Nvidia Gets 13 Games To Use Shader Model 3.0

[Oblivion]

Triumph of TWIMTBP + HL 2 spotted

It cost Nvidia more than a few millions to have its TWIMTBP ? The way it meant to be played marketing program up and running but if you ask us it efficient if you ask us. We found a link where you can find complete list of Shader model 3.0 games. Quite a long list don?t you think.

If you ask ATI, it will give you all kinds of reasons why Shader Model 3.0 is not that important as it all can be done in Shader Model 2.0b the one their hardware use. It is partly right - it will just be a bit slower with 2.0b then it is with 3.0 but from now on it won't be telling us how there won't be many Shader Model 3.0 games available.

The list has twelve games on it plus Unreal 3engine. Nvidia scored many EA games but I guess that comes from TWIMTBP partnership that those two companies have. Don?t get me wrong we think SM 3.0 is very good stuff and more games are coming. ?

List includes many good titles such as: Lord of the rings: Battle for the middle earth, Stalker: Shadows of Chernobyl, Vampire: Bloodlines, Splinter Cell 3, Tiger Woods 2005, Madden 2005, Driver 3.0, Grafan ? never heard of it, Metal of Honor: Pacific Assault, Painkiller trough Patch, Far cry trough Patch.

Last but not the least is believe it or not Half Life 2 that will have support for this Shader model that currently works only at Nvidia cards.

Nvidia sure did a great job for getting attention to their marchitecture and we are looking forward to see all those games in action.

Shader Model 3.0 Games

The Inquirer

[DjmUK]

Nice, SM3.0 is still pretty new but already games are being designed around it - this is definately good news indeed :)

Question:

Far Cry Patch (from SM2.0b > SM3.0), how is this achieved. I know what a shader is, so...um, will this update simply update the engine with new codes..? I kow that question isn't very accurate. Here's an example.

Example:

UT2004 is SM2.0 (I think). What would it take for that game to become SM3.0 compliant, and what would the updates have..? Atari would have to write a patch that get's embedded within the overall engine of the game and what differences will we see..? (new textures, animation etc.)?

I've probably got it all wrong so please let me know as this is of interest to me for my 3rd year final Degree (which I'm thinking of writing a mod).

[Glowstick]

The easiest way to claim a game to be PS3.0 compliant is to turn on PS3.0 on it but still feed it PS2.0 shaders.

[Mx]

oo nice list of games, STALKER, HL2, FarCry Patch and Unreal Engine 3, looks some good stuff there :D

[DjmUK]

  Tom Servo said:

The easiest way to claim a game to be PS3.0 compliant is to turn on PS3.0 on it but still feed it PS2.0 shaders.

Not sure what you mean there.

I'm VERY new to SM3.0 programming and the theories behind it. So, a game say "Far Cry" originally SM2.0, the game has an option within it (via update patch) to turn on SM3.0 which will then increase performance (where SM3.0 is only used if the card can handle it, if else then the game will revert to the SM2.0 coding pathways)..?

Pseudocode (Start)

Engine AutoDetect:

IF Card = SM3.0 Capable THEN

Enable SM3.0 Throughout Game

End IF

IF Card = SM2.0 Capable Only THEN

Enable SM2.0 Throughout Game

End IF

Pseudocode (End)

Result = higher framerates, performance, lightning etc.

If so, then how does one program SM3.0 into the game..? (which is the question I really wanna' know the answer to so I can learn to write my own).

[Glowstick]

Well, SM3 is a superset of SM2. If the chip runs in SM3 mode, the SM2 ones will still work. And since it's usually about word twisting, turning on SM3 suffices to proclaim something SM3 compliant.

Some of the game companies will write actual SM3 shaders, but that doesn't imply nicer graphics. SM3 is just about code flow constructs. Stuff might get faster, not better looking.

[DjmUK]

Thanks Tom,

That's the thing, I want to learn how to write these shaders and then toggle them on/off at will via creating a mod for a current game.

What I'm understanding is this:

- SM3.0 can be coded to make the engine coding easier and more efficient.

- SM3.0 shaders can be written to take full advantage of the chip.

- These shaders are written in HLSL or C/C++ < can't remember which. These can make certain light refractions off materials look more realistic and life-like.

The only differences the user will see is that the game might be a bit faster (because of updated coding), and you can see the differences with certain textures/lighting that are optimised for the shader.

Here's my other question regarding this:

Does the engine have to be coded in SM3.0 to produce the visual improvements, or can I simply write a mod with SM3.0 that the GPU can read and understand and then produce (even though the engine is SM2.0)..?

P.S.

Sorry about all these questions but this is the only thread that I understand and is helping me in the theory world of shaders (which I want to learn).

[Jason S. Global Moderator]

wow.. thats pretty sweet... i cant wait to see some real picture comparisons though... from what ive heard, Far Cry doesnt look any different using sm3... it just runs faster...

[figgy]

I might just buy an NVidia card if this is true.

[DirtyLarry Veteran]

hugs my 6800 Ultra :D

then gets fried to a crisp from all the extra power needed to run it ;)

[Glowstick]

  DjmUK said:

- SM3.0 can be coded to make the engine coding easier and more efficient.

Yes.

  Quote

- SM3.0 shaders can be written to take full advantage of the chip.

Depends on how you mean it. Basically just: SM3 = SM2 + Flow Control.

  Quote

- These shaders are written in HLSL or C/C++ < can't remember which. These can make certain light refractions off materials look more realistic and life-like.

HLSL. The look of shader effects isn't dependent on the language. What HLSL can, you can also in shader assembler. Using HLSL is however easier. Just as it's easier to code an app in C than it is in assembler.

  Quote

The only differences the user will see is that the game might be a bit faster (because of updated coding), and you can see the differences with certain textures/lighting that are optimised for the shader.

Mainly only faster. There's nothing new in SM3 that allows breathtaking stuff. However can you start writing more sophisticated effects, that'd choke on SM2 because the shader would get way too long.

[DjmUK]

Thanks for that, now I finally understand it - it's taken me weeks to get my head around "how it works" and "what it does", and this is the only thread that has answered those questions.

All I gotta' do now is learn HLSL and how to implement the HLSL shaders into a C/C++ program that then gets compiled into a mod and import it into a game (say UT2004) and made playable with visual effect improvements (SM3.0 compliant) only.

Because as far as I know the mods are local (as opposed to global) which are totally seperated from the game engine, results in visual effects only instead of performance code because we don't have access to the engine source code of UT.

[jerry]

Nice ! 12 more TWIMTBP games that run faster on ATi cards. :rolleyes:

People should go back and read that article "Doom3 v HL2: whoever wins, we lose".

[DoNuTs]

  jerry said:

Nice ! 12 more TWIMTBP games that run faster on ATi cards. :rolleyes:

People should go back and read that article "Doom3 v HL2: whoever wins, we lose".

what the **** :rolleyes: just .... :rolleyes:

[jerry]

  DoNuTs? said:

what the **** :rolleyes:: just .... :rolleyes::

Dont get upset, its just another endorsing game from Nvidia. Adds a whole new meaning to optimizing games etc.,

[DjmUK]

  DoNuTs? said:

what the **** :rolleyes:: just .... :rolleyes::

Perfect reply, just 3 words and I totally understand and agree with you:))

[jerry]

  DjmUK said:

Perfect reply, just 3 words and I totally understand and agree with you :)

Sometimes the truth hurts especially when you've invested $400 into one brand. :D

[DoNuTs]

  jerry said:

Sometimes the truth hurts especially when you've invested $400 into one brand. :D

^^Forum-lamer?^^

Please stop beeing so damn narrow minded k?

[jerry]

  DoNuTs? said:

^^Forum-lamer?^^

Please stop beeing so damn narrow minded k?

Sorry but you are the one who's narrow minded. You just bought a 6800GT and simply cant accept criticism for Nvidia. I'm not either an ATi or Nvidia fanboy but when it comes I'll critisize & applaud both.

Keep calling me names, I wont:whistle:le:

[ANova]

  DoNuTs? said:

^^Forum-lamer?^^

Please stop beeing so damn narrow minded k?

He is speaking the truth. Nvidia invested millions into their PR department and out came TWIMTBP. It's nothing more then a marketing gimmick.

btw, this list is old. I know BFG posted it on their site shortly before the 6800 started showing up in stores and online.

[ctebah]

i really don't regret waiting right now, im going for a 6800U right now.

don't see any ppl saying that TheInquirer talks BS now..........

[DjmUK]

The link has gone down now :( the original link in post #1

Shader Model 3.0 Games

Anyone know where the thread has gone?

[DjmUK]

Just found out, the page has been removed at Nvidia's request (because the list was incomplete and/or incorrect).

What happened to the Shader Model 3.0 Thread?

[SimplyPotatoes]

isn't vampire: bloodlines using the source engine?

[Chode]

  SimplyPotatoes said:

isn't vampire: bloodlines using the source engine?

Indeed it is.