Opera v7.60 Preview 1 build 7141

[vcv]

http://www.quirksmode.org/dom/w3c_core.html

http://www.quirksmode.org/dom/w3c_css.html

http://www.quirksmode.org/dom/w3c_events.html

It drops huge parts of the Core spec, very, very little support for the event's spec (and some of it is wrong) and quite poor support for the CSS DOM.

Mozilla is way ahead of every other browser apart from IE on IE specific extensions.

Also, I'd take a tested version of the spec better than a list of the commands it implements.

You just showed that opera's DOM level 1 support is lacking. DOM and JavaScript are 2 seperate entities. While yes, you access you DOM through JavaScript, they are still 2 seperate things.

The JAVASCRIPT support in Opera is just fine. It is the DOM level 1 support that needs a lot of work.

[aldo]

Oh comon, don't be pedantic about it. What else can access DOM that is commonly used in a webbrowser: answer: nothing but JS.

I'd class javascript support and DOM support as the same thing, and that's why I said Javascript.

This is why Opera's javascript support sucks - they just don't have enough implemented. I mean, they had to implement a whole new subsection of JS just to get Gmail working (Xhttprequest) which Mozilla has had for ages... but let's not compare to Mozilla.

They are also missing another section which means spellchecking doesn't work....

Sorry to break it to you, vcv, but Javascript (or DOM level 1/2) support sucks.

[vcv]

I'm not going to bother arguing this after this point.

You said JavaScript support sucks when in fact it doesn't, it's DOM. You said it yourself as well. You can't say they are the same thing.

[aldo]

Fine, DOM support sucks. Happy now?

I was just simplifying it and I know that DOM and JS are different things.

[Galley]

Apparently Google has made a change (just yesterday) in Gmail that no longer requires Opera 7.6 users to use workarounds, other than ID'ing as Opera.

[worbd]

Well look, I use Mozilla (Firefox) and whenever I use Opera I have tons of JS problems, and no, it's not just down to buggy webpages.

Did you actually read what I wrote?

"The problem isn't that Opera's JS sucks. The problem is that sites block Opera on purpose or use browser detection that send Opera outdated JS code made for Opera 6."

Have you checked those pages you were having problems with and verified that it is NOT a browser detection issue? Cuz in my experience that's what the problem usually is.

I think that Google is implementing support for Safari and Konquerer (who have pretty basic JS engines) before Opera is just testament to that.

Uh. Google supporting or not supporting doesn't mean a damn thing one way or another. In Gmail's case it was because Opera didn't support XMLHttpRequest which is *NOT* standard JavaScript, but an extension by Mozilla.

You can't generalize based on *ONE* site, and especially not one which just underlines my comments about browser discrimination, and which uses non-standard extensions!

[worbd]

Fine, DOM support sucks. Happy now?

I was just simplifying it and I know that DOM and JS are different things.

Uh, according to those tables Opera's DOM support is just fine.

JS support in Opera is excellent, DOM support is good.

Let's not spread misinformation, shall we?

[Jerry Grey Member]

* Speech-enabled browsing *

You may have noticed the increased size of the install file. This release comes with a set of voice libraries that enable the user to control Opera by speaking commands to it. Opera now supports XHTML+Voice 1.2 and the CSS3 speech module (properties new to CSS3 are prefixed by "-xv-"). With the default setup, you can navigate pages, have selected text read to you, and control parts of the browser. Select some text, hold down Scroll lock, and say "speak" or visit the IBM Multimodal demo page for a demo. More information about using voice can be found in the help files by issuing the command "voice help" or in the Opera with Voice tutorial. Join the discussions about this new feature in #voice on irc.opera.com.

Voice functions only work on Windows 2000 and XP.

Did you know them got that idea off of Yazzaweb ;)

[Nathanael]

Me IDed as Opera and gmail works.

[Nirvy]

Yup Google had blocked Opera as it didnt work as intended in 7.54.

Now opera have 7.60 which supports google they have unblocked it, so long as you ID as opera it works perfectly :)

[Sushubh]

this is old stuff but still proves a point.

anyone doubting opera's JS performance can take this test:

http://www.24fun.com/downloadcenter/benchjs/benchjs.html

[l0g0ut]

this is old stuff but still proves a point.

anyone doubting opera's JS performance can take this test:

http://www.24fun.com/downloadcenter/benchjs/benchjs.html

actually people aren't complaining about how fast JS in opera; they complain about compatibility. some JS does not SEEM to work with opera id'd as opera but works fine when id'd as IE.

[TechyClaire]

..

Edited September 3, 2004 by TechyClaire

[Chode]

I'm always ID'd as Opera, and I don't have any hassles with anything.

[Sushubh]

pretty much same with me. though i do not mind opening firefox for those sites... takes a button on the interface.

[megamanXplosion]

Opera's JavaScript/DOM support is rather poor, but I'm quite pleased that they've made a major step in the right direction with the 7.6 preview by enabling XMLHTTPRequest, XMLSerializer, and DOMParser functionality. I think Sushubh knows how hard I've been pushing the developers to include this, for my own project, not for gmail (that too, but that was the least of my concerns). The aural stylesheets are also damn sexy, one of the things that I've yet to play with. Another thing that I've been pushing them hard for is the Dom2 Range and Traversal which allows forms to put text where the cursor is in the form fields, this is possibly my biggest gripe about Opera in it's current state.

As for voice browsing, I could care less because I don't need it, but it's pretty good for accessibility purposes, as are almost all features in Opera hehe.

Gmail support? Opera 7.6 is almost completely compatible with gmail except for some squished buttons, that's the only real issue on Opera's end, the rest is from Google. Right now, all you need to do is enable javascript (which is likely to already be on), iframes (the same), and ID as opera (this might be a different story, but F12 and change, simple), then login and enjoy gmail.

People wonder why Opera is claimed the fastest browser? It's not necessarily because of the speeds (though it's caching is faster than other browsers' at the moment), but for productivity. In Opera it's amazingly simple to do things. It's built for productive solutions and not necessarily fool-proof solutions like their competitors (Microsoft and Mozilla). Let me demonstrate. Imagine that you copy a URL in firefox (step 1), then you have to double-click on the tab-bar (step 2), then move over to the address bar and give it focus (step 3), then paste the URL (step 4), then press Enter (step 5). In Opera, you copy the URL (step 1), then middle-click on the tab-bar (step 2), [you need not give focus to the address bar,] then Ctrl+D to Paste and Go (step 3). Another thing about Opera, quick preferences menu, press F12 and then change your setting, something which I use almost daily and it's always within quick reach instead of digging through a giant control panel. Opera could also carry that title by simply being the fastest, which it is because of it's memory cache control which allows you to press the back button and INSTANTLY see the page you were viewing before and those files are pulled from cache a lot quicker than the hard-drive method which other browsers use as the primary cache. I've also done benchmarks on Opera's JavaScript engine, it's amazingly fast compared to the others, but the JavaScript/DOM implementation is still kind of lousy IMHO. Opera could also be titled as the fastest browser for error-recovery, you can use the 'Window' menu to easily access pages which you might have accidentally closed, and if Opera crashes then it will allow you to resume where you left off unlike the other browsers. It really doesn't matter how you look at the situation, Opera is the fastest in every possible way except for the initial learning curve, which some people are simply to lazy/ignorant to care to learn for 5 minutes to experience something better. Anyways...

I don't think I really have anything else to say in this thread, except use Opera :p

[Sushubh]

lets hope u don't get slammed by... we have got an extension for this and we have got an extension for that ;) but yeah... me too hate the fact regarding

forms to put text where the cursor is in the form fields

makes me use firefox instead ;)

[theyarecomingforyou]

I was thinking the other day of trying Opera again, and then I read that it doesn't support GMail properly. :huh:

Is it Google, or Opera, or a bit of both? The reason I stopped using Opera was because sites often wouldn't render properly and this still seems to be the case. Also, does anyone know if Opera plan to stop identifying themselves as IE by default? While it might "seem" like a nice idea to help out a few sites, it seems destined to cause it problems in the long run (as it has done already).

[Chode]

I was thinking the other day of trying Opera again, and then I read that it doesn't support GMail properly. :huh:

Is it Google, or Opera, or a bit of both? The reason I stopped using Opera was because sites often wouldn't render properly and this still seems to be the case. Also, does anyone know if Opera plan to stop identifying themselves as IE by default? While it might "seem" like a nice idea to help out a few sites, it seems destined to cause it problems in the long run (as it has done already).

As other threads have said: Using this new preview build of Opera (and thanks to some modifications the Google boys made), GMAIL works 100%. Well, you stil have to tell it to "sign in anyay", but besides that I'm yet to find flaw.

[Nirvy]

I was thinking the other day of trying Opera again, and then I read that it doesn't support GMail properly. :huh:

Is it Google, or Opera, or a bit of both? The reason I stopped using Opera was because sites often wouldn't render properly and this still seems to be the case. Also, does anyone know if Opera plan to stop identifying themselves as IE by default? While it might "seem" like a nice idea to help out a few sites, it seems destined to cause it problems in the long run (as it has done already).

Gmail works perfectly now. Google had blocked Opera until they supported XMLHTTP or something, now Opera 7.60 supports it they unblocked opera. Works pretty nighty too :)

[dreamthief]

can anyone tell me how is Opera faster than the other browsers out there in running JAVAScript and other in-built code of HTML ?? Can anyone tell me how ???

go download the "other browsers" and test it out yourself. The speed and etc are very judgemental....

[lillitnn92]

this is old stuff but still proves a point.

anyone doubting opera's JS performance can take this test:

http://www.24fun.com/downloadcenter/benchjs/benchjs.html

i tried running this, but get a 404 error everytime when it's doiing results, both Opera and IE. should add that Opera ran through most of the tests waaay faster than IE. i think only two were slightly slower.

[worbd]

actually people aren't complaining about how fast JS in opera; they complain about compatibility. some JS does not SEEM to work with opera id'd as opera but works fine when id'd as IE.

Most problems with "JS compatibility" are caused by browser detection and have got nothing to do with Opera's abilities.

[worbd]

Opera's JavaScript/DOM support is rather poor

It isn't actually. It supports ECMA-262 100%, plus loads of extensions. You are calling it "poor" because it happens to not implement your pet wishes but that doesn't make it poor, objectively speaking.

[Sushubh]

--snipped--