official SimCity (2013)

[HawkMan]

Earthquake is unlocked by mining a certain amount of coal/ore.

It's title is a quote from Lord of the Rings, but I forgot what it was D:

Also, not playing until I can have cheetah mode back >.>

I had cheetah mode all day yesterday, when I coudl play the day before, and when I played this morning....

The size of the city is very frustrating, I hate to remove population to place government buildings, and they're a lot! If you use most of them you'll end taking up to 30-40% of the city just in government buildings :pinch:

Each city isn't supposed to have everything.

[djdanster]

I had cheetah mode all day yesterday, when I coudl play the day before, and when I played this morning....

For me, I can click to go to cheetah speed but it will only go as fast as the middle speed.

[DrakeN2k]

same ^^^

[PGHammer]

same ^^^

That is due to Patch 1.2.

[nub]

http://www.amazon.com/Electronic-Arts-41018ted-Edition2-SimCity/product-reviews/B007VTVRFA/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

Look at all those 1 stars

[+Warwagon MVC]

So do the pirates have this problem? Can they download the game off the net, patch it and play it locally without connecting to a server?

[djdanster]

So do the pirates have this problem? Can they download the game off the net, patch it and play it locally without connecting to a server?

No pirate version out ATM if I'm looking in the correct places.

[Elliot B.]

http://www.amazon.co...howViewpoints=1

Look at all those 1 stars

http://www.amazon.com/review/R2MC4X10C5KZFO/ref=cm_cr_pr_perm?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B007VTVRFA&linkCode=&nodeID=&tag=:

You'd think I'd be mega unhappy like everyone else at the constant waiting and lack of actually being able to play a game I purchased.

Well, you'd be wrong.

The hours upon hours since launch that I haven't been able to log in, whether it be sitting in queues, or server busy messages, or just plain old not working screens, I've managed to do a heap of things that I never do when I'm locked in my man cave playing video games.

I've washed the dishes, the laundry, changed the oil in the car, mopped the floors, dusted, did a spot of gardening, greeted my children who I hadn't really seen since Christmas, walked the dog, asked how my wife's day has been and listened to the entire response, restocked the groceries and many more things! My family has never been happier that they've got a father and husband again.

In fact, I feel like Simcity has given me a new lease on life. This wouldn't have been possible without the seemingly crazy decision to have constant online connections and server side save points even for single player.

So I can only thank EA and Maxis. Your failures have been my rewards. 5 stars!

:rofl:

[+Warwagon MVC]

Ya they deserve to burn in hell. This is soooo ****ing stupid, to buy a game and then have to connect to a server to play, especially for a game like sim city. When will this company ever learn.

[djdanster]

I'm able to log into a server with no issue and play inside my region, but after about an hour it'll kick me out after the "attempting to connect to SimCity Servers" message in the top left corner times out (after 10 minutes).

Anybody else facing an issue when they go to invite their friends in regions, none of them show up? Even though they are playing the game.... and right next to me :p

[PGHammer]

So do the pirates have this problem? Can they download the game off the net, patch it and play it locally without connecting to a server?

No - and they are feeling rather frustrated about it.

This isn't Crysis 3, folks (which, quite aside from the DRM, is completely playable offline). Even SImcity's Sandbox uses the server connection for background computation (not for DRM, but so the CPU isn't bogged and runs like crap) - it relies more on the background stuff than Diablo III (which has STILL not been for cracked for offline play).

What's more, just going by the posts on Simtropolis, EA's own Simcity forums, and other places (including the pirate sites, oddly enough), EA is proving itself right that it needs the back-end server (which are provided by Amazon's EC2 Services - not directly by EA) for non-DRM-related purposes. The rage now is basically down to the usual resentment of needing an online connection for ANY reason.

[scaramonga]

The rage now is basically down to the usual resentment of needing an online connection for ANY reason.

Yes, and why? ;)

[articuno1au]

No - and they are feeling rather frustrated about it.

This isn't Crysis 3, folks (which, quite aside from the DRM, is completely playable offline). Even SImcity's Sandbox uses the server connection for background computation (not for DRM, but so the CPU isn't bogged and runs like crap) - it relies more on the background stuff than Diablo III (which has STILL not been for cracked for offline play).

What's more, just going by the posts on Simtropolis, EA's own Simcity forums, and other places (including the pirate sites, oddly enough), EA is proving itself right that it needs the back-end server (which are provided by Amazon's EC2 Services - not directly by EA) for non-DRM-related purposes. The rage now is basically down to the usual resentment of needing an online connection for ANY reason.

bull****..

The rage is because people can't play their games and that the reason they can't play their games is to stop piracy.. Something which the people who bought the games clearly weren't going to do anyway..

[spacer]

The servers only process saves, the global market, friends list, achievements, client action validation, and region-level statistics like pollution and inter-town dependencies. Most of those things are multi-player only, and are not needed for single player. The saves are already being stored on the client, and are only uploaded to the server every 10 minutes or so when client talks to the server. The client validation is the piece of this whole mess that is causing the server issues since the game came out. That's why they decided to remove cheetah speed.

Maxis' claim that they can't come up with an offline patch is completely false. Everything required for single player only games is already being done on the client machines. The only thing stopping the game from working is the periodic check with the server. That's why the game functions just fine in the interim between syncs. (if you disconnect after a sync, your game will play just fine until the next automatic sync)

Maxis really just needs to come clean at this point and support offline play. Their continued insistence that their current model is fine is just getting sad.

[PGHammer]

Yes, and why? ;)

You went right PAST my comment about extra computational power - instead, you are all het up on DRM.

Look at Amazon EC2 and what their PRIMARY reason for being is - on-demand cloud-based computational power. EC2 is basically the FOSS version of Microsoft's own Azure Services.

It is Amazon (via EC2) that is supplying the extra servers (and computational oomph) to EA.

Simulating a background marketplace (which is included in the Sandbox mode) locally is NOT a small task; doing so for just a single three-city region would bog down an i7 - let alone an i5 -turning the game into a hyperniche game (and that is with NO online at all). Do you want an unplayable game?

Notice that I did NOT say that DRM was not part of the reason for online; however, it's not even the largest part of why the online connectivity is a big thing. Cloud-based computational services (such as EC2 and Azure Services) did not even EXIST when SC4 launched! Now both are practically commodity resources. However, GlassBoxEngine is really the first commercial product to leverage background computation in the consumer space. It is showing up when there are connectivity issues between the client and the cloud/server - the game bogs down according to ALL reportage to date. Having a background cloud-based computational engine means there is MUCH less work the front-end (the client) HAS to do - the idea behind it to make things available that a single PC could not do at all - let alone the average PC.

Still, this is a "1.0" product - and as has been the case with ALL 1.0 products, there are issues at launch. However, adding additional compute engines is actually licking those issues (comments in this very thread are evidence of that).

A cracked version of this game won't have the access to the EC2 cloud for additional compute power - how badly will performance tank as a result? Could that in fact be the fly in the potion? (I'm talking about in terms of developing a crack.)

I HAVE SimCity 4 (Deluxe Edition) and the fully-updated and CURRENT CitiesXL Platinum installed on my computer (along with SimCity 3000, and even the GOG version of SC2000). NONE are the equivalent of even the deliberately-hobbled closed betas of SimCity before the launch - let alone even where the game is today - problems and all. And I am pretty sure that most - if not all - of you still complaining are well aware of that.

There's a LOT more to needing an online connection than DRM - especially with compute engines as a service now being not merely a possibility, but being available today.

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

The whole "It runs on the server!" was in response to people complaining about the DRM, it doesn't actually simulate the city on the server.

[Luc2k]

snip

This seems like a ridiculous notion. I haven't heard of a game not being able run due to lack of CPU power (provident it's not some low end). Sure, if cracked, it won't do all the online stuff (if any) the original does, but it won't need too.

[PGHammer]

The whole "It runs on the server!" was in response to people complaining about the DRM, it doesn't actually simulate the city on the server.

However it DOES use OTHER server-side (as in not on the PC) resources - which is actually the BIGGER reason why online connectivity is a biggie. Also, city location (and region location) is *entirely* server-based, as it turns out (too many cases of cities going away when you change servers).

The availability of compute engine resources as services (such as EC2 and Azure Services) is starting to filter down to where it impacts the average user, and, like it or not, GlassBox is part of the impact.

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

However it DOES use OTHER server-side (as in not on the PC) resources - which is actually the BIGGER reason why online connectivity is a biggie. Also, city location (and region location) is *entirely* server-based, as it turns out (too many cases of cities going away when you change servers).

The availability of compute engine resources as services (such as EC2 and Azure Services) is starting to filter down to where it impacts the average user, and, like it or not, GlassBox is part of the impact.

That's just because they (for some stupid reason) tied regions to specific servers. If you start a game on NA East 2, it won't show up if you connect to NA East 1, etc.

The only server side computation done is on inter city affects, like one city polluting another. But that's based purely off city statistics, not an actual simulation (We know this because it's currently broken, producing random air pollution in clean regions, etc.).

[articuno1au]

Sorry Pghammer, you're on the wrong side of that one..

I'm also seeing some fun issues with my playmates water supplies (I'm having to buy some water/sewerage) randomly going offline.. Always awesome because it completely ****s me -_-

[neo1911]

To those people here who are defending the online play and giving pathetic reasons as to why online connection is needed:

Since we have ruled out DRM as the problem, I totally blame this disaster on Maxis due to design fault. They deserve this and will get no sympathies as more and more people become aware of the real cause.

I don't see a reason as to why a core i3 to core i5 cannot compute the simulation. Were they so ahead of themselves that they totally forgot that internet by tap is still not here? Not especially when one is traveling.

This entire fiasco must have impacted them in sales more than some casual Securom and serial key based piracy. More over, it has hurt them and EA where it matters most. THEIR REPUTATION.

[scaramonga]

I agree with the above, but Maxis only exists in 'name', nothing else. EA, dictates, rules, and tells them/us otherwise. Maxis, if it could, would go tell EA to take a flying ****, and more so now I guess, but it cant, and wont, as EA has its greedy little claws around their neck also, they made sure of that quite some time ago.

[PGHammer]

This seems like a ridiculous notion. I haven't heard of a game not being able run due to lack of CPU power (provident it's not some low end). Sure, if cracked, it won't do all the online stuff (if any) the original does, but it won't need too.

The reason why it seems ridiculous is an understandable one - remember that I pointed out that EC2 and Azure didn't even exist a decade ago.

And consider how big the database can get for a simple three-city Sandbox region.

Then there is *seeming complexity* vs. *real complexity* - look at CitiesXL (in the current fully-updated form). It's basically a cross between SimCity 3000 Unlimited and SimCity 4; none of the three is half as complex as either closed beta of the current SC is (and all three betas were, as we all know, deliberately hobbled). I played in the first two closed betas of SimCity, and have all three of the games I named CURRENTLY installed - the SC betas were far more complex, even with the game basically hobbled severely.

Then there is what I did before I first was exposed to ANY version of SimCity - database programming. Mere *spreadsheet databases* (Excel or 1-2-3) can get really complex - what about bigger ones, such as what it would take to simulate even a medium-sized TOWN (example I'll give is Morningside, Maryland - it's a real town outside the main gate of Joint Forces Base Andrews in my home state of Maryland, between the base itself and the larger town of Suitland). Morningside doesn't even have a thousand residents - however, each resident represents one or more (usually many more) elements in the simulation database that represents the town. The town grows, and so does the database the represents the town. During the two closed betas, I was able to create a 20K-resident city with no problem at all - in less than an hour. (And that is at the LOW end of the scale.) I can't do that in CitiesXL, or either previous version of SimCity - not from scratch - it takes quite a bit longer - and on the same hardware. And I've made plain that none are as complex as even the hobbled SC betas were. So where is the complexity coming from?

I have EVERY reason to believe that the simulation databases themselves largely run as background tasks (especially anything dealing with intercity movements - such as a Sim leaving Morningside to work in Suitland from my example above) and on the server. Anything that can get farmed to the background (and better yet, off the PC) is that much less the PC has to worry about - that makes rich gaming more accessible to more users with average - if not sub-average - hardware.

Lastly, there is EC2 (the service) itself. Sure - it can do file hosting, and even host entire Web sites. However, it is designed to be, first and foremost, a database/compute engine as a service - basically, computer power on-demand that eats databases (like the ancient machine in the Star Trek TV series episode "Doomsday Machine" would eat phasers and photon torpedoes as snacks - the destruction of the USS Constellation worked because THAT much energy not only was too much - which made it vomit - it also blew all its fuses, forcing it to shut down). Unlike the "Doomsday Machine" EC2 the Database Machine has a far bigger stomach - in fact, it has untapped digestive capacity it can bring to bear on databases. Big databases. Downright monstrous databases. (In fact, one of the largest EC2 customers - in the United States - has been the National Nuclear Security Administration; they leverage the EC2 Database Machine for nuclear weapon=related modelling simulations.) And by having the computer equivalent of scutwork done outside the client PC, the client can focus on more important (to the user) tasks.

That really came home when I saw the complaints of what happened when connectivity got compromised well outside the local network. I'd seen this before in terms of database operations, and there is generally one reason for it OTHER than a sloppily-written database - compute-engine starvation. (Basically, lack of resources.) Without that big background Database Machine to chew up the scutwork, that means the game has to rely on local resources - which are invariably capped.

And when a game bogs down, it affects gameplay negatively. Massively negatively.

Hence the issues with the launch - EA/Maxis made the Database Machine service appetite too little. (That is what the contract for EC2 is -- a bounding limit as to how much appetite EC2 is allowed to bring to bear.)

[spaceelf]

To those people here who are defending the online play and giving pathetic reasons as to why online connection is needed:

I don't have anything against online play and have already had craploads of fun with SimCity. It makes sense to process the regional interaction on the server since it affects more than one city often among more than one player, I believe resources at the trade market are also exported server wide. I don't know what all is actually done on the server, though.

Everything's almost fixed. Once they take down and patch up the original servers we can all get on with our lives.

http://www.simcity.com/en_US/blog/article/simcity-update-2

[spaceelf]

The reason why it seems ridiculous is an understandable one - remember that I pointed out that EC2 and Azure didn't even exist a decade ago.

I don't know if SC uses EC2 or not, but I do know Origin does.