write something racist, or linking to pirated material - it's against the Community Rules, but more importantly drives away readers which is not what we want, why we don't post this stuff and use common sense in what we write.

We write for our audience, to entertain and to inform; but also to keep the site alive through revenue. This is not something that forum members need to be concerned about, so that's why the Community Rules are needed for the forums. The methods of business essentially keep our posts conforming to the Rules anyway.

I hope that clears things up.

This sums up that this site is going down hill, they are unwilling to listen to the people that read the articles are are defending one another, go elsewhere for the news its a win, win situation. They get to continue to write badly written articles with titles that make them look foolish, if thats the only way people read there articles then it says it all really. "How will we get people to read our articles? I got it! Call people idiots!" Sorry to say the only idiots here are the people that write the articles and the staff that blatantly dont care.

Once again, out of this thread and back to the sections i like to read i and will continue to ignore the news page on this site seeing as its run by children who needs flamebait titles to grab peoples attention.

[Ice_Blue]

Mr. Sam's editorial has become something of a Muhammad's cartoon, I see.

Tender sensibilities indeed.

[Shadrack]

This is what I can't figure out, the 5 articles I linked to in my post, none of those authors complained about my post...if those folks would have been offended (you know, the people I linked too) I would have amended the article. Seeing as none of them mentioned a peep to me, we left the content as is.

Brad - I will be honest with you, I really have loved your editorials. This particular one kind of slipped through the cracks and you are getting a lot of flack from people over it. What I am seeing on Neowin is that you guys are just posting stuff without reviewing it and considering the consequences... that is what sites like TechCrunch do. I think that the quality of the posts on Neowin would be heightened if there were a little more review by the other members on your staff before posting

Calling someone out as an idiot is an emotional attack that gets an emotional response. That is what you are seeing here. A little review would have revealed that and changed it to an objective attack which would have had the more desired objective response. That is how you create good discourse. If you want to use words the draw the emotions of people so that they feel attacked, I think the forums are the place for that. Otherwise you just come across as standing on a big front page soap box.

No they dont the editor even says it...

This sums up that this site is going down hill, they are unwilling to listen to the people that read the articles are are defending one another, go elsewhere for the news its a win, win situation. They get to continue to write badly written articles with titles that make them look foolish, if thats the only way people read there articles then it says it all really. "How will we get people to read our articles? I got it! Call people idiots!" Sorry to say the only idiots here are the people that write the articles and the staff that blatantly dont care.

Once again, out of this thread and back to the sections i like to read i and will continue to ignore the news page on this site seeing as its run by children who needs flamebait titles to grab peoples attention.

Essentially the same tactics the tabloids use... Is the goal clicks for ad money or good content?

[Arceles]

Where is the option for ignoring specific articles of specific writers? there was another time, I think it was John Callaman, when he wrote a lot of apple articles as in "worshiping" apple, nowadays they are non existent, but another user suggested the same... I'm so waiting for that, if calling "Idiots" to anyone who disagrees certain point of view is gonna become trend in this forum too, I at least would like to have the opportunity to avoid such articles.

Thanks in advance.

[Stoffel]

And we are a day further and still the same people feeling butthurt.

Do you guys have nothing better to do then sit behind your computer feeling hurt about an Editorial.

As adults you should just shrug and move on.

[Arceles]

And we are a day further and still the same people feeling butthurt.

Do you guys have nothing better to do then sit behind your computer feeling hurt about an Editorial.

As adults you should just shrug and move on.

Far more than you do, in fact... tomorrow I'm moving to England for a PHD, how about you?

[Xilo]

Neowin news articles really have gone down hill.