Windows 8 Falls Behind Even the Maligned Vista

By Rickkins
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Grand Master

n_K

Posted
Posted

W8 being what is it, a fifth of the price of what W7 or Vista were? And it's still doing bad.

Don't blame this for not including christmas shopping.

It's not selling well because it's not selling well.

Grand Master

xendrome

Posted
Posted

While it may well be usable with a mouse and keyboard, it was designed for touch.

Actually it was designed for both and studies have shown it to be more accurate when using it with a mouse/keyboard - http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2011/10/04/designing-the-start-screen.aspx

That link is a very good read if you would like to take the time to educate yourself on the what and why's of how the design was planned.

Grand Master

Lord Method Man

Posted
Posted

Personally, I hit WinKey, type what I want and get what I want.

E.g.

WinKey, type DNS, hit enter, I get a DNS console.

WinKey, type powershell ise, hit enter, I get a Powershell ISE.

WinKey, type steam, hit enter and I get my games.

It's fantastic.

Never before has Windows listened to me.

How people cannot want this? I don't know.

In other words, just like Vista and 7.

Experienced

Rickkins

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Actually it was designed for both and studies have shown it to be more accurate when using it with a mouse/keyboard - http://blogs.msdn.co...art-screen.aspx

That link is a very good read if you would like to take the time to educate yourself on the what and why's of how the design was planned.

Yes, sure, those involved in the development will surely have the courage of their convictions, but you can't seriously offer that up as proof of anything.

Mentor

+LightEco Subscriber²

Posted
  • Subscriber²
Posted

Personally, I hit WinKey, type what I want and get what I want.

WinKey, type DNS, hit enter, I get a DNS console.

WinKey, type powershell ise, hit enter, I get a Powershell ISE.

WinKey, type steam, hit enter and I get my games.

It's fantastic.

Never before has Windows listened to me.

How people cannot want this? I don't know.

The issue is that this was the same in 7, better in fact. In 7 you only had to type "powershell" and it would show PowerShell AND the ise, in 8, you must fully type "powershell ise" perfectly for it to be even an option. On top of that, in 7, the ise link was the actual program, in 8 its actually a PowerShell script that launches the ise, increasing startup time (not by much, but its noticeable).

Another fun example is Windows Remote Assistance. I use this a lot with my parents and in 7, I simply had them type "remote assistance" and it would show up as "Windows Remote Assistance", in 8, you can still type that, but now its hidden under "settings" (even though its technically an app) and its called "Invite someone you know to connect to your PC and help you, or help someone else". How does that make any sense?

I just don't understand how the awesome search in 7 is now terrible in 8. Example - 7 - start + "power options" + enter = Power Options vs 8 - start + "power options" + enter = nothing, I have to add two down keys and then hit enter now. Its annoying.

I'm all for progressing Windows to fit the new era of computing, but not when it comes with the price of a loss of functionality and ease of use.

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

Yes, sure, those involved in the development will surely have the courage of their convictions, but you can't seriously offer that up as proof of anything.

Well if you actually used it, you would see that not only does the start screen work better than the start menu. it actually works better with a mouse than with touch.

And since I use Win8 regularly and I've have tried it on touch devices, and have one available to me pretty much every day. and from reading your previous posts, you have never used win8, you have barely seen screenshots of it, most of your win8 claims are outright wrong.

The point however is that the UI was designed for both touch and mouse and works great on both.

HEck it's funny seeing self proclaimed power users saying it's unusable for power users, when it's power users who probably can make the most out of the start screen as a more powerful and faster and more efficient launcher. But that would require actually trying it and using it and admitting that they where wrong, something these people aren't very good at, especially the admitting they're wrong part.

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Grand Master

Aergan

Posted
Posted

In other words, just like Vista and 7.

No, this version actually works and fetches what, not spend random amounts of time doing FA then return either the wrong thing or random library files.

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

The issue is that this was the same in 7, better in fact. In 7 you only had to type "powershell" and it would show PowerShell AND the ise, in 8, you must fully type "powershell ise" perfectly for it to be even an option.

And this is another example of someone who hasn't used 8, and comes with wild and outright wrong claims. another one of the popular win 8 myths. this one keeps being repetaed all over in various forms. and always completely wrong.

Grand Master

Detection

Posted
Posted

Touch & Mouse are pretty much the same thing in the Metro UI, except for the swipe from the side actions, what you do with the mouse, you would do with your finger, difference is, with the mouse, you don't need to move your arm / hand anywhere near as much

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

Another fun example is Windows Remote Assistance. I use this a lot with my parents and in 7, I simply had them type "remote assistance" and it would show up as "Windows Remote Assistance", in 8, you can still type that, but now its hidden under "settings" (even though its technically an app) and its called "Invite someone you know to connect to your PC and help you, or help someone else". How does that make any sense?

Think abotu it from your parents POV, which ones makes more sense, Remote assistance that could mean anything, in fact it sounds more like you are connecting to someone else, or the actual text that says you are inviting someone to help you.

And typing both remote, invite and any number of variations will give you the "invite someone..." option in the search list, so...

Touch & Mouse are pretty much the same thing in the Metro UI, except for the swipe from the side actions, what you do with the mouse, you would do with your finger, difference is, with the mouse, you don't need to move your arm / hand anywhere near as much

Right clicking is a lot better than the hold function with touch though. organizing is also a lot easier with mouse.

Mentor

+LightEco Subscriber²

Posted
  • Subscriber²
Posted

And this is another example of someone who hasn't used 8, and comes with wild and outright wrong claims. another one of the popular win 8 myths. this one keeps being repetaed all over in various forms. and always completely wrong.

Ya, I haven't used 8 at all. I've been running on all my computers since the CP. Even at work. :rolleyes:

I just tested my "outright wrong claim" too. Typing just "powershell" in start does not show the ISE. I have to type "powershell ise" for it to show up as a link to a powershell script that launches the ISE.

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Grand Master

linsook

Posted
Posted

Ya, I haven't used 8 at all. I've been running on all my computers since the CP. Even at work. :rolleyes:

I just tested my "outright wrong claim" too. Typing just "powershell" in start does not show the ISE. I have to type "powershell ise" for it to show up as a link to a powershell script that launches the ISE.

didn't even press 'w' yet.. nvm i see what you mean now.

JGkIF.png

Grand Master

Lord Method Man

Posted
Posted

No, this version actually works and fetches what, not spend random amounts of time doing FA then return either the wrong thing or random library files.

No, what you described is how Windows 7 search function works, and as LightEco has mentioned it doesn't even work as well in 8.

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Grand Master

trek

Posted
Posted

Think abotu it from your parents POV, which ones makes more sense, Remote assistance that could mean anything, in fact it sounds more like you are connecting to someone else, or the actual text that says you are inviting someone to help you.

And typing both remote, invite and any number of variations will give you the "invite someone..." option in the search list, so...

When they have the Son on the phone and he says "open Remote Assistance", the non-retard would expect to click on something that says "Remote Assistance" and not some long rambling sentence.

Also, nice selective quote. What about his point on the Power Options applet?

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Grand Master

xendrome

Posted
Posted

I just tested my "outright wrong claim" too. Typing just "powershell" in start does not show the ISE. I have to type "powershell ise" for it to show up as a link to a powershell script that launches the ISE.

That's because it isn't a shortcut, pin powershell ISE to your startmenu, then you can just do Winkey and type ISE and enter

didn't even press 'w' yet.

he's talking about powershell ISE not just powershell

Mentor

+LightEco Subscriber²

Posted
  • Subscriber²
Posted

didn't even press 'w' yet.

Thanks, just about to post that myself. As you can clearly see only PowerShell is shown, the PowerShell ISE is not an option. You need to fully type "powershell ise" for it to show that link.

That's because it isn't a shortcut, pin powershell ISE to your startmenu, then you can just do Winkey and type ISE and enter

You are correct, but why in 7 did it work just fine without needing to be pinned? Why the loss of functionality? I only nag on this because I use the ISE daily at work (I've since pinned it to my taskbar, but its the perfect example of a literal harder to use scenario)

Grand Master

trek

Posted
Posted

Thanks, just about to post that myself. As you can clearly see only PowerShell is shown, the PowerShell ISE is not an option. You need to fully type "powershell ise" for it to show that link.

Does it show Powershell ISE by typing only 'ise' like it does in 7?

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

what about the power options ? for one I always go to power options by rigth clicking the battery icon, but I could also use the power menu by right clicking the lower left corner.

and if I was searching for it, I'll gladly sacrifice that oh so horrible single down arrow click to separate application searches from settings searches and files searches. it's a MUCH better system.

and no, the dumb user, in this case parent, doesn't expect anything.

"click the winkey and write remote, and click down arrow once"

"Oh I see this thing that says invite someone to help you"

"yeah click that".

Grand Master

Hum

Posted
Posted

Windows 8 is rubbish and so are the drivers for it. I don't need any flaming it just my opinion.

I don't know about Win 8 being rubbish, but I simply see no advantage in buying it.

I wouldn't be doing anything better or faster. ;)

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Mentor

+LightEco Subscriber²

Posted
  • Subscriber²
Posted

what about the power options ? for one I always go to power options by rigth clicking the battery icon, but I could also use the power menu by right clicking the lower left corner.

and if I was searching for it, I'll gladly sacrifice that oh so horrible single down arrow click to separate application searches from settings searches and files searches. it's a MUCH better system.

and no, the dumb user, in this case parent, doesn't expect anything.

"click the winkey and write remote, and click down arrow once"

"Oh I see this thing that says invite someone to help you"

"yeah click that".

Yes you can still get to the things you need, however Windows 8 has made getting there a more difficult experience. I actually like the new Start menu, but its just these little annoyances that kill the experience for me. Death by a 1,000 cuts or in this case an extra step here, an confusing rewording there, etc.

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

Yes you can still get to the things you need, however Windows 8 has made getting there a more difficult experience. I actually like the new Start menu, but its just these little annoyances that kill the experience for me. Death by a 1,000 cuts or in this case an extra step here, an confusing rewording there, etc.

How are things more difficult to get to ?

the power user tools are all on the right click power menu. so they only thing that's actually harder to get to is the shutdown, which anti 8 people keeps pulling up. which is funny since it's a function that's at MOST for the average person used once a day. and for the more techie users often never, and for the average user with a laptop, also never since they just close the lid. heck most of them are to dumb to check that the laptop has gone to sleep/shutdown before they put it in a bag.

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