Even With Telemetry Disabled, Windows 10 Talks To Dozens of Microsoft Servers

[Eric Veteran]

[Thread cleaned]

 

For Pete's sake, it's not that hard to stay on topic!

[binaryzero]

<face palm>

[lassekongo83]

1 hour ago, randomevent said:

And it's easily disabled.

From https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/

 

Quote

Because the data used for interest-based advertising is also used for other necessary purposes (including providing our services, analytics and fraud detection), opting out of interest-based advertising does not stop that data from being collected. Nor does it mean you will stop getting ads or see fewer ads. However, if you do opt out, the ads you receive will no longer be interest-based and may be less relevant to your interests.

So my assumption is that is some of the data MS is trying to collect no matter what you have disabled in the default Windows settings. As the original article claims.

[spaceelf]

25 minutes ago, lassekongo83 said:

From https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/

 

So my assumption is that is some of the data MS is trying to collect no matter what you have disabled in the default Windows settings. As the original article claims.

Anonymously, if you've got no ID attached to it.  Not to mention, it's only relevant to MS sites and services which use the Microsoft ID when you haven't opted out, as you can see.

 

[adrynalyne]

24 minutes ago, lassekongo83 said:

From https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/

 

So my assumption is that is some of the data MS is trying to collect no matter what you have disabled in the default Windows settings. As the original article claims.

Data collection isn't just advertising data and MS has made that clear. In fact, telemetry mostly has nothing to do with that. 

[DavidM]

10 hours ago, DeusProto said:

Yep I still have faith that once Microsoft decides to make desktop users a high priority again we will get a solid OS with Windows 10.1 or 10.2 or whatever, possibly with things like Aero Glass being restored, the ability to customize vertical spacing between rows on jumplists to be EFFICIENT and COMPACT for us mouse users, and also the ability to again customize how many items you can pin -- where the crippled XAML jumplists are limited to 11 items now with zero customization. You can't even drag to reorder jumplist items anymore. 

 

I have faith that in a couple years or so, desktop users will be catered to once again and Microsoft will be content to make iOS and Android programs in terms of their mobile sandbox instead of a "one size fits all" OS. 

I do not, there was a time (as others have posted) when the consumer mattered, but now it's about enterprise and data mining, Google has shown the world a way to billions and Microsoft is following their lead. I can't see them giving up this "easier" path to the money.

 

9 hours ago, JHBrown said:

I agree. I made a post similar to that last week. Microsoft has gamers by the throats with Direct X. Microsoft could not pull off this spying nonsense, and half-baked operating system if we had some kind of competition. Their monopoly over the operating system market is the only thing holding them together. We need competition desperately! Gamers would leave in droves if Linux had the proper gaming support. 

Never going to happen, nVidia, Amd, and Intel, would have to support way too many variables from distro to distro, and don't forget the leader, Red Hat is making money, where? Enterprise, they don't deal with consumers. So, the most popular distros according to DistroWatch are Mint, Debian, Ubuntu, openSuse and Fedora, Mint and Ubuntu are the only ones on that list that stands a chance of getting "proper gaming support", and Canonical has spying/privacy issues themselves, and none of the others are going to include anything NOT completely free and open source, and there's no way the graphics cards makers are going to release such a driver. Then we'd have to get into package managers for updates and there are 3, maybe 4 in the top 5 distros, do you think  nVidia or AMD is going to maintain any of that? Proper gaming support is a dream, I still have that dream but it's getting further away and not closer.

 

2 hours ago, lassekongo83 said:

Microsoft has an advertising ID for you in Windows by default.

 

Windows 10 EULA refers to: https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement

Windows 10 may not apply to all of those statements, but if ads are displayed within Windows 10 in an official Microsoft app for example, it would make no sense not to collect a lot of what stated in their Privacy Statement within Windows 10 as there is a lot of profit to be made by doing so. The statement also states they can share this data with a trusted third party. I would actually like to know more about who those trusted third parties are.

 

But should we use the word "spying"? Maybe, maybe not.

Yes, because Microsoft has been caught changing setting to re-enable the Advertising ID and other user settings after updates. It becomes spying when the user turns off this feature(?) and they enable it without asking for permission.

 

1 hour ago, randomevent said:

And it's easily disabled.

Yes, and just as easy for Microsoft to re-enable it, as they have done time and time again with updates.

 

Bottom line, all OS's need to phone home and they always will, how could they update if they didn't? I will not use Windows 10, but not just for the privacy stuff, for me the UI is terrible and I have no interest in the other new features they are adding. I'll keep Windows 7 until they stop supporting it and go from there.

[spaceelf]

31 minutes ago, DavidM said:

as they have done time and time again with updates.

The only time I'm aware of any settings resetting is the major November update.

 

Otherwise, pretty much just if you're installing preview builds.

[Lamp0]

the question isn't, "are we paranoid", it's, "are we paranoid enough?"!!

[+John Teacake MVC]

There is an excellent post somewhere in here, I have created a Cisco ACL for people to block the IP's Listed. It may not do much but its something. Feel free to use it.

 

https://github.com/tg12/Windows-10-Telemetry-Block

 

[FloatingFatMan]

12 hours ago, JHBrown said:

I agree. I made a post similar to that last week. Microsoft has gamers by the throats with Direct X. Microsoft could not pull off this spying nonsense, and half-baked operating system if we had some kind of competition. Their monopoly over the operating system market is the only thing holding them together. We need competition desperately! Gamers would leave in droves if Linux had the proper gaming support. 

Gamers have always have alternatives beyond Microsoft. Sony, Nintendo, Sega, and so on.  Neither have managed to pull people away from Windows, so what makes you think Linux has a chance? Even SteamOS will never come close to it.

 

[Order_66]

12 hours ago, adrynalyne said:

They tell you what they collect, you agreed to it in the EULA, yet you call it spying. It isn't spying if they tell you about it. If they are collecting more than that, lets back it up instead of making wild claims.

Actually no they do not, they give you an approximation of what they collect, they have not been very transparent about the data at all.

 

I didn't agree to any EULA that allows some pervert at Microsoft to look at pictures of my children, is that what they are doing? I don't know, nobody outside of Microsoft knows because they only give an approximation of the data they collect, so we can only assume, and given Microsofts track record we can only assume the worst.

[Order_66]

25 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Gamers have always have alternatives beyond Microsoft. Sony, Nintendo, Sega, and so on.  Neither have managed to pull people away from Windows, so what makes you think Linux has a chance? Even SteamOS will never come close to it.

 

Actually there are no alternatives for many (most) games, if I want to play BF4 on my PC I have no other choice than to use windows.

 

If I want to play any future DX12 titles I have no other choice than to use windows 10 if I want to use my hardware to its fullest potential.

[FloatingFatMan]

1 minute ago, Order_66 said:

Actually there are no alternatives for many (most) games, if I want to play BF4 on my PC I have no other choice than to use windows.

 

If I want to play any future DX12 titles I have no other choice than to use windows 10 if I want to use my hardware to its fullest potential.

Well done.  Your head was so deeply buried in the sand that my point whizzed by you completely and missed by a mile...

 

There are just as many "hot" titles on other platforms, and if you want to play them, you have to have that platform too. However, those other platforms don't have the same spying problems people have with Windows so... You pays your money, you makes your choice.

 

[Order_66]

Just now, FloatingFatMan said:

Well done.  Your head was so deeply buried in the sand that my point whizzed by you completely and missed by a mile...

 

There are just as many "hot" titles on other platforms, and if you want to play them, you have to have that platform too. However, those other platforms don't have the same spying problems people have with Windows so... You pays your money, you makes your choice.

 

I'm not interested in the other titles, I want to play BF4 on pc, what are my options?

[FloatingFatMan]

2 minutes ago, Order_66 said:

I'm not interested in the other titles, I want to play BF4 on pc, what are my options?

Your options are in my last sentence.  You pay your money, you make your choice.  I never said the alternatives let you play the SAME game, merely that there are alternative gaming platforms.

[adrynalyne]

44 minutes ago, Order_66 said:

Actually no they do not, they give you an approximation of what they collect, they have not been very transparent about the data at all.

 

I didn't agree to any EULA that allows some pervert at Microsoft to look at pictures of my children, is that what they are doing? I don't know, nobody outside of Microsoft knows because they only give an approximation of the data they collect, so we can only assume, and given Microsofts track record we can only assume the worst.

Go read the EULA again then come back and show me evidence they collect other things outside the EULA. 

Edited February 7, 2016 by adrynalyne

[DavidM]

27 minutes ago, adrynalyne said:

Go read the EULA again then come back and show me evidence they collect other things outside the EULA. 

I think the problem is the EULA is so steeped in lawyer speak (since lawyers wrote it makes sense) to you can't actually nail down what they are collecting, nor can you nail down what they are keeping "in good faith", of course. It's also a fluid document with Microsoft being able to change it at their whim (like all EULAs) and that the builds can be radically different in what they collect and keep. These changes are also shipped with the default setting turned on and that benefits Microsoft as well. Just because I agree to the EULA and collection policies of builds dated Dec. 1, 2015, doesn't mean the same policies are in effect for the next major "update" which will change from build to build. Yes, Microsoft has always done this (like everyone else) but they have NEVER made data collection MANDATORY to use Windows before. This a problem for me, and why I choose not to use Windows 10, you or anyone else is free to do so.

 

The problem is Microsoft is not being clear with any of this, and they know most users will simply click next, or they would FORCE the user to make a selection during the install. If they were transparent then there wouldn't be so many threads or "theories" about what they do collect and keep. The forced updates also make it easier for Microsoft to change what they want without the user being able to select the things they agree to, now if I don't want telemetry (or as little as possible) in Windows 7, I can disable the updates that they keep pushing that enable such data collection. I have 20+ "updates" hidden, and look at that, a new one, KB3123862 another one that provides "Updated capabilities to upgrade Windows 8.1 and Windows 7" - "The update adds capabilities to some computers that lets users easily learn about Windows 10 or start an upgrade to Windows 10. Before you install this update, see the Prerequisites section. For more information about Windows 10, see Windows 10." That makes 23 non-security updates for an that is only supposed to be receiving security updates, plus a driver for my Intel HD3000 that is older than the one I have installed.

[Order_66]

1 hour ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Your options are in my last sentence.  You pay your money, you make your choice.  I never said the alternatives let you play the SAME game, merely that there are alternative gaming platforms.

And as I said, I have no other options if I want to play my favorite game(s), and I have no other options if I want to use my hardware to its fullest potential, Microsoft is the only option and windows 10 is the only option available for DX12, this is by anti-consumer design, no choices whatsoever.

 

So should I simply quit playing my favorite game because I don't want to be spied on?

Should I abandon my hardware so that I can't be spied on?

Should I abandon my hardware because I am forced into an OS that is many steps backwards from the previous OS from a UI standpoint (and many other areas) ?

 

Do you condone this forced stranglehold on consumers?

[FloatingFatMan]

You made your choice, you paid your money, you knew the consequences. Now you can either accept them, or make a different choice.

 

[ZakO]

4 hours ago, John Teacake said:

There is an excellent post somewhere in here, I have created a Cisco ACL for people to block the IP's Listed. It may not do much but its something. Feel free to use it.

 

https://github.com/tg12/Windows-10-Telemetry-Block

 

Why would you name it "Windows-10-Telemetry-Block"? None of these IP Addresses are shown to be telemetry related, he left all the default Apps, Store, Windows Update, NTP Syncing, etc. enabled, the majority of them will have absolutely nothing to do with telemetry.  It's worrying how fast misinformation spreads as fact.

Edited February 7, 2016 by ZakO