Recommended Posts

I, like many others, was really excited and enticed by Google's Nexus 4 Android phone. Finally a decent no-contract smartphone that was affordable!

After defeating the Google Play Store boss on November 27th, I was thrilled when my Nexus 4 shipped a whole week early! Sadly, the device didn't last 8 hours of on time before it decided it had enough of this world and bricked itself while on the charger.

I called Google Play Support and they were sympathetic. They promised that a replacement Nexus 4 would be shipped ASAP and that I should receive it in a few days. At most they said by the end of the week. Their email even specified "less than a week" shipping in it.

That week came and passed and I received no shipping information. I called Google Play Support yesterday evening to ask what the status was.

The first guy I spoke to assured me that actually the problem was with UPS. Apparently my replacement Nexus 4 was in a shipping container just waiting for UPS to come pick it up. I was thrilled and told him I was so excited to receive shipping information tomorrow. He couldn't guarantee that it would be shipped tomorrow, but within the next few days. Surely if it is boxed and ready to go, then scheduling UPS to come pick the box up shouldn't be a problem. Let me Google that for you, I explained. Sure enough, "schedule a pickup" would be a cinche! Let me talk to your supervisor.

Supervisor: No that isn't quite accurate and actually we are completely out of Nexus 4's and it could take weeks! No, can't compensate you for your time other than apologize and ask that you be patient. Can I talk to YOUR supervisor, I asked politely. No, my supervisor is an executive and doesn't take phone calls. Followed by a "Have a good day sir" and a *click*.

Today I receive an email from Google Play Store which spells it out further:

Hello -x-snip-x-,

Thank you for contacting us.

We recently have been updated, the replacement devices have been put on a backorder and will be shipped with in 3- 5 weeks. If you any other questions please feel free to reply back to this email.

Thanks,

Josh

Who knows? Maybe there will be a Christmas Miracle and I will receive a replacement Nexus 4 before the end of this week.

Meanwhile, Google Play Store has over $700 in charges and holds on my CC and I have nothing on my end. They won't even compensate me for my time. I mean, come on, is $20 in Google Play Store credits really a lot from Google?

Oh well. Lessened learned about the poor quality service that we can now expect from Google.

That's unfortunate.

I personally don't see how it's Googles fault. I understand that it's inconvenient, and that there was poor service on the phone. However, it is your choice to take the time to call and spend time on the phone with them. I don't see why they should compensate you for YOUR Time that YOU chose to spend on the phone.

Why they should give you anything, I am unsure. They didn't brick your phone, they didn't purposely run out of stock. I agree they should have been more forthcoming about the status from the get go, and they should have had some back-stock as it was clear the product was going to be a hot-seller.

That's just how I see it though.

It may not be Google's fault, but it is definitely their problem. They put their name on it. Its their support that are taking phone calls, not LG.

There were folks who ordered their Nexus 4s early last week after I had requested a replacement, and they already received their orders. Multiple accounts of people who were some of the first to order on Nov 27th, received 1-2 week shipping time frames, and are still waiting for their orders to ship. My shipping was estimated 2-3 weeks, and it shipped a week early. They have some serious out-of-order problems going on over there.

But anyway, I'm just sharing what my experience has been with Google and Android so far. I expect a lot of Google apologist in this thread defending them...so..whatever.

However, it is your choice to take the time to call and spend time on the phone with them. I don't see why they should compensate you for YOUR Time that YOU chose to spend on the phone.

Why is it unreasonable to you for me to call them to see what is going on with my replacement order? I only called after the date they specified I would receive shipping tracking on.

There were reports in November about some folks being refunded the full amount of the Nexus 4 and basically given the device for free over small RMA issues. Clearly now that was a publicity stunt. A small compensation for holding onto your customers money while they wait for a product is not too much to ask and not out of the ordinary for any respectable tech company. Google doesn't seem to fall into the 'respectable' category, it would seem...

I agree it's their problem, I wasn't defending them or apoligizing for them, they are a big company they can take care of themselves. I would be upset too, I just would know that they don't owe me anything outside of the replacement phone (they didn't take money and run). I have read about that (the shipping issues) and yea it isn't right.

I don't think it's unreasonable for you to call, as it IS your product. However it's your choice to make that phone call and I don't see why you should be given anything for that. I don't know of any company that gives out "freebies" while you wait for something.

I've ordered multiple products online and waited a month for some to arrive. I didn't get anything for it. They aren't "holding your money" you paid them for your product. They sent it, it broke, you sent it back so they are sending a new one. You really paid for the first one, they are giving you the second one as the first one broke quite rapidly.

And if this is your experience with Android, that sucks.. hopefully it picks up. I would take an Android phone over any other mobile OS any day of the week.

So you have at home the old Nexus 4 which is dead and they are sending you a new one? No charge and no asking for the old one back? Or am i missing something?

And isnt there any way to actually un-brick the phone?

I just can't wait to get my hands on mine.. Still waiting and have been given 15th of Jan as an estimate.. Hope it comes sooner though!

Sorry about your bad experience, hope mine doesn't brick.. maybe it was something to do with the image they pulled.. Who knows.

So you have at home the old Nexus 4 which is dead and they are sending you a new one? No charge and no asking for the old one back? Or am i missing something?

And isnt there any way to actually un-brick the phone?

Nah, I sent them back the bricked phone. Its no good to me at this point, lol... but I may have tried harder to unbrick it if I had known the delay to receive a replacement would be like this.

They currently have a $350 hold on my CC. According to their email that hold should disappear 8-10 days after they receive my defective Nexus 4 and confirm that it is an "under warranty" problem. I'm not sure what will happen if they decide for some reason not to honor their warranty. I'm not going to worry about that until Friday which is when their 10 days are up (they received the defective Nexus 4 last Wednesday).

I've ordered multiple products online and waited a month for some to arrive. I didn't get anything for it. They aren't "holding your money" you paid them for your product. They sent it, it broke, you sent it back so they are sending a new one. You really paid for the first one, they are giving you the second one as the first one broke quite rapidly.

I think they could have at least waited to put the $350 hold on my CC when the replacement Nexus 4 actually shipped. Its kind of a tight squeeze but hopefully that will be removed by the end of the week. I'm getting use to broken promises from Google, so nothing would surprise me either way.

But yes, they are "holding my money" because their policy is to hold an additional $350 until they determine that the defective Nexus 4 I sent back to them was their fault and not mine. Basically, they don't trust their customers and err on the side of caution. I understand there are scammers out there, doesn't change the fact that I don't like being treated like one.

Nah, I sent them back the bricked phone. Its no good to me at this point, lol... but I may have tried harder to unbrick it if I had known the delay to receive a replacement would be like this.

They currently have a $350 hold on my CC. According to their email that hold should disappear 8-10 days after they receive my defective Nexus 4 and confirm that it is an "under warranty" problem. I'm not sure what will happen if they decide for some reason not to honor their warranty. I'm not going to worry about that until Friday which is when their 10 days are up (they received the defective Nexus 4 last Wednesday).

O.k, did you try to unbrick and is it even possible to unbrick this device if such thing happens?

I'm waiting for my device to arrive, the ETA is tomorrow :)

I just can't wait to get my hands on mine.. Still waiting and have been given 15th of Jan as an estimate.. Hope it comes sooner though!

Sorry about your bad experience, hope mine doesn't brick.. maybe it was something to do with the image they pulled.. Who knows.

Yes, I read about them pulling the image off of the developer site. I wonder what that was about. Speculators thought it had something to do with LTE or something (I have no idea).

At least the Dan Cabley has come out and said something about what is going on in the UK. Google has been pretty silent on this whole thing here in the US.

O.k, did you try to unbrick and is it even possible to unbrick this device if such thing happens?

I'm waiting for my device to arrive, the ETA is tomorrow :)

Chances are yours will be fine. Most are fine. I doubt the defect is as wide spread as, say, the XBox 360 RRoD problem.

I'm not sure what would be possible. Mine got stuck at the "Google" boot screen and wouldn't move pass that. My wife has an EVO 4G and she recommended removing the battery as that is what she has to do sometimes in those situations. Not possible with the N4 though :(.

Others suggested downloading the Nexus 4 Tools and reflashing the device, but given the fact that I had JUST received the phone I definitely didn't want to do anything that could have affected my Warranty.

Its ok. I can wait. I really don't want any other phone on the market. I considered cancelling and asking for a refund on principle, but there isn't another phone I want right now so it looks like my only option is to wait it out.

Chances are yours will be fine. Most are fine. I doubt the defect is as wide spread as, say, the XBox 360 RRoD problem.

I'm not sure what would be possible. Mine got stuck at the "Google" boot screen and wouldn't move pass that. My wife has an EVO 4G and she recommended removing the battery as that is what she has to do sometimes in those situations. Not possible with the N4 though :(.

Others suggested downloading the Nexus 4 Tools and reflashing the device, but given the fact that I had JUST received the phone I definitely didn't want to do anything that could have affected my Warranty.

Its ok. I can wait. I really don't want any other phone on the market. I considered cancelling and asking for a refund on principle, but there isn't another phone I want right now so it looks like my only option is to wait it out.

I'm just thinking out loud here but instead of removing the battery could you just let the battery drain and then plug it again and see what happens?

And regarding reflashing the phone i think you can later just factory restore it and no one can know.

I'm just thinking out loud here but instead of removing the battery could you just let the battery drain and then plug it again and see what happens?

And regarding reflashing the phone i think you can later just factory restore it and no one can know.

It wasn't even booting into Recover Mode. I could get to the boot loader, and select from the various boot options. But the two boot options resulted the same: "Google" on the screen w/o any response even after leaving it there for 30 mins. Ah well, its in the past now.

I've heard that its not good to let an Lithium Ion battery drain completely. There is suppose to be a safety mechanism built into the battery that prevents discharge past 2% or w/e. A completely drained (0%) lithium ion battery could become permanently damaged and unable to hold a charge. If ever you store a lithium ion battery, or a device that has one it is recommended to keep about a 60-80% charge on it.

It wasn't even booting into Recover Mode. I could get to the boot loader, and select from the various boot options. But the two boot options resulted the same: "Google" on the screen w/o any response even after leaving it there for 30 mins. Ah well, its in the past now.

I've heard that its not good to let an Lithium Ion battery drain completely. There is suppose to be a safety mechanism built into the battery that prevents discharge past 2% or w/e. A completely drained (0%) lithium ion battery could become permanently damaged and unable to hold a charge. If ever you store a lithium ion battery, or a device that has one it is recommended to keep about a 60-80% charge on it.

Interesting... I didnt know that...

O.k, thanks for the info.

I don't think it's unreasonable for you to call, as it IS your product. However it's your choice to make that phone call and I don't see why you should be given anything for that. I don't know of any company that gives out "freebies" while you wait for something.

Idk. I think it would be a really good sign that they care about their customers if they gave something for the time and trouble. Perhaps a free orb charger (because I think everyone has given up on that ever coming out)? In the end their support lied to me twice. First they assured me that my order would be shipped last week, and it was not. And then they lied to me and said my box was ready to go and it was UPS fault for not picking it up.

They can offer me lies, but no compensation.

I'm just thinking out loud here but instead of removing the battery could you just let the battery drain and then plug it again and see what happens?

And regarding reflashing the phone i think you can later just factory restore it and no one can know.

Holding the power button does a reset. So no ..

That trick only worked on my father's iPhone 4

I feel for you, I do, but this is part of what happens when you buy a phone that's sold out. You said it yourself. You "defeated the play store boss". You and I don't have a clue how they have things set up. They could be shipping new phones directly from a factory, they could be shipping replacements from an office, perhaps they are out of replacements, even if people are getting new phones, that doesn't mean that's the process you have to go through to get a replacement and so it's not as simple as saying "well someone else got their phone already!". Sure, it makes it a little worse that they told you it would be shipped already, but again, you're talking about a phone that's sold out because the demand is so high. That's part of being an early adopter. If you need a replacement, it might not come as fast as you'd like. Why do you seem to think you're so entitled to get something free out of this? I can't see this as much more than a decision you made and there might be a few consequences that come with it. Next time wait until a phone is out and stock is abundant before purchasing and you probably won't have the issue. Like I said, I definitely feel for you, but that's just kinda how it goes when you are an early adopter.

They indicated that they are out of replacements. They said they set aside a number of replacements that should have statistically covered the replacement units that they had expected but that number was underestimated.

If their system was setup proper, they would have shipped mine prior to orders specified as 3-5 weeks last week. But I'm not only an early adopter of Nexus 4. I'm also apparently a beta tester for Google's whole device buying through the Google Play Store experience.

Like I said, I'm planning to just wait for my phone to arrive and hope their estimate (like the original shipping estimate) is being super conservative.

Am I entitled to compensation? Certainly not. But if Google smooths things over with me, I may consider buying their next device. As of now and how they've treated (especially with the lying to me about it being packaged and they are just waiting for UPS) I will probably never buy hardware from them again.

I've been an "early adopter" many times on Apple products and nothing near this much hassle. In fact the iPhone 4 I'm using now was an "early adopter" device and it is still working strong and the battery life is amazing even after 2 years.

But Apple is working on 30 years of experience. Any iPhone 5 user that has an issue would be in and out of an Apple Store with a replacement that day. You get what you pay for...you certainly get what it is you pay for.

This problem happens to all modern phones, has to do with a battery thing being broken :-P

Exact same thing happened to me and a friend before so it's not just the nexus 4 you're just very unlucky lol

It does seem to be a battery problem but I wouldn't touch an LG phone with a 10 foot pole. I've had nothing but problems with their phones.

I thought my very first cell phone which was a flip LG feature phone was a pretty solid device :D. I was excited that after all these years I was going to return to them. Hehe... oh well, now I know.

My LG phone has been awful. File for a return as soon as you receive the replacement. i have an LG G2x and it's a lot of trouble.

Otherwise, XDA has a thread titled: [Official] Play Store orders & shipping thread!

HTH - RETURN IT

My LG phone has been awful. File for a return as soon as you receive the replacement. i have an LG G2x and it's a lot of trouble.

Otherwise, XDA has a thread titled: [Official] Play Store orders & shipping thread!

HTH - RETURN IT

Damn. That is disheartening :(. Thanks for the honesty though. I think I'm going to hold out and see what I think about the quality of the replacement. At least some folks are saying they haven't had any problems with theirs. I'm hoping there is just an over-vocal minority of users who had problems (like me) who are blowing the problems out of proportion.

Thanks for the advice. I've thought about doing just that, but I'm worried I'm going to be charged a 15% restocking fee if I do. If I was dealing with any other company but Google, I wouldn't be worried about that 15% restocking fee at all. I know that I would be able to call them up, and they would see that it was perfectly reasonable to not charge me the 15% restocking fee given the hassle of it all.

I don't think that would be the case. I may call and ask them on Friday if they will charge a restocking fee...I'm still thinking about it. Their support staff left me with the impression that (1) they will say whatever they need to to get you off of the phone, even if untruthful or misleading (2) the supervisors have no real authority over the process at all. They are just supervisors for whoever they are supervising and can't go beyond the bounds of first tier support.

Their computer system will probably just add the 15% restock fee when they initiate a refund, they will say that they have no way to refund it, and that they apologize but if I review the information on the warranty card that came with my Nexus 4 I would know that already (essentially what they keep telling me).

I report this all back with a very heavy heart. If someone would have told me they had this kind of experience with Google a few months ago I would not have believed them...

But alas, I really liked the phone while it worked. I still think it is the phone I want. I don't have another phone in mind to get...I don't have a lot of money to spend and won't go on a 2-year contract plan postpaid network to get a discount on a phone. If the replacement phone comes in and turns out to suck, I'll refund it and just stick with my iPhone 4 for a few more months and see what hardware comes out. I wish smartphones weren't so stupid expensive in general. To me it seems like they are artificially set really high when compared to even 3G/LTE Tablets. Why is that?

I think you're taking it pretty well. Sure, I'd be a little annoyed by the phone malfunctioning so soon, but I can't stand getting told one thing by CS rep only to be told something a lot different on a follow-up call (unless it's a positive change). I know it's not always their fault - in some cases they probably don't have any more information than the general public - but you feel helpless when you need information you can't even trust what they're telling you.

I also would be frustrated with the $350 hold on the CC after already paying for the phone. That part doesn't even make sense to me. They've already charged you for the phone, but now that you need to return it they put a hold on an additional $350? I'd understand if they shipped the replacement right away without yet receiving the defective phone, but whatever... I hope your luck turns around soon.

In regards to smartphone prices, I think a lot of it has to do with subsidies from the carriers (at least in the US). Consumers don't really "feel" the true cost of the phone, so they just buy whatever phone they like for a huge discount and pay the rest as part of the phone bill without realizing it.

This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Posts

    • You've tried DuckDuckGo and Brave Search, now get serious with SearXNG by Paul Hill Over the last decade, it has become quite trendy to dump Google Search in favor of privacy-preserving alternatives such as DuckDuckGo, Startpage, and Brave Search. These search engines have done a very good job at highlighting dodgy practices by Google, such as adjusting search results based on what it thinks you’ll like (filter bubble) and stalking you around the web to advertise to you. While these search engines are good starting points when compared to non-private services like Google, there are still quite a few issues with them. For example, both DuckDuckGo and Brave Search require running non-free JavaScript in your web browser, which is comparable to running proprietary software on your computer, meaning you can be sure about what it’s actually doing in the background. Another issue is that these search engines are hosted on the respective companies’ servers, and you are using a service that you don’t control. Finally, DuckDuckGo, while offering privacy features, relies heavily on Microsoft’s infrastructure for its results and, in the past, has permitted Microsoft tracking scripts. If you are looking for a more private search solution than DuckDuckGo, Brave Search, and Startpage, then I recommend taking a look at SearXNG. It is a privacy-respecting metasearch engine that can be used via different public instances, which is useful for mobile users, or you can install it on your computer or server and run it locally with maximum control. Unlike Google, Bing, or Brave Search, which crawl the web and have their own search indexes, SearXNG is a metasearch engine, meaning it taps other search engines, stripping your identifying data, such as IP address, user agent, and cookies, in the process. Your search query is sent to the other search engines you enable before aggregating the results. SearXNG has deployment flexibility. If you are a casual user or a mobile user and don’t want to run SearXNG locally, you can use a public instance that is hosted by someone else. The main problem with this is that you are putting trust in the maintainer of the instance regarding stuff like logs that they may keep; good hosts should have a privacy policy explaining their policies. If you are trying to use SearXNG, you can also install the software on your device and then head to 127.0.0.1:8080 in your browser and search from there. While you don’t have to worry about a third-party admin like the public instances, search engines could ultimately block your IP address if they frown on you pulling in their search results locally. If you want to run it locally, it’s a good idea to use proxies or VPNs to hide your actual IP. You don’t have to worry about this with a public instance, as search engines never see your IP address. The main privacy benefit of using SearXNG is that it isolates your identity from the underlying engines that it’s capable of searching, such as Google and Bing. These search engines will only see requests coming from a generic server, so they can’t profile you and create a bubble filter that influences what results you see. This also ensures that your search engine doesn’t turn into an echo chamber that prevents you from reading alternative points of view. As a free software project, you are allowed to inspect SearXNG to make sure there are no negative features bundled inside. This sets it apart from the privacy search engines mentioned earlier because you can’t check their source code. As a meta search engine, you are not restricted to getting results from one source. Due to the fact that it scrapes content from other websites, your SearXNG instance will periodically get blocked from different providers, so it’s good to select a range of sources as a backup. While enabling all of the services will give you great results, this can make searching slower. I am personally happy with slower searches for the best results, but you can always check which providers are slowing down your search from the search results page and disable them to speed things up. If you want decent results quickly, enable the main search providers such as Google, Brave, DuckDuckGo, Qwant, Bing, and Yahoo. This way, you get wide coverage without the latency. On the Engines tab in Preferences, do note that there are different tabs, such as General, Images, and Videos, with their own providers that can be toggled and are not covered by "Enable all" while on the General tab, so be sure to dig into each. Just a note, if you want to enable everything, press "Enable all" in one tab, then hit save at the bottom of the page, then do the next tab, and so on. If you press "Enable all", then do that in each tab, and then save, nothing will stick. When I had just some of the search engines enabled, I searched “define nefarious” and results came back with the definition of “define” - obviously that was a sucky result. However, when I had everything enabled, it found dictionary pages for the word “nefarious” and even had an inline definition on the sidebar, which is quite nice too - that was delivered by WolframAlpha for anyone wondering! Probably the worst thing about this meta search engine is that the engines you select are saved with a cookie, so you must enable them on every new device you use SearXNG on, including if you decide to go into incognito mode with your web browser. Honestly, I would say this is the most annoying aspect, and perhaps if your browser lets you choose a separate private browsing search engine, then it would be best to use DuckDuckGo for this portion of your browsing. Another weakness of SearXNG is the random blocking of it by search providers. When you are on the results page, expand the “Response time” box, and it will show things like “Suspended: too many requests” or “access denied”. This is why it is good to enable several providers so that there is always a fallback to get results from. I won’t pretend SearXNG will be for everyone, however, if you enable all of the providers and put up with the slower response time, the results can be really amazing. Even if you don’t want to use it as your daily driver, keeping a bookmark handy that links to it is a good idea if you ever feel like doing a deep dive into a niche topic where other search engines are just failing to bring up any good result, due to the amount of sources it looks on. If you’re interested in radical user control over the software you use, installing SearXNG locally can also be a good idea, but be prepared to be temporarily blocked from sites if you trigger bot sensors without a VPN. Personally, I’ve opted to use a public instance, rather than install it myself. If you want to use it via a public instance, head over to searx.space to find a provider. Let us know in the comments if you have used SearXNG or its predecessor, Searx. What do you think about the quality of the results?
    • Dear Neowin, If it is not too much trouble, can you start using the new-ish designations for Insider Preview? "Experimental" is different than "former Dev" as it can apply to different models, eg 26H1 or 26H2 etc, right? No need to seed confusion IMHO. And, please "finally" update your graphics. OK?
    • Did you see their FAQ, its quite good. Have a look in the Advanced section. https://delta.chat/en/help
    • Just install Linux Mint that is a real blessing and many times cheaper because you can continue using your old Windows computer/laptop with the latest Linux updates.
    • Interesting share -- however it does not make sense: Email messages get stored somewhere, so how is Delta Chat "based on email" and decentralized without actually storing anything? By Web3 standard practices, the various Relays would require dedicated storage to make messages available to the recipients (like a large series of message queue channels, akin to racks of traditional post office boxes)... and Contacts must be two-way confirmed in order for encryption keys to be exchanged (ostensibly every key-pair is uniquely bound between sender and recipient) and the Relays would preserve the public keys in order to facilitate message carriage... or every device stores all sorts of keys and contact info. All of this to say, decentralized messaging is like running Bluesky nodes except instead of discovering/browsing public feeds by various posters (at the given node) these Delta Chats would be relaying encrypted messages (via Relays) that only trusted recipients would have the appropriate decryption key (their own private key) to read it. But this doesn't solve the "it's like email" sales pitch. The only way it's like email is that there's encrypted binary stuff being transported from your app into the federated ether of Delta Chat Relays for others to decrypt (hopefully only the intended recipient)... but outside of this federated relays framework, it is absolutely nothing like email.
  • Recent Achievements

    • Week One Done
      Woland13 earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • One Month Later
      Woland13 earned a badge
      One Month Later
    • One Year In
      bernmeister earned a badge
      One Year In
    • Week One Done
      Scoobystu earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • Week One Done
      tuben earned a badge
      Week One Done
  • Popular Contributors

    1. 1
      +primortal
      502
    2. 2
      +Edouard
      226
    3. 3
      PsYcHoKiLLa
      158
    4. 4
      Steven P.
      75
    5. 5
      FloatingFatMan
      71
  • Tell a friend

    Love Neowin? Tell a friend!