Switching to Linux... still deciding on Manjaro KDE vs Kubuntu

[BoondockSaint]

After decades of working purely on Windows, I'm taking the plunge and will be installing Linux on my new notebook. I work as a dev and while it won't be my primary device, it'll be my secondary machine for working on code from the couch or while travelling.

 

I have played with various flavours of Linux over the years in VMs, but never actually went to use it for production work, so it'll be interesting (and probably frustrating at the start). Still trying to decide between Manjaro and Kubuntu. Unless I am missing something huge, I cannot stand how GNOME looks & works - KDE just feels so much better and more flexible.

 

It starts tomorrow!

[Max Norris]

Both are solid choices, mostly boils down to do you want to install once and forget it (rolling releases) versus regular point upgrades? (Or staying with an LTS release.)  Manjaro for the most part is pretty good, it's not 100% as I've ran into a few bugs/quirks from time to time, nothing major though. Kubuntu tends to be more stable, but again you're dealing with a system that's more fixed in the software.. there is a PPA for Kubuntu for some backported Plasma but it's still the same static base underneath. Manjaro isn't as bleeding edge as Arch, they hold the updates a bit to make sure there's no major issues and then release it after testing so it's less likely to blow up if something goes wrong. 

 

As far as Plasma itself goes, yea nothing else comes close. I respect Gnome but, I don't know I guess it feels kind of Mac-ish, and not a fan of that at all. Absurdly flexible, surprisingly lightweight for what you get, and you can make it look *really* good. For development they've got all the tools you'd expect, you can find things like VSCode and such in the AUR. My biggest gripe is probably the issues with multi-monitor support under Plasma, it's still pretty bad, can be pretty flaky at times. Otherwise excellent with some nice supporting programs to go with it.

[JustGeorge]

Thought about PopOS?

[Mindovermaster Moderator]

PopOS is more for gaming than coding..

 

If you want a stable slate, use Debian. They aren't the fastest on updates, but they are rock solid.

 

You ever try EndevourOS? I'm currently on it now. It's based on Arch. IDK if you need the newest and greatest stuff. There's ~10 updates per DAY.

 

Just wondering, is there a reason you want KDE? If youre into coding, I think i3 or a like WM would be better.. Just my two cents..

[spacelordmaster]

Try ZorinOS or Fedora 36. You will not regret either.

[JustGeorge]

On 23/09/2022 at 01:18, Mindovermaster said:

PopOS is more for gaming than coding..

 

If you want a stable slate, use Debian. They aren't the fastest on updates, but they are rock solid.

 

You ever try EndevourOS? I'm currently on it now. It's based on Arch. IDK if you need the newest and greatest stuff. There's ~10 updates per DAY.

 

Just wondering, is there a reason you want KDE? If youre into coding, I think i3 or a like WM would be better.. Just my two cents..

They also market themselves as STEM focused and consider themselves a "semi rolling release".

[ThaCrip]

On 23/09/2022 at 01:18, Mindovermaster said:

If you want a stable slate, use Debian. They aren't the fastest on updates, but they are rock solid.

 

Which is why I would argue for Linux Mint in general as it's a little more updated (newer kernel etc) and pretty much the same but without the excess bloat of the real Ubuntu. but Ubuntu (which is what the main version of Mint is based on) has PPA support where as Debian basically does not. but Mint is one of the 'safer' choices for Linux in general and each major release is supported for pretty much 5 years (where as many others seem to be in the 2-3 year range tops off the top of my head)...

 

-Mint 19.x = April 2023 (no point in installing this since there is only about 6 month left of support)

-Mint 20.x = April 2025 (if you want to play it a bit 'safer', one may opt for this over Mint 21 since it's been out longer and probably has a bit more polish. but I personally went for Mint 21 since Mint 20.x only has about 2.5 years of support left now)

-Mint 21.x = April 2027 (this is their current release, which was released not all that long ago now)

 

Mint 21 uses the 5.15 kernel by default (I think a person 'can' use 5.17 kernel but it's not listed in the usual 'Update Manager > View > Linux Kernels' section and you can do it from terminal or 'synaptic package manager'). Mint 20 uses the 5.4 kernel by default but can be changed to 5.15. Mint 19.x on the other hand, prior to 19.3, would default to 4.15 kernel (I think) and then if someone clean installed from Mint 19.3, it was 5.0 kernel which almost certainly shifted to 5.4 and then stopped there. so basically in terms of kernels supported for the life of Mint 19.x series it would be 4.15 and 5.4. but I don't really see a point in using Mint 19.x at this point in time since you got about a half year max of support left.

 

so as long as your hardware is not super new (call it about 1 year old or older), chances are the current Mint 21 will support it. that kernel is pretty much Oct/Nov 2021. so if your hardware is a fair amount before this, chances are it will work.

 

but in general the Mint team suggests people stay with the LTS (Long Term Support) kernel that comes with the OS unless they have a reason to use a newer/different kernel.

 

at the end of the day I would say in terms of safer choices in general Debian/Ubuntu based OS's are probably safer than alternatives since, 'if' there was a standard, these would probably be it since they have been out the longest etc and Ubuntu is basically a more friendly(and I suspect more commonly used) version of Debian. but I think Debian is probably considered a bit less bloated/snappier than Ubuntu, but the difference is probably small enough not to matter in the real world.

 

with that said, I would say Mint has a nice balance of installed programs but not become too bloated either, or it's not TOO light/stripped down. but in regards to Mint, their flagship DE(desktop environment) is Cinnamon, but I prefer the lightest version they offer, which is Xfce. but in terms of basic use, all three (Cinnamon/MATE/Xfce) are similar. Mint is a more user friendly OS so it tries to remain simple (so in terms of basic user interface navigation if a person can use/navigate Windows, they can on Mint to), which is never a bad thing as I don't see no point in making things more difficult than it needs to be.

Edited September 23, 2022 by ThaCrip

[+Raphaël G. MVC]

Welcome to the world of Linux!

 

Both Manjaro KDE and Kubuntu are excellent choices. Having used both (their gnome flavor though, I'm a fan of minimalism ), I have a preference for Manjaro for these reasons:

 

- Rolling release. So no reinstalls ever needed.

- AUR: the software availability is just amazing. If it's not in the official repo's, you're sure to find it in AUR.

 

i'm also a DEV and Manjaro and (K)Ubuntu work great for software development. If you need any help while switching, don't hesitate to ask. Good luck!

[Steven P. Administrators]

On 23/09/2022 at 02:35, BoondockSaint said:

After decades of working purely on Windows, I'm taking the plunge and will be installing Linux on my new notebook. I work as a dev and while it won't be my primary device, it'll be my secondary machine for working on code from the couch or while travelling.

 

I have played with various flavours of Linux over the years in VMs, but never actually went to use it for production work, so it'll be interesting (and probably frustrating at the start). Still trying to decide between Manjaro and Kubuntu. Unless I am missing something huge, I cannot stand how GNOME looks & works - KDE just feels so much better and more flexible.

 

It starts tomorrow!

Following this, because my i5-7200U HP Pavilion x360 laptop is not even supported for Windows 11. I wouldn't mind sticking a user friendly version of Linux on it to breathe some life into it.

 

Please update us with what you decide to go with.

[BoondockSaint]

Thanks for all the insightful comments, I will go through and reply to everyone soon.

 

On 23/09/2022 at 11:28, Steven P. said:

Following this, because my i5-7200U HP Pavilion x360 laptop is not even supported for Windows 11. I wouldn't mind sticking a user friendly version of Linux on it to breathe some life into it.

 

Please update us with what you decide to go with.

Courier just dropped off my machine, so what I think I will do is install one of the distros, play with it for a day, wipe, then install the other. VMs are fine, but - especially with laptop hardware - it's good to see it on actual metal. I got a Lenovo Legion 5, with an R7 5800H, 16GB, 500GB nvme, RTX3060 - for the money (I didn't want to spend too much), it's hard to fault that configuration, and build quality seems very good on first look.

 

Just as an aside, I also went with this one because I checked the Arch Wiki and it seems like the hardware is well supported.

 

I decided to switch purely because I don't like the direction W11 is heading in - the deficiencies in the taskbar would seriously hurt my daily workflow, and I refuse to accept it.

[BoondockSaint]

On 23/09/2022 at 03:32, Max Norris said:

Both are solid choices, mostly boils down to do you want to install once and forget it (rolling releases) versus regular point upgrades? (Or staying with an LTS release.)  Manjaro for the most part is pretty good, it's not 100% as I've ran into a few bugs/quirks from time to time, nothing major though. Kubuntu tends to be more stable, but again you're dealing with a system that's more fixed in the software.. there is a PPA for Kubuntu for some backported Plasma but it's still the same static base underneath. Manjaro isn't as bleeding edge as Arch, they hold the updates a bit to make sure there's no major issues and then release it after testing so it's less likely to blow up if something goes wrong. 

 

As far as Plasma itself goes, yea nothing else comes close. I respect Gnome but, I don't know I guess it feels kind of Mac-ish, and not a fan of that at all. Absurdly flexible, surprisingly lightweight for what you get, and you can make it look *really* good. For development they've got all the tools you'd expect, you can find things like VSCode and such in the AUR. My biggest gripe is probably the issues with multi-monitor support under Plasma, it's still pretty bad, can be pretty flaky at times. Otherwise excellent with some nice supporting programs to go with it.

I don't mind a rolling release, though I wouldn't update the same day, because when I want to use the machine for work, it needs to be up and running straight away instead of having to worry about a patch breaking something. However I do like the idea of new features being available regularly, rather than at big intervals like with Windows.

 

As for the DE, I fully agree - nothing wrong with GNOME for those who like that sort of thing. It's very polished and you can see a lot of effort went into it to make it easy to use. But I do like tweaking every last bit of the UI, so Plasma is much more appealing.

 

I was playing around with my Kubuntu VM last night, and managed to upgrade the kernel & Plasma to the latest stable versions. Great to be able to have so much power when it comes to the OS.

[BoondockSaint]

On 23/09/2022 at 03:58, JustGeorge said:

Thought about PopOS?

I installed it in a VM to check it out, but I'm not a fan of GNOME or its derivatives.

 

On 23/09/2022 at 07:18, Mindovermaster said:

PopOS is more for gaming than coding..

 

If you want a stable slate, use Debian. They aren't the fastest on updates, but they are rock solid.

 

You ever try EndevourOS? I'm currently on it now. It's based on Arch. IDK if you need the newest and greatest stuff. There's ~10 updates per DAY.

 

Just wondering, is there a reason you want KDE? If youre into coding, I think i3 or a like WM would be better.. Just my two cents..

I did try Endeavour in a VM - it does look good, but that much "latest & greatest" I probably don't want if I need to do work. I won't discount it though.

 

I think KDE is a good compromise when coming from Windows. I might experiment with others down the line, but for now I want to get things up and running (primarily work on VSCode and the JetBrains IDEs) and get used to the OS.

[BoondockSaint]

On 23/09/2022 at 07:46, spacelordmaster said:

Try ZorinOS or Fedora 36. You will not regret either.

I didn't try Zorin, after downloading some 10 distros and setting up the VMs it skipped my mind. I have a Fedora VM, but GNOME does not appeal to me. I see there's a KDE spin of Fedora though, might give that a shot.

[BoondockSaint]

On 23/09/2022 at 09:48, ThaCrip said:

 

Which is why I would argue for Linux Mint in general as it's a little more updated (newer kernel etc) and pretty much the same but without the excess bloat of the real Ubuntu. but Ubuntu (which is what the main version of Mint is based on) has PPA support where as Debian basically does not. but Mint is one of the 'safer' choices for Linux in general and each major release is supported for pretty much 5 years (where as many others seem to be in the 2-3 year range tops off the top of my head)...

 

<snip>

 

with that said, I would say Mint has a nice balance of installed programs but not become too bloated either, or it's not TOO light/stripped down. but in regards to Mint, their flagship DE(desktop environment) is Cinnamon, but I prefer the lightest version they offer, which is Xfce. but in terms of basic use, all three (Cinnamon/MATE/Xfce) are similar. Mint is a more user friendly OS so it tries to remain simple (so in terms of basic user interface navigation if a person can use/navigate Windows, they can on Mint to), which is never a bad thing as I don't see no point in making things more difficult than it needs to be.

Thanks for that detailed write-up! I did consider Mint, but as I'm (heavily) leaning towards KDE, others came before it in the list.

 

I have used Mint a little on an ancient Toshiba notebook I have kicking around, to rescue data from a NAS that corrupted the base OS. Windows couldn't access the drives even with third party tools designed to read Linux partitions, but Mint worked like a champ. Can definitely see that the Mint devs put a lot of love into that distro.

[BoondockSaint]

On 23/09/2022 at 10:43, Raphaël G. said:

Welcome to the world of Linux!

 

Both Manjaro KDE and Kubuntu are excellent choices. Having used both (their gnome flavor though, I'm a fan of minimalism ), I have a preference for Manjaro for these reasons:

 

- Rolling release. So no reinstalls ever needed.

- AUR: the software availability is just amazing. If it's not in the official repo's, you're sure to find it in AUR.

 

i'm also a DEV and Manjaro and (K)Ubuntu work great for software development. If you need any help while switching, don't hesitate to ask. Good luck!

Appreciate it! The minimalism of GNOME is what turned me to KDE, but that's why it's so great we have many choices under Linux 😁

 

The more frequent updates of Arch are appealing, and I do like the slightly more "hands on" approach of Arch - it's not as simple to get into as the bigger distros (for example when you look at something like installing MS Edge & VScode which have DEB & RPM packages, but for Arch is more of a manual process). As I mentioned in my other post, I think I will try one for a day, then wipe and try the other and see how each one feels to use. In my VMs, I like both equally to be honest, but let's see how they behave on the real hardware.

[Good Bot, Bad Bot]

On 23/09/2022 at 03:30, JustGeorge said:

They also market themselves as STEM focused and consider themselves a "semi rolling release".

Pop!_OS is not any kinda of "semi-rolling release" distro. It is literally based on Ubuntu and follows their release schedule except there won't even be an upcoming 22.10 version at all. Fedora would be an example of a "semi-rolling release" distro.

Edited September 23, 2022 by Good Bot, Bad Bot

[Good Bot, Bad Bot]

My two cents...

 

On Manjaro, while I have zero experience with Arch based distros I read a lot negative things about the distro and the people behind it. EndeavourOS which was already mentioned I seem to hear nothing but good things about it. One of the main guys behind it bailed from Manjaro.

 

My personal vote would be for Fedora (KDE spin) and what I use. It is fairly well tested and stable for a distro that uses more recent kernels and software packages. Test the 37 beta as the release has a lot nice changes/updates. I used to use Kubuntu at one time but unless you all right with Snaps I wouldn't bother with it. I know Snapd and any Snap apps can be removed but it has never made sense IMO to install a distro and then go remove the thing that makes it the most unique.

 

Linux Mint was mentioned and I used to be a fan and while there is nothing wrong with it I do consider it a Linux distro for grandpas these days. LOL  The Cinnamon DE will make any Windows user comfortable for sure.

[Nick H. Supervisor]

I wouldn't bother playing around with a Linux distro in a VM, especially if you plan to wipe and start again. You may as well just fully install a distro and play around with it for a few days to see if it suits you before wiping and trying something else.

 

I haven't used Manjaro, but I did use Kubuntu for a while and it worked perfectly fine for things like coding.

 

Zorin was good. I installed it for a guy that doesn't know the difference between a CPU and a GPU and he used it for years without really noticing that it wasn't Windows.

 

But for me, I'm using Linux Mint as my secondary OS. @Good Bot, Bad Botconsiders it to be for grandpas, but I consider it to be a solid distro that does what I need it to do.

[BoondockSaint]

On 23/09/2022 at 16:52, Nick H. said:

I wouldn't bother playing around with a Linux distro in a VM, especially if you plan to wipe and start again. You may as well just fully install a distro and play around with it for a few days to see if it suits you before wiping and trying something else.

That's exactly my plan - I'm just about to make a coffee and start installing on the machine I was just using the VMs this week to test out a pile of distros and make a shortlist. After some of the posts here, I'll add Fedora KDE to the list too.

[Arceles]

Another vote for Debian. Is not the latest kernel but it is so easy to maintain and to keep things simple. Also if you really want to go to the latest kernel you can do it by going into their test branch but that is when you get acquainted with Debian and Linux in general. You can play games really well on it to as I do most of the times and pretty much everything that I wanted to work in it simply works as its main focus is to be stable.

[Farchord]

I'm using Fedora 36 on two computers (One laptop and one desktop). Had issues with Manjaro personally, and Fedora is stable as a rock while STILL being very close to the bleeding edge.

[Good Bot, Bad Bot]

On 23/09/2022 at 10:52, Nick H. said:

I wouldn't bother playing around with a Linux distro in a VM, especially if you plan to wipe and start again. You may as well just fully install a distro and play around with it for a few days to see if it suits you before wiping and trying something else.

 

I haven't used Manjaro, but I did use Kubuntu for a while and it worked perfectly fine for things like coding.

 

Zorin was good. I installed it for a guy that doesn't know the difference between a CPU and a GPU and he used it for years without really noticing that it wasn't Windows.

 

But for me, I'm using Linux Mint as my secondary OS. @Good Bot, Bad Botconsiders it to be for grandpas, but I consider it to be a solid distro that does what I need it to do.

Yeah, especially if have an extra PC you should install a distro to try it out. It's nothing to install and setup a Linux distro (assuming no hardware compatibility issues) compared to Windows. It takes me half a day to config, disable all the spyware functions in settings, installing GPU drivers, and removing  the unwanted apps when installing Windows. There is very little needed to do or change with a Linux install. Hell, many of the programs I use (Firefox, LibreOffice, VLC) are usually already installed by default with most Linux distros which would need to be installed on Windows.

 

I said there was nothing wrong with Linux Mint LOL but LTS based distos made more sense years ago but today? On the desktop? I want more updated kernels and packages. There has been so much positive development in the last year or so with KDE and even GNOME that makes the Linux desktop so much more usable that I like to be using the current versions.  I use Fedora which is a semi-rolling release distro and in my experience has been rock solid. It's even sometimes a necessity to use a non-LTS distro if have recent hardware.

Edited September 23, 2022 by Good Bot, Bad Bot

[Mindovermaster Moderator]

On 23/09/2022 at 09:45, Good Bot, Bad Bot said:

My two cents...

 

On Manjaro, while I have zero experience with Arch based distros I read a lot negative things about the distro and the people behind it. EndeavourOS which was already mentioned I seem to hear nothing but good things about it. One of the main guys behind it bailed from Manjaro.

 

My personal vote would be for Fedora (KDE spin) and what I use. It is fairly well tested and stable for a distro that uses more recent kernels and software packages. Test the 37 beta as the release has a lot nice changes/updates. I used to use Kubuntu at one time but unless you all right with Snaps I wouldn't bother with it. I know Snapd and any Snap apps can be removed but it has never made sense IMO to install a distro and then go remove the thing that makes it the most unique.

 

Linux Mint was mentioned and I used to be a fan and while there is nothing wrong with it I do consider it a Linux distro for grandpas these days. LOL  The Cinnamon DE will make any Windows user comfortable for sure.

I hear ya, bro.. I never really liked Manjaro when I used it for like a month. While it is based on Arch, they toned the thing down so you don't get the latest stuff until THEY tested it. It's a twisted way of thinking.

 

IMO, EndeavourOS or ArcoLinux is a better choice than Manjaro. Don't even start me with Garuda..

[Good Bot, Bad Bot]

On 23/09/2022 at 13:00, Mindovermaster said:

I hear ya, bro.. I never really liked Manjaro when I used it for like a month. While it is based on Arch, they toned the thing down so you don't get the latest stuff until THEY tested it. It's a twisted way of thinking.

 

IMO, EndeavourOS or ArcoLinux is a better choice than Manjaro. Don't even start me with Garuda..

Testing new packages is a "twisted way of thinking"? Huh? Fedora is 1 or 1/2 step behind Manjaro but I appreciate the testing they do and that it's rock solid. I can wait 3-4 weeks for the latest point release of KDE or GNOME. LOL

[Mindovermaster Moderator]

On 23/09/2022 at 13:58, Good Bot, Bad Bot said:

Testing new packages is a "twisted way of thinking"? Huh? Fedora is 1 or 1/2 step behind Manjaro but I appreciate the testing they do and that it's rock solid. I can wait 3-4 weeks for the latest point release of KDE or GNOME. LOL

Arch is supposed to be the greatest and latest. Manjaro doesn't fit that pattern. Yet it's based off Arch.

 

If you don't need the newest stuff, then don't use Arch, plain and simple..