Windows 10 or 11 for a new Desktop? And the Microsoft Account "dilemma"

[Progetto Prisma]

Hi,

my new pc is on the way to arrive at home, is a simple machine only for office productivity and web browsing (simple config a N6000 + 16 GB RAM and 512 GB HD SSD)

This PC include a Windows 11 Pro license, but a lot of people tell me to downgrade to Windows 10 at the moment because is more stable and 11 is very bad. (i never used it)

What do you suggest?

Until now i have always used windows 10 with a local account.

I read that Windows 11 is only available with Microsoft Account. It's true?

What are the benefit to use it? I'm an old school boy and i don't love online account... but if the benefits are better that the cons i will start to use it.

What do you suggest to do?

Only a question, i'm a bit curious about that:

- I was also wondering one thing, a company with 100-200 computers will have to configure all of them a microsoft online user account or how does windows 11 behave in corporate environments where maybe there are hundreds of PCs? It seems to me "absurd" to force the creation of hundreds of microsoft accounts for each employee.

 

Thanks very much for your opinions!

[ThaCrip]

Since you said 'office productivity and web browsing' I suspect it probably won't matter either way. but in general (like general usage and gaming etc) Windows 10 is a safer all-around choice for things to 'just work' since it's standardized unlike Windows 11.

but I do think that a forced account on Win11 is true from what I heard unless you use ways to bypass it which I think Rufus and Ventoy do.

p.s. I also never used Windows 11, not even in a virtual machine. but come to think of it, I might play around with it in a VM on my Linux Mint PC at some point.

 

On 15/01/2023 at 06:12, Progetto Prisma said:

What are the benefit to use it? I'm an old school boy and i don't love online account... but if the benefits are better that the cons i will start to use it.

I don't blame you as ill never use a online account just to use Windows. it should be a simple install (just local account creation only) and use like usual. I don't mind if it's a option for people to use a online if they want, but it should ALWAYS be optional as a standard local offline account is always going to be my default install method.

but all the more reason I am glad I dumped Windows for Linux (Mint).

ill let others take it from here on more details

[Som]

Windows 11 is fine and stable, use the email address "no@thankyou.com" when registering and any password (it errors out) and you can bypass the need for an online account

[PriitU]

On 15/01/2023 at 13:12, Progetto Prisma said:

my new pc is on the way to arrive at home, is a simple machine only for office productivity and web browsing (simple config a N6000 + 16 GB RAM and 512 GB HD SSD)

This PC include a Windows 11 Pro license, but a lot of people tell me to downgrade to Windows 10 at the moment because is more stable and 11 is very bad. (i never used it)

Try using it, you can always modify it to look like Windows 10 or download and install Windows 10 if you wanted to. Just because some believe or experienced issues with Windows 11 then that doesn't mean those issues are not in Windows 10 or that they haven't been resolved or ever explained why some might have experienced issues.

For me Windows 10 is less stable, slower and consumes more resources that I would install newest Windows 11 22H2 instead of Windows 11 21H2 or some Windows 10 even to some officially unsported very old computers.

Most new PC's and laptops even come with unnecesary software and recovery partitions by default, that it is best to update BIOS and Firmware and then start completely from scratch and install Windows 11 or 10 into totally empty drive to get rid of weird anomalies and gain more space and get Windows to be more stable. Most modern computers and laptops should even offer stable drivers and uptodate firmware and bios through Windows Update and preinstalled ones are not always as good.
 

On 15/01/2023 at 13:12, Progetto Prisma said:

Until now i have always used windows 10 with a local account.

I read that Windows 11 is only available with Microsoft Account. It's true?

What do you mean by is only available? I tried downloading Windows 11 from official Microsoft Windows 11 Download website and it didn't force me to login. If you mean setting up new computer then there are many misleading articles even about Windows 10 forcing users to create or use Microsoft account and unfortunately there are less articles about ways to pypass it and you can consider yourself lucky or not if you managed to not ever have it forced to do, maybe you had very old Windows 10 version.

Just don't connect with internet and you will be able to create a local account, if setup screen still shows you need to use Microsoft Account, then press back button on screen and you then afterwards you can create local account and only if major Windows 10 or 11 update comes once a year, then maybe you will be asked to login with Microsoft account, then just use the same bypass method.
 

On 15/01/2023 at 13:12, Progetto Prisma said:

What are the benefit to use it?

Microsoft account allows you to synchronize some of your purchases, files, apps, settings, give option to see device location, set restrictions for other family members, share Office subsciption with other family members and by using Microsoft Account it should help to reset login PIN or to recover bitlock code to decrypt your files or to maybe easily get your Windows or Office licence transfered to another device. Some things might work even with local account and you can always login to Microsoft Store, Edge, Office and OneDrive with email and keep using local account to login to computer, that's if you believe you never will get your TPM reset or if you think you don't ever need to repair device or to add your drive to another computer. You can even remove password or login pin code requirement if you really wanted to and not use BitLocker and have your device be less secure, just go to settings and leave new password or pin empty for your local account.

Some benefits of Windows 11:
Windows 11 has more built in apps that natively support dark mode
Windows 11 Settings app has more options than Win10.
Win11 supports Android apps through Amazon Appstore that's from Microsoft Store or with a help of some other special software.
Win11 OS consumes less drive space, updates are smaller and are faster to install, animations and transparency effects require less resources.
So it's better for most users to use Windows 11. Just default looks and some default settings need time to get used to if you have been using Windows 10 before, otherwise you can search online how to modify various things to make it look like Windows 10 again, otherwise when Windows 10 support ends, then your computer will be less secure that it is good to try Windows 11 yourself instead of just asking for other users opinions. Some newer Windows 11 can even look slightly differently, so things can change every year when new major version is released to general public.

Heres Microsoft page where it is written that newest Windows 11 22H2 can consume 2.8 GB less space than previous Windows 11 21H2 and downloading new updates can be even ~450 MB smaller:

 

https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/windows-it-pro-blog/faster-smaller-windows-11-version-22h2-update-fundamentals/ba-p/36

Originally Windows 11 21H2 was supposed to take less space and have updates install quicker and be smaller than Windows 10, but some news articles speculate that it was isn't true for some users and maybe some users made upgrade to Windows 11 on old slow device instead of clean install, that it is hard to know what is the most recent truth without having to search online or without trying to benchmarking things yourself. Weird also why Windows 11 22H2 articles write extra major improvements if 21H2 builds were already supposed to be a lot better in some ways than Windows 10.

Best is to try out things yourself, don't let misleading, half true or outdated news articles confuse you or force you to spend time to seek for other users opinions. Some are still happy with Windows 7, 8 or 10 and some prefer or just have less issues with newer Windows or are fine modifying things to fit their needs and if someone have the opposite or finds issues, then that's not always necessarily true for everyone or for every device.

Installing Windows 10 or 11 to totally empty drive shouldn't take more than 20min and a good to do that if you want to get rid of unnecessary preinstalled software and unnecessary large recovery partitions that get quickly outdated and which still many new devices have it even by default when they can cause more issues and when Windows built-in recovery and reset feature should be enough. Most drivers and firmware updates should even come through Windows Update, some are hidden in optional updates and manufacturers preinstalled drivers aren't always worth keeping, some prefer doing things manually and experience the opposite, so you just need to find whatever you like, looks or behaves or works best as you wish.
 

On 15/01/2023 at 13:12, Progetto Prisma said:

I was also wondering one thing, a company with 100-200 computers will have to configure all of them a microsoft online user account or how does windows 11 behave in corporate environments where maybe there are hundreds of PCs? It seems to me "absurd" to force the creation of hundreds of microsoft accounts for each employee.

It's absurd to think that companies and schools would use or allow to use same default settings or Windows editions that are not meant or be good for them. It's even absurd to think it's easier to keep devices secure if every random person can come, modify and use devices and internet without any restrictions.

Different Windows editions are for different purposes and have various settings or options that are hidden or made available by default and IT department should read news of changes and differences between Windows editions and builds that aren't aren't mentioned as often for normal users. Most companies and schools have their own server, own network, own firewall and own emails or they pay for another company to provide them for employees and it shouldn't be allowed for a random person to use random device, random email or give access to all files, websites or Windows features that could bypass privileges or threaten security or make recovery and management of computers and user accounts more difficult. Most companies even use Thin Clients with POE ethernet cable instead of regular computers and virtual Windows for those devices come from another device that has Windows Server OS.

Windows 10 or 11 Business or Education editions most likely will try to persuade using accounts given by IT department and not allow to run with normal home network without making you to find ways to bypass such requirements to be able to use simple local account if you are really interested in hidden settings and features that those editions provide that a Home or Pro versions of Windows do not give.

Edited January 15, 2023 by PriitU
I had some typos and wording not as good in one paragraph and I was missing one tip that things can change whenever a new major Windows comes out once a year.

[Progetto Prisma]

What do you think about the use of Rufus to modify the Windows 11 and install directly with an Offline Account/local account? It's secure or it's better not modify the iso?

[Dick Montage]

Just install Win11 as per normal, don’t mess with stuff.

[Progetto Prisma]

On 15/01/2023 at 17:25, Dick Montage said:

Just install Win11 as per normal, don’t mess with stuff.

And for the local account problem?

[Nick H. Supervisor]

Generally speaking I always try to work with whatever OS is installed on the computer I get. If I don't like it I know I can switch to something that I prefer.

As for local vs. online accounts...as I've mentioned elsewhere, I don't think I've seen an advantage to having an online account, but at the same time it wasn't a chore to set up and my computer still runs fine with it.

[DJ-Light]

On 15/01/2023 at 12:28, Progetto Prisma said:

And for the local account problem?

There is no problem, you can set up a local account.

[zikalify Editor]

Windows 11

and

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/create-a-local-user-or-administrator-account-in-windows-20de74e0-ac7f-3502-a866-32915af2a34d

[Xenon]

On 15/01/2023 at 12:40, zikalify said:

Windows 11

and

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/create-a-local-user-or-administrator-account-in-windows-20de74e0-ac7f-3502-a866-32915af2a34d

This is the way. 

[Progetto Prisma]

On 15/01/2023 at 18:59, Xenon said:

This is the way. 

And if i want to install with local instead ms account? I need first install Windows 11 and after that convert to local account?

[zikalify Editor]

On 15/01/2023 at 18:11, Progetto Prisma said:

And if i want to install with local instead ms account? I need first install Windows 11 and after that convert to local account?

With 10 you had to do setup without net to be offered local account set up. Doesn't that work on 11 too?

[adrynalyne]

On 15/01/2023 at 11:23, zikalify said:

With 10 you had to do setup without net to be offered local account set up. Doesn't that work on 11 too?

 No but it’s just as easy to sign up with a bad email address and let it error out a couple times to offer you a local account. 

[Dick Montage]

On 15/01/2023 at 16:28, Progetto Prisma said:

And for the local account problem?

What "problem"?  Create a MS account if you don't have one, use it if you do.

[cooky560 Veteran]

With Windows 10, pulling out the network cable or otherwise disconnecting it from the internet worked fine for making a local account. I think it's gross that Microsoft forces such trickery just to get an operating system to work, it's just one more thing on the pile of "weird MS stuff" I guess, every Windows had something weird about it.

[RisqueFiasco]

I'm running Win10 on a touchpanel. Win 11 on an i5-11400 desktop, Ubuntu 22 or Debian on other PC and SOC. All are connected 24/7 along with Smart TV, automation, android phones and tablets. Accounts are everywhere.😶

[jesseinsf]

Keep Windows 11 Pro. When you first turn it on and you get to the network connection page, push Shift + F10, a command prompt will display. Type the following and hit enter: oobe\bypassnro

The laptop will reboot and when you get to the network connection page again, choose that you don't have a network and you will know what to do with the next page. After that you can create a local account.

[sinetheo]

Go with Windows 11.

Your hardware and drivers is tested and QA'd to work on Windows 11. You don't have to worry about upgrading when Win10 goes EOL soon anyway.

 

WIth the Microsoft account? It is no different than a gmail or AppleID and exists for token management with MFA. It is not some evil vast conspiracy. A disclaimer I am a systems engineer and we use Okta and MFA at work for security over passwords. If you are really worried about spying you have the option at the startup to opt out of data. Also that scary EULA about inquiries is due to Windows Search. Of course you when you send a search query it talks to a server duh.

You can turn off the advertising ID and Windows 10 has that as well. You miss nothing. 

Windows 11 has been out for over a year now and has had it's first update so it is stable. Getting used to change is part of life and you may find a few things nice and useful. I love the new settings and the removal of the cell phone UI in win10 nice for things like getting an ip address without a command prompt (when calling my Mom). 

[sinetheo]

On 15/01/2023 at 10:55, Nick H. said:

Generally speaking I always try to work with whatever OS is installed on the computer I get. If I don't like it I know I can switch to something that I prefer.

As for local vs. online accounts...as I've mentioned elsewhere, I don't think I've seen an advantage to having an online account, but at the same time it wasn't a chore to set up and my computer still runs fine with it.

The advantage is security and convenience. I do Okta MFA tokens for websites and apps at work. These are more secure as they are stored on your phones encryption chip making it impossible to retrieve. On a PC this what the TPM chip does (nothing else scary or special like the comments speak of). 

With my Hotmail ID or you can use an office.com ID all you have to do is use a pin to sign in. Chrome also uses the TPM for saved passwords.

Saved passwords and pin sign ons saved on a chip is nice and normal on any cell phone. 

[Brandon H Supervisor]

I would ignore all the internet "complaints" and judge for yourself. 11 is just fine for most people outside of specific use cases so I would just stick with 11 for a bit to get your own feel for things. I wouldn't mess with downgrading unless you run into something that hinders your personal workload or needs.

as for the local account you can just put in a fake email like none@none.com a couple times at user creation and then it will give you the option to create a local account instead. no issue there  though I do recommend using a Microsoft account as it does have its advantages over a local account.