Pc Crashing Everytime I Play a Game

[viniciusxis]

Like I said, I tried playing Dota2 and it crashed into desktop.

But cs:go seems to be "working", it doesn't crash but it also doesn't perform very well.

[DevTech]

1 hour ago, viniciusxis said:

So I just used DDU for the 80928342 time and installed a earlier driver.

The crashes appear to be gone in csgo, but I'm afraid it won't be the case for dota2/PoE/other games, because csgo continues to be a little stuttery/laggy.

I mean with Fx6300 and Rx 470 I should be getting good performance, right?

Anyways I think I'll be ok with it like this for now, I'm just too burnt up to keep looking.

Thanks for all the help and support guys, seriously. I'll be sure to lookup how to update my Bios too.

ps: this is the thread I based on to do the lower driver thing: https://community.amd.com/thread/210109

 

Update the BIOS. 

 

That is one of the primary causes of this sort of crap.

 

Review the rest of the list I gave you. You are approaching this problem backwards by looking at the least likely areas.

 

[viniciusxis]

Will do, thank you!

I have to say, this forum is excellent.

So many helpful users with insightful inputs and patience.

[DevTech]

1 hour ago, viniciusxis said:

Will do, thank you!

I have to say, this forum is excellent.

So many helpful users with insightful inputs and patience.

I reviewed the AMD forum link you posted and when people start talking about a specific driver being the ONLY one that works, that is a sign of VooDoo "Cargo Cult" type thinking. What is really happening is that there is an underlying hardware or system issue that different driver versions expose to different degrees. The video card itself may even be defective. Some posters fixed their problem by slowing down the GPU RAM or GPU itself by some small amount which is a sign that the card is being overclocked from the factory or is using borderline components.

 

The main thing to focus on is that a properly working GPU will run everything you throw at it. Until then, nothing is solved.

 

Some of the latest GPU chips do not have a power connector on the video card and get all their power from the PCIe slot. I suspect this is one common cause of issues when a modern card like that is plugged into an older motherboard. Possible issues like that are why it is important to have the latest motherboard BIOS.

 

[viniciusxis]

Can you explain to me thoroughly how to update my bios?

I asked my brother if he knew how he said its dangerous to do it and he'd rather not risk my hardware.

[DevTech]

2 hours ago, viniciusxis said:

Can you explain to me thoroughly how to update my bios?

I asked my brother if he knew how he said its dangerous to do it and he'd rather not risk my hardware.

Your brother should chill out with some Pearl Jam because he is stuck in 1990. Although in theory a BIOS flash can go wrong, you can also be struck by lightning next time you go outdoors and I'm guessing your brother does not live in an underground bomb shelter.

 

Your motherboard BIOS will have a menu option to update itself. In 2017, that's all the instruction anyone needs other than don't turn off the power to the computer during the flash. I guess if we allow for stupidity, make sure you download the correct BIOS for the exact model and revision of the mobo you have. This can be a bit confusing for ASUS mobos since they usually make a lot of variations on each mobo model. The flash software should detect this in any case by doing a checksum but sometimes it is not perfect when the mobo models are similar. And that was a lot of words to cover an unlikely scenario.

 

Anyways all modern mobos have a "bad flash" recovery procedure built into the chipset.

[viniciusxis]

Well I tried to update it and it turns out the link provided before was wrong, this is the correct link:

http://www.asrock.com/mb/NVIDIA/N68-GS4 FX R2.0/?cat=Download&os=BIOS

and as you can see, the bios is updated.

So now I'm fresh out of options, and while trying to play cs:go today (with my PSU), it went back to crashing. I don't know if the driver auto updated (I can't seem for the life of me to be able to find the f**ng driver version), or if my PSU is indeed kind of not working. So I'm back to 0.

[DevTech]

1 minute ago, viniciusxis said:

Well I tried to update it and it turns out the link provided before was wrong, this is the correct link:

http://www.asrock.com/mb/NVIDIA/N68-GS4 FX R2.0/?cat=Download&os=BIOS

and as you can see, the bios is updated.

So now I'm fresh out of options, and while trying to play cs:go today (with my PSU), it went back to crashing. I don't know if the driver auto updated (I can't seem for the life of me to be able to find the f**ng driver version), or if my PSU is indeed kind of not working. So I'm back to 0.

Really try hard not to see device drivers as "vintages of fine wines"

 

Always use the latest driver and maybe roll back one version in rare cases.

 

It just is not ever going to be a driver problem if the GPU is failing on multiple games.

 

[viniciusxis]

So what could it possibly be?

The games continued crashing with my brother's PSU.

The GPU is brand new and seems to be working fine when I left my desktop open to see how it works, the only "iffy" thing I saw was the fans imediatly stops working after my game crashes, but it seems normal logicaly.

Used a eraser on memories yesterday.

Like I said, I'm fresh out of options. I'm gonna go try the "slow down memory" thing you said earlier, but I'm really frustrated right now.

[DevTech]

14 minutes ago, viniciusxis said:

So what could it possibly be?

The games continued crashing with my brother's PSU.

The GPU is brand new and seems to be working fine when I left my desktop open to see how it works, the only "iffy" thing I saw was the fans imediatly stops working after my game crashes, but it seems normal logicaly.

Used a eraser on memories yesterday.

Like I said, I'm fresh out of options. I'm gonna go try the "slow down memory" thing you said earlier, but I'm really frustrated right now.

You just have to be methodical and avoid considering VooDoo scenarios.

 

Areas to focus on are power supply to the GPU, the GPU card's health, and compat issues between GPU and mobo.

[patseguin Global Moderator]

On ‎5‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 8:21 PM, xendrome said:

I'm going with power supply is failing..

That seems a little too specific for just games crashing, no?

11 minutes ago, viniciusxis said:

So what could it possibly be?

The games continued crashing with my brother's PSU.

The GPU is brand new and seems to be working fine when I left my desktop open to see how it works, the only "iffy" thing I saw was the fans imediatly stops working after my game crashes, but it seems normal logicaly.

Used a eraser on memories yesterday.

Like I said, I'm fresh out of options. I'm gonna go try the "slow down memory" thing you said earlier, but I'm really frustrated right now.

What version of Windows are you on? Sometimes, a clean install of the OS and drivers solves a lot.

[DevTech]

28 minutes ago, viniciusxis said:

So what could it possibly be?

The games continued crashing with my brother's PSU.

The GPU is brand new and seems to be working fine when I left my desktop open to see how it works, the only "iffy" thing I saw was the fans imediatly stops working after my game crashes, but it seems normal logicaly.

Used a eraser on memories yesterday.

Like I said, I'm fresh out of options. I'm gonna go try the "slow down memory" thing you said earlier, but I'm really frustrated right now.

You started out with a 450 W PS - what is exact brand and model?

 

Then you swapped with your brother's Cooler Master also a 450W.

 

Neither of these power supplies are something to inspire confidence and although the issue could be something else, the PSU is of concern.

 

Personally, for my average computer builds I'm not comfortable with anything less than a major power supply vendor such as EVGA or Seasonic at minimum of 650 W

[DevTech]

15 minutes ago, patseguin said:

That seems a little too specific for just games crashing, no?

What version of Windows are you on? Sometimes, a clean install of the OS and drivers solves a lot.

He is using 8.1 (first post)

 

There is a giant stair step in power draw when a 3D game starts up so it is actually not a bad smoking gun to consider...

[Tidosho]

Have you tried using your brother's GPU in your PC?

[DevTech]

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-radeon-rx-470,4703-6.html

 

There are some charts on that page showing the RX 470 power draw.

 

The card is pulling almost 150 W which is split between the PCIe Slot and the power connector to the card.

 

Either source coming up short would produce the problem.

 

 

[DevTech]

So the motherboard needs to supply 55 W / 4.5 Amps to the GPU through the slot.

 

Perhaps that can be confirmed in the ASRock specs.

 

Then the 6 Pin PSU connector to the GPU has to deliver almost 90 W which in the case of that ASUS is over spec.

 

If your RX 470 has similar characteristics, then the card is going to be a challenge to the PSU and would require a first rate brand I think, since they always exceed their specs.

 

Note that if you have a generic brand 450 W PSU, not only will it barely make specs if at all, it will also exaggerate the power by totaling the 5V and 3.3V lines, but the only thing that matters in a modern computer is how much power is delivered on the 12 Volt line and chances are, you don't have a 450 W total for that.

 

Although I would never have started with anythingless than 650 W, if I was in this situation, I would immediately get either a 650 W or 750 W PSU depending on future expansion plans. In terms of the few PSU brands worth actually considering, the EVGA line-up delivers the most value per dollar IMO.

 

 

[viniciusxis]

I was using windows 10 before, but reading so much about how win10 has some problems with windows defender and xbox recording stuff, I went and did a clean 8.1 install. 

The problems persisted obviously.

Everywhere I looked said 450W should be enough for the RX 470, why do you think it could still be that, Devtech?

I can't find any place here that would just lend me a good one I think, and if I bought a better one and the crashes remained I think i'd be just ###### off

 

The thing is, its just insane how just a chance of gpu/mobo could actualy make my computer performance become worse.

I had a (little) better mobo that got burnt and a geforce 750 TI a couple months ago. 

I moved to the US for 6 months and when I came back I brought the RX470 with me (which is supposed to be way better than the 750TI), and the mobo was burnt.

I swapped the gpus, sold the 750TI and ever since then I just keep getting crashes on top of crashes, not to mention the cs:go performance is probably even worse than before.

I know for sure that Path of Exile runs way worse than before, with not only a bunch of crashes but stuttering like crazy.

 

I guess if you could find how much power does the 750TI require from the PSU we could maybe come to the conclusion that my PSU is not enough.

Considering my brother's is also a 750TI and my old one too, and they both run fine. I'm just not in the mood for taking out his gpu, installing drivers and etc on my computer just for the sake of testing.

 

PS: I think I mentioned it before, but my computer makes a lot of noise.

I'm not sure if its just the new gpu, but its the noisiest one here..

Edited May 23, 2017 by viniciusxis

[patseguin Global Moderator]

1 hour ago, DevTech said:

He is using 8.1 (first post)

 

There is a giant stair step in power draw when a 3D game starts up so it is actually not a bad smoking gun to consider...

Makes sense. I guess the PSU can do really funny stuff to your system when it's on the way out. Seeing as how he's on 8.1, I wonder if a clean install of Windows and drivers might be in order...

5 minutes ago, viniciusxis said:

I was using windows 10 before, but reading so much about how win10 has some problems with windows defender and xbox recording stuff, I went and did a clean 8.1 install. 

The problems persisted obviously.

Everywhere I looked said 450W should be enough for the RX 470, why do you think it could still be that, Devtech?

I can't find any place here that would just lend me a good one I think, and if I bought a better one and the crashes remained I think i'd be just ###### off

 

The thing is, its just insane how just a chance of gpu/mobo could actualy make my computer performance become worse.

I had a (little) better mobo that got burnt and a geforce 750 TI a couple months ago. 

I moved to the US for 6 months and when I came back I brought the RX470 with me (which is supposed to be way better than the 750TI), and the mobo was burnt.

I swapped the gpus, sold the 750TI and ever since then I just keep getting crashes on top of crashes, not to mention the cs:go performance is probably even worse than before.

I know for sure that Path of Exile runs way worse than before, with not only a bunch of crashes but stuttering like crazy.

 

I guess if you could find how much power does the 750TI require from the PSU we could maybe come to the conclusion that my PSU is not enough.

Considering my brother's is also a 750TI and my old one too, and they both run fine. I'm just not in the mood for taking out his gpu, installing drivers and etc on my computer just for the sake of testing.

Oh, so you already did try a clean OS install?

 

a 450W PSU seems kind of low. I personally run a 1200W PSU in my rig.

[viniciusxis]

Yea i've come to realize it seems low after such discussions, the problem is that I don't wanna unload some money on a new PSU and come back to the same error/crash again.

Everywhere I look says 400/450W is enough for the RX 470, which is why I'm still doubting it could be that.

[xendrome]

2 hours ago, DevTech said:

Your brother should chill out with some Pearl Jam because he is stuck in 1990. Although in theory a BIOS flash can go wrong, you can also be struck by lightning next time you go outdoors and I'm guessing your brother does not live in an underground bomb shelter.

 

Updating the video card BIOS on a non-stable system is pretty risky, I'd do it in another system to be safe.

18 minutes ago, viniciusxis said:

Yea i've come to realize it seems low after such discussions, the problem is that I don't wanna unload some money on a new PSU and come back to the same error/crash again.

Everywhere I look says 400/450W is enough for the RX 470, which is why I'm still doubting it could be that.

I might have missed this but does that card have 6 or 8 pin connectors? Are the 12v rails giving enough power? Wattage doesn't mean much if the 12v isn't enough for the card.

[DevTech]

22 minutes ago, viniciusxis said:

I was using windows 10 before, but reading so much about how win10 has some problems with windows defender and xbox recording stuff, I went and did a clean 8.1 install. 

The problems persisted obviously.

Everywhere I looked said 450W should be enough for the RX 470, why do you think it could still be that, Devtech?

I can't find any place here that would just lend me a good one I think, and if I bought a better one and the crashes remained I think i'd be just ###### off

 

The thing is, its just insane how just a chance of gpu/mobo could actualy make my computer performance become worse.

I had a (little) better mobo that got burnt and a geforce 750 TI a couple months ago. 

I moved to the US for 6 months and when I came back I brought the RX470 with me (which is supposed to be way better than the 750TI), and the mobo was burnt.

I swapped the gpus, sold the 750TI and ever since then I just keep getting crashes on top of crashes, not to mention the cs:go performance is probably even worse than before.

I know for sure that Path of Exile runs way worse than before, with not only a bunch of crashes but stuttering like crazy.

 

I guess if you could find how much power does the 750TI require from the PSU we could maybe come to the conclusion that my PSU is not enough.

Considering my brother's is also a 750TI and my old one too, and they both run fine. I'm just not in the mood for taking out his gpu, installing drivers and etc on my computer just for the sake of testing.

 

PS: I think I mentioned it before, but my computer makes a lot of noise.

I'm not sure if its just the new gpu, but its the noisiest one here..

You are troubleshooting by telling an anecdotal story. This is not how science works. Instead of reviewing history and throwing in personal ideas of how you think it should work, you should just be looking at data and whatever measurements you can make.

 

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-750-ti-review,3750-21.html

 

The 750 Ti uses about 65 W.

 

That is a huge amount less than the RX 470. Less than 1/2 of a RX 470.

 

Now look on the label of your "450 W" PSU and there will be maximum watts listed for the 12 Volt line, which will probably read 300 W.

 

So your RX 470 will want about 150 W on the 12 V, leaving you just 150 W to power everything else.

 

I am really surprised it has been working as well as it has been, but you probably have a degraded PSU at this point.

 

[DevTech]

6 minutes ago, xendrome said:

Updating the video card BIOS on a non-stable system is pretty risky, I'd do it in another system to be safe.

I might have missed this but does that card have 6 or 8 pin connectors? Are the 12v rails giving enough power? Wattage doesn't mean much if the 12v isn't enough for the card.

It was just the mobo BIOS, not the video card BIOS which is another beast entirely.

 

His first post was very organized so I assumed he had checked all this stuff out. It turns out he is attempting to completely violate the laws of physics here.

 

To do that, ones objective should be a Star Drive, not a desire to cheap out on a power supply!

 

[Mindovermaster Global Moderator]

1 hour ago, DevTech said:

 

The 750 Ti uses about 65 W.

 

 

 

I think that's actually 60W, but yes, around that. I own a 750Ti myself

 

Edit: yeah, it's actually 60W: http://www.anandtech.com/show/7764/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-750-ti-and-gtx-750-review-maxwell/4

Edited May 23, 2017 by Mindovermaster

[DevTech]

10 hours ago, viniciusxis said:

I was using windows 10 before, but reading so much about how win10 has some problems with windows defender and xbox recording stuff, I went and did a clean 8.1 install. 

The problems persisted obviously.

Everywhere I looked said 450W should be enough for the RX 470, why do you think it could still be that, Devtech?

I can't find any place here that would just lend me a good one I think, and if I bought a better one and the crashes remained I think i'd be just ###### off

 

The thing is, its just insane how just a chance of gpu/mobo could actualy make my computer performance become worse.

I had a (little) better mobo that got burnt and a geforce 750 TI a couple months ago. 

I moved to the US for 6 months and when I came back I brought the RX470 with me (which is supposed to be way better than the 750TI), and the mobo was burnt.

I swapped the gpus, sold the 750TI and ever since then I just keep getting crashes on top of crashes, not to mention the cs:go performance is probably even worse than before.

I know for sure that Path of Exile runs way worse than before, with not only a bunch of crashes but stuttering like crazy.

 

I guess if you could find how much power does the 750TI require from the PSU we could maybe come to the conclusion that my PSU is not enough.

Considering my brother's is also a 750TI and my old one too, and they both run fine. I'm just not in the mood for taking out his gpu, installing drivers and etc on my computer just for the sake of testing.

 

PS: I think I mentioned it before, but my computer makes a lot of noise.

I'm not sure if its just the new gpu, but its the noisiest one here..

Most likely your performance issues (when the game runs at all) is related to starving the GPU of power.

 

You should identify the source of noise - possibly the fan in your overworked power supply.

 

I will guess you are in Brazil since language is Portuguese and you mentioned high prices. A quick search shows insane variation in prices of same components! Here is a possible power supply for you:

 

http://www.terabyteshop.com.br/produto/5025/fonte-evga-750b-110-b1-0750-vr-750w-80-plus-bronze-pfc-ativo

 

EVGA 750 W at R$ 400

 

You may have other issues with mobo etc but for sure I can say you need a power supply!

 

Note that I am not suggesting you need a 750 W PSU. That was the only decent price for a decent PSU I could locate in a quick google for Brazil. If you live in Portugal, then I'm sure the choices would be very different.

 

You probably need a quality 600 W PSU such as a Seasonic unit. Given the difficulty in tracking model variations within a brand, I would start at 650 W for other brands to get a safety factor. Since it would be a pain to repeat all this when you upgrade to a GTX 1080 in 3 years, I'd personally suggest thinking hard about 750 W but for right now a quality 650 W PSU will do what is needed.

 

 

 

[viniciusxis]

This is my PSU: http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story&reid=231

 

I think this is the sticker you mentioned?

 

I will try and get a better psu to test it out from a friend and will let you know the results.

PS: Yesterday I was too tired to keep doing stuff so I just went to bed, but I lowered the memory thing you said on bios (it was 600something I lowered to 400), left dota open vs bots and went to bed.

Today I woke up with it working normaly and the game had finished, I played around 40minutes of dota as well and it didn't crash.

I will try it out more this afternoon, we'll see.

Thanks for all the help. I'll be sure to buy a new PSU anyways I think, cause if it doesn't fix the problem I'll probably just buy a new mobo/cpu...

 

And yeah, I'm in Brazil, prices are insane.