opinion Microsoft really screwed up! *IMO*

[freak180]

Microsoft really messed up here. Surely most of you saw my comments and probably assume I?m some PS fanboy. But let me explain where I stand as well as my opinion on the matter.  This whole thing honestly reminds me of Windows 8 and how they force changed upon consumers. I?m starting to think they really don't know what they're doing. Yes they corrected their mistake with Windows 8 with the Windows 8.1 update but with Xbox one they appear a bit desperate because of their policy changes today. I honestly believe they didn?t think things through like they did with Windows 8.1. Instead of finding the middle ground they immediately went with the majority of people who wanted DRM removed and without thinking about the other side.


So what do we have now? A newer gen Xbox 360 with all these cute TV features and no new gaming features. Between the 3 new Gen consoles the Xbox One really stood out to me mainly because all of these features. Xbox one could have simply kept the family plan for digital content and the shared library feature as well as allow used games. Which would require people to not be force to installed games to the hard drive if bought as disc. That way users can see the advantages of using digital content. It makes no sense to remove it completely like some of you might think it being a wise decision. We still have CDs for music and Blu-rays are still around. Perhaps in the next 4 or 6 years, yes I can see this happening. Clearly it is not time to remove disc just yet. Instead of thinking things through Microsoft obviously pulled a desperate maneuver due to the Sony E3 Conference.

In conclusion. Don't blame fans who wanted choice. Blame your precious Microsoft for their arrogance and greed for not allowing choice and middle ground. This pathetic attempt to beat Sony only made things worst IMO. Now we have people who feel screwed over and fans who feel that the new Xbox is nothing special now that its features have been stripped away.  We lost features, so do you feel that it?s worth the 500$ anymore? I don?t. I usually don't write things like this but I felt like I had to get this off my chest. 

[The Evil Overlord]

Ok great, but why not use the soapbox for this?

I'd ask a mod to move it to the soapbox before the thread gets closed

(Feel free to ask for this comment to be removed also, I only wished to give a heads up, and not rain on your parade)

[~Nikhil~]

:s dem wall of text...

[abecedarian paradoxious]

You sound more EMO than IMHO.

 

[jerryspringfield]Here's a razor.[/jerryspringfield]

[freak180]

:s dem wall of text...

Sorry I wrote it in word.

You sound more EMO than IMHO.

 

[jerryspringfield]Here's a razor.[/jerryspringfield]

And...here comes the trolls  :laugh:

[The Evil Overlord]

Come on guys, he just wanted to sound off, it's was probably more for him just to get it off his chest, be nice

The world's messed up enough as it is.

[Ian W]

Microsoft is always damned if they retain something that people don't like, and damned if they don't.

[freak180]

Come on guys, he just wanted to sound off, it's was probably more for him just to get it off his chest, be nice

The world's messed up enough as it is.

Thanks for understanding. It's been on my mind for the past couple of hours so I figure I write about it :)

Microsoft is always damned if they retain something that people don't like, and damned if they don't.

Well they manage to get Windows 7 right after Vista so I still have hope.

[The Evil Overlord]

Thanks for understanding. It's been on my mind for the past couple of hours so I figure I write about it :)

NP :)

[Ian W]

Thanks for understanding. It's been on my mind for the past couple of hours so I figure I write about it :)

Well they manage to get Windows 7 right after Vista so I still have hope.

Oh, you're one of those people? :P

Not sure where they got Vista wrong; a lot of the features almost everyone raves about were introduced in that operating system: Instant Search, Windows Aero, scalable icons, etc.

Anyway, sorry for going off-topic. I did not like a lot of what they were trying to propose with the Xbox One, but by changing course, they lost a good amount of innovations.

[freak180]

Oh, you're one of those people? :p

Not sure where they got Vista wrong; a lot of the features almost everyone raves about were introduced in that operating system: Instant Search, Windows Aero, scalable icons, etc.

Anyway, sorry for going off-topic. I did not like a lot of what they were trying to propose with the Xbox One, but by changing course, they lost a good amount of innovations.

I have nothing against Vista. Honestly I really liked it :shiftyninja: and it ran great on my system. Its sad that a lot of people saw the same features in 7 and were like WOW I like this feature (Start search) a lot....but it debuted in Vista :pinch:

I completely agree. I didnt like how they were going and being arrogant about it did not help either. I still hope they are working on new features for launch which both parties can be happy with. 

[Brandon Live Veteran]

Microsoft really messed up here. Surely most of you saw my comments and probably assume I?m some PS fanboy. But let me explain where I stand as well as my opinion on the matter.  This whole thing honestly reminds me of Windows 8 and how they force changed upon consumers. I?m starting to think they really don't know what they're doing. Yes they corrected their mistake with Windows 8 with the Windows 8.1 update but with Xbox one they appear a bit desperate because of their policy changes today. I honestly believe they didn?t think things through like they did with Windows 8.1. Instead of finding the middle ground they immediately went with the majority of people who wanted DRM removed and without thinking about the other side.

So what do we have now? A newer gen Xbox 360 with all these cute TV features and no new gaming features. Between the 3 new Gen consoles the Xbox One really stood out to me mainly because all of these features. Xbox one could have simply kept the family plan for digital content and the shared library feature as well as allow used games. Which would require people to not be force to installed games to the hard drive if bought as disc. That way users can see the advantages of using digital content. It makes no sense to remove it completely like some of you might think it being a wise decision. We still have CDs for music and Blu-rays are still around. Perhaps in the next 4 or 6 years, yes I can see this happening. Clearly it is not time to remove disc just yet. Instead of thinking things through Microsoft obviously pulled a desperate maneuver due to the Sony E3 Conference.

In conclusion. Don't blame fans who wanted choice. Blame your precious Microsoft for their arrogance and greed for not allowing choice and middle ground. This pathetic attempt to beat Sony only made things worst IMO. Now we have people who feel screwed over and fans who feel that the new Xbox is nothing special now that its features have been stripped away.  We lost features, so do you feel that it?s worth the 500$ anymore? I don?t. I usually don't write things like this but I felt like I had to get this off my chest. 

 

I think it's ridiculous to blame any of this on "arrogance and greed." They simply don't have time to build both in time for a holiday launch. Supporting offline discs requires a lot of infrastructure that they would've avoided with the original plan. Things like having to include system updates on every disc shipped, like they do for 360 games. It would've removed that need and reduced costs and process overhead for a lot of people. Now they need to build the tech to handle that and set things up with publishers to have their discs include the min or latest dashboard version. And the test matrix for everyone gets more complicated too.

 

Sure, you can say they screwed up in any number of ways. Both the initial messaging and the backlash were poorly handled, and I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone denying that much. You can also argue that they were pushing things too far all at once and perhaps too soon. Or that they should've figured that out beforehand and been able to come up with a better middle-ground solution. But as someone who used to work at that company I know how these decisions are made. There's no Mr. Burns menacingly rubbing his hands together trying to screw with customers. That's a crazy assertion even if you do you think their only motivation is money (hint: for the people spec'ing these things day-to-day, it's usually more than that). To make money you need to build something people want. That's what they're trying to do. It's what motivated them to come up with the original plan, and to revise it (possibly with some pressure from the top, but I wasn't there so who knows).

 

They probably know that some of the previously announced features could still work without changing discs into download vouchers or sneaker net downloads. But in order to go back and support the older disc model they're left with only a few months to design, build out, and verify infrastructure they didn't think they'd need. That means some other things needs to be cut. That's just reality.

[francescob]

Microsoft is one of the companies with the worst marketing/PR. Not only they pick the most retarded marketing choices they can, ignoring all sorts of early feedback from users, but they are also extremely slow and inefficient to answer the userbase.

 

It took them days to respond first to the Kinect-always-on/NSA-spying accusations and now to the online-check requirements and all they got from this is a reputation that has been permanently tarnished while Sony actually gets away with even worse restrictions on digital-distribution of games that will be the only future of games distribution. Another recent example: in 2006 they tried tying Vista retail installs to only one machine but they were forced to restore the previous reinstall policy after user backlash. What did they do then? They tried pushing the same retarded restriction with Office 2013. And, of course, the result was exactly the same (though they still managed to cut the allowed office installs from 3 machines to only 1).

 

It really takes some skills to never learn the lesson and to keep staying so out of contact with people demands, even a PR/marketing team made exclusively of sociopaths could have easily avoided this huge trainwreck.

[Fourjays Veteran]

Microsoft really messed up here. Surely most of you saw my comments and probably assume I?m some PS fanboy. But let me explain where I stand as well as my opinion on the matter.  This whole thing honestly reminds me of Windows 8 and how they force changed upon consumers. I?m starting to think they really don't know what they're doing. Yes they corrected their mistake with Windows 8 with the Windows 8.1 update but with Xbox one they appear a bit desperate because of their policy changes today. I honestly believe they didn?t think things through like they did with Windows 8.1. Instead of finding the middle ground they immediately went with the majority of people who wanted DRM removed and without thinking about the other side.

So what do we have now? A newer gen Xbox 360 with all these cute TV features and no new gaming features. Between the 3 new Gen consoles the Xbox One really stood out to me mainly because all of these features. Xbox one could have simply kept the family plan for digital content and the shared library feature as well as allow used games. Which would require people to not be force to installed games to the hard drive if bought as disc. That way users can see the advantages of using digital content. It makes no sense to remove it completely like some of you might think it being a wise decision. We still have CDs for music and Blu-rays are still around. Perhaps in the next 4 or 6 years, yes I can see this happening. Clearly it is not time to remove disc just yet. Instead of thinking things through Microsoft obviously pulled a desperate maneuver due to the Sony E3 Conference.

In conclusion. Don't blame fans who wanted choice. Blame your precious Microsoft for their arrogance and greed for not allowing choice and middle ground. This pathetic attempt to beat Sony only made things worst IMO. Now we have people who feel screwed over and fans who feel that the new Xbox is nothing special now that its features have been stripped away.  We lost features, so do you feel that it?s worth the 500$ anymore? I don?t. I usually don't write things like this but I felt like I had to get this off my chest.

 

Most sensible post I've seen on here for some time. It's good that Microsoft have listened to customers and removed the DRM (would certainly have stopped me considering it). However I really don't get why they've removed it entirely. Why not disc in drive and it plays, no disc in drive and you must login for a check? Helps people get used to the idea and the (alledged) benefits, without making it a requirement. Choice, Microsoft, choice!

 

I honestly believe they didn?t think things through like they did with Windows 8.1

This is the new Microsoft. They've very much stopped thinking things through and replaced it with willful ignorance and a boatload of arrogance. And that's coming from a long-term supporter of the company.

[The Evil Overlord]

 

Most sensible post I've seen on here for some time. It's good that Microsoft have listened to customers and removed the DRM (would certainly have stopped me considering it). However I really don't get why they've removed it entirely. Why not disc in drive and it plays, no disc in drive and you must login for a check? Helps people get used to the idea and the (alledged) benefits, without making it a requirement. Choice, Microsoft, choice!

 

This is the new Microsoft. They've very much stopped thinking things through and replaced it with willful ignorance and a boatload of arrogance. And that's coming from a long-term supporter of the company.

A Fellow Staffordshire User :)

I do agree on the point you made, the main reasons I haven't dumped windows for a rival product is because I can't afford a Mac, and I've been told finding drivers and support for Linux is a nightmare

(That and I love win 7)

[+Zagadka Subscriber²]

So what do we have now? A newer gen Xbox 360 with all these cute TV features and no new gaming features

 

... The Kinect 2.0 integration seems to be a pretty big feature.Other than that, I honestly don't know what you can add to the gaming package. 

[Skiver Veteran]

I honestly believe within the first 6-18 months MS will look to implement a middle ground, they won't have spent the money they have building an infrastructure to support what they had and some good features like game sharing and disk-less operation to just simply abandon it in desperation for not loosing too much of its consumer base.

For me I understand the majority didn't like the DRM and the 24hr checking was far too draconian however the features it gave me (completely selfish) completely outweigh what we will have at launch. If there was an option to opt in to use it as it was designed I honestly think I would.

To give MS their due, I do think they listen to their user base, people had issues with Vista, 7 came along, people had issues with 8, 8.1 is addressing some of those. This time around they don't have time on their side so it will be baby steps to get to what will be a happy medium for all.

[The Evil Overlord]

I vote one of those 'feeling suits' you see in some sci fi movies and tv shows.

The ones where once you're wearing them, you in a virtual world 'do' things to pretty women and the suit replicates the sensations.

Geez I'm such a pervert :p

 

Hell I'd drop the PS4 and Run to get an XBox for that :p

[Fourjays Veteran]

A Fellow Staffordshire User :)

I do agree on the point you made, the main reasons I haven't dumped windows for a rival product is because I can't afford a Mac, and I've been told finding drivers and support for Linux is a nightmare

(That and I love win 7)

Similar here. I'm on Windows 8, went all-in with the Modern/Metro features and used them solidly for the first 2 months. 8 months on and I've realized I'm basically using it like I did Windows 7. It isn't that Windows 8 is bad, just that there isn't anything great about it. /offtopic

 

I really want Microsoft to succeed. But... they keep promising me awesomeness and delivering me mediocrity. It isn't for a lack of ideas, but a poor execution of them. Then there is their PR...

[Gaffney]

I doubt this will actually help their sales, PS4 fanboys have actually nitpicked the hell out of good feature. I've not seen one person yet say, now I can get an XBO. That's because the biggest real disadvantage of the XBO is the price. The DRM complaints were a circlejerk, something PS4 fanboys could easily pick out and say our console is better and not mention any of the benefits that came with it.

[JonnyLH]

They have screwed up, but not because of the reasons you state. They've killed innovation, the biggest change since the console has came out to drive digital games and a full digital game library has been killed. We're now stuck with a 360 with bigger specs because of bad PR and peoples inability to think and evaluate situations themselves.

 

Give yourself a pat on the back Internet. 

[slapfacemcdougal]

I doubt this will actually help their sales, PS4 fanboys have actually nitpicked the hell out of good feature. I've not seen one person yet say, now I can get an XBO. That's because the biggest real disadvantage of the XBO is the price. The DRM complaints were a circlejerk, something PS4 fanboys could easily pick out and say our console is better and not mention any of the benefits that came with it.

I may get an xbox one now that they removed the drm. Not for $499, that would be stupid. My Internet is not the most stable thing in the world. And no i don't have any other options for isp's so the xbox drm was a huge turn off to it.

[cork1958]

A Fellow Staffordshire User :)

I do agree on the point you made, the main reasons I haven't dumped windows for a rival product is because I can't afford a Mac, and I've been told finding drivers and support for Linux is a nightmare

(That and I love win 7)

 

 

 

Don't know who told you finding drivers for Linux is a nightmare, but QUIT listening to them! Couldn't be any easier in Windows even!!

 

Definitely biggest turn off for me is and would be the price, and the fact I'm a PS person!!

 

Edit:

Just short of 4 minutes for this post to go through. Sheesh!!

[The Evil Overlord]

Don't know who told you finding drivers for Linux is a nightmare, but QUIT listening to them! Couldn't be any easier in Windows even!!

 

Definitely biggest turn off for me is and would be the price, and the fact I'm a PS person!!

 

Edit:

Just short of 4 minutes for this post to go through. Sheesh!!

Not just the drivers, (That I read here somewhere here) There's little in the way of support, so I've been told (of course I could be wrong in this again)

[BajiRav]

So what do we have now? A newer gen Xbox 360 with all these cute TV features and no new gaming features. Between the 3 new Gen consoles the Xbox One really stood out to me mainly because all of these features. Xbox one could have simply kept the family plan for digital content and the shared library feature as well as allow used games. Which would require people to not be force to installed games to the hard drive if bought as disc. That way users can see the advantages of using digital content. It makes no sense to remove it completely like some of you might think it being a wise decision. We still have CDs for music and Blu-rays are still around. Perhaps in the next 4 or 6 years, yes I can see this happening. Clearly it is not time to remove disc just yet. Instead of thinking things through Microsoft obviously pulled a desperate maneuver due to the Sony E3 Conference.

In conclusion. Don't blame fans who wanted choice. Blame your precious Microsoft for their arrogance and greed for not allowing choice and middle ground. This pathetic attempt to beat Sony only made things worst IMO. Now we have people who feel screwed over and fans who feel that the new Xbox is nothing special now that its features have been stripped away.  We lost features, so do you feel that it?s worth the 500$ anymore? I don?t. I usually don't write things like this but I felt like I had to get this off my chest. 

What? The desperate maneuver was necessary given all the backlash and there is probably not enough time to put in online/offline modes in the console. It is a fact that Sony forced their hand with respect to used game block but there are plenty of new gaming features that make it a good improvement over Xbox 360.

 

There is still,

1. High quality game audio through controller (this is a cool new feature but not advertized properly :S)
2. new controller
3. fast switching games/apps
4. Power of the cloud :p (things like drivatars)
5. Skype replacing in-game voice/video chat
6. Game DVR, twitch integration

It doesn't matter if you think Kinect is a cute gimmick or not, fact is - it works and Kinect v2 brings many improvements on its own to existing features such voice controlled dash operation.

 

Then the family sharing option: If it was real (I doubt even MS knew what it was) then it wouldn't work without the used games block. They probably can't get publishers on board sharing if publishers can't be compensated by a cut in used games sales.

Microsoft doesn't have history on its side but used games block could've enabled game prices to drop faster (similar to steam) if it worked. They can still bring it back by enabling both modes in future given enough time but right now, they need to hit that launch window.

 

Fact is: Whoever lost with this, GameStop won.

That's the real sad part of the whole saga.